(Topic ID: 122664)

Lamp Problem with Metallica

By Rumtastic

9 years ago


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  • 18 posts
  • 6 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 9 years ago by herg
  • No one calls this topic a favorite

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MET_resized.jpg
backbox2.jpg
5-PENTAWATT.jpg
#1 9 years ago

Hi guys,

I have the following problem: After works under the playfield all lamps of column 4 of the lamp matrix grid are always on.

This means that the following inserts are always on (partly flashing): shoot again, the "e" from fuel, the left return lane, the left pop bumper, the gravemarker on the left ramp, the middle coffin-lock, and a spider on the right loop.

Also when I do the single lamp test, all lamps of the whole column 4 are on.

I have standard bulbs, no LEDS.

Can anybody please help me how to fix this?

#2 9 years ago

Looks like U14 is shorted on. This is a Pentawat VN02N that controls this column. It looks like the picture below. A 5 leg transistor. You'll probably need to buy a new one and replace it.

5-PENTAWATT.jpg5-PENTAWATT.jpg

#3 9 years ago

Exactly what did you do under the playfield before this happened?

#4 9 years ago

First of all thank you VERY MUCH for the fast answers.

@ schudel5

I was just looking in the backbox (I suppose these transistors are located there?). U14 looks different than the transistor you posted. I have a lot of transistors looking like your picture with a Q at the beginning. Unfortunately I have just a thin "Metallica Pinball Service Manual" (with no detailed drawings - do you all have just this small manual?). There is one you can download at the Stern side (still things are missing there). Do you have your information from that manual? Can you maybe tell me the side where you have found that information.

@ LOTR_breath

Actually two things happened. When I opened the lockbar (clamps) to take the glass out I got a small electric shock. I did not check after that for any problems with the lamps.

Then I changed the lamp 22 (middle lamp at the entrance of the fuel lane - not in column 4) as it was not working properly (lamp went on and off without any reason).

#5 9 years ago
Quoted from Rumtastic:

@ schudel5
I was just looking in the backbox (I suppose these transistors are located there?). U14 looks different than the transistor you posted. I have a lot of transistors looking like your picture with a Q at the beginning. Unfortunately I have just a thin "Metallica Pinball Service Manual" (with no detailed drawings - do you all have just this small manual?). There is one you can download at the Stern side (still things are missing there). Do you have your information from that manual? Can you maybe tell me the side where you have found that information.

It's in the manual. I downloaded it somewhere, but it's not very complete; so I used my Spider-man manual that shows all the info. Anywho...here's the location on the driver board. There are 8 of these on the left side in the red circle. The one you need to look at is U14.

backbox2.jpgbackbox2.jpg

#6 9 years ago
Quoted from Rumtastic:

U14 looks different than the transistor you posted.

My Metallica Pro uses surface mount parts for these rather than through hole. It may not be a dead part, however. You might have a short under the playfield.

#7 9 years ago
Quoted from herg:

My Metallica Pro uses surface mount parts for these rather than through hole.

Hmmmm. Interesting. Is your's the LED version? I'll have to check mine when I get home as I have the incandescent version. The Metallica Pro manual is crap and really only shows that column 4 is controlled by U14. Ultimately, I guess, buy whichever style the game uses and replace it.

#8 9 years ago

Luckily I also have a Spider-Man. I will look at the manual.

My U14 looks like this. Actually I am quite afraid to change such a tiny little thing ...

Is there any way to check whether it is really this part that is broken?

MET_resized.jpgMET_resized.jpg
#9 9 years ago
Quoted from herg:

My Metallica Pro uses surface mount parts for these rather than through hole. It may not be a dead part, however. You might have a short under the playfield.

Interesting. When opening the lockbar I got the electric shock at the left side with all the wires at the start button and so on. Maybe there can be the fault?

#10 9 years ago
Quoted from Rumtastic:

Luckily I also have a Spider-Man. I will look at the manual.
My U14 looks like this. Actually I am quite afraid to change such a tiny little thing ...
Is there any way to check whether it is really this part that is broken?

