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(Topic ID: 66860)

Just pre-ordered BoP 2.0 kit!!

By pinlawyer

7 years ago

Topic Stats

  • 876 posts
  • 114 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 5 years ago by Snux
  • Topic is favorited by 29 Pinsiders


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#215 6 years ago
Quoted from awarner:

OK - I just got off the phone with Rick. This isn't really a BOP 2.0 issue, it's a "right to make changes to existing software" issue. This was something that was totally against the rules Williams had established. Industry leaders are behind this initiative for other reasons so BOP 2.0 is just waiting for the legal machine to get through it's process. This is the best way I can describe my conversation with Rick.
Personally, I feel better knowing it's not just about BOP 2.0. I think we'll have something special after all of this is figured out.

I just assumed from reading between the lines on Rick's post that this was about things he's hinted at, like code improvements to a Cactus Canyon Remake for instance.

#234 6 years ago

The mylar came off my '89 EATPM pretty cleanly, so you just never know.

3 weeks later
#287 6 years ago
Quoted from calvin12:

Interesting wording in the last paragraph. This is a blanket license, CCC if worked out can be formally done, same with seemingly any williams owned license.

Rick has been hinting about just that sort of thing pretty broadly for a while. Definitely curious to see what comes of it all.

6 months later
#412 6 years ago
Quoted from Pdxmonkey:

That's what I thought last year befor the colorization

It's even nicer in color for sure, all that shading and detail that worked pretty good on the red DMD really shines with full color.

#416 6 years ago

Yeah, it's still a DMD look, not a high rez video screen. It looks totally appropriate in person.

2 weeks later
#461 6 years ago

No problems getting parts that I'm aware of.

#468 6 years ago
Quoted from markmon:

I've heard rumors about this and it's pretty annoying considering that probably none of us care at all about a stupid sticker.

You know who cares about stupid stickers? Lawyers.

#487 6 years ago
Quoted from Jarkko:

But yeah, if the delivery time for the hologram sticker was six months, this could indeed explain the delay. They should have told this to the customer, in order not to get all the blame on themselves.

Let's just assume that a 6 month delay for some stickers involved legal fighting. In a situation like that one might assume that you were unable to say anything.

Is what it is, looks like the light at the end of the tunnel is sunny now.

#542 6 years ago
Quoted from MapleSyrup:

Would you mind explaining this? My BoP arrives tomorrow. Is there an older ROM that is considered better than the latest for some reason? Rules? Audio? Perhaps this is something all BoP owners know about... I'm new to the machine. Also on board for the 2.0 kit, so I'd like to understand all the nuances of the different code versions at play here.

I don't have a Bride, but generally speaking the non-ghosting stuff was added in afterwards by enthusiasts, and not "official" releases. So the issue here isn't rules, it's that the last official release doesn't have the hack.

Since you can just use non-ghosting LEDs it doesn't strike me as a particularly big deal. It's usually just a few problematic inserts, just swap those if you have cheaper LEDs in them and call it a day.

#577 6 years ago

I'd be surprised to see DP do another Williams/Bally 2.0 game personally.

#588 6 years ago
Quoted from burningman:

I am modding mine now. Geert Koop from Koop Kustoms (he is doing some of the work on TBL) has my Rudy head and painting him up. I am adding some lights, and a few things here and there. Hopefully will have it at 100% by the first of the year.

Ooh, definitely want to see what Geert does with Rudy!

#597 6 years ago
Quoted from Cheeks:

Wait, are you saying the code is not complete? I thought the code was virtually done on this game. I certainly was not expecting to get a preliminary version of code, especially given how much extra time they've had compared to the original timeline given.

Yeah, I didn't know this was being released "unfinished", what gives?

#603 6 years ago
Quoted from TheNoTrashCougar:

To be fully transparent, the kits are currently not shipping with the final code. The shipping version of the code is very playable, fun, and deeper than the original software. As we progress further, we will be giving the game more depth, more multiballs, more wheel modes (currently 6 unique modes), Metamorphosis, better PinMAME integration, and more hidden surprises. We may also add coin-op functionality further down the road for people that use tokens in their game rooms. Keep in mind that this kit is geared toward home use and not meant for commercial use.

Wow. That's really not encouraging.

Was this already known? It's news to me. It's bad enough on a new game, but at least there's a whole other game that had to be developed, so you can kind of understand. This is a pure software project (yes, it has hardware components, but playfield and switches are all there already) and so the whole purpose of it is code. And that's not done? Why are you even releasing it then?

I'm not in on BOP 2.0, but it's making me feel concerned about TBL now if this is the kind of thing that DP thinks is acceptable. Frankly forget pre-ordering a game, waiting a year, and then playing the "wait for code" game, I'm tired of it.

#640 6 years ago
Quoted from KoenHeltzel:

For the upcoming update v1.09 we're taking a different approach, which is to resize PinMAME behind some part of the screen that is obstructed by the speaker panel, and then in our own game code simulate a nice alphanumeric display.

Very nice, looks a million times better.

#705 6 years ago
Quoted from Joshmx19:

DP is keeping pretty quiet about this, I think they have something up their sleeves.

I hope not. Meaning, I hope they're not being quiet on purpose to try and reveal some surprise. I'm tired of lack of communication.

#719 6 years ago
Quoted from rosh:

This thread is a classic pinside thread where there are folks who can't see the forest for the trees and just want to bitch and moan. This is a great time in pinball with all of these new players advancing the technology. If folks are not willing to have some ups and down, then maybe they should stick with their 80s and 90s games exactly the way they are and just be happy and stop getting involved with new leading edge projects like BOP2.0 or any of the pins being made by folks other then Stern.

Or, alternately, maybe companies should stop taking our money and delivering half-finished products, with poor communication.

