(Topic ID: 228025)

Let's design a new Bally/Stern Classic game > Time to talk design...

By Whysnow

5 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 163 posts
  • 56 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 5 years ago by wugly
  • Topic is favorited by 11 Pinsiders

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    Topic poll

    “What theme do you like best?”

    • mythical beasts 31 votes
      11%
    • alien creatures 24 votes
      9%
    • underwater 44 votes
      16%
    • space/time travel 54 votes
      19%
    • outerspace 46 votes
      16%
    • wizards 24 votes
      9%
    • boardsports 4 votes
      1%
    • greek 7 votes
      2%
    • hot chicks 47 votes
      17%

    (Multiple choice - 281 votes by 162 Pinsiders)

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    There are 163 posts in this topic. You are on page 2 of 4.
    #51 5 years ago

    This topic confuses me.

    #52 5 years ago

    Something wacky, alien, and spacey. I'd say something like Asteroid Annie, but more fun.

    #53 5 years ago
    Quoted from FatPanda:

    Yes same! Exposed pop bumpers for sure. Maybe double flippers (ala Paragon, Harlem Globetrotters, or Alien Poker)

    I almost put down exposed pop bumpers, but wasn't sure on the exact terminology that I wanted to use. For me, they don't need to be exposed, but they have to interact with the game. Exposing them is one way to accomplish this interaction, but I think there are other examples, such as needing to use the bumpers to knock down other targets.

    I'd be okay to never see double flippers again.

    #54 5 years ago

    Space Wizards.

    #55 5 years ago
    Quoted from lpeters82:

    I'd be okay to never see double flippers again.

    I'll second that!! Just don't see the point since you can make the shots with the normal flippers.

    #56 5 years ago

    I always thought a sequel to Williams' Sorcerer would have made for a cool theme, something like "Sorcerer II: The Necromancer". No reason it wouldn't have fit in just as well with the lineup of other Bally SS mythological themes. You'd have a wealth of material about the undead to draw on, and I don't believe a theme along the lines of necromancy has been done before, except in a tongue-in-cheek way like Bone Busters or Ghostbusters, or a license like Walking Dead or Dracula.

    #57 5 years ago

    Classic design:

    2 parts Mpu 200
    1 part bally 81
    Sprinkle of post double level williams

    Edgy Playfield, edgy art, mirroring, robot laser fat analog sounds... And voice. Alpha numeric as the maximum level of technology

    Hot chicks in space
    hot wizard chicks
    Space with wizards
    Robot baboons
    Hot robot jungle escape
    Cosmic strangely erotic goo
    Skulls for no reason, or for a reason, doesn't matter

    I can get into any combination.

    #58 5 years ago

    I like the topic.....

    Space type theme - aliens and weird creatures with a 5th Element story collect the elements

    Roadkill type of theme - fix a car and travel across the states and see how far you get but what up grades you collect and upgrade your car, adventures

    Masons - mystery, treasure, like a National Treasure type twist

    #59 5 years ago

    Animal sex

    #60 5 years ago

    How about a theme about a Rock band that turns into monsters?

    #61 5 years ago

    The time travel idea could have some cool features. How bout different modes - representing different time periods - where lighting and music changes to match that period. And scoring could be affected - say you shoot the wrong mode and end up in the 20's where points are deflated to represent what scoring would have been like in the day (50 cents in the 20's you'd be Oprah rich). But then you could do something difficult and end up in the future where score values are a plenty!

    Just as long as it's an original theme - maybe i'm a minority but I'd rather pay for an artists time to design something original, rather than just pay for a license and slap on some shitty clip-art.

    #62 5 years ago

    I voted board sports and hot chicks, two themes that have been severely lacking in pinball lately.

    The other fairy/ fantasy themes have been beat into the ground already.

    New movie out called Mid 90s supposedly covers both these themes. Haven't seen it yet though.

    #63 5 years ago
    Quoted from Whysnow:

    Hot alien wizard-type chicks that are taking control of mythical lizard/beast man (on another planet of course)

    might work if the code is good.

    #64 5 years ago
    Quoted from chubtoad13:

    Time travel and space stuff are my favorites

    top two themes for me as well

    -1
    #65 5 years ago

    Ideas for pinball that are WAY OUT there...

    Phobia! A machine based on things people are afraid of... like Luposlipaphobia... the fear of being chased by wolves around a newly waxed kitchen floor while wearing socks... my apologies to Gary Larson.

