I've seen a similar post claiming the same. For my LE, however, I noticed flipper fade during long games. Replacing them with the PBL coils made a noticeable difference in my case, but mine may be an aberration.

Lotr LE uses the same coils as the regular lotr. Neither need upgraded coils, just properly rebuilt flippers. Mine with stock coils is so ridiculously strong.

If you're having the problem where the coils get weaker as you play the game, replace the coils. If not don't worry about it.

Ditto on the transistors. There is no reason to upgrade transistors carte blanche, the recommendation is to put in a higher current transistor if you're replacing it anyways. Although that is done to prevent the transistor from failing, not to keep fuses from blowing.

My LE had flipper fade so I upgraded the coils. Not sure if the regular LOTRs were worse but I could notice the difference. Did not know about the transistor upgrade but mine have not blown.

It's the same coil - one just has a diode on coil and the other has diode in the circuit. The coil numbers and strengths are the same.

I have the "upgraded" flipper coils in my LOTR and honestly I think it's too strong, thinking of going back to the regular.

My LE came with the upgraded coils. Stern put the upgraded coils in the last runs of the LE model.

If anyone is interested i have a pair i can send out for $25 (shipped)... bought them just in case but never used them.

So you want to contact him to ask him about a problem you don't have?

You can adjust the flipper coil strength in the latest version of the software, so no need to uninstall them.

This makes sense. Mine was an early build.

Sorry about the pm's turned off. I periodically get profane/abusive emails from a certain Brazen_Ranting pinsider, and I didn't want to deal with the unnecessary hassle.

As for the LE coils: huh, I didn't know that some LEs shipped with stronger coils, and I don't even know which ones are in my game. I have never had the flipper fade issue (even after a few hours of continuous play), and had read consistently that it wasn't a problem with the LEs. Mine don't seem to strong either; no airballs or craziness, and you still need a direct shot up the ring ramp to score it.

Best thing is to have an extended play period on your LOTR and see if the flippers get too weak after a while. You'll notice if it becomes impossible to make the center or left ramps. If it ain't broke, don't fix it!

I installed upgraded coils on my LE, then toned down the settings in software. With the provided coils a long game definitely made them overheat and lose strength.

What settings did you use turbo? I want to turn mine down a tad as well

(090-5020-20-ND) is the model number of the improved/stronger coils. I think you can open your coin door and look up at the coils and read them.

My LE was built in Jan. 2011 and had the stronger coils stock.

The previous thread re: Q15/Q16 transistors that StevenP helped out on may have been mine. Your LOTR LE build date sounds like the more recent run of LE's that includes improved flipper coils. That is the case with my LE: once I replaced the transistors, I've had no problems with flipper fade. I actually finally made it to Valinor over the weekend with a game close to 600million and around an hour long, and no issues with still being able to hit the ring for that penultimate "through the ring" shot to finish of DTR to start up Valinor.

I have a set of the Pinball Life LOTR coils just in case, but have not needed them as of yet. They are certainly physically larger than the coils installed by Stern, but hopefully will not be needed.

The pinballlife upgrade coils are the exact same as the stock coils on mine.

Valinor??!?!!?/ NICE!! Haven't come close yet. I had a bit of trouble making the 2-ball DTR ring shot recently, but it does have to bee a straight shot. The ring magnet seems a bit strong, as I rocked the ball a few times but it still held. Is there a setting for the ring magnet strength too? It really seems to be locked in there!!

Thanks! Still on a pinball high....
Valinor had eluded me for years -- all the times I had pumped quarters into LOTR's on route -- what a difference it makes to have a HUO LOTR with flippers that don't fade and all shots/switches that work consistently!

Re: DTR... I have my DTR set to single ball play:
A) I wanted to see how I would do on factory settings (which was set to one-ball DTR) and wide outlanes before tweaking the settings.
B) I heard from another LOTR owner that if you play your LOTR (and DTR mode) a lot, then over time, the extended length that the ring holds the captured ball in the ring during DTR will permanently magnetize the pinballs. Also, the extended continuous actuation of the ring magnet will cause its components to fail faster.

Is there any truth to (B)?

I've played the DTR as a 2-ball mode a couple times a few years back, and I must say that I love the game-play aspect (plus link to the LOTR story) of having a 2-ball DTR that requires you to knock the ball through (knock Gollum off the cliff), but I was wary of the settings based on what I mentioned above.

Perhaps my eyeballing of the coil diameter was off. Out of curiosity, I'll check this evening.

