Now all we need are some repo playfields. I know someone was working on it but SOMEONE please build it too! Would be nice to be able to install this and do the PF swap at the same time.

I don't get this. You can't see buying a $1500 mod for a $1500 game which makes it basically a 2 in 1 game. But you can see spending $1000 for a playfield for a $1500 game? I guess I just see things differently the others.

OP - How many have you sold yet? I'm still wanting this but waiting to place an order until this is confirmed to be done or we are closer to the cut off date.

SWEET! I'll be ordering it then. Sounds like it's time to start collecting parts. My game plan was to install this at the same time I restore my BOP so I only have to tear it apart once.

Ordered and paid for today. Can't wait.

If I can get the kit in time to install it for TPF I'll bring it to the show

I did paypal. When you order you'll get an e-mail with how to paypal them.

I'm with VID. I'm not watching any new video's since I've ordered and paid. I'd like a surprise.

With that said, that doesn't stop anyone from posting one. I'm just going to steer clear and try to not hear about it. Kind of like DVRing the superbowl and watching it the next day. Going to be real hard but I'm gonna try.

Let me know who you use. I need the same done with mine but everyone I've talked to isn't taking on new work right now or isn't doing anything but clearing NOS playfields

Yeah. The standard DMD was $270 US and it looks like color DMDs are $400 for their kit so hopefully we will get credit for the standard DMD already bought and can upgrade for about the price difference. If so, I know what I'm adding

Looks cool.

Can I bit nit picky for a second. Saw the tilt animation and heard "Chicago, we have a problem." Not sure where Chicago comes from but NASA is in Houston and the phase is normally, "Houston, we have a problem." Maybe Chicago was chosen for another reason but thought I'd bring that up.

Just making an assumption since I don't see anywhere where the specific DMD is. I figured it's safe to assume that if their is a company that produces color DMD's as a kit for $400 it would be safe to say that just the DMD itself could be had for about that same cost.

My thought being expressed is the same that I hope we get credit for the DMD that was placed before the color option was an option.

Makes sense. Just sounded weird when I heard it as my ears are used to something different.

While I do like the above for me personally, if you do add the suggestiveness back into the game please add an option to remove them in the settings (like sterns family mode). I say this as I like to have pinball parties for the local elementary school (my wife is a teacher there) and BOP doesn't get turned on for these due to that suggestiveness. That was one of the things I was looking forward to on this kit as I was now going to be able to get to use BOP at those parties.

I know what you are all thinking that it's not that bad but I just don't feel like dealing with the parents when she starts oohing and aughing.

SSD's are much better than standard hard drives but they do fail. Is their a game plan in place for a situation where one fails down the road? Like maybe the ability to buy just a pre-loaded hard drive with the software already installed? Or, will we be able to make a back-up of the file ourselves? Being it's not open sourced I'm assuming that answer would be no. Just would like to have a game plan in place for the inevitable being I am the definition of Murphys law

P.S. - I'm so excited and can barely wait for mine to show up. Also, fingers crossed the news about the color display is good but worst case the non-color display is still pretty awesome.

I REALLY want some of those black decals. Would love a PM from the person that has them if possible

Anyone heard anything new on when these kits may start shipping or if the license concerns have been resolved?

That would just be stupid. Asking the production company for an update on production is not going to impact the license holder. Now bugging the license holder may but that would be bad business (loss in income).

What else is bad business would be taking peoples money and going silent (not saying what they are doing here, just a blanket comment).

double post

Thanks Rick. I completely understand how sometimes attorneys will drag their feet a bit. I deal with it on a daily basis at my work. My gut was telling me that they are focus on a bit of a bigger project going on right now. Since we have you in the thread now. Have you heard any more from your vendor on the BOP playfields? This kit is getting some big interest in this pin again so I think those are going to be a winner for you

But heck, what do I know. I'm just a moron as I just like to be updated on things, especially when I have paid $2K on a mod for a machine that's not even worth $2K as it sits. Apparently only stupid people like to hear, "Hey guys, just letting everyone know we are still working on getting this thing to market. Hit a few road bumps but we're making good progress with our licensing team. We are shooting for ____ but as you know things can change but will let you know more later. Thanks again for your support." Because silence is just so comforting we should just sit around and check the mail everyday watching for our kits. I guess all those people asking for updates on MMR and WOZ before things were finalized are idiots to so at least I know I'm not alone.
***for those that don't understand a moron's thought process (you know who you are) most of this was sarcasm.***

DP - Thanks for the update and working so hard on this. "most" of us are super excited to get these things installed. It's pinside so I think it's safe to say this will be EPIC once it's finalized.