    And that American Horror story honey comb phobia... Trypophobia. That one, at the the right time and the right texture and the right color, I have a little of that.... it repulses more than it makes me fear it, though. So could you imagine a mode where you have to look at a mini screen like di or gb and shoot at pictures of the things you fear? Fear of flying video mode... Use that BG display and really go to town. Not to mention fear of heights (shoot the ramp), and show progressivly higher pictures on bg...

    I did say way out there....

    #66 5 years ago
    Quoted from o-din:

    I voted board sports and hot chicks, two themes that have been severely lacking in pinball lately.
    The other fairy/ fantasy themes have been beat into the ground already.
    New movie out called Mid 90s supposedly covers both these themes. Haven't seen it yet though.

    Big Dick 2

    -1
    #67 5 years ago

    Thinking about that idea... Phobia... hmm... Face your Fears... get bigger points. Choosing a fear and facing it... some fears (rational) could be worth more than phobias (irrational) or vice versa... let the player choose his fear and rate his/her fear of it (1 to 5 scale?) and then attempt to overcome it... how hard the combos are to complete based on their choice, 1 is easy,but not owrth much points, 5 being a bitch to complete but worth the $$$... spider toy, snake toy,
    Fear of the dark... all lights go out... just the display is lit up... this stuff writes itself....

    Phobia! Scared Stiff II? Or American Horror Story I?

    #68 5 years ago

    Mad Libs: The Pinball. :p

    #69 5 years ago

    the matrix!

    #70 5 years ago

    Long time no see EalaDubhSidhe from the VP days... same Bublehead as before.

    #71 5 years ago

    Robotron 2084 The pinball

    #72 5 years ago
    Quoted from arcademojo:

    I'll second that!! Just don't see the point since you can make the shots with the normal flippers.

    It's not about making certain shots from the double flippers, it's about the threat that the gap creates! No trapping, just solid flipper skills from that side.

    #73 5 years ago
    Quoted from FatPanda:

    It's not about making certain shots from the double flippers, it's about the threat that the gap creates! No trapping, just solid flipper skills from that side.

    That's fine and dandy until you have to pay for a flipper rebuild on these games.

    #74 5 years ago

    Mythical beasts

    #75 5 years ago
    Quoted from arcademojo:

    That's fine and dandy until you have to pay for a flipper rebuild on these games.

    I have. And it's not a huge deal.
    4 flippers on Paragon
    3 flippers on Flash Gordon
    2 flippers on Frontier

    #76 5 years ago

    As a person used to NOT playing with double flippers, nasty trapping and cupping habits bite me endlessly for my first few games... then you start really reaching for that 1970’s muscle memory, and if it wasn’t wiped out by now by all the mind altering substances, or with the help of some, who knows?, you finally settle down and play like a man with one hand tied behind his back and your scores start climbing back up to decent. You definitely are forced by the double right flippers to rely on your weaker left hand (for the majority, sorry south paws) and this is exactly why a designer might choose this arrangement. Push you out of your right handed comfort zone. Do it to both sides? Um, ouch, I can feel the blade on my neck before I plunge the ball. And speaking on Paragon, does anyone else remember just how long a ball it takes to complete Paragon with weak flippers? I hate thumper bumpers in outlanes. I’ll just say it. Yes, they have been the reason for some really interesting saves and much chiding has been thrown down while a ball is trapped precariously thump thump thumping just a couple of degrees off pure sudden death, and yeah, I’ve been on the receiving side of it once too often. But I was also shoveling quarters into this machine back then too. Many an operator I am sure has some fond memories of opening the coin box on a Paragon.

    #77 5 years ago

    You know, it's just possible someone may be way ahead of this whole thread on ALL of the above.

    #78 5 years ago

    Based on the poll Space/time travel, Mythical Beasts, and Underwater all seem to be the clear winners.

    I think we go with some type of half woman/ half lizard type central character (female and attractive). This hints at being underwater/evolved from underwater and also has human characteristics (we need our central characters to be identifiable and good looking after all; scale type armour for part of her body but obvious female features). Let's also be equal opportunity and while the central character is the hot lizard woman, her main buddy will be the mythical man beast (thinking large, hairy and cute in that ugly self deprecating sort of way). They are working together to defeat an evil overlord of a planet they have time (or space)-traveled to.

    Working title>> TBD at a later date.

    Sounds like a fun theme to me Art will be key! Wondering if Paul Ferris is available for hire?

    #79 5 years ago

    So let's get into design. Only so much room on the pf but lot's of great features to borrow from (and modify) on the classics many of us love.

