Last Action Hero
Data East, 1993My lah ripper coil is not firing during game or during the coil test. I have read past posts and feel like I have done what they have but will list what I have looked for:
-checked all fuses out of board and all good
-checked fuse holders
-checked magnet board under playfield
-checked coil and seems fine
-checked wires and solder
Everything thing else on the game is working good so I’m lost on what to look for next and any advise is greatly appreciated. Thanks!
LTG Just to make sure I’m following, desolder and move swap the left and right flipper coils, then see if the “ripper” coil is still not firing or if a different coil starts not firing?
Quoted from LTG:Yes. Stat ruling things out to work your way to the problem.
LTG : )
Okay. Just wanted to make sure. I will grab my soldering supply’s from work tomorrow and try that out. Thank you
Wait, also check the diode!
I had a tough time with my LW3 flipper, and the diodes looked great and tested okay. When I went to desoldered them, a little pressure on the diode and it bent completely away from the coil.
It held its shape, but the leg had broken, so it was merely resting against the lug, but not making contact that was meaningful.
Quoted from Isochronic_Frost:Wait, also check the diode!
I had a tough time with my LW3 flipper, and the diodes looked great and tested okay. When I went to desoldered them, a little pressure on the diode and it bent completely away from the coil.
It held its shape, but the leg had broken, so it was merely resting against the lug, but not making contact that was meaningful.
I will definitely check for that first and make sure that is good
Quoted from frunch:Does it fire in the coil test? (accessed in the diagnostics using the inner coin door buttons)
No it does not fire in the coil test. It is the only thing that does not work during the test.
I hate to ask but did you check both boards? Including the small "PBB" one on the lower left?
I've had so many DE games where that board is literally missing one or more of those giant transistors, and those transistors always fire kickbacks. I never understand it. Best I can figure is they were using them for parts to fix a game that was earning.
i think LTG thought "ripper" is a misspelling of "flipper", in which the advice to desolder and swap the two flipper coils would be correct.
but i'm assuming you mean the "ripper" kickback coil isn't firing. since it's not firing in test mode and you've checked all the wiring, the next thing i'd look at is the associated transistor(s). from the manual it looks like that's Q13 (a TIP122) on the CPU board; there's also a 2N4401 pre-drive that often goes if the TIP122 takes a hike. if one or both are bad (you can test the TIP122 on the board with a multimeter as described here: https://pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php/Data_East/Sega#Driver_Transistor_.22Quick_Check.22 ) or you decide to swap them out, make sure you check the diode on the coil too. often the transistors blow because of a bad or disconnected diode.
Quoted from frunch:Geez I went right past that, sorry! You said you checked the coil, it has resistance? Also, did you verify proper voltage at the coil?</blockquote
I had my multimeter out and think i did and but to be honest I’m doubting I checked that now. I will double check for sure in the morning to be sure.
I hate to ask but did you check both boards? Including the small "PBB" one on the lower left?
I've had so many DE games where that board is literally missing one or more of those giant transistors, and those transistors always fire kickbacks. I never understand it. Best I can figure is they were using them for parts to fix a game that was earning.
I have for sure checked that and all seemed fine. I enjoy data east games but I hate so many things about the few I have owned. Trying to access the menu I find so difficult, the manuals always seem to be missing stuff. Idk it probably just my inexperience but ugh with data East’s lol
Quoted from mc300baud:i think LTG thought "ripper" is a misspelling of "flipper", in which the advice to desolder and swap the two flipper coils would be correct.
but i'm assuming you mean the "ripper" kickback coil isn't firing. since it's not firing in test mode and you've checked all the wiring, the next thing i'd look at is the associated transistor(s). from the manual it looks like that's Q13 (a TIP122) on the CPU board; there's also a 2N4401 pre-drive that often goes if the TIP122 takes a hike. if one or both are bad (you can test the TIP122 on the board with a multimeter as described here: https://pinwiki.com/wiki/index.php/Data_East/Sega#Driver_Transistor_.22Quick_Check.22 ) or you decide to swap them out, make sure you check the diode on the coil too. often the transistors blow because of a bad or disconnected diode.
When I read his msg I thought the same misunderstanding with ripper and flipper so I double checked but he has helped me on several fixes over the years so I figured “whelp looks like I’m flipping some shit around and reporting back” haha. But it’s not a big deal at all to do to narrow things down
Yes I am talking about the ripper kickback. Thank you so much for that info. I will absolutely check those out and and report back. That link to pin wiki is also super helpful!
Quoted from Watkinsd13:Trying to access the menu I find so difficult, the manuals always seem to be missing stuff. Idk it probably just my inexperience but ugh with data East’s lol
Amen to that, lol! I always find you have to search all over the manual to find where things go. Like any given circuit will be covered over 4 separate diagrams... i still have trouble following them sometimes 
Quoted from frunch:Some additional info I got from the schematics:
It looks like Q7/Q13 (right above the flipper relay) on the CPU drives Q1 on the PPB board, which fires the ripper coil.