For the DTR problem, head over to this active thread: http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/lotr-destroy-ring-problem

Thx, missed that thread! I'll clean the ring and tighten, and check if the balls are magnetized. I do like the 2-ball DTR when it works!

I doubt the ring will 'wear' anything over time in 2-ball mode. The balls may get magnetized faster, but everything else should be bulletproof (heavy coil, switched current source)if the transistor holds up. (One replacement should be all that's ever needed, if that!)

BTW, checked my LE and the coils are 090-5020 N|D so it looks like mine also had the stronger coils installed by the factory. Didn't know that! Always thought the board change from the original version addressed the flipper fade issue.

PM sent

I must have the stronger coils because my flippers are almost too strong....

SM on the other hand I'd say is average for me on the flipper strength...but still good

I emailed Terry at Pinballlife and asked him what the difference was between his LOTR coils and the normal Stern coil of the same part number. 090-5020-20T.
http://www.pinballlife.com/index.php?p=catalog&mode=search&search_in=all&search_str=090-5020-20&x=41&y=16

He says the LOTR coil is 10% stronger. I guess I should have asked how they made them stronger but my guess is they removed some of the windings.

There's a misconception here. The game ships with 090-5020-20 coils. These are not the over powered coils from pblife. I think they have to have the T on them to be but really the part number might be the same. I think pblife removes done windings or such. You could test you coil impedance and know what you have for sure.

Was wondering, the stock coils are 22-900s. If you put in 21-900s, wouldn't they be the same strength but not heat up as quick and therefor take much longer to weaken?

I upgraded coils on IM both have 090-5020-20's. I'm upgrading coils this week on TF with same. I heard the special lotr coil has 100 less windings than a regular 090-5020-20 and it's remarketed. I'm sure someone knows. I like my games as fast a possible, and my playfields are all set to 9+ degrees. It's needed.

Coil strength info
http://www.pinballmedic.net/coil_chart.html

Thanks for the info. So they basically made it a 22-800.
I'm thinking I will swap out the LOTRs coils with the upgraded ones and then put the normal ones into my SM which came with 22-1080s

The LOTR upgrade coils are 10% stonger. We went to the manufacturer and said "make them 10% stronger". It was about as simple as that. The power increase was not achieved by taking off windings from the original coil. The upgraded coil is considerably heavier than the original. After all the math the resistance is lower making he coils stronger.

If you are having flipper strength issues with your game you should address them in the following order:

1. Change out the flipper button leaf switches, especially if your game was manufactured before 2005. The switches on these games were manufactured incorrectly and suck. Replace them with part number 500-6889-01. These switches are shorter than the original switches, but they are exactly what you need.

2. Rebuild your flipper mechs.

3. Still not enough power? OK, buy the upgraded coils and install them in your machine.

Terry.
www.pinballlife.com

Thanks Terry. Do you know what the model number was on the original coils?

Thanks

Thanks Terry. Sorry for bugging you. Hopefully you sell more of these now.

090-5020-20 is 22 gauge 900 turns so, lotr is thicker gauge wire with the same amount of turns? It's time for the coil parameters calculator. This is interesting. Good info.

Just installed my LOTR coils. They are definitely a heavier guage wire. Not sure what the guage is but you can see the difference. The entire coil is also much heavier than the original and should have no problem handling the heat of extended play.

The way I understood this, changing this setting really had no direct effect on the flippers. If there is settings within the game people think can make them "weaker"(or for that matter stronger) please let me know but all the posts I have read in the past, majority seemed to say this didn't work.

ohhh yes they do. My friend had issues with his lotr, and through the settings you could make the flippers basically hardly move at all or add strength to the point where I thought he would be burying balls through the walls.

and how do you change the settingss?

This is correct. Coil strength setting doesn't affect flipper coils.

Here's the service bulletin from Stern. From version 8 on they added three more adjustments specifically for the flippers - adjustment 53-55. Maybe strength was the wrong word - the adjustments affect the coil fire times but the net result is the ball doesn't come off the flipper as hard. I'm running adjust 53=5 and 54=40 with the Pinball Life coils and I'm happy with it. The default 10/50 was whipping the ball around.

http://sternpinball.com/downloads/sb151.pdf

I put the upgraded coils in my lotr because the flippers got sloppy and felt like wet noodles pushing the ball after several games or during a marathon game.

While the upgrade may be a bit strong IMO it beats it being to weak to shoot a ramp or the ring.