Laser War Club

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By joetechbob

3 years ago


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  • Started 3 years ago
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  • Latest reply 1 week ago by fmofmpls

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#1 3 years ago

I've spent a fair amount of time fixing up my Laser War, so I wanted to document some of my findings in a central location.

1) Have a dead Rev 1 or Rev 2 MPU? Convert a Rev 3 Data East MPU board to be Laser War compatible as fully documented in the following thread: http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/laser-war-not-fully-booting

2) Have significant ball bounce on transition from return frame to flipper in the inlanes? Pick up a set of High Speed return lane guides from Cliffy as documented in the following thread: http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/laser-war-flipper-return-frame-replacements-cliffys-frames-for-hs#post-1390827

3) Want an amazing light show experience? Install LEDs throughout the game. I used bulbs from pinballbulbs.com, including flashers. WELL worth the investment of time and money--Laser War has a top-notch light show and the LEDs give it some extra pop. I also went with red/blue/warm white GI in the red/blue/yellow team areas--adds nice ambiance in my opinion. See a nice example of Laser War with LEDs here: http://pinballsoul.com/laser-war-pinball-gameplay-video/

4) Having ball bounce out from base shots? Add felt pads to the metal stoppers on the red, yellow and blue bases. On my machine I was also seeing significant bounce out of good shots to the yellow base. I added a blue rubber pad (http://www.pinballlife.com/index.php?p=product&id=689) *adjacent* to the metal stopper, attached to the metal lane guide that feeds to the WAR rollovers. What I found was that many shots came through, struck the metal lane (instead of feeding to the saucer) and bounced out. With the blue pad, hard shots tend to deaden out and fall into the saucer. I might at some point attempt to cut a 45 degree angle into the blue pad to further encourage the ball to deflect into the saucer.

5) *Some* folks recommend replacing the stock "walnut cracking" flippers. I found that I actually enjoy mine--just make sure that the game is at 6.5 degrees slope or steeper.

6) Need a new ramp? MAD amusements has them for $45: http://mad-amusements.com/product.php?id_product=321

7) Display out? Pick up a XP-WMS10877 set from xpin...Wonderful product (I went with red): http://xpinpinball.com/products/displays/XP-WMS10877

#2 3 years ago

I need to get on items 2, 4, and 6. I wouldn't have known how to deal with any of these as well as you have laid it out, so thanks very much!

#3 3 years ago

I don't own this game, but would like to. My buddy owned it for a while and I had it my house for a month or two while I shopped it out. I had a great time playing it and loved the light show. Here are some pics I took of it while I had it.

IMG_2035.jpg IMG_2039.jpg IMG_2041.jpg IMG_2042.jpg IMG_2054.jpg IMG_2056.jpg IMG_2077.jpg IMG_2080.JPG IMG_2081.JPG
#4 3 years ago

Hello! Good notes!

I JUST picked up my first pin, and it's Laser War. It's in very good shape, especially for the deal I received.

1. Here is an ODDITY, there are no stereo speakers in this unit. The only wired speaker is the sub, and all sounds are coming mono out of the bottom of the cabinet. The unit was shopped by someone about 5-6 years ago to my knowledge, and I'm not sure why the speakers would have ever been removed. I plan on hopping into the schematics with my brother to figure it out, but there aren't even any mounts for speakers in the head - just nothing. It is the original sound board though. All three amps are there.

Is it possible to get a snapshot of the stereo speaker mount inside your head so I can see how it came from the factory? So weird.

2. The only other strange thing is the bumpers. They don't appear to have active lamps, but all videos I see of LW have lamps in the bumpers. The user manual doesn't actually mark any lamps in the bumpers. Is this just a mod that everyone does? http://screencast.com/t/6qnGMldk

These are noob questions, but the stereo speaker thing just blows my mind.

#5 3 years ago

Hi Stemage,

in my bumpers are #44 bulbs and it looks like they are factory sealed. I can't open your link at this moment so I can't see, what your pictures show.

So just look under the bumper caps, if there are bulbs and if they were out of order...