I'm done with the slack cutting. For anyone. I love what Dutch Pinball is doing, I was in on TBL, but I just can't support this model anymore. Stern, JJP, DP, SkitB, I don't care who it is.

This is a software project. The hardware exists only to support that fact. Shipping it with the software so unfinished sucks. There's no hand waving that away. Rick, blah blah, I know all about it. They chose to not finish the game during all that BS, and I think it's lame. Just because I like Dutch Pinball doesn't mean they should get some free pass.

I like Stern, I like Steve Ritchie, I'm pissed about Star Trek being so broke ass still. And the reason they get away with it is because we keep rationalizing it. Forget it, no more buying new stuff until you actually are ready to give me what I paid for.

Does anyone here think Keefer isn't rad? Guy is awesome. Does anyone here think Hobbit will ship with even vaguely complete code? I sure as hell don't. That's the new status quo, and we accept it. Bleh.

#726 6 years ago
Quoted from Pdxmonkey:

Yay somebody else sees the big picture.

That's certainly a legit way to look at it, and it's entirely possible that without people willing to step up and play the pre-order game that (new) pinball would die off. I get that.

On the other hand the big picture I see is also one that includes enabling the kind of stupid behavior that means you pay $7,000 for a game, and over a year later it's still full of bugs and broke ass shit.

You know who didn't do that? Spooky. AMH is being built, as promised. Ben's working on a "final" update with some fixes and features that have been requested and I applaud that, but they shipped the game done. So it's obviously possible, even for a small shop.

Maybe TBL will ship on time with finished code, that would rule. But I'm okay with being in the "doesn't have the stomach for it" camp. It's just not enjoyable for me.

#730 6 years ago
Quoted from sd_tom:

So did you really cancel Aurich or still chewing on it? Haven't revealed it to the RTR preorder list yet I see... so there's a chance...

Emailed Barry already, done deal. I guess it's too late now, but I didn't want to make a big deal out of it, wasn't going to go into the pre-order thread and announce it or anything.

The truth is I've always thought pre-ordering was bullshit. Thought so on WOZ, on Jpop, Predator, etc etc. But I can't lie, I fell under the spell of Phil and DP at Expo. Got excited and wanted in. I still think it's a fabulous project that could be a great game. But it's too much money, and too much stress, and too much heartache, and I just want to play pinball and enjoy it.

I bought Star Trek NIB because I wanted to make new art for it. That's really the reason I didn't wait to pick up a HUO one, I wanted to play it, but I wanted to "play with it" too. Lesson learned though, it's been over a year, and the code is a mess, Ritchie is pissed, and I doubt I'll ever buy another Lonnie game that's for sure.

So no more new games that are half assed, no more pre-ordering games. I don't care what the theme is. If I just want to look at something I'll get a nice print.

Quoted from markmon:

sorry but it's not true. After having the game in my house a couple weeks I realized just how buggy it is.

Sorry to hear that. Coding pinball isn't easy, or it wouldn't take so long. Ben's probably learning a lot from this experience. I still respect what Spooky is doing though. They communicate, they do what they say they'll do, they're available. It's like the polar opposite of the SkitB mess.

#734 6 years ago
Quoted from rosh:

I believe the licensing issues hit immediately after expo and took quite awhile to resolve.

It's more complicated than that. But it doesn't matter, because that was someone like Phil's problem, not the programmer. The legal stuff had nothing to do with whether or not it could be finished, that wasn't the hold up. So they chose to focus on other stuff for at least part of it I guess.

#736 6 years ago
Quoted from rosh:

Not sure what you mean by this.

Is what it is now, and the details aren't something to talk about in public anyways. What's more important is seeing the communication going forward, and more importantly, how quickly the game gets updates and attention.

I'm pulling for DP, I still think they have enormous potential.

#761 6 years ago

FWIW I'm sure BOP 2.0 will be finished, code-wise, and probably by early next year. It's not that I don't have faith the final product will be awesome. I'm just disappointed that they're shipping it so unfinished.

So having a nice BOP for it to live in sounds great, and totally worth it.

#782 5 years ago

I like The Shadow's video mode. It's fast, works well with pinball controls, and you can use the gun smart bomb strategically when deciding if you're just trying to go for EB or actually finish out the mode.

#785 5 years ago
Quoted from freddy:

Did not know this . Smart Bomb Thanks

Right, so once per video mode you can pull the trigger on the gun to erase all the falling phurbas. Here's the catch: when they come back a second later they're all falling faster than before.

I generally use it after I've sucked up enough points that I know the EB is coming, and once I get it I don't mind getting hit, or right at the end if I'm going for completion. Definitely adds a little more strategy and fun.

3 weeks later
#802 5 years ago

Rarehero was order number one. Where's his?

#825 5 years ago
Quoted from TheKorn:

Couple of thoughts...
1. Why is that Calvin's problem? He doesn't work for DP, he shouldn't be expected to answer for them.
2. Seriously!??!? With all the FUD around DP since the Phil blowup, the first concrete iron clad good news about DP comes out and not only do you try to piss all over the parade, you actually take your pants down and try to deficate on it from eight stories up! BAD FORM! Celebrate when people do good things, don't obsess over a micro transgression. (And a perfectly justifiable one, at that!)

Hey, easy, not trying to crap on things, and not Calvin's problem at all. But Rarehero was the first order, so just curious if he's about to get his. (He was first because he cheated and snuck into Expo through the kitchen before it was open.)

Hey, if you're local and can pick up then great, but are they about to go out the door then?

I'm happy for Calvin and want to hear more, didn't mean to come off negative.

2 weeks later
#870 5 years ago

The US kits should ship any day now from what I've heard. This thread should hopefully get some life soon.

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