(Topic ID: 92581)

Long Distance Sales


By tl54hill

4 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 45 posts
  • 22 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 4 years ago by vid1900
  • Topic is favorited by 3 Pinsiders

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    #1 4 years ago

    Looking at a long distance sale of my pin to a party across the country. The buyer wants to use NAVL, which I am ok with. My questions are, as a seller:

    1. How do you handle receiving payment from someone across the country? I have only done cash and carry in the past.
    2. Do you require the buyer to get insurance for transit?
    3. Anything else I am not thinking about.

    Thanks for any insights you can offer! I want this to be a good experience for both the buyer and seller.

    #2 4 years ago

    Lots of opinions on this to be sure..

    1) Electronic payment, cash, wire, money order...but however you do it, generally pin doesn't get on the truck until funds are free and clear.
    2) No. Once it's on the truck, it's not your machine any more. If they want to get insurance they can.

    #3 4 years ago

    1. Get a personal check and wait 3 weeks for it to clear, Western Union, or a wire transfer.
    2. Cashier's Checks and Money Orders also take a full 3 weeks to clear - don't be fooled that they clear in 48 hours - and these are much more likely to be forged.
    3. Wire Transfers can be faked by them Overnighting a forged check directly to your bank. Your bank deposits it first thing in the morning, you see the deposit believing it to be a Wire Transfer. 3 weeks later the check bounces and your account is dinged for the amount + $38 bounced check fee.
    4. You will need to insure the pin, but remember that it can take weeks to get a claim processed, and often they only want to "settle" for 20-50% of the actual claim amount.
    5. NEVER take Paypal. The buyer can claim the pin is counterfeit and you will lose the pin and your money with no recourse at all.

    #4 4 years ago

    I've purchased games at a distance.
    The buyer usually takes care of all the shipping paper work and finding a provider. It's the buyers responsibility to get the coverage that he/she desires. Your job as the seller is to pack the pin to get ready for transit.

    1. You (the seller) should send the buyer extremely detailed pictures of the game he/she is buying so that there are no surprises when the buyer gets the game and for insurance purpose in case the shipper damages the machine. I'm talking about inside the backbox, under the playfield, all the playfield details, in the back, under the machine...etc.... you get the idea.

    2. Talk extensively about every issue the machine has...even the extremely minor ones. Be thorough.

    3. If you can skype and have the machine in the video with you assures the buyer that the machine is in fact real. And a video teleconference lets both parties know who they are dealing with.

    4. Payment, you can do it a few ways.
    a. paypal as a friend (saves the 3% fee you get charged but doesn't offer the buyer assurance)
    b. paypal regular but add the fees you are getting charge (reassurance on the buyers end)
    c. Email money transfer
    d. Cheque (wait 20 business days until it clears and there are no surprises)

    5. Take pictures of the game leaving your house or premisses. Show it getting loaded on the truck.

    that's pretty much it.

    #5 4 years ago

    The best way to ship pins long distance is to fill up the back of a hearse, and send them
    on their way.

    #6 4 years ago
    Quoted from vid1900:

    Get a personal check and wait 3 weeks for it to clear, Western Union, or a wire transfer.

    So, based on your post, if you're selling to someone you don't know (at least by reputation), you nearly always wait three weeks to ship? I am not disagreeing, but it sounds like it would be quite a challenge to sell anything with those terms.

    #7 4 years ago
    Quoted from Craig:

    So, based on your post, if you're selling to someone you don't know (at least by reputation), you nearly always wait three weeks to ship? I am not disagreeing, but it sounds like it would be quite a challenge to sell anything with those terms.

    Better be safe than sorry. If the cheque bounces and the machine is gone.......you're left with both your balls in a tight squeeze.

    #8 4 years ago
    Quoted from Craig:

    So, based on your post, if you're selling to someone you don't know (at least by reputation), you nearly always wait three weeks to ship? I am not disagreeing, but it sounds like it would be quite a challenge to sell anything with those terms.

    If they pay by Personal Check, Money Order, or Cashier's Check, then yes, of course, I wait 3 weeks to ship.

    I would have to be an idiot to ship before funds actually clear.

    Quoted from Craig:

    but it sounds like it would be quite a challenge to sell anything with those terms.

    If a buyer does not understand that payment has to clear before I send the game, that is a buyer I don't want to sell to.

    Any time someone tries to rush or pressure you, it's likely to be a scam.

    .