Be careful removing the bumper caps, they aren't screwed so you have to pull them up with a lot of attention, so the plastic pins won't break...

You can replace the bulbs although with #47 bulbs to need less energy. In my Laser War i use a red, blue and green bulb so the bumpers light more effectful.

Greetings from germany,

Dirk

#6 3 years ago
Quoted from Stemage:

Is it possible to get a snapshot of the stereo speaker mount inside your head so I can see how it came from the factory? So weird.

Nothing really interesting here--the game uses 4"x10" size speakers, with the speaker hole patterns matching up with the holes on the main plastic housing. Perforated black plastic is used as a speaker grille...If you can find a sheet of it just cut it down to size.

There is, however, a bracket with light sockets for illuminating the "Digital Stereo" sign in between the speakers...If you don't have that you can probably throw something together to make it work.

#7 3 years ago

4"x10"!? Really? Those are HUGE. The replacement kit only has 4" speakers. Interesting. They would certainly sound better. Or at least 4"x6"s.

Thanks man.

4 weeks later
#8 3 years ago

Hello all! What inclination do you keep your tables? I started with 6.5%, but the ball was draining in every direction. I bumped it up a bit, and the steeper I go the better my scores seem to get. I'm just wondering if you all keep this table a little steeper than your others?

2 weeks later
#9 2 years ago

Just a smidge over 6.5 IIRC

Stock flipper coils?

1 month later
#10 2 years ago

I just got a Laser War as my first machine, and have been working on cleaning it up and fixing some issues. Thanks for the tip on the pads for the Bases. I was getting a lot of ball bouncing back out too.

Question though, how do you access the area behind the back, where the shooter lane goes? There are three flasher. I was wanting to replace those, and also clean that wire form. But I don't really see an easy way to do it. I thought I'd be able to remove that back plastic, but I have two screws behind the wood rail of the playfield. I wouldn't be able to get to those screws without removing that.

#11 2 years ago

Finally getting my board issues straight. Can't wait to actually play a game. All I have been able to do is watch videos of others. It sure looks fun. Woody I haven't broken mine down yet so not sure.

#12 2 years ago

Tokkentakker, I kinda figured it out. There are 3 flashers and 2 #44's. I didn't actually know there were #44 back there until I took a photo with my phone to get a better look at what it looks like behind it. Looked like they were the original bulbs since '87. Basically, you have to lift up the playfield half way. The flashers you can get too from the top. And the #44's you can access from the bottom. You can't see what you're doing, and you have to lean in pretty far to access them, but they are reachable. But looks like if you wanted to take out the ramp, you have to lift the playfield out of the cabinet. I tried to remove the ramp, and it doesn't come out when its in the cabinet.

Also to the OP, Joetechbob. In the upper playfield, you have your one way gate next to WAR the same way my machine came. After I took mine apart, I noticed the gate fit much better when mounted to the hole adjacent to the right. No more balls slip through. And after doing some image searching for other machines, I saw that someone had the gate mounted under the plastic. See the notch cut out to the right? Thats for the ball gate. It made sense now.

But was wondering why mine and yours both were mounted incorrectly? User error when putting back together, or was it an oversight from when they built the machine? Either way, no more balls can slip through now.

Edit. Doh, realized the photos weren't from OP. They were from Gov.

#13 2 years ago

Question for the spinner targets. The arm that goes down below the playfield, goes through a hole. That hole is divided by a guide rail. When I got my machine, the arm connected to the spinner and the switch was on the inside of the guardrail inside the play area. One arm was bent, the other was still good. After cleaning the machine, I decided that it was probably meant that the arm was supposed to go on the other side of the rail, so that it wasn't in the playfield area.

But I've noticed that its so tight, that it restricts the spinner from spinning freely.

So how are others set up? With the arm inside or outside the play area? How well do they spin?

2 weeks later
#14 2 years ago

Thought I would post this here in case anyone has seen this before and can throw some advice my way. I picked up a Laser War. Great shape. Story is that it was in a bar for a few years and then the bar owners took it home when they closed the bar and it never got used. Anyway, the previous owner who bought it said it only beeped when he powered it up, nothing else. He had borygard repair the MPU and now it says Laser War on boot up, but after about 10 seconds it shuts off. I haven't looked at it yet, going to check voltages and such. Just thought I would ask if anyone else had a similar problem and if so, what fixed it for you. Any help appreciated. Thanks.

