(Topic ID: 243533)

KRUZMAN monthly playfield thread

By kruzman

2 years ago


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#1451 30 days ago

Only because of posting the pic, have I looked at it long enough to see that its not an orange arm but a sheer orange over thing. Until now I didnt put it together.

#1452 30 days ago

Time to play name that pf. I been looking at the backs of pfs all day, and I kept playing to keep my mind active. Dont answer if you own the game, please

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#1453 30 days ago

The first pic has 252 dimples on the back alone. the last pic is how cpr does the backs now. they print the dimple pattern. I dont spray clear on the back because it wouldn't soak in, I use polyurethane (2 coats)

#1454 30 days ago

I don’t know which playfield it is. What I do know is the back of your PFs looks almost as good as the front!

#1455 30 days ago

Ron I used a plastic shot glass to dimple the back of a CPR playfield. Laser burns make it interesting, & I used painters tape on the drill bit as a depth mark. Used the bottom of the glass to stop drilling.

#1456 30 days ago
Quoted from ToucanF16:

I don’t know which playfield it is. What I do know is the back of your PFs looks almost as good as the front!

That’s what she said?!

#1457 29 days ago
Quoted from greatwichjohn:

Ron I used a plastic shot glass to dimple the back of a CPR playfield. Laser burns make it interesting, & I used painters tape on the drill bit as a depth mark. Used the bottom of the glass to stop drilling.

Thats a great idea on the plastic shot glass john!
The reason I use that drill Jig is when the holes are in the center of the pf and the arm of my drill press gets in the way for some of them so I have to do them by hand and I want them at 90 deg. I also use it for flaring the top of the "pop bumper lug screw" holes.
I am thinking of not flaring them any more because once the pf is cleared you only need to grind out some of the clear to counter set them.

my step dad was relentless with the "thats what she said", and man it got so old by the time I was 30. I have thought about it, and obviously when I was a young kid he said it because he thought it was funny. As an adult I guess that he continued as some kind of shared joke? or maybe he still thought it was funny. As a kid it made me feel uncomfortable, as an adult, its such a groaner. Then I start watching the office....

#1458 29 days ago

On the first pic, the pf I am dimpling, I taped over the inserts that really give it away.
The first 3 are WPC the last is a bally. pretty easy stuff.

#1459 29 days ago

The third one is Whodunnit?

#1461 29 days ago

Bally is Centaur

#1462 29 days ago

First one is Indy 500.

#1463 29 days ago

All correct. The one left unsolved was the one I figured would be the toughest.

#1464 27 days ago

NOTICE THIS POST IS IMPORTANT:

Man o man, I screwed the pooch this week. I sanded and polished the stars pf (pictures on post 1404). In the 13 hours I spent blocking and polishing the pf after the last coat, and the hour I spent cleaning out the holes and edges, I didnt notice that I had sanded in to the ink when I prepped it, and never noticed. Its very clear in the pic, and I still didnt see it.
I have missed flaws that were the result of the makers, mostly little spots of flawed screening in crowded areas. I have never not noticed when I sand in to the insert key line, and that is a major fuck up. Its very easy to fix when its done, most of the time. In fact when some pfs have the really sunken inserts (actually its caused by the manufacturer using a couple coats of clear to level the uneven insert) and after a couple of months and the stock clear shrinks, there is a big lip around the insert. If I dont level that spot I will get ghosting where I didnt level, the clear wont mechanically grab there, and it will be crap. The problem is the stock clear is too thin and I hit the wood of the edge around the insert. The isnert is always sunken lower than the surface. In most cases, not all, I just sand in to the black key line, but if the insert is not lined up correctly, the edge of it will be outside the key line. (that is very common on NOS as well as repros).
Well like I said, this happens all of the time, but I finally didnt realize it, and just continued the job. when I was done with this job, I was riding high that I loved how good it came out. I posted the pics and sent it to the customer's installer. within 2 min he noticed.
What a screw up. Like I said I have never done this, but I allowed myself to get over booked more than double my record amount of work, before I realized it would effect my quality and I eventually stopped accepting new work, but I guess not soon enough.
I guess most people wouldnt post this on their site, but I am doing it because I am very humbled and I also feel horrible for the costumer. I offered to do whatever will make him happy, including a refund for my work and buying the pf, or fixing it. He is shipping it back monday and I am going to sand off all of the clear around the areas I have to paint, and about 70% everywhere else, and fix the damage I caused which I am positive I can make back to normal, since I do it all of the time (but always before I start clearing). If it is good enough for him, we will go from there, but if not, I will do what it takes to make him happy and possibly trust me enough to work with me again. To make matters worse, I really like working with this guy and its our first time.