    #9 4 years ago
    Quoted from flashinstinct:

    a. paypal as a friend (saves the 3% fee you get charged but doesn't offer the buyer assurance)
    b. paypal regular but add the fees you are getting charge (reassurance on the buyers end)

    Even if they send you Paypal as a friend, they can still dispute the charge with their credit card company and screw you out of both your game and your money.

    Really, truly, absolutely, don't use Paypal to sell a pin .

    #10 4 years ago
    Quoted from vid1900:

    1. Get a personal check and wait 3 weeks for it to clear, Western Union, or a wire transfer.
    2. Cashier's Checks and Money Orders also take a full 3 weeks to clear - don't be fooled that they clear in 48 hours - and these are much more likely to be forged.
    3. Wire Transfers can be faked by them Overnighting a forged check directly to your bank. Your bank deposits it first thing in the morning, you see the deposit believing it to be a Wire Transfer. 3 weeks later the check bounces and your account is dinged for the amount + $38 bounced check fee.
    4. You will need to insure the pin, but remember that it can take weeks to get a claim processed, and often they only want to "settle" for 20-50% of the actual claim amount.
    5. NEVER take Paypal. The buyer can claim the pin is counterfeit and you will lose the pin and your money with no recourse at all.

    Dont listen to this guy! He is full of Crap.. Cheques can clear within days and western union is same day.

    3 weeks? Haha

    The truth is he is a very cautious seller and that is why he waits that amount of time and why he does not take paypal.

    I personally would not buy from someone who told me to wait 3 weeks.....just saying!

    #11 4 years ago

    As a buyer, I prefer to use personal checks. I ask the seller to put a unique mark on the front of the check before the deposit it.

    Then once the check has cleared my account, I send the seller a digital copy of the front and back of the check. The seller can confirm the unique mark as well as their signature.

    This has worked for me 100%. It also gives the seller peace of mind that the funds have indeed cleared. Then the seller will typically allow a 3rd party shipper to pick up the game much sooner than 3 weeks.

    As a seller, I will accept personal checks as well. I request the same level of service.

    Hope this helps!

    Marcus

    #12 4 years ago
    Quoted from LouisXV:

    Dont listen to this guy! He is full of Crap.. Cheques can clear within days and western union is same day.
    3 weeks? Haha
    The truth is he is a very cautious seller and that is why he waits that amount of time and why he does not take paypal.
    I personally would not buy from someone who told me to wait 3 weeks.....just saying!

    Wow, you are incorrect. You get the money quickly as the bank is being nice but the actual check will not clear for some time. Had a security deposit check from my landlord bounce 2 weeks after cashing it. I had the money the next day after cashing. I have PNC who says that a deposited check will clear by the next morning. They are full of shit. Also do you happen to know who vid is?

    #13 4 years ago

    Check clearing is a bit confusing. It will often show up in your account well before it actually clears. That is the biggest scam there is. I still have a check from a motorcycle... the guy paid me more than I wanted and I only had to send him the difference. The guy seemed nice enough in his emails. That being said, I once bought a Corvette (car) using a cashiers check (with agreement from seller as I offered to bring cash). I got a cashiers check from my bank, Chase, which I thought would be fine as it is a huge bank. Well, turns out they do not have a Chase in rural PA. His bank told him that it would have to go through 2 reserves before it clears. Here I am Friday before Memorial Day weekend, ready to drive the car home to WI. I was able to take the car, but I'm sure that was an uncomfortable weekend for the seller.

    #14 4 years ago
    Quoted from LouisXV:

    Cheques can clear within days

    You are sadly misinformed and are ripe to be ripped off.

    Federal regulations require that banks make check funds available within 48 hours.

    But the actual check has not cleared yet.

    When the check bounces 3 weeks later, your account gets the money the bank "advanced" to you subtracted and you get a $38 bounced check fee.

    -

    That is how those fake Cashier's Checks and Money Order scams work on people like you:

    You deposit the check.

    A day or so latter the funds are "available".

    You believe that "available" means the check has cleared (very incorrect), so you send the item.

    3 weeks later the check actually bounces.

    You get a chargeback from your bank for the full amount AND $38 for the bounced check.

    You become another ripped off know-it-all; congratulations.

    #15 4 years ago
    Quoted from LouisXV:

    I personally would not buy from someone who told me to wait 3 weeks.

    .

    Quoted from vid1900:

    If a buyer does not understand that payment has to clear before I send the game, that is a buyer I don't want to sell to.