Also, does anyone have or has anyone seen the topper before?

http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/1987-data-east-lazer-war-topper

#15 2 years ago

The audio board will always say "Laser war" on boot--you can completely unhook the MPU and it won't change.

Anything else happen? What "shuts off" after 10 seconds? Are you saying that it keeps repeating "Laser War" over and over for 10 seconds? If so, I would guess that your power supply has a low 5V supply. Bust out the multimeter and check.

#16 2 years ago
Quoted from joetechbob:

The audio board will always say "Laser war" on boot--you can completely unhook the MPU and it won't change.
Anything else happen? What "shuts off" after 10 seconds? Are you saying that it keeps repeating "Laser War" over and over for 10 seconds? If so, I would guess that your power supply has a low 5V supply. Bust out the multimeter and check.

I'll find out. Right now the cab is at an operator friend's house. He was going to take a look at it for me.

#17 2 years ago
Quoted from joetechbob:

The audio board will always say "Laser war" on boot--you can completely unhook the MPU and it won't change.
Anything else happen? What "shuts off" after 10 seconds? Are you saying that it keeps repeating "Laser War" over and over for 10 seconds? If so, I would guess that your power supply has a low 5V supply. Bust out the multimeter and check.

Ok, talked to him and he said when you turn it on it says Laser War and then just beeps over and over. It never turns off, just keeps beeping...

#18 2 years ago

What do the three status lights show on the MPU board? I'm trying to remember if the beep means checksum failure on the ROM...

Do you or your tech have access to an EPROM burner? If everything is looking good (PSU, etc.), I would recommend throwing in some test ROMs which will give you much more detailed diagnostic info.

#19 2 years ago

Yeah, I can get roms burned locally if needed. I'll ask about the lights.

#21 2 years ago

Ok joetechbob. I got a lot more info. I did pass your thread along to the op as well. Here is where we stand. You turn the game on and it says "Laser War" but does not show it on the display. The player one display has garbage on it and the other displays have nothing. The upper half of the gi comes on, but the lower half looks like it is off. After saying Laser Wars, the game beeps a few dozen times, stops for a few seconds and then does it again. For the indicator lights, the first board light comes on and then goes off, then other two stay on, which seems normal from what he has read. He checked voltages from the power supply board and they all read good. He was going to check the -12v to -5v conversion on the sound board I think it is, which apparently is a common issue. When that goes, it can fry chips apparently, but sound doesn't seem to be the big issue. With the game on, if he reseats the ribbon cables, he will get different sound effects and noises during the beeping. Also, the boards are the original rev 1 blue boards.

Help me joetechbob kenobi, you're my only hope...or anyone else that has any ideas...

#22 2 years ago

If anyone can help you it's joetechbob. He is the man when it comes to this game.

#23 2 years ago

The sound board in laser wars is its own computer. When it boots up it says "laser war." Your game CPU could be completely dead and the sound board would still say "laser war." I have a laser war and this is exactly what it was doing. The CPU was dead (turned out to be a dead processor).

So it may be best to not worry about the sounds until the game is properly booting into attract mode.

Parker

#24 2 years ago
Quoted from michiganpinball:

The sound board in laser wars is its own computer. When it boots up it says "laser war." Your game CPU could be completely dead and the sound board would still say "laser war." I have a Laser War and this is exactly what it was doing. The CPU was dead (turned out to be a dead processor).
So it may be best to not worry about the sounds until the game is properly booting into attract mode.
Parker

Yeah, he wasn't worried about the sounds yet, but that was pretty much all he was getting at this point. The MPU was repaired by Rob Anthony and apparently it was a mess, but should be working now. The previous owner had that done.

#25 2 years ago

Sorry--no magic bullet here. Just blood, sweat and tears. The good news is that Laser War is a great game so it's worth it.

