Jurassic Park
Data East, 1993
Star Wars
Data East, 1992Quoted from ChadH:The thought was to boost the score for those who hit it 5 times or less and then curtail the score for those who make over 5 jackpots.
I don't think I am ever normally able to nail the raptor pit even that many times during the mode. So 5 or under sounds good to me :-p
Quoted from stangbat:Although System Failure is great, I don't see a reason to extend it simply to rack up more points. If it were an issue of balance such as what Chad is looking at for all the other modes, then I'd say fine, increase it. But it is kind of an icing on the cake mode and you take what you can get. Increasing it doesn't really change anything other than let you bang the balls around longer.
+1 not something that needs changing. If anything (and I suspect may not be possible) extending it if a score level during it would make sense as a reward. But really not needed IMO.
Great work on the modes Chad!
Goatdan suggested a EOB bonus award based on the nature of your completed modes. I think this is a great suggestion to reward players for attempting the modes.
Typically I just skip most of the modes, going for ramp/control room combos to progress through them as quickly as possible to get to System Failure, stopping only to claim the big/easy points in Escape, Bone Busting and Spitters.
But if there was a good EOB bonus for achieving points in the modes then it might be worth the diversion risk to attempt them.
Not sure if this is agreeable, or even possible with the nature of your code adjustments.
Quoted from accidental:Great work on the modes Chad!
Goatdan suggested a EOB bonus award based on the nature of your completed modes. I think this is a great suggestion to reward players for attempting the modes.
Typically I just skip most of the modes, going for ramp/control room combos to progress through them as quickly as possible to get to System Failure, stopping only to claim the big/easy points in Escape, Bone Busting and Spitters.
But if there was a good EOB bonus for achieving points in the modes then it might be worth the diversion risk to attempt them.
Not sure if this is agreeable, or even possible with the nature of your code adjustments.
I've been working with GoatDan offline on the scoring change proposals. He has a deep level of understanding of the game scoring that I do not possess. I don't think there is enough free memory to be able to implement a completed mode based bonus. So instead the plan is to boost up the scoring of all the weaker modes to make the player WANT to play them all. Let me know what you think of the changes so far.
Compared to Star Wars, JP only has about 1/4 the amount of free space. Which makes the more elaborate ideas more difficult to implement.
Chad
I thought that might be the case. You've got a tough job deciding what improvements will make the cut! I think you've done excellent work so far.
Quoted from ChadH:Compared to Star Wars, JP only has about 1/4 the amount of free space. Which makes the more elaborate ideas more difficult to implement.
Stupid question but do they make higher capacity roms?? I mean, if we're changing them out anyways then.....
I'm sure the answer is a resounding "NO" otherwise it would have been brought up already but I just had to ask 
Quoted from ChadH:OK, I have returned the Right Inlane Timer to it's original value.
I actually think your decrease was a great idea. I find it is much easier to just wait for an inlane roll over than shoot the power shed. If you drop the time that would at least make the power shed a more attractive shot to go for compared to the inlane.
Quoted from Starscream:Do we not like my suggestions of extending system failure from 45 seconds to 60 seconds to rack up more points?
I find system failure to typically award about the same points every time I get it; on my dad's machine, this is usually ~130M which seems valuable enough. I'm not sure why you'd up the time.
Quoted from ChadH:JP is a very score-heavy game when it comes to Multiball leaving many of the modes seemingly under powered. Been focusing a lot on looking at all the modes and doing some balancing of them.
Here's an update on all changes implemented so far... more to come...
STARTING MODE:
The starting mode was always Stampede. This has been changed to be random. Lite Extra Ball has been removed from the starting random choice.
DINOSAUR TARGETS:
Dinosaur stand-up targets would auto-collect between balls guaranteeing Tri-Ball lit by third ball. This has been removed. If player still wants them to auto-collect, then they can switch Adjustment 7 from the default of Moderate to Easy or Extra Easy.
END OF BALL BONUS:
Original: Starts at 500,000 points. 7,500 points per switch. Limit 2,000,000 points.
