(Topic ID: 81343)

Kiss repaint

By DrMark12PA

7 years ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 29 posts
  • 6 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 7 years ago by Gatecrasher
  • Topic is favorited by 3 Pinsiders

You

Linked Games

Topic Gallery

View topic image gallery

Pinball Parts.jpg
2014-03-05 08.55.07.jpg
coin door2.jpg
lock bar.jpg
coin door.jpg
Lower playfield.JPG
IMG_0157.JPG
New Back box inside.JPG
Done 4.JPG
KISS cab restorebackbox 024.jpg
KISS cab restore 036.jpg
Before 1.JPG
Done 3.JPG
images.jpg

#1 7 years ago

I'm considering repainting my Kiss pinball to get it back to original look. The paint has faded obviously over time but overall no major dings or dents in the cabinet, backglass is excellent, playfield is average for the age.
My question is can the playfield easily be removed from the cabinet for a repaint? I don't necessarily need the inside of the cabinet redone. I don't need the inside of the backbox repainted either as that would involved quite a bit of hardware removal.
My thought is to seal off any openings into the backbox.
Then:
A) tape off cabinet with playfield not removed and cover and holes into the cabinet, have my professional painter I use do it perfectly on the exterior
or
B) if easy enough, disconnecting the playfield, take the playfield out so that the exterior can be done with at least a rim of new paint at the top of the inside cabinet.

#2 7 years ago

Mark, removing the playfield from any SS Bally machine is rather easy as it just consist of unplugging the wires from the boards in the backboard and then unscrewing some screws. If you're not familiar with how to do this post your location and ask if someone, here on Pinside that is close to you, would give you a hand!

IMO if you're going to take the time to repaint any game it's best to do it right and remove the rails, coin door etc. etc. and do it right! This way if you ever go to sale the machine it will appeal to more people!

#3 7 years ago

I know taking the backbox off is disconnecting the plugs so I figured that might be fairly easy to take all the playfield with wiring out in one chunk so to speak.
I'm planning on taking off the coin door as that appears quite easy with the screws behind it. However, I've inspected the side rails and can't seem to figure out how they attach on the back. It looks like a rivet on the outside that just goes into the wood. Any insight on how to remove those rails?

#4 7 years ago
Quoted from DrMark12PA:

I've inspected the side rails and can't seem to figure out how they attach on the back. It looks like a rivet on the outside that just goes into the wood. Any insight on how to remove those rails?

Been awhile since I had a KISS machine but if I recall correctly all you need to do is remove the flipper buttons and the spiral nails. I have found that the spiral nails are typically loose in these older games but you always get a few that are in there good. Just need to be careful removing them as you don't want to bend up the rail and make it look like Scheiße.

So what you're thinking are rivets are actually spiral nails

Post edited by meSz : Added picture

images.jpg

#5 7 years ago

Removing the side rails is pretty easy. After removing the flipper buttons, you will find one bolt at the front of the machine for each side rail. After it is removed you will need to pry off the side rails.... Something broad and thin is gently driven up under the side rail. I have a unique little crow bar that I use. Just start at one end and gently pry the side rail. The nails come out pretty easily and can be reused.

Done 3.JPG
#6 7 years ago
Quoted from meSz:

So what you're thinking are rivets are actually spiral nails

Do those just have to be pried out? And once pried out, isn't the hole a bit stripped out or too big to use the same type of screw?

#7 7 years ago
Quoted from Freeplay40:

Removing the side rails is pretty easy. After removing the flipper buttons, you will find one bolt at the front of the machine for each side rail. After it is removed you will need to pry off the side rails.... Something broad and thin is gently driven up under the side rail. I have a unique little crow bar that I use. Just start at one end and gently pry the side rail. The nails come out pretty easily and can be reused.

Done 3.JPG 95 KB

Nice machine!
Did you just reuse the same side rails and did the nails securely hold the rails back once they were already pulled out?

#8 7 years ago

Yes, I used the same nails....after I buffed them... I polish everything. If you notice any that are really loose you could fill them with wood filler before putting the rails back on, but I've never had to do that. The holes will get a little paint in them anyway. Just be careful when nailing them back into place...you don't want to miss the nail and dent the rail. This machine has a new playfield, new NOS back glass and a complete new cabinet... Here's what it looked like before the restore....

Before 1.JPG
#9 7 years ago

Your game turned out great! I have the new playfield, backglass, plastics, and bumper caps standing by.....did my cab repaint last year and it turned out really nice.