I would start with the basics:

0) Double, triple and then quadruple check that the power supply is good. Not just that it's got +5, etc., but that it's a clean +5 without any crazy 60Hz harmonics or anything (use an oscilloscope or listen for hum coming through your audio amp--use sine wave generator on your phone to identify frequency of hum...if it's a multiple of 60Hz you may need to replace your line filter cap [the big one])...

1) Re-seat all socketed chips, cleaning any legs that look oxidized; carefully examine the board for any obvious defects (shorts, fried components, battery damage, etc.). Note any damage, if any. Anything that can be proven as defective at this point should be replaced (e.g., multimeter shows a component as bad or component appears to have been on fire at some point :). You could also do a basic sanity check and unhook CN14, CN13, CN12, CN11, CN10, CN8, CN7, CN6 (lamp matrix, switch matrix, special switches and solenoid drivers) to see if maybe there's a short somewhere that's somehow affecting the CPU board and/or software.

2) If no change, run the test ROMs, carefully following the instructions for checking each PIA when running Leon's ROM.

3) If the test ROMs show no failures you'll need to look at the schematics and try to determine what's going awry.

If you have a rev 3 board from another game you could run through the "rev 1 compatibility" conversion process, sans header modification (i.e., don't add the missing three pins), and see if it works--it can be easily "unconverted" if necessary.

#26 2 years ago

This game is da bomb. It's that true shit...

1 week later
#27 2 years ago
Quoted from joetechbob:

Sorry--no magic bullet here. Just blood, sweat and tears. The good news is that Laser War is a great game so it's worth it.
I would start with the basics:
0) Double, triple and then quadruple check that the power supply is good. Not just that it's got +5, etc., but that it's a clean +5 without any crazy 60Hz harmonics or anything (use an oscilloscope or listen for hum coming through your audio amp--use sine wave generator on your phone to identify frequency of hum...if it's a multiple of 60Hz you may need to replace your line filter cap [the big one])...
1) Re-seat all socketed chips, cleaning any legs that look oxidized; carefully examine the board for any obvious defects (shorts, fried components, battery damage, etc.). Note any damage, if any. Anything that can be proven as defective at this point should be replaced (e.g., multimeter shows a component as bad or component appears to have been on fire at some point :). You could also do a basic sanity check and unhook CN14, CN13, CN12, CN11, CN10, CN8, CN7, CN6 (lamp matrix, switch matrix, special switches and solenoid drivers) to see if maybe there's a short somewhere that's somehow affecting the CPU board and/or software.
2) If no change, run the test ROMs, carefully following the instructions for checking each PIA when running Leon's ROM.
3) If the test ROMs show no failures you'll need to look at the schematics and try to determine what's going awry.
If you have a rev 3 board from another game you could run through the "rev 1 compatibility" conversion process, sans header modification (i.e., don't add the missing three pins), and see if it works--it can be easily "unconverted" if necessary.

So there is a little progress...

Turns out that the previous owner must have put one of the ribbon cables on backwards. Fixing that now shows text on the displays instead of garbage. When the game starts it says Laser War and now shows it on the display too. Now, after that it goes into a continuous loop of the menu adjustment items, each one getting a beep with it. Anyone seen that before?

The op that is looking at the game for me thinks the jumpers may be wrong? He said from everything he has read online, there are different jumpers for the different boardsets. This is the single EEPROM original blue board and the jumper settings seem as though they are for the later revision board, but the jumpers are soldered on and they look original. I am attaching a pic of the board. Any other ideas on the jumper issue?

unnamed (22).jpg

#28 2 years ago

More progress. The new issue was that the game would show a test menu selection and beep, one after another. Borygard said this was because CN13 and CN14 were swapped. Sure enough, swapping those fixed that issue and the game looks like it boots like normal.

Now the only issue is that the game won't coin up or go into test mode. Anyone have any ideas on what would cause that? Thanks again for all the help, I think I can see the light at the end of the tunnel.

#29 2 years ago

Just picked one up. Will be going over it and cleaning it over the next week. Good reading here for sure.

