Where I live you will not find ANY DMD game for 1400, even beaters...so your rant is pointless...pin pricing has skyrocketed...

$12,293 is what bp has mm going for in 2012. there is an average price since that guy has been tracking them as well as a current year. before anyone hastles me about my use of the word "investment" by that I mean I'm investing a large amount of cash in an item. I own a Harley sportster and a couple of cars that I hope are worth more and not less.

I'm just glad we could finally have this discussion regarding the value of pinball machines...

Long time coming, for sure....

Yes but I bet you wished they were less when you bought them

As for Dredd we shall see. Games get popular and go up and down for whatever reason. Who knows what will happen with it's value.

Shall we start a new post about when these price increases will ever stop! LOL

Lately, i have seen Dredd going up. Shadow leveling off. RFM going up. Batman Forever going up. A lot of system 11's leveling off. It definitely fluctuates.

Poor JM just stays at the bottom. Not sure why. it's a good game.

There seems to be more discussion about Dredd in these forums than any other machine lately. Most posters seem to like it!

Dredd is highly underrated and for the longest time was sub 1,000 with BSD. I paid 700 for mine and sold it for 700 4 years ago. Dredd kicks some ass if its set up right.

Because it's horrible

Yeah a seriously large portion of pinball buyers are here. If you see a lot of threads pop up that a game is so awesome and gains steam, it's going to drive the price becasue a big % of the buyers are here.
Shadow was booming probably 6-7 months ago and now is heading back down.
RFM is also trying to be jacked up for some reason. Probably by poor people trying to make everyone believe it's as good as AFM. Seriously though probably a lot of newer players don't have the hang up against p2k that I do.

Look, I hate the price increases as much as the next guy...but to think that the lower end games are to remain stagnant while the "A" games skyrocket is not smart. All games are going up in price, that's just how it is right now.

It is what it is. Fact is people are paying 2k all day long on nice machines and going as high as $2500 on really nice ones.

I'm taking it back 20 years. I played TZ and AF side by side wherever they were. Ok, but once I found STTNG and JD, now these games I could really rock. Even after they dropped a TOM, and then later a MM next to Dredd, it was still my staple. Now that 5 of these machines have seen large increases in price, logic tells me that the other one is not far behind.

interesting Ralph. we shall have to agree to disagree. every big ticket item I buy is taken care of to maximize my sales price if I sell. used motorcycle? taken care of. sons car? washed and waxed. house? regular maintainence. my $25,000 pinball collection? again taken care of. every big ticket item that I have is maintained in an effort to improve resale. I don't have a single item that I could care less what they are worth. must be a nice attitude to have and I'll remind you of it the next time you post a pin for sale. EVERY pin that I have bought and sold has been at the fair market value for that transaction. NOBODY has ever said "it's worth four but I'll sell it for 3 thousand just to pay it forward so the next guy can enjoy what I have enjoyed."

I need a couple of these $80 toppers!

Uh, where are these $1,400 JDs at? Seriously.

Any game is worth whatever someone is willing to pay for it. Condition is king.

If I've been looking for a game for awhile and one comes up for sale locally, and the value is 200 or 300 more than market value based on condition - I'm a buyer. What's 200 in the grand scheme anyway. So yes, I've overpaid for games. According to some I guess I overpaid for my dredd, but at the end of the day I'm happy with the game and if I have to sell it and take a 200 loss - it was my entertaiment money anyway.

Illinois Pinball sells the toppers for around $80. They aren't on their web site though, you have to call. I got one from them a couple months ago and they said they had several in their warehouse.

Nailed it.

Really? Well I'll find you a third JD to trade for your MM. Hell I'll even throw in a Joker Poker.

or maybe by people that like games that take a great theme and build on it. Making it even better

We're getting close! That would have to be an EM Joker Poker.

I think i 'may' have the last one from their current run coming in the mail today. But Kim said they might make more.

Far enough. I'll always have a somewhat hatred of p2k no matter what from living through it, sad times. But I really like RFM.