Proposed: Starts at 500,000 points. 25,000 points per switch. Limit 6,000,000 points. End Of Ball Bonus will no longer increase during multiball.
TIMERS:
Ball Launch Ball Save Timer has been extended from 4 seconds to 10 seconds.
Raptor Kickback Timer has been extended from 3.5 to 5 seconds
SPITTER MODE:
Original: 20 seconds to hit Spitter targets. Points are awarded at end of mode.
1 hit = 5M, 2 hit = 20M, 3 hit = 30M
Proposal: 20 seconds to hit Spitter targets. Points are awarded at end of mode.
1 hit = 5M, 2 hit = 15M, 3 hit = 30M
2-BALL RAPTOR:
Original: Raptor pit is worth 7M, 9M, 11M, etc.
Proposal: Raptor pit is worth 9M, 10M, 11M, etc.
MOSQUITO:
Original: 20 seconds, captive ball is worth 5M, 6M, 7M, etc.
Proposal: 20 seconds, captive ball is worth 10M, 11M, 12M, etc.
RAPTOR RAMPAGE:
Original: 20 seconds, Raptor Pit is worth between 5M and 10M.
Proposal: 20 seconds, Raptor Pit is worth between 5M and 10M and award keeps adding to itself when collected. Example, first shot is 6M, player collects 6M. Second shot is 8M, player collects 8M plus 6M. Third shot is 5M, player collects 5M + 8M + 6M.
STAMPEDE:
Original: Always first mode. 20 seconds. Starts at 5M, all switches add 300K, 310K, 320K, etc to reward.
Proposal: Random mode. 20 seconds. Reward at 5M, all switches add 400K, 420K, 440K, etc to reward.
BONE BUSTING:
Original: 25 seconds, hit ramp 3 times to collect 20M.
Proposal: 25 seconds, hit ramp 3 times to collect 30M.
PARK REVENUE:
Original: Starts at 500,000. 30,000 per pop bumper hit. Resets between balls.
Proposal: Starts at 1M. 50,000 per pop bumper hit. Resets between balls.
That's it for now.
These sound good to me. Play testing will let you know if you need more tweaks.
Quoted from ChadH:RAPTOR RAMPAGE:
Original: 20 seconds, Raptor Pit is worth between 5M and 10M.
Proposal: 20 seconds, Raptor Pit is worth between 5M and 10M and award keeps adding to itself when collected. Example, first shot is 6M, player collects 6M. Second shot is 8M, player collects 8M plus 6M. Third shot is 5M, player collects 5M + 8M + 6M.
This turned out to be way overpowered. The new proposal is: 20 seconds, Raptor Pit is worth between 5M and 10M and award keeps adding to the previous award when collected. Example, first shot is 6M, player collects 6M. Second shot is 8M, player collects 8M plus 6M. Third shot is 5M, player collects 5M plus 8M. Fourth shot is 10M, player collects 10M plus 5M.
I have also increased the Dinosaur Shootout award from 3M to 10M. It will now also display a "10 MILLION" graphic when achieved. Previously it didn't show anything when achieved and left the player wondering what happened. This new scoring makes this quick video mode more worth the risk.
Quoted from ChadH:I have also increased the Dinosaur Shootout award from 3M to 10M. It will now also display a "10 MILLION" graphic when achieved. Previously it didn't show anything when achieved and left the player wondering what happened. This new scoring makes this quick video mode more worth the risk.
SWEET!!
Quoted from caker137:I actually think your right inlane / control room light decrease was a great idea. I find it is much easier to just wait for an inlane roll over than shoot the power shed. If you drop the time that would at least make the power shed a more attractive shot to go for compared to the inlane.
+1 to this.
I actually got around to playing a game last night (I haven't in awhile). I mainly activate control room using that right inlane switch and even I agree that the timer is just way too long. I missed the shot, hit like 5 pops, rolled down from left inlane over to right flipper and then I STILL had time to make the control room shot. I agree, shorten it up a tad.
Quoted from Matt_Rasmussen:I agree, the power shed is an important shot and it should play that way.