[quoted image]
[quoted image]
[quoted image]
Awesome. I will definitely check this out and double check voltage at the coil in the morning. Thank you
Quoted from Watkinsd13:I have for sure checked that and all seemed fine. I enjoy data east games but I hate so many things about the few I have owned. Trying to access the menu I find so difficult, the manuals always seem to be missing stuff. Idk it probably just my inexperience but ugh with data East’s lol
When I read his msg I thought the same misunderstanding with ripper and flipper so I double checked but he has helped me on several fixes over the years so I figured “whelp looks like I’m flipping some shit around and reporting back” haha. But it’s not a big deal at all to do to narrow things down
Yes I am talking about the ripper kickback. Thank you so much for that info. I will absolutely check those out and and report back. That link to pin wiki is also super helpful!
Oops! Sorry. Didn’t realized never played a LAH. Still always check the diodes on those things. They can break very discretely and cause headaches!
Sorry about getting back to this so late, one of “those days” with work.
But I got home and checked the Tip122 like the video does and I’m not sure if I’m understanding it wrong. The video says it should have no reading if it is good and it will have a reading if it is bad. So I’m going to include photos. I circled all of the tip122 that have no reading in blue and all of the tip122 in red that do have a reading. It seems like half are red and half are blue but Q25 is the only one that has a reading in the all blue section.
Also checking Q1- Q5 on the PPB board they are all having readings. I also went through and checked all of the diodes in the back box and all seem to be fine letting power only go one way.
I have not have time yet to get under the playfield and flip coils but want to post and see if any of this helps.
40D84C2F-D4E5-4BFE-BD18-F20BDFD2DB81 (resized).jpeg66889F98-99BD-4385-A02D-CD76BFB96A14 (resized).jpegfrunch okay so I think I was checking Q1 incorrectly. I’ll include photos and explain what I found. Testing Q1 I had the positive lead in the middle and the ground on the multi meter on the bottom metal post and get no reading. When I flip the negative to the top post on Q1 I get a reading like all the others. I will have to order one of these but is that transistor bad atQ1 or is something else cause if this and I need to test other areas?
57DA5E42-8D66-4D16-9A6F-4BBA3A1B2F29 (resized).jpegQuoted from Watkinsd13:But I got home and checked the Tip122 like the video does and I’m not sure if I’m understanding it wrong. The video says it should have no reading if it is good and it will have a reading if it is bad. So I’m going to include photos. I circled all of the tip122 that have no reading in blue and all of the tip122 in red that do have a reading. It seems like half are red and half are blue but Q25 is the only one that has a reading in the all blue section.
You forgot to mention that you have the Rottendog MPU004. Rottendog does not use BJTs but rather FETs. The circuits are different and you cannot use the OEM schematic.
Quoted from DumbAss:You forgot to mention that you have the Rottendog MPU004. Rottendog does not use BJTs but rather FETs. The circuits are different and you cannot use the OEM schematic.
You should be asking Rottendog for support. Good luck getting support from them.
Post on this forum asking for help but specify that you are using a Rottendog board and specify which one.
Okay thank you. I did not know it made a difference. This is the only game I have that has a rotten dog board. Came with the game and I just thought it was a duplicate of the original. Now on I will definitely include that info.
It would appear Q1 is likely bad given those readings. Whenever in doubt, I always like to compare readings on similar nearby components, so if you're getting a different reading on Q1 than the others nearby, I think that supports Q1 being bad. I know in some cases when a coil driver transistor goes bad, it can sometimes damage the other transistors in the same circuit.
It's also possible the diode on the coil might be damaged. (if the diodes are on the coils, sometimes the diodes are on the boards instead...) If the coil has a diode, I would recommend replacing it before turning the game on with the new transistor. Make sure to wire it correctly with respect to the banded side of the diode. Take pics before you replace it for reference, or ask for help if unsure--you need to make sure it's wired correctly or you'll just damage the new transistor(s) and possibly the coil too.
DumbAss makes a good point, Rottendog is not the same design as the original CPU. Troubleshooting it may require their assistance if there's still trouble after trying what can be done.
One other thing that should be mentioned here is that the ripper is a "switch triggered solenoid" meaning there's 2 ways for it to be activated--one way is for the CPU to fire the coil in the coil test and the other way is tied to the switch in front of the ripper that the ball rolls over. I would get a good look at that switch and make sure nothing is shorted/miswired there. Might not be anything wrong with that switch, but I would def get a look at it during this process.
Quoted from frunch:Any progress with this?
No unfortunately. I ordered the transistor the day I found it but it still isn’t here. Says they should be here March 15th. I will give an update as soon as I get it switched out.
frunch well got the transistors in, replaced Q1, and the ripper coil lives again! Thank you so much for all of the help. A simple fix but I learned a ton.
Quoted from Watkinsd13:frunch well got the transistors in, replaced Q1, and the ripper coil lives again! Thank you so much for all of the help. A simple fix but I learned a ton.
Hell yeah!!!! Nice work!!! 
Glad to be of assistance!
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