DonKISS cab restore 036.jpg
KISS cab restorebackbox 024.jpg

#10 7 years ago
Quoted from DrMark12PA:

Do those just have to be pried out? And once pried out, isn't the hole a bit stripped out or too big to use the same type of screw?

Yes just pry them out like FreePlay40 advised in his comment.

Quoted from Freeplay40:

If you notice any that are really loose you could fill them with wood filler before putting the rails back on

Or what you can do is take a toothpick, put some glue on it and than inset it into the hole and cut it off flush with the cabinet. You can then put a spiral nail back into the hole and that toothpick will make the spiral nail very snug again!

#11 7 years ago

Here are some more photos of mine. All new aluminum sheeting in the back box as well. My cabinet has some modifications from the original. Original has a 1/4" gap in the bottom of the lower cabinet then a 1/4" sheet...very weak. I put a 1/2" sheet in the bottom that is flush with the cabinet side lower edges... Much stronger and will prevent the splintering of the lower edges. Also put in a cord storage hole. All buss wiring on the bottom of the playfield updated to 1/8" braid

Done 4.JPG New Back box inside.JPG IMG_0157.JPG Lower playfield.JPG
#12 7 years ago

Did you have to drill the new pf? I have to, have never done it before - its been cleared, and I'm pretty nervous about chipping it or doing something wrong -

#13 7 years ago

Mine was pre-drilled for the most part and dimpled on the bottom to spot other locations. Generally the holes drilled all the way through are good. I do a lot of additional drilling so that stuff just screwed into the playfield isn't too tight resulting in wood distortion, especially on the top of the playfield. I like everything to screw in perfectly. You should note that sometimes the holes or the dimples are not in the right, or best spot. It's best to compare locations constantly with the original. As far as chipping the playfield they do make drill bits that cut the outer edge of any hole drilled, but I've never really worried about it because any minor chipping is covered by what you are attaching. Just use good sharp bits. If you are unsure of the right size bit to use, try it in a scrap piece of wood first.

#14 7 years ago

Good thinking - I have read to use Forstner bits (the ones you described) but thought that might be a little overboard. Thanks, and fantastic looking game!

Don

#15 7 years ago
Quoted from Freeplay40:

Here are some more photos of mine. All new aluminum sheeting in the back box as well. My cabinet has some modifications from the original. Original has a 1/4" gap in the bottom of the lower cabinet then a 1/4" sheet...very weak. I put a 1/2" sheet in the bottom that is flush with the cabinet side lower edges... Much stronger and will prevent the splintering of the lower edges. Also put in a cord storage hole. All buss wiring on the bottom of the playfield updated to 1/8" braid

How much work was involved remove the boards and such from the backbox before painting?

#16 7 years ago
Quoted from pinzrfun:

I have read to use Forstner bits (the ones you described) but thought that might be a little overboard.

Actually it's not overboard. Regular bits can grab the clear-coat and pull it away from the surface or crack it instead of drilling it. The Forstner bits won't.

#17 7 years ago
Quoted from DrMark12PA:

How much work was involved remove the boards and such from the backbox before painting?

Mark, it's not hard at all. Just take your time. With the questions you have asked so far I would just recommend taking a lot of pictures so you can refer back to them when you start to put your game back together. Pictures are VERY helpful not to mention it's nice to have the before and after pictures! Where you located???

#18 7 years ago
Quoted from meSz:

Mark, it's not hard at all. Just take your time. With the questions you have asked so far I would just recommend taking a lot of pictures so you can refer back to them when you start to put your game back together. Pictures are VERY helpful not to mention it's nice to have the before and after pictures! Where you located???

I'm in Minnesota...
What kind of paint did you use and did you use the stencils you can find online?

#19 7 years ago

I used an automotive paint on the BOPP machine I restored but I know several people use the Krylon rattle cans and have had great success with it! It comes down to a matter of what you have to do the job. If you don't have a compressor etc than the rattle cans might be the route to go.

As for stencil kits for KISS, I would ask others that have done a KISS machine for their input. I know Classic Arcade has them but I know of two people that had issues with their kits being made from real thin material. I don't know this to be true, only what I have heard. I also know Pinball Pall has them (http://pinballpal.com/products/stencil/#KISS) for $119 but I have no knowledge of their products.