    #16 4 years ago

    Listen to what Vid is saying. I had a Flipper Pool for sale and a guy offered me a cashier's check. I said fine but then did some research and the only safe way to go with cashier's checks is to go with the buyer to his bank and witness the check being issued which is usually not practical or wait the 3 weeks. I told the buyer that I was going to wait the full 3 wks after receiving the check and I never heard from him again. Pretty sure it was a scam.

    #17 4 years ago
    Quoted from LouisXV:

    Dont listen to this guy! He is full of Crap.. Cheques can clear within days and western union is same day.
    3 weeks? Haha
    The truth is he is a very cautious seller and that is why he waits that amount of time and why he does not take paypal.

    Are you a scammer?

    #18 4 years ago
    Quoted from vid1900:

    Wire Transfers can be faked by them Overnighting a forged check directly to your bank. Your bank deposits it first thing in the morning, you see the deposit believing it to be a Wire Transfer. 3 weeks later the check bounces and your account is dinged for the amount + $38 bounced check fee.

    Isn't it possible to confirm with the bank that an actual wire transfer occurred? I am still trying to understand if there is a way of doing this safely that does not involve waiting three weeks.

    #19 4 years ago
    Quoted from vid1900:

    You are sadly misinformed and are ripe to be ripped off.
    Federal regulations require that banks make check funds available within 48 hours.
    But the actual check has not cleared yet.
    When the check bounces 3 weeks later, your account gets the money the bank "advanced" to you subtracted and you get a $38 bounced check fee.
    -
    That is how those fake Cashier's Checks and Money Order scams work on people like you:
    You deposit the check.
    A day or so latter the funds are "available".
    You believe that "available" means the check has cleared (very incorrect), so you send the item.
    3 weeks later the check actually bounces.
    You get a chargeback from your bank for the full amount AND $38 for the bounced check.
    You become another ripped off know-it-all; congratulations.

    Wait...the person cashing the bad check gets a ($38) fee? How is that fair?

    #20 4 years ago

    Because it is their fault for accepting a bad check and cashing it. If you don't want to take that chance, don't accept a check as payment from someone you don't know.

    #21 4 years ago

    Anyone have any comments about problems with accepting US postal money orders as payment? I think you can call and verify with USPO that the money order is valid. But they can be cancelled by the purchaser if they submit a form and say it was lost/destroyed.

    "Verify - Call the money order verification system at 866-459-7822."

    I am wondering what the timeline is like and if the USPO is on the ball enough to let you promptly know when a money order has been cancelled.

    Like if a seller bought and immediately reported a money order as destroyed and asks for a reissue, causing the original money order to be void, which the buyer could still send to you.

    #22 4 years ago

    I won't deal with anyone that won't talk to me on the phone. I get a chance to feel them out. Other than seeing several methods posted here that I would accept, there are some that will not be satisfied with anything but cash.

    #23 4 years ago

    Western union both parties can have the deal done within a day.

    Buyer finds a retailer that accepts western union. He then pays x amount and fills in the form with sellers details.

    The buyer then recieves a code that he gives to the seller. The seller can then walk into any wu retailer and get the cash on the same day.

    No need for cheques.

    #24 4 years ago
    Quoted from LouisXV:

    Western union both parties can have the deal done within a day.

    What are the fees for using WU?

    #25 4 years ago
    Quoted from Craig:

    Isn't it possible to confirm with the bank that an actual wire transfer occurred?

    You can speak directly with a bank MANAGER and explain your concerns.

    A bank TELLER will just tell you that the funds have been deposited.

    #26 4 years ago
    Quoted from Roo:

    Wait...the person cashing the bad check gets a ($38) fee? How is that fair?

    It's not.

    That's why I tell people who want to deposit those scammy checks "just in case it's real", not to do it.

    Those who still believe get a $38 lesson.

    #27 4 years ago
    Quoted from mg81:

    Anyone have any comments about problems with accepting US postal money orders as payment?

    The main problem with the USPS MOs is that the post office never seems to have more than $100 on hand to cash them. So you end up depositing them at your bank and waiting 3 weeks anyway.

    The max money order is $1000 - so on a pin, you might get several of them.

    If they turn out to be fakes, you get a $38 fee for each MO that bounces, LOL.

    #28 4 years ago
    Quoted from pdman:

    What are the fees for using WU?

    Last year when I sent $5000 to my GF, they charged $275 in fees.