2 weeks later
#30 2 years ago

Still messing with my Laser War. The latest thing I noticed is that the 3amp fuse on the 50volt coil power board is blown. When I replace it and turn the game on, the flipper coils energize for about 5 seconds and then the fuse blows again. Anyone have any idea what would cause that?

6 months later
#31 2 years ago

I have a broken Ion Cannon on my Laser War. I've found the replacement part, but it appears the part doesn't come with the decal. What to do?

#32 2 years ago

Where is the cannon available? I keep finding that it's out of stock. Anybody know where to get target switches in the correct translucent color disks? Found some blue but no yellow or red. Action has all 3 colors in the deep square style. Thinking I may have to go that route. $15 each though.

3 months later
#33 1 year ago

I'm working on mine. Going to replace my speakers. I see they are 4x10, what's the Ohm rating on it? I didn't see it marked on the speaker. Any recommendations on replacement, other than the complete $150 kits?

1 month later
#34 1 year ago

I've been willfully ignoring the urge to put time and money into my machine as I fear the slippery slope... but after seeing how people love and care and show off their machines at TPF this year I think that will change some. It's my first machine and deserves more.

I have some ideas about a custom topper to fabricate someday too since I'll never get an original. I'm so glad there is a club for this most excellent game.

1 month later
#35 1 year ago

I have a manual for sale if anyone is looking.

1 month later
#36 1 year ago

Hi everyone,
I recently came into a Laser War machine!
It seems to play well now with a little tweaking. There is only one major problem - the sounds are out of order and the talking comes on randomly (out of step with play) throughout the game.
For example, it always says "Last ball!" on every ball, and it will say "return to yellow base...return to blue base", etc." randomly throughout the game even when it is not part of what is happening. In fact, the talking is almost always happening, there is very little "just music" throughout the game?
Any thoughts of what that could be? FYI, the boards inside are blue, not green like some of them, if that helps.
I am not a tech in any sense of the word, but the game is not enjoyable to play right now, especially as I am trying to learn it and it is giving me false instructions!!
It appears an owner at some point did some repairs/mods (e.g. the battery) at some point. I can take pictures if that helps.
Thoughts?
Thanks!

1 week later
#37 1 year ago

Wife picked this game up for me for a gift. Played it for roughly 20 games - it's great! Game play keeps you interesting, and the multi-ball stage isn't easy.

Unfortunately, the out-hole solenoid locked on after those few games. Hoping the seller will hold up to his end of the deal and "make it right". If not, I'll be replacing boards and going through it in entirety.

#38 1 year ago
Quoted from chris1044:

Unfortunately, the out-hole solenoid locked on after those few games. Hoping the seller will hold up to his end of the deal and "make it right". If not, I'll be replacing boards and going through it in entirety.

That would be hard. If the game worked when you tested it, then it's not really his fault. It just went bad. Something you can't really predict, and most individual sellers don't offer a warranty service. But the seller could be helpful in fixing the game. Replacing the boards seems a bit extreme. You could track down the issue for less than $2.

#39 1 year ago

Hi Everyone -

Relocating a Laser War machine from my folks' place to mine shortly, and plan on doing some upgrades/TLC to it. It needs new spinners (for the Red + Yellow bases) and a complete band replacement. I've also got an NVRAM chip arriving shortly so I no longer need to worry about swapping batteries.

Can someone recommend a vendor for sourcing the spinners from? I found the sticker set on eBay, but no dice yet on the spinners themselves.

After this, I think an LED upgrade is in the cards; from the YouTube videos I've seen, it looks amazing.

Can any other Laser War owners out there recommend any other good maintenance/upgrades?

Thanks a ton in advance!

-Craig

#40 1 year ago
Quoted from CraigL2112:

Can any other Laser War owners out there recommend any other good maintenance/upgrades?

I put felt on the metal stoppers for each of the base holes. It deadened the shots, and had a better chance of not bouncing back out. The felt I bought was a perfect fit. They sell strips of it at Lowes, and was the perfect width.

#41 1 year ago
Quoted from woody24:

I put felt on the metal stoppers for each of the base holes. It deadened the shots, and had a better chance of not bouncing back out. The felt I bought was a perfect fit. They sell strips of it at Lowes, and was the perfect width.