#20 7 years ago

Ok, I've begun disassembling my KISS... not bad so far though my question is what is the best way to get the dingy looking inside of the coin door and some of these screws and parts shining again?
I've polished pretty much all of the playfield metal parts and they turned out very well. However, some of these parts look rusted possibly and I don't know that simple brass polish type of products will work.

coin door.jpg lock bar.jpg coin door2.jpg
#21 7 years ago

To get the inside of a coin door looking nice is a lot of work. I completely disassembled mine and used a wire brush (on grinder) and then a buffer wherever I can. Need to do the same to the lock down bar mechanism. Your coin door doesn't look to bad...I've seen much much worse. As far as screws go, I used to tumble them but found holding them in a pair of pliers and hitting the buffer really makes them shine. A really good use I've found for my vibration tumbler is to clean up old light sockets. Works great for them.

#22 7 years ago
Quoted from DrMark12PA:

Ok, I've begun disassembling my KISS... not bad so far though my question is what is the best way to get the dingy looking inside of the coin door and some of these screws and parts shining again?
I've polished pretty much all of the playfield metal parts and they turned out very well. However, some of these parts look rusted possibly and I don't know that simple brass polish type of products will work

In case you haven't seen it, check out this link to a HEP thread where he restores KISS

http://christopherhutchins.com/gallery/album425

#23 7 years ago

I asked Chris once what his process was for polishing metal and he advised "When metal is good enough to rework as is then it is polished with a paste and hand buffed. I prefer Flitz metal polish."

#24 7 years ago

I have read that a rock tumbler with dry powder is the way to go to clean the small parts such as screws. Does anyone here have direct experience with this?
I've started polishing some of the bigger pieces today (ie lock bar handle mechanism for example) but it still has black pitted areas with just polish and a towel so I believe I'll need a grinder or something similar. Any recommendations on how aggressive to get with the abrasive application? (ie bench grinder, bumper, 300+ wet sandpaper, etc)

#25 7 years ago

The restoration is under way which isn't too bad taking it piece by piece and picture by picture. Rock tumbler purchased, running, and so far the pieces that I've polished have looked incredible. A few questions:
a) any way to keep the parts this shiny?
b) is there any easy way to really get a good shine to the coin door parts and the drop of the locking mechanism (mine has rust) since these won't fit in my tumbler?
c) has anyone seen or done a KISS restore with have the side rails and/or legs powder coated a different color such as red/orange to match the paint? My side rails have a few dings here and there which are very subtle and I think they might not be as noticeable with a powder coating vs. buying new replacements and still consider coating those as well.

#26 7 years ago
Quoted from DrMark12PA:

a) any way to keep the parts this shiny?

You can get yourself a can (see picture below) of "Outdoor Clear #8321 Lacquer" and spray the parts. It will coat and protect the parts.

Quoted from DrMark12PA:

b) is there any easy way to really get a good shine to the coin door parts and the drop of the locking mechanism (mine has rust) since these won't fit in my tumbler?

I have used a buffer as well as used 00000 steel wool with Mothers chrome polish. Of course there are other ways to do this but this is what works for me!

Quoted from DrMark12PA:

c) has anyone seen or done a KISS restore with have the side rails and/or legs powder coated a different color such as red/orange to match the paint? My side rails have a few dings here and there which are very subtle and I think they might not be as noticeable with a powder coating vs. buying new replacements and still consider coating those as well.

Check out the pictures on Chris' site http://christopherhutchins.com/gallery/album328

2014-03-05 08.55.07.jpg
#27 7 years ago

Has anyone here used the clear lacquer after polishing? I have several parts I literally have looking like a mirror and would like to preserve that look if possible using a clear finish.

#28 7 years ago
Quoted from meSz:

Been awhile since I had a KISS machine but if I recall correctly all you need to do is remove the flipper buttons and the spiral nails. I have found that the spiral nails are typically loose in these older games but you always get a few that are in there good. Just need to be careful removing them as you don't want to bend up the rail and make it look like Scheiße.
So what you're thinking are rivets are actually spiral nails
Post edited by meSz : Added picture

Has anyone here swapped the spiral nails out for just a stainless screw when doing a restore or just replacing their rails? I'm just curious what others have done or seen on the older Bally to secure the side rail vs. reusing the same spiral nails.

images.jpg 5 KB

#29 7 years ago

I manufacture replacement carriage bolts for the coin door and the side rails. They are made from pre-polished stainless steel and will look a whole lot better than clear-coated ones with the original zinc plating worn off them. Not to mention that they will stay looking nice forever.

I also manufacture some metal playfield parts and backglass lift channels & trim for Bally pins if you are interested.

If you need them, I also have a new set of nails too that will work.

Here's my Bally parts flyer:

Pinball Parts.jpg

Hey there! Got a moment?

Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run thanks to donations from our visitors? Please donate to Pinside, support the site and get anext to your username to show for it! Donate to Pinside