Just to confirm, you are saying the Right Inlane Timer should be 6 seconds instead of the current 7.5 seconds?
Quoted from ChadH:I have also increased the Dinosaur Shootout award from 3M to 10M. It will now also display a "10 MILLION" graphic when achieved. Previously it didn't show anything when achieved and left the player wondering what happened. This new scoring makes this quick video mode more worth the risk.
Quoted from fattrain:I missed the shot, hit like 5 pops, rolled down from left inlane over to right flipper and then I STILL had time to make the control room shot. I agree, shorten it up a tad.
Did you get Tri-ball Multiball lit by shooting the Targets on this game?? I think not.
I think the player will get so focused to lit Tri-ball that starting Modes gets secondary.
In that case getting them easy like it already is is a good thing.
I don't have the feeling that i reach the System Failure to often or to easy.
...Just my two cents.
Maybe it's good the get the 3 second Inlane Timer with "Hard/Very Hard" settings?
...Is there even any Inlane Timer with "Very Hard" settings? Probably not. I don't know.
Call for help...
Can someone describe for me how Escape mode works in v.5.13?
This is what I have:
Starts at 21M, counts down 1M per sec, each shot to Visitor Center, Helipad, Boat Dock scores value plus adds 10M to count down. The round ends when a total of 10M has been counted down?
Trying to nail down exactly how this mode functions as it stands today. I've seen it end abruptly, and I've seen it count all the way down.
I'm moving this to the playing tips, rule sheet sub forum (first one I've moved since the new server went in so I hope it goes to the right place). Very cool by the way!
Quoted from TigerLaw:I'm moving this to the playing tips, rule sheet sub forum (first one I've moved since the new server went in so I hope it goes to the right place). Very cool by the way!
Hmmm, not sure that forum makes sense for this. We aren't discussing the rules so much as we are discussing the modification of them. Honestly, not sure which forum makes most sense. I'd say the modding forum for now.
By the way is it possible to get the Victory Lab after ANY (Extra Ball/Special) Replay is achieved and not only for a "Credit" Replay award?
I use Extra Ball as a achievement and with this setting I'm never able to see a Victory Lab. =(
Quoted from ChadH:Previously it didn't show anything when achieved and left the player wondering what happened. This new scoring makes this quick video mode more worth the risk.
Thats very nice!
Maybe it's a goob idea the show the player the Hammonds Bunker Value when collected too (if possible)?
Quoted from ChadH:Hmmm, not sure that forum makes sense for this. We aren't discussing the rules so much as we are discussing the modification and update of them. Honestly, not sure which forum makes most sense. I'd say the modding forum for now.
Yea, this is a tough one to pick. As you wish, will move you to modding pinball.
Quoted from NFK:By the way is it possible to get the Victory Lab after ANY (Extra Ball/Special) Replay is achieved and not only for a "Credit" Replay award?
I use Extra Ball as a achievement and with this setting I'm never able to see a Victory Lab. =(
Good suggestion. Added to the list (near the top).
Quoted from oopsallberrys:In one of the older ROMs, it used to say "oooo T-Rex got him" on the match screen if there was no match. Can this be put back in?
I was play testing and my game said that during the match (and I didn't mod that). So it must still be there but very rarely said. I'll look into that. Might be a way to make it say that more often.
This is all great stuff! Any plan on when you are going to make this available for everyone? Thanks!
Quoted from ChadH:Good suggestion. Added to the list (near the top).
How about completing modes gets you some victory laps/ramps...?
Quoted from Trace_on:Would it be possible to update the skill shot animations? Right now there is a distinctive pattern for each ball:
Ball 1: Dino moves right and left without stopping
Ball 2: Dino pauses while moving right, but moves left without stopping
Ball 3: Dino pauses in both left and right directions
Extra Balls: No animation
The ideal solution would be to chain together different patterns so it doesn't repeat. In other words, every time the dino moves left or right there would be a random pattern. For example:
Any Ball: Dino moves right w/ pause, left w/o pause, right w/o pause, left w/ pause, etc.