I totally know what you mean about the shots bouncing out -- it seems to happen the most on the Yellow base. I think I have some felt strips at home I could cut to size and apply. Any chance you have a pic of exactly where you placed yours?

Thanks a ton for the reply!

-Craig

#42 1 year ago
Quoted from CraigL2112:

Any chance you have a pic of exactly where you placed yours?

I don't think I do. But know that I covered all the exposed metal that faces downward. It's maybe a 2in x 2in square area.

#43 1 year ago
Quoted from woody24:

That would be hard. If the game worked when you tested it, then it's not really his fault. It just went bad. Something you can't really predict, and most individual sellers don't offer a warranty service. But the seller could be helpful in fixing the game. Replacing the boards seems a bit extreme. You could track down the issue for less than $2.

I would normally agree with you on this - except the machine was bought from a reputable dealer. I.E. not a hobbyist.

The machine had this problem originally, and it was "fixed" along with some other stuff (new play field which looks great, new rubbers, etc). Hoping all that needs to be done is a transistor on the driver board, but after pulling the board out there are some not-so-stellar repairs on it.

If they don't cover it, I'm more than capable of fixing it. The wife bought this with the intention of it being a single thing that I have fun with, but unfortunately I think it's the start of a slippery slope. LED upgrade is already planned one it's back up and running...

#44 1 year ago
Quoted from chris1044:

machine was bought from a reputable dealer.... The machine had this problem originally, and it was "fixed" along with some other stuff

Well in that case, then yes, they should fix it.

#45 1 year ago

Well...Monday I dropped the main CPU board off with them and they "fixed it." Could not get specifics. So Friday night I spent some time going through and making sure all the fuses were good, none of the coils were shorted, and installed the board.

Flip the power switch on and "click"....outhole coil locks on again.

So my question now is this - where's the best place to make a long winded post about this game? I have some questions about various things after I've played with it for a few hours now. Fairly sure I've got a bad transistor as coil enable pin is shorted to ground, but my display's all messed up and I can't get it to go into diag mode.

1 month later
#46 1 year ago

Hi Everyone -

Finally relocated the Laser War machine to the new house. All is good except after the relocation...the displays for player 1 and 2 simply don't work. The ribbons to the display board were slightly loose, so I re-seated them all to no avail.

Any ideas for troubleshooting this?

Thanks a ton in advance!

-Craig

#47 1 year ago

Update: The folks who did the move sent a tech here this afternoon and he confirmed both displays are, indeed, toast.

So, at this point, I figure I might as well order the LED XPin display setup. It looks to be a simple rip and replace operation, and at that point, the entire display setup is brand new.

Can anyone see any reason why I shouldn't do this?

Thanks a ton in advance -- I can't wait to get the pin back to 100% working!

-Craig

1 week later
#48 1 year ago

I have had my Laser Wars Machine for about 17 years now. I love it and just had to replace the MPU board. The machine worked great for a month, now the ball gets stuck in the Yellow Base. The machine says, "Fire Yellow Base" and nothing happens. I replaced the solenoid but that didn't work either. When the machine is on, and I remove the balls, the other 2 bases will try to kick at the same time (looking for the ball) but the Yellow Base will not. Any suggestions?
Thanks Rob

#49 1 year ago

Does the coil work? Try to replace it with base blue or red coil (27-1500) and test it in the test menu (yellow eject).

Otherwise the transistor (Q26) on the CPU might be broken and need to replace (replace a TIP122 with a TIP102).

#50 1 year ago

Joined the club at expo, picked up a decent LW, great PF, cab above avg. Oddly enough I found a NOS chrome ramp at expo sitting on a table for cheap. On the way to expo, picked up another game and this pinsider had a NOS plastic set for cheap just sitting in a box. Full teardown, board work, NOS decals for the spinners, New posts, lane guides and added some very cool aluminum flipper bats... Full leds, New xpin displays, glass, you get the idea..IMAG5211.jpgIMAG5214.jpgIMAG5207.jpg

IMAG5212.jpg

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