Sure. The fast food industry.

Sometimes you get a fresh burger the way you order it and hot fries.

Other times the burger patty was cooked hours ago with green tomatoes and wilted lettuce, and the fries are cold and petrified.

brave.

There's two (technically) 3 posts about it already. The accountability factor solely rests on the buyers shoulders. Your public voice and wallet holds the power to make change. I firmly believe had the prior threads not been started the JJP crowd wouldn't have been taken care of. I got burned on another Mirco playfield bought from Jack and ended up losing $80 to ship it back asking for a shipping refund if he agreed it was defective. Same crap clearcoat issue amongst others. Guess who didn't get a refund.

If you purchased with a Visa/MC and then open a claim that what you ordered is defective I would think that the manufacturer would make it right rather than lose the sale and $$. It's your only leverage/recourse if you are not being treated fairly. My 2c

Depends on your definition of “taken care of”...many would argue they weren’t and I am not sure what changed but people were mad at JUST getting blank playfield...but when Jack personally said here’s a blank playfield suddenly it’s cool! Even that wrench guy that’s all over the place is back in on a 13k roll of the dice I think. Pinball dudes be crazy.

Great post. Many of us are with ya. I can’t believe simps already lining up for Elvira when someone already posted a picture of blistering at posts.

by my definition of "taken care of" they where NOT "taken care of". a new blank playfield? whatever, jack can stick that up his butt. I do not think I have heard if Stern is even helping folks out at all.

Until people stop throwing money at these manufacturers it will continue. People can spend their money how they want, but do NOT come on here and complain when you get a crap product.

There's low accountability around here for starting lame, redundant threads, that's for sure.

I can. It's just history repeating itself, over and over again.

I don't disagree, but I accept the limitations of what I'm getting from a supplier that is trying to stay in the black. I'm optimistic, so I believe the pinball manufacturers are trying to get a good product built but it's pretty difficult to keep an eye on quality when you farm out major components (playfields, cabinets, graphics stickers, etc) to outside vendors who surely have their own bottom line to worry about. it's also difficult to appease the home-use-only folks like us, as we a $1000+ upcharge for an LE machine only gets a few extra toys and not necessarily improved quality. We all know that a steel ball usually wins when hitting hardwood or plastic. And the folks installing your plastic posts were probably installing your flipper bats earlier in the day and don't have the training, skills, or know-how to not use the same torque from one part to the other.

Early adopters of other technology or limited-production items also can get burned. I bought a low production GM car and it was a PITA. I sold it when it parts for it were getting unobtainable. The first products off of many production lines are often crapola while, if you're lucky, the later ones are better (not bashing JJP, but there are 3 versions of light boards on WOZ...). Good customer service can make the experience better, but it won't fix everything... and there is always someone else who will buy that expensive you if you don't.

Who's we all?

I don't know that at all considering how many pinballs I have dropped on my solid oak floor that didn't put a dent into it.

Here's how my thousand dollar KISS playfield arrived. I don't know how it didn't slide right out at some point. Hell, for all I know it did. The entire end was open.
No damage though - thank god CPR wraps it in a separate cardboard layer in addition to the box.
20190904_170100 (resized).jpg

Come on, at least it’s not a “has pinball peaked” thread!

or do you consider pinball machines a investment

or getaway vs JD vs WCS

or which version of Elvira should I buy

Good for you. While you do that I will continue to buy NIB and not really give a shit about a small crack or pooling clear or resale value and have the best time ever.

Then you are the perfect customer for Stern and JJP. Enjoy.

In your original post, I would change “used car” to “used pinball machine”. Just a suggestion.

And ur a good customer for the bizarro world Stern and JJP where the pins are made 100% perfect. No JJP's yet. Stern? certainly and I've been pretty lucky with what I have bought thus fa, but believe me there's a fine line. Good day sir.

To use the cargument, even the Yugo and the Pinto had it's loyal customers.

Yeah, but 99 times out of 100, if you asked for your burger to be remade, they would. Probably freshly made. So, they are accountable for their end product, which was the OP point.

Its difficult to compare 2$ burgers and 7k pinball machines though. You cant expect them to replace everyones playfield for every minor issue.

I dont understand the issue well enough to know if issues with the playfields are due to buyers being too picky, or cost cutting measures on the manufacturer's part. It does seem like there is a playfield issue thread with every manufacturer though.

Unless you're in the drive thru, and don't open the box until you get home.

Sure, you can drive back and complain, and sure they will redo it.

But then they will just spit on your burger or worse, and shortchange you on your fries.

Then you've got to go thru the whole routine all over again. If you dare...

Here’s my 10k, just send me anything.

Cargument...tires go bald eventually, just start with bald tires new from dealer.

Dirty oil...no problem, happens, just start that way.

Rust? Great.

Shitty dead rat smell, add it on...that’s the super LE

People bragging about wasting money on shitty products. That’s got to be unique to pinball.

No worries I’ll have fun and sell at a HUGE LOSS. Give me more!!

Sounds like spooky has been kicking ass since day one with customer service.

Those that don’t care keep buying and those that do stop. I was in the stop column, cancelled my latest LE and will not be a buyer without guarantees or inspection. Heck I’d drive 100 miles for a new in box purchase that I could inspect before receiving. Maybe there’s a new market for that type of distributor.

I can relate though.

I'm cleaning out mom's house and am about to throw a TV from the 1980s or 90s right in the shitcan or drop it off at Goodwill without getting one cent in return.

I know I should really consider how much we are losing on that deal, but the years of entertainment it provided makes it less painful.

So instead of using carguments, perhaps we should start using TVguments in regards to our pinball machines?

Newer tvs are meant to be thrown out! I tried getting one repaired and the guy basically said just toss it! Pathetic

That's true with all electronic devices and appliances these days.

Pinball has just been a little late to the party, but has been making great strides to catch up recently.

The Goodwill in my area won't even take old CRT's. And it cost 25/30 dollars to get rid of an old TV.

No accoutability for the defects on my NIB JP2 as of yet thats for sure.

Messaged Stern and my distro, and not a peep back yet.

Looking like no more NIB for me thats for sure...

Dup

True, but starting the lame thread doesn’t cost 10k.

It’s not widespread

Don't bet on it...

Here are things I’ve learned from reading Pinside:

1) OMG ALL PLAYFIELDS ARE CRAP NOWADAYS!

2) NO MANUFACTURER WILL STAND BEHIND THEIR PRODUCT!

3) (this one kills me). OMG JJP OFFERED ME A FREE PLAYFIELD AND I REFUSED BECAUSE I DONT HAVE TIME or (more likely) THE SKILL OR PATIENCE TO DO A SWAP!

4) not everyone has these playfield issues

5) if manufacturers “do something” about these issues, it will be addressed - but it will cost us. NIB prices will keep going up

6) prices will go up

7) prices will go up

Stern can hardly cut any more corners, and JJP is crucified for trying to do something real that the rabid consumer base is imagining in their heads. AP is “shots are too tight” despite actually delivering several fully playable (remember the JPop Houdini debacle), fun, imaginative games. CGC seems
To be the only ones coming out smelling fresh - and they are REMAKING existing, proven games !

Anyway, carry on.

There is a smell but I don't know if I would call fresh...

LOL. I have played several of the remakes, they seem pretty good to me - but frankly I just dont want to have to learn to maintain yet another set of boards, I'll stick with my original