    (BTW, WU wanted my GFs actual Social Security Card to pick up such a large sum. Not just the number, but the actual physical card - if you don't know where your card actually is, that could be a problem)

    #29 4 years ago

    Thanks for the feedback, guys. I guess the bottom line is payment needs to truly clear before shipping...period.

    #30 4 years ago

    So what's the safest option, wire transfer?

    #31 4 years ago
    Quoted from Kkuoppamaki:

    So what's wrong with a wire transfer?

    Nothing is wrong with it, if it is a real transfer and not the overnight check trick.

    Although in the USA it is expensive ($30-40 at my bank), in Europe it is often less than a Euro.

    #32 4 years ago

    Email Money Transfer is the best option IMO
    EMT
    instant, inexpensive ($1.25 per transaction. Maximum $3000 per transaction)
    and irreversible.

    #33 4 years ago

    What about a certified bank check or a cashier's check? Don't those take less than 3 weeks to clear?

    #34 4 years ago
    Quoted from ForceFlow:

    What about a certified bank check or a cashier's check? Don't those take less than 3 weeks to clear?

    Those are faked all the time.

    They still take 3 weeks to bounce back as counterfeit.

    (although, if the bank that issued it is the same corporation as the one cashing it, it can clear in a few days (i.e. both banks are BOA).

    #35 4 years ago

    Good grief, it sounds like there is no quick, easy, and inexpensive way to send money to someone. This really surprises me.

    #36 4 years ago

    I've used PayPal to buy machines several times. I'm not going to buy something then claim I haven't, but on the other end, if you send someone a large check, wait for it to clear, what recourse do you have if they don't send anything, no recourse, period.

    #37 4 years ago
    Quoted from shimoda:

    I've used PayPal to buy machines several times. I'm not going to buy something then claim I haven't, but on the other end, if you send someone a large check, wait for it to clear, what recourse do you have if they don't send anything, no recourse, period.

    I was wondering this exact same thing. Is PayPal not fair to both buyers and sellers? As a buyer, I would have a really hard time giving a large amount of cash without receiving the goods at the same time. You never know what might happen. The seller could be a scammer (though, unlikely if they have a good reputation on pinside); the seller could get hit by a bus right after cashing the check; etc. It seems that there should be a way where both sides are covered with the risk mitigated. Otherwise, one is always going to have to be at the mercy of the other.

    #38 4 years ago

    Paypal is great if you are the BUYER.

    It is a nightmare if you are the SELLER.

    #39 4 years ago

    How about an Escrow account, where one can deposit the money, once it is known the money clears, then the seller ships the Pin. When the buyer gets it, the seller gets his cash.
    Probably something wrong with this as well but just throwing it out there.

    #40 4 years ago
    Quoted from pdman:

    How about an Escrow account, where one can deposit the money, once it is known the money clears, then the seller ships the Pin. When the buyer gets it, the seller gets his cash.
    Probably something wrong with this as well but just throwing it out there.

    I own an escrow company, the fastest way to scare off a buyer is to mention you can escrow the game.
    Too many escrow scams out there.

    #41 4 years ago
    Quoted from vid1900:

    Paypal is great if you are the BUYER.
    It is a nightmare if you are the SELLER.

    Only if the Buyer is a shyster

    #42 4 years ago
    Quoted from pdman:

    How about an Escrow account

    Those are good.

    High end audiophiles have been using https://escrow.com/ for many years.

    Both parties are protected.

    #43 4 years ago
    Quoted from shimoda:

    Only if the Buyer is a shyster

    Those are the bad ones. They steal from you.

    #44 4 years ago
    Quoted from tracelifter:

    I own an escrow company, the fastest way to scare off a buyer is to mention you can escrow the game.
    Too many escrow scams out there.

    Quoted from vid1900:

    pdman said:

    How about an Escrow account

    Those are good.

    High end audiophiles have been using https://escrow.com/ for many years.

    Both parties are protected.

    More confused than ever!

    #45 4 years ago
    Quoted from pdman:

    More confused than ever!

    Real escrow (and you only want to use https://escrow.com/ - the rest seem to be scams), works like this:

    1. Buyer sends the check to the Escrow - they verify and cash it.
    2. Seller sends you the game - you check it out and report back to Escrow that it is good.
    3. Escrow sends funds to the seller.

    Escrow gets $160 on a $5000 purchase. Not too bad for piece of mind. Autos, Audio Equipment, Art - all use Escrow.

    -----Again, don't go using any other escrow service, even if the seller says he gets a discount "because he uses it so much...". Stick with the real deal.-----

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