Collect-ability is weird. This is a bit of an exaggeration, but sports card manufacturers used to print 100,000 copies of 1 card and they were worthless. They now print 100 copies of 1,000 cards and they are valuable. No change in the total number of cards available; but the manufacturers were able to create a demand by calling everything a "limited edition". Not quite as easy to do in the pinball industry since there are some larger manufacturing costs; but Stern certainly seems to be entering into that market. Take the base game; add on a numbered plaque, artwork, and powder coating; call it a "super limited edition"; and sell it for $5,000 to $6,500 more.

The day it was announced and I 'nearly' bought a spot, there were only going to be 13 ever made? And then numbers kept changing.

22 July 2011.

I agree,just saying it feels wrong.
Not saying mg owners can help it.
It just feels wrong for 200 raza and aiw buyers.
First everybody is ecstatic about something being delivered to who cares who.
But it starts to sink in that magic girl is selling for insane monies and raza amd aiw paid for that.
Just sucks

IMG_3318 (resized).PNG

You can say that again, and it's not always just about rarity. Some things simply become more collectible than other things, and there isn't always an obvious reason why. For example, there are way less 24s out there than BBBs, and yet nobody really gives a shit about 24. For whatever reason, the people willing to spend the big bucks really want an MG in their collection, thus it has doubled in price overnight.

I will say this, you couldn't pay me to put an MG in my collection. In my eyes, that game was built from the blood of fellow hobbyists, and I consider its very existence to be a slap in the face to every person who lost money with Jpop.

Did John's "Big Labowski" reveal actually happen? Considering how TBL is going now...

If you would have told me a year or two ago that people would have a magic girl in their house, while other people were fearful of losing all their money on the big lebowski I would have thought you were nuttier than a squirrel turd...

Are we seriously talking about Jpop building extra non-working, incomplete games that are woefully short on code, with ball traps, missing parts, toys that don't function and pixelated playfield artwork? And this is just what we know after less than a week.

Sounds like a Kickstarter I'll pass on but good luck in raising the capitol.

Don't know when it changed but I just noticed Houdini in the threads title. If he has nothing to do with that game why is it there?

Totally. I'm honestly wondering if these games would be selling for this much if they were produced as promised, and didn't have the notoriety or drama. Would this game still be selling for $20-$40k? At that point it would probably come down to how it played. Like you said it's not just about rarity.

He needs to build more, and keep building more until sales dry up, or everyone with pre-orders are refunded...

I love the irony of the man who killed Pre-order, given a chance to do another pre-order.

Owning a full size mostly unworking game is overrated but if they were to make say 250 Magic Girl translites and 250 playfields all signed/numbered by Zombie Yeti I would be interested in adding one of those to my gameroom. Plus, they could use the profits to help make Zombie Yeti and Applejuice whole again. The game is basically an art piece anyway with a bunch of useless plastic and blinky lights, so just cut out the unnecessary stuff and just make the art available for people to enjoy!

Would you trust him to pay of the vendors and previous buyers? Even if it's not a preorder it would seem like they would have to have a 3rd party handling the money. Plus, I think the announcement of another build would drive prices down pretty quickly.

curious, would anything be stopping Zombie from doing just this? Seems like he owns the actual art and guessing his current contacts could easily print him up 250 pfs and translites.

I too woudl be up for buying one of these so long as I knew Zombie and AppleJuice were getting the profits to make them whole.

I was just editing my previous post to ask the same thing. I'd love to see John try to convince a judge he owns the rights to that work.

I'll be honest, it kind of sickens me when I hear how much some people are shelling out for an MG. I can't blame the MG owners for cashing out when people are literally throwing money at them, but it pisses me off that in some warped way it vindicates John (at least in his mind). The man didn't do anything to deserve any sort of vindication. In fact, quite the opposite is true. He pushed out a broken piece of shit game just to fulfill his legal obligation. By paying up for an MG, you are essentially condoning this bullshit.

A fool and his money...

There are fewer than 200 24's? I'll be honest, I played 24 for the first time at Pinburgh 2016 and enjoyed it.

I think most people are forgetting that most MG buyers are also in on at least one of the other games. It's still not over for most of us.

When I first signed on, I couldn't have been more excited about the prospect of having a new JPop game in my collection.

That went to crazy feelings of regret, idiocy, and deep sadness when things went to crap. I buried my head in the sand and wanted to read or hear nothing about all the negative goings-on. To the point that when Zombie-Yeti graciously offered some of his art to the buyers, I wanted nothing to do with it. I didn't want a reminder of how I'd been so screwed and stupid, hanging on my wall.

When Bill stepped in and it looked like things were going to get done, I got optimistic again. That quickly turned back to burying my head in the sand again when it fell apart.

Another round of the same when American Pinball came on the scene and then showed a dead playfield on a table for their Expo reveal of Houdini and promises of delivering MGs there came up empty.