    What features do you see on your perfect retro classic game made for 2018?

    Let's look at some pics of the aforementioned classics to start talking it out.

    9 ball (resized).jpg9 ball (resized).jpgCentaur (resized).jpgCentaur (resized).jpgEBD (resized).jpgEBD (resized).jpgEmbryon (resized).jpgEmbryon (resized).jpgFathom (resized).jpegFathom (resized).jpegFrontier (resized).jpgFrontier (resized).jpgMedusa (resized).jpgMedusa (resized).jpgMeteor (resized).jpgMeteor (resized).jpgQS (resized).jpgQS (resized).jpgSG (resized).jpgSG (resized).jpgSeaW (resized).JPGSeaW (resized).JPGSkate (resized).jpgSkate (resized).jpg
    #80 5 years ago

    Inline drops FTW

    #81 5 years ago

    I think there are a few clear must haves:
    Must have inline drops (really needs to be the Danessi Lock system as this uses the drops super efficiently and allows you to have real active locks and also the satisfaction of inline drops) With coding you could even utilize these in a unique way to give them a different feel (thinking in an orbit and since controlled you could do lots with them).
    Must have at least 1 spinner, but 2 is preferred.
    Must have at least 1 3-bank of drops
    Must have at least 1 exposed pop

    I think the first question in my mind is what kind of bottom do we like best?

    Traditional (i.e. 9-ball, EBD, Frontier, Metero, QS, SeaW)
    Or non-traditional (i.e. Centaur, Embryon, Fathom, Medusa, SG, Skateball)

    I see big things I like about both and personally would like to see something that is a mix with one more traditional side lane and the other requires a nudge back. The traditional provides more flow and allows for interesting flipper play. The non-traditional with a nudge back keep you on your toes and provides some flavor.

    #82 5 years ago

    Cool thread idea Whysnow.

    It hasn't been mentioned in here, but I know there's been some past talk about Ben Heck's desire to come out with a Bible based pin. I think a Bible based pin would be simply amazing. With so much content to draw from, you'd never run out of ideas and never have to pay for a license.

    For a licensed theme, Jaws. 'Nuff said.

    Subways, upkickers and drop targets...Always a good thing.

    #83 5 years ago

    I would absolutely NOT use the Danesi lock when its use was created so recently and you want this 'ideal' game to have its own personality.

    There are also plenty of old devices that haven't had a mention. Don't know why you're restricting it to Bally/Stern type and ignoring the potential of roto-targets, kicking targets, spinning posts and the like.

    #84 5 years ago
    Quoted from Whysnow:

    Traditional (i.e. 9-ball, EBD, Frontier, Metero, QS, SeaW)

    My vote!

    #85 5 years ago

    Let's talk BoM. How much should we be willing to 'spend' on this hypothetical game? Is the point of the exercise mere wish-fulfilment, or is it intended to be thought of as though it could be a viable low-run production game at a sensible price, with all the restrictions that entails?

    #86 5 years ago

    Fireball 3 is one I have often envisioned. Where multi-ball becomes a hindrance to gameplay, rather then a virtue.
    Like in life where some entity is throwing roadblocks at you every step of the way.
    A Combat, wild west sort of play where you really accomplish something. The goal is to hit targets, rollovers, etc. to AVOID multi-ball and keep from getting slammed. Have a book-ball unit loaded with 4-6 balls just waiting to drop and begin SUBTRACTING points, all drains close off until you hit the right targets to open them.

    #87 5 years ago
    Quoted from EalaDubhSidhe:

    Let's talk BoM. How much should we be willing to 'spend' on this hypothetical game? Is the point of the exercise mere wish-fulfilment, or is it intended to be thought of as though it could be a viable low-run production game at a sensible price, with all the restrictions that entails?

    I'm thinking bom not to exceed $3500- ,that leaves a little room to go over budget by $500 but hopefully not and sell it for say $6000. That leaves a little bit of profit unless this is more for profit, then bom has to come way down to coincide.
    -Mike

    #88 5 years ago

    How 'exposed' should the pops be? Do you just mean plenty of space, or directly shootable, or capable of gobbing the ball down the middle?

    #89 5 years ago
    Quoted from EalaDubhSidhe:

    capable of gobbing the ball down the middle?

    A gobble hole! Haven't seen that on a new machine. Some folks would go nuts over that experience.
    -Mike

    #90 5 years ago

    not interested in BOM. Interested in the fun of building an imaginary game on a forum.

