(Topic ID: 193066)

Jungle Queen EM Restore


By legtod2

2 years ago



Topic Stats

  • 33 posts
  • 7 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 2 years ago by legtod2
  • Topic is favorited by 5 Pinsiders

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#1 2 years ago

Yesterday I added a new addition to the family, a 1977 Gottlieb Jungle Queen Electro mechanical.

This machine was in surprisingly good shape. Cosmetically the cabinet showed its age and some artwork from 5year old's doddling on side. The tiger artwork on the side has a hat drawn on the head.

My intention is to focus on the mechanicals first then focus on the cabinet externals. The legs are rusted badly and front legs are missing threaded levels. Playfield looks fairly good and the back glass has flaking through out.

One relay is completely burned and needs replacement as well as all playfield rubbers needs replacement.

Part one of the restore is to get it working reliably and then make it less ugly externally.

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#2 2 years ago

The machine powers on and starts. The score reels reset to zero but during scoring the score reels do not advance.
One of the steppers has a broken spring, so I will locate a new spring and give that a go. Plus I have notice some of the relays are not resetting properly (what a surprise).

Get a load of the burnt relay. I don't understand why constant on relays like the coin lockout and the gottlieb start and tilt relays can't have a mechanical latch so that the relay doesn't actually have to be on all the time. Maybe some bright minds out there have a replacement suggestion for me.

#3 2 years ago

I can not identify where this loose wire connected any idea's.
It looks like it should connect somewhere on the coin stepper unit.
Open the image and magnify to see the wire more closely, my finger is pointing at it.

Update July 18,2017 the disconnected wire was a ground to the solenoid body.

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#4 2 years ago

Need your help:

When ever I press the 500 point relay my score motor engages but no score appears on the reels.
I manually set each one of the reels for players 1 - 4 to a score of 1234 and pressed the start button.
Each of the four player score reels reset to 0000.

So I am not sure why my score is not increasing why I press the 500 pts relay or any of the score switches.

Any suggestions out there.

#6 2 years ago
Quoted from legtod2:

Need your help:
When ever I press the 500 point relay my score motor engages but no score appears on the reels.
I manually set each one of the reels for players 1 - 4 to a score of 1234 and pressed the start button.
Each of the four player score reels reset to 0000.
So I am not sure why my score is not increasing why I press the 500 pts relay or any of the score switches.
Any suggestions out there.

Are you saying the 500pts is not scoring on any of the players or just one of the players? If it is just one of the players then it would probably be the switches behind the player unit in the head. I had this exact problem. it could also be the relay on just that one 500 point score reel. If its on all of the players i would suspect the 500pt relay at the right side in the backbox.

#7 2 years ago

No points are displaying for players 1 - 4. The bonus lights accumulate as you hit bonus but no points are updated on the score reels.

#8 2 years ago

I just check my credit stepper unit in the backbox. The unit is suppost to allow 15 credits but stops after 5.

I believe my credit stepper unit in the back box requires some work. Will share pictures latter.

#9 2 years ago

I found a great youtube animation that shows step by step the start up sequence. This is a keeper if you have Gottlieb startup problems.

What would have help me if it showed how it adds points.

#10 2 years ago

Love JQ, prolly one of my favorite all time Ems

#11 2 years ago

Doomid

I had a Grand Prix, a fun em machine as well.

#12 2 years ago
Quoted from legtod2:

Need your help:
When ever I press the 500 point relay my score motor engages but no score appears on the reels.
I manually set each one of the reels for players 1 - 4 to a score of 1234 and pressed the start button.
Each of the four player score reels reset to 0000.
So I am not sure why my score is not increasing why I press the 500 pts relay or any of the score switches.
Any suggestions out there.

Does the ball get kicked out into play?

#13 2 years ago

The 500 pt. relay and score reels will not score until the player unit stepper advances to Player 1, Ball 1.

#14 2 years ago

I have a second thread opened for assistance on my scoring problem
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/gottlieb-jungle-queen-em-no-score

It looks like I have two or three separate issues.
The coin unit, R relay, and credit stepper unit.

Basically I have three separate problems to fix.
I would not be surprised if I dont have a player unit issue to.

#15 2 years ago

Having two pinball project on the go (Close Encounters Arduino and Jungle Queen EM) has taught me two different schools of thought on how a solid state and electro mechanical machine work.

I get now after 7 months of effort how the solid state is suppost to work, but em machines are hard wired or hard coded programmed switches. I am amazed how well they do what they do and have stood the test of time decades even and still work.

Wow, I am beginning to like em's except I hope I dont pull out all my hair first trying to read the schematics.

#16 2 years ago

The first misconception of going through an EM is to treat the process like a SS game. Where the function is 1000 times more discrete with a SS and troubleshooting independent issues can provide success, you will be lucky if you can get a rough or long neglected EM going that way. You will learn a lot along the way if you take that approach, it may not be as timely.

I suggest you go through and validate the set up of every single switch and mechanism, as well as run a file across every switch contact, before trying to start it up. Once you have validated most of the set up of the game then you will be more successful at identifying and solving what are more likely discrete issues.

Good luck.

#17 2 years ago

The legs are all pitted and neglected baddly. Steel wool and wire wheel on a drill and some black paint is the order of the day.

Front two legs done and they look pretty good. I may switch the legs from my Elvira table to this machine. Turned out nice.
The legs on my Elvira are NOS legs.

Machine plays really nice. I have all the bulbs in place and it looks and plays well in the dark.