I'm sorry to say but I'm getting close to that point. I'll let you know if I decide to (if it's even allowed). Been a lot of hopes and dreams with BOP lately (repo playfields, Repo plastics, 2.0) and all of them are going silent now which is disappointing.

+1 on this.

Leave it. I had slight bubbles on my mylar so removed it. The edges of the inserts came off and a big chunk of the insert art of my billion heart insert. If I had to do it again I would have left it until a repo was out.

I'm starting to learn with these things that good enough sometimes needs to be enough as "better" has made some things worse than good enough was.

Just got a newsletter from them. Sounds like they are making good progress and there may be a light at the end of the tunnel if everything goes as planned

Don't think so. Summery of the e-mail is basically that they still have some work to do with getting the liscense approved but things are looking good for potentially having that done this month (not going to hold them to the timeline they gave but it's soon).

That's great news as it makes it seem as though the license concerns may have been resolved now

Always been that price. You have to keep in mind that includes:
- Color DMD
- Upgraded speaker system
- Mini computer with P-roc
- Backpanel to fit the color DMD
- then the software itself

It's $1300 pounds so if the dollar was a bit stronger it wouldn't be so much either. It's not cheap but it's really not to bad when you consider everything you get. Color DMD is $400 itself, then add the speaker system and that's another $150 (flipper fidelity comparison) before you even get into the actual P-roc and code changes.

It better have both or the price needs to go way down or I'll be out. While I prefer BOP 2.0 software I still want the original software. Only having one defeats a large portion of the benefit here. Ears are back open and emotion is back on the rollercoaster ride again it seems

That's great news. I've learned one thing from all this. No more pre-orders for anything for me. I just can't handle the emotional rollercoaster. Was really frustrated yesterday and now I'm excited again at least.

Been a month since the "parts were shipping to be assembled". Can we get an update on where we are in the progress? I would assume the parts have made it to the US by now. Any thoughts on how much we are going to be expected to pay for shipping and when we can expect these to be delivered to those paid in full already?

Precisely. We are paid in full and get the carrot in front of the horse treatment. Those interested in TBL should be watching this. If it takes 8+ months to start production on something that was advertised as ready to build if ___ orders were made then I'd be very concerned with a new game all together. Not trying to start *&^% but my patience is about done with this whole thing.

Guess the elephant in the room then is...

Have the boards been ordered already atleast?

My thought is one of two things.

- They eat shipping due to the delays for those that pre-ordered and paid in full almost a year ago

or

- We don't get the shipping details until they are boxed up ready to go

Couple more weeks. I'm holding tight right now as I don't see anything but problems for them if they don't ship by Expo. I.E. - Doubt they will do to well promoting TBL when they constantly get asked questions about BOP 2.0. I think that is the main reason for the goal given. If Expo is missed it looks like they will be in Houston a couple weeks later. I wont be at Expo and if I don't get my BOP by the Houston Expo I'll go to it and be a big pain in the ass there personally. Hoping I get it for two reason. 1. I'm getting tired of waiting. 2. I do not want to go to the Houston show.

I think we should hold our pitchforks at bay until Expo. If kits haven't shipped by that time then we should get really vocal really fast. I'm thinking that they will go out by Expo as he communicated to me. Just way to many risk for not doing so. You don't want people bringing this up when trying to promote a new game. I think they understand that thus their push to get out by then.

By any chance have you received shipping info? They told me Expo so I'm still waiting but since you were told 10/3 I'm curious if you have heard something.