All day yesterday I felt so much self hatred like kicking my own ass, I was questioning weather I have any idea of what I am doing, and if my ego is too big. I have made enough mistakes in relationships to know they are an opportunity that highlights my flaws, and gives me the choice to fix them.

I have got in the habit of taking 6 pics of each pf that gets completed. from now on I will post that its complete, and I ask you guys that like to look at the pics of the complete job, to let me know if you see something questionable. Since the mistake is so obvious in the pics I think people must have thought it was work in progress. I am not trying to pass the buck, not at all. I am asking from this point on, if you see something questionable, please post or PM me. This will help me. I honestly dont understand how I let this get by, and I think I just got over whelmed. Well not only do I hate excuses, they dont do anything for the customer who pays me well to not only do what I do, but do it to the best of my ablity, and in most cases better than anyone else. excuses dont matter. he paid for what I offered.

So besides asking my peers to check my final pics for issues, I will also not allow my self to get over booked. If I am going to do that, there is no way it can be done without it costing quality, and people dont get a discount because I am over booked.

While I have your attention, I want to bring up one other possible option. I was criticized by well known pin restorer because my clear was wat too thick, and he coundnt screw in to it without chipping the clear. Well clear it too brittle to handle screw threads. It doesnt like to be drilled except right at the right speed, with a high quality bit. By no means do I suggest you attempt to just push a screw in to my clear. The thickness of my clear is for 2 reasons. the first to make it so it wont ball dimple. the other is I use just enough so you cant feel the inserts. Now even though you cant feel them after the last coat and I went thru and block sanded, when I polish it back to clear, the heat of the polisher and the abrasive of the compound makes the plastic insert hot and it moves more and faster than the wood, causing it to expand and you can feel it. Big ones more than small.

So this is why I push my install kit. That will allow you to remove enough clear before you pre drill and screw down to the pf. Most pro installers dont want to do this, because its more hassle, and the restorer I am talking about wont install my pfs any more. He believes in 2 coats. He said because thats the the manufacture suggest. of course they are talking about a car, not a wood and plastic plank that has a heavy ball rolling on it. It is actually illegal for me to use the automotive clear in the way I do.

So if you dont mind if some of the inserts can be fealt when you run your hand over it, I will be happy to do 2 less coats which will make a very nice depth and I believe will be very close to the same repellent to ball dimples.. Its just some of the inserts may be felt. Maybe not, but usually. I am very confident in my process especially for hardness and being so flat, but my job is to make the customer happy, and if you want it different I will do what you want. no problem at all. There are a list of things I wont do, like clear something that needs paint work (see the top of this post). Or ship a pf that I spent 3 days sanding and polishing in a cardboard box. But on the thickness I am totally fine with i.

So this is a really low point for me that is coinciding with some serious "family" issues that are testing my sobriety for the last week and just getting worse on several fronts. But now I am back to excuses. I will continue to do the very best work I can on each and every pf. Hopefully the customer will not suffer too much from the delay, and in the end hopefully he will be very happy with the pf, and I will have a better policy and procedure. A lot of you read this for info, or like pics, or like to laugh at the clown, me, but a lot of you are the people who support me with your jobs, and I want you to be confident that I am taking my job as serious as I can. It is the center of my life. I just made a big screw up. I guess it happens, and I will take it as an opportunity to learn and better myself. So as always thank you for your continued support. ron kruzman

#1465 27 days ago

Everyone screws up now and then.
How you deal with it is the thing.
Don't be down on yourself.