#18 2 years ago

One of the tools I have found handy is clear plastic hose the is roughly the diameter or a lamp bulb 44.
The tube makes it easy to grab lamb bulbs and insert/extract them from hard to reach areas without breaking them.

The second tool that I have found really handy are multi sized paint brushes. The brushes allow me to clean switches and wire bundles to sweep the crude and dust off them and be gentle without breaking things.

#19 2 years ago

I have a second thread opened to deal with a 100,000 light issue.

See thread here. Issue resolved was J1 and J2 switches. These switches are located inside the 10,000 score reels.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/gottlieb-jungle-queen-em-no-100000-light

#20 2 years ago

It was like christmas my new playfield rubbers arrived. I installed them and wow what a difference.
The game really has bounce and zip now.

The old ones were almost disintegrating. I notice a big difference plunging the ball and hitting the large hockey puck rubber at the top of the table. It has a bounce rather than a spunging action.

Happy dance time.

Next big gift will be my replacement coil relay.

#21 2 years ago

Nice!! Post some pics, That's a game I'd like to find.

#22 2 years ago

Coin stepper unit has a lot of slop in the center wheel. That slop or slack is causing the step up and down to slipp.

I have not attempted to disassemble it yet. I know I need a replacement spring for one of the three pins that slides from the platter disk. My suspect that a bearing or bushing needs to be replaced in the wheel or the ratchets needs adjustment.

New picture tonight. All lamps and shiny white playfield rubbers. Looks good when room lights turned off.

#23 2 years ago

What are you calling the coin stepper?

#24 2 years ago

MikeO

This is the stepper located in front of the cab beside the chimes.

#25 2 years ago

Last night I did some work on my bonus count stepper. This is the stepper located under the playfield that steps the bonus lights to the playfield. The solenoid plunger was covered in oil or some other lubricant. The pivot points were also caked in oil and dirt build up. The combo of these two were causing intermittant bonus count down to stop working. Some times all I had to do was flip the flippers to unjar or losen it up then it would become unstuck.

There are a great deal of moving parts on these machines.

#26 2 years ago

The Gottlieb steppers are pretty robust. So to state you have one wobbly strikes me as though the flange that the disc attaches to may have come loose or something else has come loose. I'd inspect closer before concluding a part has worn out. Both the bonus and coin units can be gummed up as your u have stated. I use Tri Flow teflon lubricant to break the gunked up lubricant and to newly lubricate the pivots and moving parts.

#27 2 years ago

After cleaning my bonus stepper unit, the subtract bonus is not working. Starting a new game and adding bonus points, then place ball in outhole. The bonus does not subtract nor kick the ball out for next player.
Since I just cleaned the unit, I suspect the switch on the stepper needs adjustment.

The add bonus stepping works its just the subtract that does not work

I did not lubricate the stepper unit, and question if it common practice to lubricate the solenoid plungers that slide back and forth. My assumption is no. As far as lubricating the pivot points I dont know what is recommend to lubricate them.

#28 2 years ago

Here's a great video to keep you motivated

#29 2 years ago

Don't lubricate coil plungers. These should be clean and dry.

#30 2 years ago

At long last I have found another gremilin that was not adding bonus points after the ball lands in the outhole.

I could manually press the K relay and the bonus would count down to zero but it did not add my bonus points.
Some time when it appeared stuck I could rapidly flip the flippers and it would become unstuck. Then it got to a point that did not work any more.

The root of my problem was the zero point bonus switch stack. Even when it was perfectly clean and appeared to be properly adjusted the bonus countdown did not work.

By touching the switch that has the orange and yellow wire I closed the circuit and the bonus count down worked.
Stupid switch...

Thanks to Rolf, Frb, and others who assisted in the other thread to fix this.
See this thread for details

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/gottlieb-jungle-queen-em-wont-subtract-bonus-after-ball-sinks

#31 2 years ago

This machine has taught me alot about Gottlieb EM and the theroy of it operation. I still am struggling to follow the schematics. The if this than that in relation to score motor and so many pulses per rotation confuses me
The use of constant on or long term on coil relays surprises me as to how long those relays last.
In the solid state world this usually leads to burnt out transistors and coils. The coin lockout and the under the table relays used while game in play are the exceptions for ss machines. The other thing that scares me a bit is the hum from relays like the first ball relay and lock relay that are on during game play or the game over relay. I want this machine to be a playing machine rather than a work of art cosmetically. My painting skills suck. I may sand down the body and putty were needed that order the plastic artwork to the outside body similar to my virtual pinball cabinets.

Here is my present laundry list of outstanding issues I'd like to address.
Credit stepper unit in back box. Has 15 credit reel but will only step 5 spots. I see some bent switches.
Ball credit stepper unit located in cabinet beside chimes. This unit sticks, need new spring for sliding disk.
Bonus credit stepper. This unit has given me the most headach, especially the zero pos stack switch.
Game over relay is cooked and broken wire on one end. Ordered a replacement and waiting for part.
Double bonus light sporatically is not reseting.
Cleaning of score motor. This one scares me cuz its working right now, just dirty as hell.
Playfield has cupping where plastic inserts present. Considering plastic covering to level out.

1 week later
#32 2 years ago

I did a 5 hr cleaning session involving complete removal of motor assembly and clean top to bottom

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#33 2 years ago

I spent a great deal of time checking every switch, cleaning score motor, confirming every thing is clean and adjusted.

After everything looked fine I reinstalled the board back into the game.

My Game over relay now works.

Present problem now is the Tilt Hold relay is not staying on so when I start a new game everything resets but tilt turns on after 1st ball is ejected.

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