I was told by Expo so they have about a week and a half. Fingers crossed that still comes through. I don't see any reasonable reason that timeline would be desired to be missed. With Expo and the Houston Show so close there are a lot of reasons to make this happen as advised upon.

I do keep checking my e-mails every hour waiting for that shipping message.

Hey, let's all band together and when this starts shipping let's put some heat on the repo playfields That's the last piece of the puzzle before I can make a killer BOP!

Not sure but I do hope that the speaker in the pic is not what is included with the "High Fidelity" speaker upgrade. That thing looks just as bad as a stock Stern speaker so I'm going to assume it's not.

By the looks of the pics it looks like one of the "treats" may be some "DP" flipper bats though.

I wonder if I should change the "williams" logo on my cab to a BOP 2.0 Logo instead. Doing the custom black decals already so nows the best time to make some mods. Already thing of replacing the part in the front that says "The Machine" with "BOP 2.0". Any suggestions for changes there?

I'll take your word for it on the speakers. Gotta be better than the ones in the game already. Hoping for quality at least on par as the flipper fidelity or pinball pro set-up.

Sounds good. I really like that you will allow for the software on a new HD if something happens. That was actually my biggest fear of having this up and running and then something happen and having to buy another kit or find some way to get a new computer/HD.

I actually hope not. I don't want it looking like my HD TV. I want it to look like a DMD, just with color. Having it to sharp seems like it would look even more out of place on such an old game. I'm weird though as I actually prefer the DMD look over these new color LCD screens.

Best to follow that here - http://www.planetarypinball.com/forum/index.php/topic,106.0.html

What's the story with Phil and when are kits going to start shipping. Yet, another deadline promised has been missed without the courtesy of an update to the buyers of the product. The fact that what looked to be a major player at DP left is troublesome as well. How will this impact us getting our paid for kits?

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/uh-oh-phil-leaving-dp

Got a surprise phone call from Barry.

I may be a complete jack ass sometimes but I'm still a man of my word so I wont share our full conversation as it was a private conversation thus the call. I do feel it merits a post to advise that they are listening and that after speaking with him my confidence level is better especially since he confirmed that he was the one running with 2.0 and Scott was the main man for US.

I still do believe that actions are what speaks so that will tell the full story but I was very pleased with what he had to say.

I'll let Scott or Barry themselves answer that question with a specific date if they have one as I didn't ask for a specific date while speaking with him. I did however get the feeling that the non-US kits are super close. The US kits sound to still have a hurdle or 2 to cross. Didn't seem like big issues but something that will prevent the US kits from going out when the non-US kits do (which is inline with their last communication).

I honestly wouldn't be surprised to start seeing some "my kit's been shipped" e-mails any day now for you non-US folks. Again, I preface this next statement with the fact I didn't ask for a specific date or timeline on the US kits specifically, but I'm thinking Santa may be delivering the US kits. Just my gut feeling at this point. Our conversation was more inline with DP in general, the communication challenges faced by the BOP 2.0 owners and my personal frustrations with the process.

Barry was very polite, took ownership for things that have not gone to plan and rightfully defended things that are just part of business. I respected him even more after the call as I know it took a lot of guts to call someone that was obviously very upset about their company. That takes a lot and shows to me, at least, they are still working and striving to improve their business one interaction at a time. Action will show everything so time will tell how they respond to these adversities that they have recently faced.

Full kit looks to be $1996.58 US ($1595 Euro's) now. This includes the color DMD and speaker upgrades. Shipping is extra but we don't know that cost yet.

It makes your game 2 games in one since you can play both versions of the game still. This kit makes BOP more than a one trick pony which I feel increase the value of fun quite a bit.

It's a heavy price tag but don't forget you are also getting a color DMD and an upgraded speaker set-up with amp, sub and backboard speakers as part of that. Those two items combined are about $500-$600 if I wanted to add them to one of my new stern games.

kapsreiter - That seems like a fairly easy install. I was expecting to have to repin some connectors to get things to fit the P-roc. Looks like it's pretty much all plug in play. That's awesome if that's the case.

That's interesting. Seems like there should be at least a ball search that would release the ball even if the switch was bad. I would think that would have been an easy one to reproduce and identify and DP would be aware of it if there was a software glitch since it's been played for a year now. Hopefully it's something simple.