According to this thread title. they are sitting in both of our game rooms.

Right. But the only problem is that we aren't selling for $1,400! I am not selling mine but I would want over $2,000 for mine if I did decide to sell.

In the age when the best games and new games cost 5-6-7K. It makes 1000-2000 seem like a deal.
But I think we loose sight of the fact that to most people, me included 2000 dollars is a huge sum of money. No old pin should be worth that much. Its a hobby/toy.
i mean back in the day when they weremoney making devises these high prices made sense.
But as long as 30 somethings with a wad of cash keep coming into the hobby and buying 6-8 games in thier first year there will be no end to the demand. So prices will always go up.

same here. so it must be at least a 2k game. right?

All games are worth what someone at one end is willing to pay for it
and what the other person at the other end is willing to sell it for.
Market CAN be seen as an average current going rate in a certain region.
Worth is a subjective point of view.

Finding one of the games that was at the top of my wish list at the bottom
of the price list made o-din very happy!

It's funny, we used to refer to Judge Dredd on RGP as "J*dg* Dr*dd" ... people could not fathom typing the full name of the game as it was not a popular title....and C*ng*

Hey, if people like the game....BUY IT!!! You've got a lot of middle aged folks in this hobby that have cash to play with, so why the hell not...

Chris

I don't disagree with taking care of big ticket items, I need a house to live in and a car to get to work, but pinball to me, is just a hobby, and pinball machines are just toys as far as I am concerned. I don't need them, I don't rely on them, and I don't care if their value drops or goes up, my preference is that their value drop so that more people that normally wouldn't get into the hobby, get an opportunity to do so.

There are plenty of machines out there that people can get (and I sell a lot of those to those families), but the fact that certain machines are fetching more than what I pay for a decent car (for me), takes this "hobby" to a level I am not a participant in because I refuse to justify those costs with a hobby....

As for my sale posts, feel free to chime in with a price police post if you want.....I truly price machines to where people probably are going to make a few bucks on them when I go to sell (Longest it has taken me to sell a game is probably two days)....It doesn't matter at all to me (I also pass on deals to others that are looking for machines, not asking for a dime in return).....

http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/fs-t2-1300-se-wisconsin
http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/fs-batman-forever-se-wisconsin-1900
http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/fs-multipinvirtual-pin-cabinet-15000-southern-wi
http://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/fsft-home-use-only-world-poker-tour-southern-wi

Yep....there are still a handful out there. It's just that now the bottom of the price list is closer to 2k than 1k.

You can do that??? AWESOME! Im gonna go start a thread: Asking All WH20 owners to pledge that they are now worth $6K in average condition.

What? I am just saying what I would want for mine.

Judge Dredd is boring maybe just a step above Popeye hahahah

wow Ralph! asking $2300 for a wpt game that sells for $2233 in 2012 on eBay. maybe not the best example to illustrate your altruistic ways. wanna try again? or do you wanna drop the pay it forward scam and admit you want fair market value like the rest of us.

You obviously know anything about me, but if guys wanna chime in if they choose, they can feel free. I don't play in the "fair market value" that you obviously live in. I can GAURANTEE you that you will not hear ONE negative thing about the pricing of games I sell.

I don't buy high and I don't sell high, plain and simple. Based on your previous comments, you will never grasp that I honestly could not care less what my games are worth. They are just games.... I am fortunate to even own one, let alone over 100 in the last 13 years....I still remember the feeling of owning my first one, and I hope others get to experience the same thing.

Your statement couldn't be more ignorant, but you don't know me, so I get it....

Also for the record, I only posted Pinside links to sales I opened to the public... 99% of stuff I sell never even makes it to the public....Wonder why that is....?

I still kinda want to punch you for selling that GnR for $2700 last march without asking me first. Good thing you got back on my good side by finding me the Afm & MM at a more than fair price.

BTW, that WPT ralph sold was HUO and mint. It took less than a 1/2 day to sell, iirc.