    Please dont take the fun out of this

    Back to design.
    What do people like on the bottom and why?

    For me a nudgeback is just so sweet! I think Centaur probably is the best nudge back but I dont like how a ball coming through the inlane can bounce a bit as it rattles off the 1 way gate. I wonder if there could be a better way to design that in a more modern feel where it could be the best of both worlds?

    #91 5 years ago

    Are you thinking made up themes or real themes?

    If so, this would be a perfect board sports theme that suits the feel of the era.

    I know not many on pinside voted board sports, but what do you expect out of this crowd?

    dtzboyz (resized).jpgdtzboyz (resized).jpg
    #92 5 years ago

    Did interest in this thread fizzle when it stopped being taken seriously as an exercise that took into consideration all the steps and limitations necessary to create something potentially 'real'?

    #93 5 years ago

    Well this topic died on its arse all of a sudden. Going to try and breathe some life back into it by dusting off one of my old designs from the Heighway days, squeezing it into the classic single-level Bally size and tinkering with it to tick all the design boxes brought up in the thread.

    #94 5 years ago
    Quoted from EalaDubhSidhe:

    Well this topic died on its arse all of a sudden. Going to try and breathe some life back into it by dusting off one of my old designs from the Heighway days, squeezing it into the classic single-level Bally size and tinkering with it to tick all the design boxes brought up in the thread.

    awesome!

    Would love to see it!

    #95 5 years ago

    Could you utilise the apron area like Blackwater100 ? Thats gives you a little more room to add some sort of ramp feature?

    #96 5 years ago

    It's going to be single-level to keep the 'classic' period style, but it will be a more unconventional sort of layout. No ramps on this version, won't need them - the more sophisticated 46-inch 'modern' build, were it ever made, would already cater for that in its own way.

    #97 5 years ago
    Quoted from Whysnow:

    I think there are a few clear must haves:
    Must have inline drops (really needs to be the Danessi Lock system as this uses the drops super efficiently and allows you to have real active locks and also the satisfaction of inline drops) With coding you could even utilize these in a unique way to give them a different feel (thinking in an orbit and since controlled you could do lots with them).

    Quoted from EalaDubhSidhe:

    I would absolutely NOT use the Danesi lock when its use was created so recently and you want this 'ideal' game to have its own personality.

    If the goal is an updated classic, I don't see anything wrong with adding items like the Danessi Lock. It basically takes an in-line drop target and adds versatility. I'm not 100% sure if that is the direction Jack Danger is going, but it certainly looks as if he's working on a version of the Danessi Lock in that right orbit. I assume there must be a diverter at the top of that right orbit too. I think that's a great idea as the one shot could be used as an orbit, in-line drop targets, ball lock, or dead end shot. Not exactly a feature of classic games, but I do enjoy when the same shot has multiple uses.

    pasted_image (resized).pngpasted_image (resized).png

    Photo from Dead Flip Pinball Streaming: https://www.facebook.com/DeadFlip/

    #98 5 years ago
    Quoted from Whysnow:

    I think the first question in my mind is what kind of bottom do we like best?
    Traditional (i.e. 9-ball, EBD, Frontier, Metero, QS, SeaW)
    Or non-traditional (i.e. Centaur, Embryon, Fathom, Medusa, SG, Skateball)
    I see big things I like about both and personally would like to see something that is a mix with one more traditional side lane and the other requires a nudge back. The traditional provides more flow and allows for interesting flipper play. The non-traditional with a nudge back keep you on your toes and provides some flavor.

    Again, not a Bally/Stern classic, but Indiana Jones: The Pinball Adventure has my ideal inlane / outlane. It's fun to save a ball, but not to the point where you have super long ball times. I also like how it's used to feed balls from the Idol. That reminds me of the inlane balls crossing the outlane in Fathom.

    #99 5 years ago

    I feel the Danesi lock limits the number of ways a multiball can start though. Rules and mechanics-wise, it's designed for one purpose which it does brilliantly. It's also a 'trademark' device, and the last thing I'd want to do is 'challenge' Scott on his own terms with ideas he came up with. That's just begging for failure.

    #100 5 years ago

    I don't think those in-lines on Jack Danger's game are being employed as a Danesi lock: you need more space in between each target, and each one needs to be a separate single-drop mechanism rather than being one complete unit. (Another reason I wouldn't use it: makes the BoM more expensive, especially if you're already committed to using drops elsewhere.)

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