With that solution there would only need to be one skill shot programmed and it would be available for any ball, even extra balls. Now implementation of that is probably quite difficult if not impossible, but figured I would throw it out there.
Oh, and in case it isn't obvious, I will be picking up the updated software chip as soon as it is available.
I just made a minor break through with Skill Shot. I now have it so the Skill Shots are no longer given to you in the predictable order as described above. It is now random. Meaning, each ball will randomly choose the Ball 1 animation, the Ball 2 animation, or the Ball 3 animation.
I am hoping to take it further and have it work as Trace_on describes above (where it is randomized even during the animation). But for now, at the very least, Skill Shot is random each ball.
Quoted from NFK:By the way is it possible to get the Victory Lab after ANY (Extra Ball/Special) Replay is achieved and not only for a "Credit" Replay award?
I use Extra Ball as a achievement and with this setting I'm never able to see a Victory Lab. =(
I have this working now also. Hopefully this one fully passes testing. But for now it looks good. The game is now set to always play the Victory Lap when you get to the replay high score. If your game is set to Extra Ball or Special, then those will also be granted as well.
Quoted from ChadH:I just made a minor break through with Skill Shot. I now have it so the Skill Shots are no longer given to you in the predictable order as described above. It is now random.
Nice! That is a great change.
Quoted from ChadH:I just made a minor break through with Skill Shot. I now have it so the Skill Shots are no longer given to you in the predictable order as described above. It is now random. Meaning, each ball will randomly choose the Ball 1 animation, the Ball 2 animation, or the Ball 3 animation.
I am hoping to take it further and have it work as Trace_on describes above (where it is randomized even during the animation). But for now, at the very least, Skill Shot is random each ball.
This is awesome! You're going to make this game so much better!
Quoted from ChadH:I just made a minor break through with Skill Shot. I now have it so the Skill Shots are no longer given to you in the predictable order as described above. It is now random. Meaning, each ball will randomly choose the Ball 1 animation, the Ball 2 animation, or the Ball 3 animation.
I am hoping to take it further and have it work as Trace_on describes above (where it is randomized even during the animation). But for now, at the very least, Skill Shot is random each ball.
This is good news. That is already a vast improvement over the current skill shot.
Now where the Skill Shot animation is random, what do you think about getting more points (Super Skill Shot) when the player hit the Raptor when he FIRST comes left to right/right to left?
Quick Fist Try Skill Shot = Super Skill Shot
The player would be awarded with a Super Skill Shot when he hits the Raptor bevor he knows his pattern.
Quoted from ChadH:I am hoping to take it further and have it work as Trace_on describes above (where it is randomized even during the animation).
Alright... Skill Shot is now completely random even inside of itself! No more memorization tricks allowed. This adds a little more skill requirement to the Skill Shot.
Here's a demonstration:
Quoted from ChadH:Alright... Skill Shot is now completely random even inside of itself! No more memorization tricks allowed. This adds a little more skill requirement to the Skill Shot.
Here's a demonstration:
» YouTube video
Congrats on figuring this one out! I know early on you were thinking it might not be possible. This is awesome! Can't wait to get these changes in my JP.
I know some of you are concerned that the removal of the Auto-Collecting Dinosaurs between each ball will make it too difficult to collect them in the game because some of the red/green dinosaur targets are really hard to hit.
I have some code working that will "collect" a dinosaur, I just need to know what to associate it with. Right now, I have it so if you successfully shoot the dinosaur with the gun during the random Shoot Out, it will now also collect one of the dinosaurs.
I am thinking that it should also be associated with something else in the game... possibly a shot? Maybe something to do with the egg shot? Or something else?
I'd love to hear your suggestions.
Can't wait to get my JP back in working order. One of the main reasons I sold my first one was the lack of value in the modes. Sure you can still play them, but it's hard to resist just going for a high score and the only way to do that was to get into CHAOS multiball.
I also love the idea of randomizing the modes. It would really be awesome to be able to select the mode you wanted to play, but I'm sure that would be difficult. I really don't have any request. I'm sure there are a lot of good opinions, but it really would take a lot of playing with the actual code in place to make sure it works. Sometimes less is more, it's not like we're dealing with a bad game to begin with.