#1466 27 days ago

As always with your work, I’m always in awe at this playfield pron. My lighting sucks in my game room but you get the idea. And the crates and pack job are top notch.

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#1467 27 days ago

Stay positive stuff happens. I have cracked clear from others playfields installing posts. Same with sanding into the ink. What you do is so above the level of most of us. So keep it up doing the playfield work.

#1468 26 days ago

Everyone screws up a little now and then. You owned it, offered up a solution or two, and that's the hallmark of a good person. All of us getting work done by you appreciate the dedication and attention to quality. It shows in the work, and in your transparency here.

#1469 26 days ago

Repeating what others say - mistakes happen. Sometimes you need to learn from them. Other times? You already knew better and it just slipped being caught. I run into the same thing at both jobs I have - and one is rather dangerous where as, if I screw up, people could die.

As far as overbooking, I personally don't have an issue with it. I'm never is such a rush that I NEED a playfield cleared and fixed up immediately. I always plan one or two games out in advance - I JUST finished my previous game, and next will be the Meteor that you did for me - and that I received back in Feb of this year. By the time I get that done and up, I figure you'll have been done with my TZ. I'm assuming others do this too - and if they don't, they really should.

#1470 26 days ago

kruzman Ron as the guy who got received the Stars playfield with the issues - you know my point of view…your work is amazing!! Mistakes happen and best we can do is learn from them and move on. I have 100% confidence that you will fix the issue or we will figure out plan together!!!

I am also very fortunate that the beautiful Harlem in the picture is mine and we have a joker poker that has already been installed.

Quoted from kruzman:

NOTICE THIS POST IS IMPORTANT:
Man o man, I screwed the pooch this week. I sanded and polished the stars pf (pictures on post 1404). In the 13 hours I spent blocking and polishing the pf after the last coat, and the hour I spent cleaning out the holes and edges, I didnt notice that I had sanded in to the ink when I prepped it, and never noticed. Its very clear in the pic, and I still didnt see it.
I have missed flaws that were the result of the makers, mostly little spots of flawed screening in crowded areas. I have never not noticed when I sand in to the insert key line, and that is a major fuck up. Its very easy to fix when its done, most of the time. In fact when some pfs have the really sunken inserts (actually its caused by the manufacturer using a couple coats of clear to level the uneven insert) and after a couple of months and the stock clear shrinks, there is a big lip around the insert. If I dont level that spot I will get ghosting where I didnt level, the clear wont mechanically grab there, and it will be crap. The problem is the stock clear is too thin and I hit the wood of the edge around the insert. The isnert is always sunken lower than the surface. In most cases, not all, I just sand in to the black key line, but if the insert is not lined up correctly, the edge of it will be outside the key line. (that is very common on NOS as well as repros).
Well like I said, this happens all of the time, but I finally didnt realize it, and just continued the job. when I was done with this job, I was riding high that I loved how good it came out. I posted the pics and sent it to the customer's installer. within 2 min he noticed.
What a screw up. Like I said I have never done this, but I allowed myself to get over booked more than double my record amount of work, before I realized it would effect my quality and I eventually stopped accepting new work, but I guess not soon enough.
I guess most people wouldnt post this on their site, but I am doing it because I am very humbled and I also feel horrible for the costumer. I offered to do whatever will make him happy, including a refund for my work and buying the pf, or fixing it. He is shipping it back monday and I am going to sand off all of the clear around the areas I have to paint, and about 70% everywhere else, and fix the damage I caused which I am positive I can make back to normal, since I do it all of the time (but always before I start clearing). If it is good enough for him, we will go from there, but if not, I will do what it takes to make him happy and possibly trust me enough to work with me again. To make matters worse, I really like working with this guy and its our first time.
All day yesterday I felt so much self hatred like kicking my own ass, I was questioning weather I have any idea of what I am doing, and if my ego is too big. I have made enough mistakes in relationships to know they are an opportunity that highlights my flaws, and gives me the choice to fix them.
I have got in the habit of taking 6 pics of each pf that gets completed. from now on I will post that its complete, and I ask you guys that like to look at the pics of the complete job, to let me know if you see something questionable. Since the mistake is so obvious in the pics I think people must have thought it was work in progress. I am not trying to pass the buck, not at all. I am asking from this point on, if you see something questionable, please post or PM me. This will help me. I honestly dont understand how I let this get by, and I think I just got over whelmed. Well not only do I hate excuses, they dont do anything for the customer who pays me well to not only do what I do, but do it to the best of my ablity, and in most cases better than anyone else. excuses dont matter. he paid for what I offered.
So besides asking my peers to check my final pics for issues, I will also not allow my self to get over booked. If I am going to do that, there is no way it can be done without it costing quality, and people dont get a discount because I am over booked.
While I have your attention, I want to bring up one other possible option. I was criticized by well known pin restorer because my clear was wat too thick, and he coundnt screw in to it without chipping the clear. Well clear it too brittle to handle screw threads. It doesnt like to be drilled except right at the right speed, with a high quality bit. By no means do I suggest you attempt to just push a screw in to my clear. The thickness of my clear is for 2 reasons. the first to make it so it wont ball dimple. the other is I use just enough so you cant feel the inserts. Now even though you cant feel them after the last coat and I went thru and block sanded, when I polish it back to clear, the heat of the polisher and the abrasive of the compound makes the plastic insert hot and it moves more and faster than the wood, causing it to expand and you can feel it. Big ones more than small.
So this is why I push my install kit. That will allow you to remove enough clear before you pre drill and screw down to the pf. Most pro installers dont want to do this, because its more hassle, and the restorer I am talking about wont install my pfs any more. He believes in 2 coats. He said because thats the the manufacture suggest. of course they are talking about a car, not a wood and plastic plank that has a heavy ball rolling on it. It is actually illegal for me to use the automotive clear in the way I do.
So if you dont mind if some of the inserts can be fealt when you run your hand over it, I will be happy to do 2 less coats which will make a very nice depth and I believe will be very close to the same repellent to ball dimples.. Its just some of the inserts may be felt. Maybe not, but usually. I am very confident in my process especially for hardness and being so flat, but my job is to make the customer happy, and if you want it different I will do what you want. no problem at all. There are a list of things I wont do, like clear something that needs paint work (see the top of this post). Or ship a pf that I spent 3 days sanding and polishing in a cardboard box. But on the thickness I am totally fine with i.
So this is a really low point for me that is coinciding with some serious "family" issues that are testing my sobriety for the last week and just getting worse on several fronts. But now I am back to excuses. I will continue to do the very best work I can on each and every pf. Hopefully the customer will not suffer too much from the delay, and in the end hopefully he will be very happy with the pf, and I will have a better policy and procedure. A lot of you read this for info, or like pics, or like to laugh at the clown, me, but a lot of you are the people who support me with your jobs, and I want you to be confident that I am taking my job as serious as I can. It is the center of my life. I just made a big screw up. I guess it happens, and I will take it as an opportunity to learn and better myself. So as always thank you for your continued support. ron kruzman

#1471 26 days ago

Always appreciate your work and honesty. Most people are out for themselves, but you are above that and truly care about your customers and the art behind it. Thanks for what you do and who you are. Your post just goes to show what kind of stand up guy you are. Keep your head up!

#1472 25 days ago

So This one is complete. One of the out door pics I was trying to get the reflection of the tree I saw in it (3rd from last). sucky photographer. I have really looked this one over, and over, but its a complicated pf.
For some reason I like doing sterns and I like the way they come out.

Thanks everyone for the kind words about my screw up. I just dont want to look like I am making excuses. I hate when people say their sorry, but...

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#1473 25 days ago

Gorgeous GOTG. SWEET work Ron!

#1474 25 days ago

Is your backlog over yet? Wondering when would be a good time to send the Doctor Who NOS back to you? I even have an old used depopulated playfield to get dimpling from. I think I remember that you don't restore the old playfields, even with Diamond Plate on them. Love seeing your finished works and humor.