Okay, so i guess that could be perceived as a negative thing.... LOL

I have been casually looking for a Judge Dredd. I can only find one anywhere near me and it is $2,200. I offered $2,000. That didn't work. No regrets though... I wasn't really looking forward to driving 600 miles round trip to spend $2,000.

I do remember seeing some for $1,800 maybe two years ago. Friends told me that was too much then.

You have a Popeye?

yes a warehouse full once they turn A status I'm cashing in

The only negative thing anyone can say about Ralph is that he appears to have the local market cornered on finding great deals on a regular basis.
If I could get a steady stream of deals I would be happy to pass along the price break when I am done playing a title.

I have only found 1 'good' deal to date and that means I live in the world of fair market value (both buying and selling). I can't afford to sell at the bottom and buy at the top if I want to be able to play lots of new games.

Since I seem to mostly find OK deals which need lots of work, my only chance to 'play' is to do just that.

Buy routed turd, work on and fix, play for a while, sell to hopefully recoup my cash in, buy something else, repeat. Even if selling at market value at least I am putting some love into each game to make it nicer (and in some cases to bring it back form the dead).

funny Ralph. you jump in on my investment post. I quickly neutralize it with an agree to disagree response. you then volunteer a thread that shows you are willing to sell for fair market value just like everyone else, I call you out then you get defensive... kinda reminds me of mike damone...

QUOTE: I have been casually looking for a Judge Dredd. I can only find one anywhere near me and it is $2,200. I offered $2,000. That didn't work.

Stack... is that the one on CL earlier today? (That has suddenly disappeared.) I missed it until this morning, then considered it, then realized I was broke, then saw this thread and gave up on it anyway. It looked pretty in the pics, but I have never seen one in person or played.

As a group of enthusiast, we have placed more relevance on what titles you have in your collection and what they are worth over the playing and having fun with the machines. I would be willing to bet a good portion of the mm, BBB and afm owners rarely even turn the games on due to them being significant for status over entertainment value. Its really sad that this hobby has evolved from being a group of ppl collecting and playing old arcade games to setting up a supplemental retirement fund portfolio. There was nothing wrong with the old price structure and greed is the only reason to raise the selling costs.

It is about time that JD got some love.
Great game and it's fun to play.

I have no idea who Mike Damone is.... I got defensive based on this- "must be a nice attitude to have and I'll remind you of it the next time you post a pin for sale" and this- "do you wanna drop the pay it forward scam and admit you want fair market value like the rest of us"....

I don't know where you are located, but gorgeous/HUO WPT around tend to fetch 2400+.... I will also mention that I actually delivered that machine 2.5 hours north of me, as I was going to a family function near the area of the buyer anyways....

I pretty much don't give a shit what others think of me (not even sure why I am responding now), but to question my character and intent and pretty much call me a liar is something I don't have much of a tolerance for.... I did agree to disagree with you, but the statements you made above are just straight up false.....

I HATE selling machines, I hate the process, I hate the time it takes, and I hate the fact that stuff goes wrong with machines regardless of how nice they are, and I feel bad when something happens to them when someone buys one (not that it happens a lot).....

Tell you what, tell me what the market is (what you would sell these for) on these machines (fully shopped, stripped) for the last 12 months, and I will respond with what I sold them for....

Fire! (average condition, all new plastics), Guns and Roses (Gorgeous), BSD (fade on one side), Batman Forever (Gorgeous, no cracked ramps), Road Kings (average, little playfield wear), Iron Man (HUO with shaker, mint)......

I guess it depends on what local is.... I typically end up in Indiana, St. Louis, Iowa, and Minneapolis, and sometimes Ohio.... I never factor in gas and tolls on these purchases either....Sometimes I think these machines only go up in price because everyone thinks they need to include their travelcosts into the purchase....I rarely purcahse from Wisconsin.

Last October I did a one day trip from WI, to eastern Iowa, then to Eastern Indiana, then to Chicago....Left at 5am and got home at 2am....

I enjoy meeting the people and seeing the places as much (if not more) as the machine itself.