Yeah those are a PITA to change. I've never looked at my MetPro that closely but assumed they left those the same with thru-hole components. I hate messing with SMT stuff. I guess welcome to the future...

Could be a short to ground. Pull J13 and see if the lamps stay lit or go out. A short would cause the lamps to stay on with J13 pulled. If they go out I'm saying 99.9% it's shorted U14. Couple way to check this, but probably the easiest is to swap your SM driver board in and see if the problem goes away. Or put this board in SM and see if lamps lock on.

#11 9 years ago
Quoted from schudel5:

Is your's the LED version?

No, it's the old one. It looks just like Rumtastic's picture, though.

Quoted from Rumtastic:

Is there any way to check whether it is really this part that is broken?

The most common method I can think of, you disconnect the connectors and connect a lamp between the J13 pin that controls column 4 and one of the pins on J12. Go into lamp test and see if the lamp blinks as it should. If it blinks, the board is fine.

#12 9 years ago
Quoted from schudel5:

Could be a short to ground. Pull J13 and see if the lamps stay lit or go out. A short would cause the lamps to stay on with J13 pulled. If they go out I'm saying 99.9% it's shorted U14.

Unfortunately the lamps go out.

Quoted from schudel5:

Couple way to check this, but probably the easiest is to swap your SM driver board in and see if the problem goes away. Or put this board in SM and see if lamps lock on.

For ME this actually sounds quite complicated But I guess if there is no other way I have to do it.

Quoted from herg:

The most common method I can think of, you disconnect the connectors and connect a lamp between the J13 pin that controls column 4 and one of the pins on J12. Go into lamp test and see if the lamp blinks as it should. If it blinks, the board is fine.

This "sounds" more easy but actually I have no clear idea how to do that. Put the wires of a lamp into two small connectors and put one of these onto J13 (so that the wire connects the pin that controls column 4) and the other one in any of the J12 pins?

BTW I have a digital multimeter - does that maybe help me in any way more easy to find the problem?

I appreciate all the help you give me!

#13 9 years ago
Quoted from Rumtastic:

For ME this actually sounds quite complicated But I guess if there is no other way I have to do it.

Couple screws, some molexes and bam; you're down.

#14 9 years ago
Quoted from TheLaw:

Couple screws, some molexes and bam; you're down.

Actually you are right ....... I will see if I manage to do that this weekend.

#15 9 years ago
Quoted from Rumtastic:

This "sounds" more easy but actually I have no clear idea how to do that. Put the wires of a lamp into two small connectors and put one of these onto J13 (so that the wire connects the pin that controls column 4) and the other one in any of the J12 pins?

Start with two test leads with alligator clips on the ends. Clip one end of one wire to J13, clip one end of the second wire to J12, clip the second end of wire 1 to one lead of the bulb, clip the second end of wire 2 to the other lead of the bulb.

#16 9 years ago
Quoted from herg:

Start with two test leads with alligator clips on the ends. Clip one end of one wire to J13, clip one end of the second wire to J12, clip the second end of wire 1 to one lead of the bulb, clip the second end of wire 2 to the other lead of the bulb.

There was no time over the weekend but today I tried as "herg" recommended.

I used two test leads to connect a bulb to column 4 and unfortunately the lamp always stayed (slightly) lit. When I checked column 4 via the service menue the bulb also flashed.

I made a 2nd check and connected the bulb with column 3 and it worked as it should. The lamp was only lit when I checked column 3 via the service menue.

So am I right to assume that the SAM Power Driver board is broken and that most probably U14 is damaged? (Everything else is running as it should)

If so, is it generally possible to fix U14 or is this impossible and a new power driver board is required?

Thanks for your input!

#17 9 years ago

I would have Clive do it. I would say def u14. Stern made simple repairs very hard on there new board.

http://webpages.charter.net/coinopcauldron/brepairs.html

#18 9 years ago

I agree, it sounds like U14 needs replaced. I certainly would not try it yourself since you say you're "quite afraid to change such a tiny little thing". They can be done, but you need the right equipment and experience.

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