This has been a crazy ride, and actually having a game in my collection after all of this isn't the negative reminder that some keep bringing up. It's vindication that not everything bad has to stay bad.

It may not be the game that I thought it could or would be, but it's better than the empty space and horrible feelings that were there before.

And, there's hope for the future of MG with the possibility of more complete code. Even the possibility of RAZA and AiW getting done is there. May not be very likely, but there are several times over the past few years when I thought seeing a Magic Girl in my living room wasn't even remotely possible.

--
Rob Anthony
Pinball Classics
http://LockWhenLit.com
Quality Board Work - In Home Service
borygard at gmail dot com

How many Baywatches are there out there?

A shitload. I've seen tons of them.

No production DE, sega, or Stern has been produced in fewer numbers than BBB.

Stern NBA?

hmmmmmm

Stern NBA 350 to 450 units according to Mr. Pinball price guide. Two runs done both in 2009.

BBB
14 by Capcom in 1996
191 by IPB 2007

I heard there were less than 200 of them made, but who knows for sure. Regardless, the point I was making is still a valid one. Rarity does not automatically make a game highly collectible.

Well, then a rich oil tycoon should buy up all of the remaining Baywatch pins and throw them off a roof, only keeping the top 20 machines that are in the best condition and working order.

Baywatch was expertly designed by Joe Balcer, with beautiful hand-drawn art by Markus Rothkrans. It has 4 flippers, 4 ramps, numerous working toys/mechs and 5-ball multi-ball. About the only thing Magic Girl beats Baywatch on is the color LCD, but unlike Baywatch's beautiful orange, value-sized DMD... the bottom 2/3 of the LCD on Magic Girl is un-viewable to the player.

Let's say there are 400 left and we offer $2,000 each. We then run a fund-raiser where we let men/women/children partake in throwing a pinball machine off of a 20 story building and watching it crash into the concrete below. Let's say we charge $20 for each of the 180 pins we are destroying. Because we're not in this for the money, we're just enthusiastic collectors, we'll donate that money we raised to charity. We'll also let people sift through the discarded parts and take all the working flippers, coils, magnets, rubbers, etc. Now we have 20 of best looking and playing Baywatch pins left in the entire world which I'm going to conservatively give a value of $40,000 to $60,000 each.

When all is said and done, our initial investment of $800,000 has left us with $800,000 to $1,200,000 of value plus all the money we raised for charity destroying the less fortunate Baywatches.

1200 Stern 24's made in 2009 according to price guide

Sorry Brian, but point taken.

Rothkrans the 'picasso of pinball' art doesn't hold a candle in the wind to yeti

I had to downvote this. Even if it was in jest.
You know when people freak over any sort of mention of cruelty to animals. I have the same reaction with pinball machines. Preserve NOT destroy.

Blasphemy! Rothkranz is the World's top pinball artist. He'll tell you all about it

Who would pay to make them though? AP apparently ate the bill/cost on the 19, doubt they would eat the cost on building any more. They got nothing from JPop in the end, he's of no value to AP.

Thanks for posting that link.

Benheck that is a awesome mech. An underground bash reactor sounds fantastic!

I don't think Stern has ever produced a normal production game in quantities less than 500. There are 200 PMI BBBs + 13 originals.

NBA?

A contract no one knows anything about it seems. Who is to say the Pintasia deal reaches beyond Magic Girl? Bill certainly didn't hint at that at the time. And why would John limit all future projects? He could just start another company and with new ideas.

You can't practically build games that way. You have to order parts in bulk, not 2-3 at a time.

My guess is that Pintasia has the rights to Zidware, not Magic Girl. For them to have done only 20 or even 50 machines would have been foolish.

Because he has no business sense at all. Seriously, I've met with him several times and I could make a case that Jpop is an idiot savant.

Seems legit. :p

practical (resized).jpg

I disagree. Based on the info shared at the time, the interest seemed to be about the titles, not the business. Why would he take on any of zidware's liability? He wanted the rights, and exclusive, to make the game. Did that include other games? Bill wasn't saying.. but something open ended just doesn't make much sense. Plus, as I said, John would just fold zidware and start over unless there are additional non-competes included. This is a lot of 'ifs' vs the most obvious answer.

Disagree away my friend. What you are suggesting doesn't make sense to me at all.

Thank you... He just slapped these half baked hunks of crap together to stay out of prison and people are coveting them. It's frigging mind boggling.

When AP first announced I thought Bill made a post that he had the IP rights to make all four games and hadn't been contacted at that point. I may be wrong but that's my recollection.

He did say "titles"
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/jpop-update-thread%E2%80%A6%E2%80%A6%E2%80%A6%E2%80%A6%E2%80%A6mg-raza-and-aiw%E2%80%A6/page/386#post-3359585

But again, I wasn't really referring to AIW/RAZA.. Any new partner would want to separate themselves from the prior mess but still capitalize on his formula.

As an employee or contracted designer, maybe. No one will ever want to be a partner with that cuckoo bird again.