Which begs the questions. I'm doing a restore on my machine as well speak in prep for this game. Is there something I should do to help prevent this problem? Should I touch each solder joint with my iron to reflow things?

Thanks VID for the info. That helps a lot and by looking over the board it looks good. I just finished cleaning them using a tip you gave before on using mr bubbles. All joints look nice and shiny. The joints on most of the coils and switches is another story but since I'll have to remove most of them as part of the restore anyway I guess I'll be good.

DP - Glad to see some quick responses to question on this thread now. It goes to show that improvements are being made in the communication department. Keep it up as it's good to see!

By the way. YOU SUCK!!! (for being the first to get the kit). Super jealous.

I had no idea it had a ball save. That's pretty neat as BOP can drain super fast. Would be cool if they added some sound effects to the start up. I actually thought the sound was off until the game officially started.

Can't wait to try it for the first time.

While I wish it was US kits shipping I'm supper thrilled to see the EU kits going out now. That means the wait is almost over.

On a different note - anyone know if they got the BOP 1.0 helmet lights working? I recalled in the past that was an issue and was curious if it was figured out. Don't recall seeing anything related to that.

That is a major buzz kill. I thought it was complete as well I fully expected a couple of bugs but thought it was going to be complete all the way to a wizard mode.

Can anyone speak to the timeline of when the update may come?

I would like to add. Glad to at least see that a DP response. While not the desired response it is another example of them at least trying to communicate better. Steps in the right direction.

Thinking more about this, I'm guessing most of the software work from Expo 2013 to Expo 2014 was around the color DMD. I had forgotten that was a change made towards the end of last year. I wont even speculate on how much effort it was to make that change but I'm thinking that may be a factor in why less features have been added in that past year.

Should be. The speaker kit is connected to an amp with built in cross over. I'm sure you can tweak the sounds via it.

Anyone know what toy is used for the shuttle on the shuttle ramp? I want to make one of those as I refuse to pay $80 for what is probably a $5 toy with $3 in lights.

Awesome. I'm racing them as well as PPS (repo PF) to see what gets finished first. Me getting my 2.0 kit, the PF showing up or me finishing my cab restoration. So far I think I'm winning but you know I gotta make a good home for her

Just one of 3 tables worth of parts restored and the light panel fully restored. Harnesses cleaned, metal parts tumbled, coils cleaned, new wrappers made, all new warning stickers being printed, etc...

coils.jpg
317320.jpg

Nope. Never found one. Took the advise of some other BOP owners and just painted my factory one. Not perfect due to some minor cracking in a couple of places at the top of a dome but it looks much better than before.

I think my on concern about code right now is if having only the 4 modes will keep you entertained for the long hall. I'm no pro but I've made it to encore in AC/DC, made it to 2 shots away from EOL on MET, beaten AV and TF so I'm a bit concerned that I'll see all there is after a handful of plays.

I'm sorry to say this but I will anyways. Comparing this to a recent Stern is pretty silly. We are talking about 4 modes and 1 multiball. No wizard mode. No mini wizard mode. No metamorphasis.

Original Stern code -
ST - 18 modes (you may not like them but they are there). 2 different MB (not including wizard modes). 3 wizard modes
MET - Not sure the number of modes in initial launch. Think there were a handful if you count seek and destroy, fuel, justice for all. 4 multiballs
Mustang - 7 modes, 2 MB, wizard mode
AC/DC - self explanatory
TWD - No clue as I haven't seen one yet

I think what we are seeing today with BOP 2.0 is really cool. It's not $2K US cool though yet. The frustration I see is because there was an expectation that doesn't look to be met yet. I also think some of the joy of kits getting installed even in current state is just some relief that something came since people have had a good chunk of money invested in this for a while now. I think the truth will be told on how long it takes to get the update in the kit to make this a complete game using all features of the game. I'm "hoping" that they have more really close and it's just in testing right now. WOZ like timeline on updates will be good for me (every couple of months). Stern timeline on updates would just piss me off (wait half a year plus for not much). If it falls the Stern timeline I'll just sell the game, find something else that makes me happy and remove DP from my buyers list as a company. I'm pulling for the latter though as I think they have a lot of potential to be a big player in the market.