#1475 24 days ago
Quoted from Tophervette:

Is your backlog over yet? Wondering when would be a good time to send the Doctor Who NOS back to you? I even have an old used depopulated playfield to get dimpling from. I think I remember that you don't restore the old playfields, even with Diamond Plate on them. Love seeing your finished works and humor.

I am "right now" finishing the giant group and slowly prepping all of the nos WPC pfs I got this spring, so now is a good time to send those dr who. I can make a template from the used pf. My plexi glass guy is sill out of it, but when it comes time, I will just go to lowes and pay a crazy price for some much thinner, which works just as good, but they crack and the corners break easy.

On the WPC pfs I removed mylar, front side t nuts and dimpled SS, I500, Demo man, TAFG, and FT. I am eager to block and polish the 9 pfs that are all coated, and get them out to their new homes first, but when it rains or I have time in between tasks, I poke around in a very expensive pile of nos pfs.

here is a list that is not in order of the pfs that are fully coated and waiting to be block sanded and polished
JJ POTC
BK2K upper and lower
Stars
stargazer/tommy s.
popeye
charlie and ch factory
Black hole upper. Lower needs 2 more coats
TAF cpr. I am almost done blocking
Ironman

Remember some of the flaws that will cause a pf to need to be redone, cant be seen until I start polishing. so I guarantee at least one of those pf will go back to the clear pile.

Here is a NOTICE. I have found that I cant squeeze the install kit in a crate, unless its an older pf that is shorter, like a bally globetrotters, and in that case I forget most of the time. So I am sending out install kits separate from the pfs. Many times i am waiting for bits or glue to get here, and I dont have all of the parts of the kit. I do as of this week, so if I havent got your kit to you, please let me know. I sent one to ben and dave yesterday everyone else, please let me know.

so thats whats going on at the compound today. Didnt finish as many this month as I wanted to, but whats a brother to do?

Thanks to everyone for the support.

#1476 24 days ago

No one correctly guessed the second "backside" of the mystery pfs above.
Here is the hint. Its popeye! I like the "widebodies"
They must give every day a holiday title. like it was daughter day a couple days ago, and suicide prevention day. today is national innuendo day.

#1477 24 days ago
Quoted from kruzman:

today is national innuendo day.

Well this is where a “That’s what she said!” would fit!

#1478 24 days ago

today is the day for innuendo it appears. So let em fly, but no kiss or aerosmith lyrics. way too easy.
going down?

when I was in 4th grade is was like "78 and kiss was all of the rage. as a young boy I thought this is some cool shit. I bought, I forget which record, and when I heard the lyrics and then read them. "wow", I thought, this is ... well we dont say that word any more so I will say really dumb. every song was the lamest sex innuendo. I am making them up but it seems like it was"hold my love gun squeeze the trigger" "lets go back stage and make some rock and roll!"
I give them credit for being a hard working band, but I dont think they added to the vocabulary of the young people listening to the records, not that they wanted or were trying.

#1479 24 days ago
Quoted from kruzman:

No one correctly guessed the second "backside"
Here is the hint. I like the "widebodies"

I know I've seen some of ones you've dated ha!

#1480 24 days ago

Here are some before pics of a cpr rolling stones. If I remember its a year old? If I am more than a couple months off let me know please daane. The wood grain has seriously raised. I wouldn't expect maple to do this. Its usually a really tight grain, this is what oak looks like!
I am pretty sure the last time I was on the cpr website they said they use the best wood in the world. It was either them or mirco, but I think them (being up in canada). So I don't know what's going on. I find that this grain is just high enough that for me to sand down in the record grooves, between the mountains, If I use the DA sander and 500 grit, I will quickly remove ink. And to make it worse, from a pf that is almost impossible to restore. So a hand sand it shall be.
Its gonna be a "hand job" for sure.

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#1481 24 days ago

here is a better pic of micks butta

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#1484 24 days ago
Quoted from kruzman:

So a hand sand it shall be.
Its gonna be a "hand job" for sure.
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]

Judging by this thread your hand jobs are legendary!

-Paul

#1485 24 days ago
Quoted from kruzman:

Its gonna be a "hand job" for sure.