Thank you for the hard work.
Quoted from ChadH:I know some of you are concerned that the removal of the Auto-Collecting Dinosaurs between each ball will make it too difficult to collect them in the game because some of the red/green dinosaur targets are really hard to hit.
I have some code working that will "collect" a dinosaur, I just need to know what to associate it with. Right now, I have it so if you successfully shoot the dinosaur with the gun during the random Shoot Out, it will now also collect one of the dinosaurs.
I am thinking that it should also be associated with something else in the game... possibly a shot? Maybe something to do with the egg shot? Or something else?
I'd love to hear your suggestions.
Maybe associate awarding a dino with the T-REX? Maybe on the 2nd and 4th times you hit T-REX, when lighting the T and E...
Quoted from ChadH:I am thinking that it should also be associated with something else in the game... possibly a shot? Maybe something to do with the egg shot? Or something else?
I'd love to hear your suggestions.
Speaking of the egg, and I am pretty sure this has been mentioned, but any way to implement Super Egg Mania? I have never seen this in game play (and never had it available via Mr DNA). Seems to be a mode that would be great to be able to be activated by enough egg hits (but not so many as impossible).
Quoted from ChadH:I have some code working that will "collect" a dinosaur, I just need to know what to associate it with.
Maybe the helicopter shot? Not a whole lot of reasons to shoot that otherwise. Would be nice to bring that shot back into the game. It's also not something you get a whole lot of opportunity to shoot regularly, so you couldn't abuse it easily.
I thought the lit Dock shot gives the Player already one Target!?
Raptor "Video Mode"/Dock and another Shot to get a Dino-Targets?
Maybe a whole bank (for a 2nd Triball) of the t-rex/brachiosaurus targets as two Mr. DNA options if that is possible? I think those are the hardest to lit especially on the 2nd run.
Quoted from ChadH:Alright... Skill Shot is now completely random even inside of itself! No more memorization tricks allowed. This adds a little more skill requirement to the Skill Shot.
Here's a demonstration:
» YouTube video
Congrats! This really ups the ante.
Quoted from NFK:I thought the lit Dock shot gives the Player already one Target!?
It does. I am just wondering if there should be one more way to collect them.
Quoted from ChadH:It does. I am just wondering if there should be one more way to collect them.
Ok I wasn't quite sure if I get that right and yes think that's a good idea. ...An unlit Power Shild (S) Shot could be a good solution too IMHO. Or if the shot is to similar to the lit Dock shot maybe the blinking Bunker (C) after an right Return Lane? I don't feel the Hammonds Bunker Bonus at all in this game.
I think the 3rd option to collect a Target is something for the standard difficulty setting, on Hard and above I think it should be just the Raptor Shot Out and the lit Dock (if that's the case rightnow)...
Quoted from vegemite_nick:Speaking of the egg, and I am pretty sure this has been mentioned, but any way to implement Super Egg Mania? I have never seen this in game play (and never had it available via Mr DNA). Seems to be a mode that would be great to be able to be activated by enough egg hits (but not so many as impossible).
Super Egg kinda sucks. It should show up from time to time in Mr dna, unless you are on tournament settings. I've suggested a few things to potentially make it pop up more and be better when it does.
Quoted from ChadH:I have some code working that will "collect" a dinosaur, I just need to know what to associate it with.
How about spotting a dinosaur for every mode you start? Or complete?
Quoted from stangbat:How about spotting a dinosaur for every mode you start? Or complete?
Every mode you COMPLETE would be cool! More in in encentive to finish modes
Quoted from fattrain:Every mode you COMPLETE would be cool! More in in encentive to finish modes
Yup, I thought the same.
Except the one Shot/Timebased Modes I often don't even try to finished the full mode.
I'm happy enough when i Hit the Ramp one or two times doing the Bone Busting Mode.
How about feeding the T-Rex Jackpot value with the Hammonds Bunker Bonus?
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