Scott - Any chance we could get a statement from DP around the update timeline and a high level list of things that would be part of the update? I feel this spark growing into a small fire and it would be good to have a statement from DP that could potentially help prevent this from growing out of control.

That's good to hear. Not sure where I got stuck on 4 modes. I went back and read Scott's announcement and he said 6 as well. Brain fart apparently. I still think it would be a good idea for an official notice from DP on timeline for the updated code. May help ease some nerves.

burningman - You have a lot of good feedback which is what is really surprising me that you continue to say that the frustration towards DP with BOP is not justified and that we have unreasonable expectations. That is very surprising. Almost like you have only read back to after the license stuff started. DP brought on most of the frustrations themselves. There communications has not been good. It was getting better but that's yet to be seen on if it continues. At first we would go months without a word after production was supposed to start. That's not other companies causing that frustration.

Here are the facts that have caused the frustration's towards DP -
- it was said, this time last year, that once __ orders were made they would start production of the kits. If that number wasn't reached the project would not go on. This forces the pre-order so to say we all should have waited shows that you don't understand how this all started.
- That number was hit and things were good to start production. Communication went dead for a while then we all found out about the license issues. When that first happened a simple - "hey, guys. Looks like we need an official license to produce this since we want to keep BOP 1.0 in the game. This will delay production but we'll keep you in the loop." would have prevented a lot of the concerns. Again, frustration not brought on by other companies.
- Then we were told all parts were sent to the US for building. That turns out to not be true. Again, not a frustration caused by another company.
- Then we are not told by DP that the code is behind what we all were under the impression it was at but we found out by a test installer. Later confirmed by DP. Again, frustration not caused by another company.

These are just the high level events. To say that we went in with unreasonable expectations is nonsense. Our expectation was to buy a $2K kit and have a fully working $2K kit early 2014 as that is what was "sold" to us. Once neither of those actions happened buyers are well within reason to start showing concern. Remember, this was sold as a kit not an idea they wanted to research for possible delivery.

At the end of the day, I also still think DP will be a key player in future Pinball projects and I think they will grow as a company from there mistakes on this project. Markmon is right though. We as a community seem to give a bit to much leniency with these types of situations. It's up to us, as customers, to start showing the market we are tired of being treated in this fashion. If we cont to sit back and keep our mouth closed we are not helping to improve the industry. Companies spend millions in market research to get the information that we provide in these forums for free. They would be smart to listen to the good and bads so that they can better their business for the long term. Judging by the calls I've personally received from feedback I've posted in the past, I think a few (DP included) are listening.

Put me on that list. I've had my bride for 3 years now. It was an average condition players pin. With 2.0 I bought the kit and started collecting parts for a restorations. I'm now neck deep in a full out, every nut and bolt, restoration. I'll have way more in my restoration than the BOP 2.0 kit at this point. Hopefully it will all be worth it in the end

Ask and you shall receive

Poll added here - https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/bop-poll-did-you-buy-one-for-20-only#post-2076343

Video mode sounds like it could be cool. Curious what they have in mind. If they implement everything you are saying was in the e-mail this will be a killer game.

DP - if you are still reading this thread. Even though I'm a US customer and don't have my kit I'd love to get the e-mails like the above poster received. Maybe you could send it to those that are paid in full? Wont be able to install the update on anything but being kept in the loop would help make the time pass

I love video modes and miss them in the new games. Just don't make it to easy to get as you don't want to see it every game but if done well I think it will be fun. Biggest thing is to make the action you have to complete random. Not like STTNG for instance. If you can just memorize the pattern then it would be pointless.

I think it's even more important now that they blow BOP 2.0 out of the water. Seeing a great product with frequent updates until completed would go a long way to start winning back some of the confidence of potential TBL buyers.

Gotta agree with cheeks. The new music is pretty boring compared to the old sound track. I hope we can get the old track and directions on how to put it in. It was exciting and up beat. This track does the opposite to me.