Quoted from kruzman:

sorry that was frusterating

Quoted from Pablito350:

Judging by this thread your hand jobs are legendary!
-Paul

#1486 24 days ago

Okay, I fucking laughed out loud at that. Well done, both of you.

#1487 23 days ago
Quoted from Coyote:

Okay, I fucking laughed out loud at that. Well done, both of you.

pretty funny. "sorry that was frustrating" is the best though.
That almost never happens!

#1488 23 days ago

I got this in just under the wire of september. when I started blocking I noticed what looked like a little glob of ink that comes off the screens when they get clogged up after being used many times (I am guessing) but lucky for me i have my sherloc holmes mag glass. It was a itsi bitsi gnat! Bastard. anyway lucky I found him.
Otherwise I love it. the light is morning clear direct sun outside. so no cool shade effect to enrich the contrast.

This is the cpr version that I have a couple of

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#1489 23 days ago

One way to tell an IPB TAF is the fester chair hole is not routered on the left side

#1490 23 days ago

Is that the TAF headed my way? Looks stunning!

#1491 23 days ago

I believe so , I am very happy w it

#1492 22 days ago

Here are some pics of prep before another coat, which is scheduled to be the last. notice on the ball hole I ground the clear out of the corners because it builds up too much in there. The prep is where people skimp, and all of the strength of the clear comes from the prep

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#1493 22 days ago

So how do you fix that wood grain like on The Rolling Stones? The cpr Fire “gold” was like that too.

#1494 22 days ago

Have you ever tried toset a t-nut thru 8 layers of clear? it aint easy. So I do this every coat, but before the last coat I make sure to go right down to the wood. Otherwise the dull teeth of the t nut will fold or break the clear. I didnt figure this out until a couple of years ago.

This is the nerve wracking initial sand on a nos monopoly. there are plenty of flaws in the screening of this one. Most wont show and I cant fix the ones in the fade. I no longer try to sand over the inserts with the sander. It makes too much work when the inserts are not level and the edges are not on a key line, that is easily fixed.

I have to sit on the milk crate because butthole louis is mostly def and snores thru the work day

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#1495 22 days ago

Sanding out those VUK holes is time consuming and no fun. Tried to show how the triangle inserts almost always have cracks

On the 5th pic I could fix that smear in the green fade by making the solid got down 2 in further, but I dont think that area shows

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#1496 22 days ago

The handy dandy kruzman playfield install kit is also great for prepping for clear. I use it for grinding out the countersunk areas

#1497 22 days ago
Quoted from kruzman:

The handy dandy kruzman playfield install kit is also great for prepping for clear. I use it for grinding out the countersunk areas

Beautiful work! Are there any good videos showing how to use the install kit properly?

#1498 22 days ago
Quoted from Spelunk71:

Beautiful work! Are there any good videos showing how to use the install kit properly?

There is not, and there is a reason. first I am not professional enough at installing pfs to tell others how to. The other reason is this is a group of tools that I found helped me install my pfs, and also stock cpr pfs. Any pf that is cleared in automotive clear which doesnt like to be screwed or even drilled. drilling can be done, but when I dimpled a IPB pf, every time i drilled in to the clear, it lifted around the hole. This is where the glue kit came from. I got some glue and added a material to make it thinner. By injecting some glue in the raw wood it wicked under the clear and locked it down and filled the gap, fixing the look as well as the function. so its a dozen dremmil bits, a way to clean the bits, a tool to measure stuff, and the glue kit. Like a hammer there are so many used for this stuff. its great to have available. The kit is 95 shipped.

#1499 22 days ago

What I dont want to do is make it sound like if you buy this 95$ kit you have all you need to install a pf.

#1500 21 days ago
Quoted from dmacy:

So how do you fix that wood grain like on The Rolling Stones? The cpr Fire “gold” was like that too.

I have to sand it level down to the lowest point, which is down in the grain valleys. Its really scary because the clear is so thin I get in to the ink super easy. If I dont get the grain mountains level the clear will just highlight them, and make it even worse. I can sand the clear level, but it magnifies the grain under the clear, and looks horrible.

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