AH! That was it! Huh, thanks.

This is the space John had added for "assembly". I've been there, and its mostly shelves full of form core, the foam core Alice with B/W art, and where a few of the early MG and Zombie games are set up. THere are shelves by that back drive in door that are mainly John's collection of random parts and junk from his basement.

This was from July 14. He offered it while John (pdxmonkey) and I were hacking the prototype together for the NW show. His offer was $2k.

Dan

did you want the Bumper, do you have customers for older games?

John

I'm staying out of it.

Its not just JPOP. The people that gave him money are being bashed and ridiculed here also. This was one of the issues that I confronted your friend about several months ago. To which JPOP acted dismissive and indifferent to.

Its difficult to believe or disbelieve Pinside comments. But you seem sincere so I will extend my deepest condolences to you and your son along with best wishes for your family's recovery.

Hmmmmmm... For your first two posts, these are pretty inflammatory. You might want to ease into this so you won't get yourself in trouble. Best of luck to you.

It was 5 years, not months, ago. Interesting how he suddenly left Raw Thrills. Very sudden.

Pretty sure he went back to Williams recently working on slots, since left and I think he works for general motors or similiar

I agree, I don't know why people even consider buyers as "investors" rather than customers.

Let's for a moment pretend that it all had gone well and "believe" that Jpop was successful and Zidware had shipped those three machines, was profitable and was making more new machines...

CUSTOMER:
If someone has paid money towards Magic Girl, then Zidware would have shipped it, MG would be in their house and the transaction would be complete. At that point there would be no further relationship with Zidware unless the person gave more money for another machine.

INVESTOR:
This implies that the person put down money for the long term. What do they get back for their money? If they put down MG money, then I assume they are expecting an MG, but what else?

Is there anything in the agreement where they would hold a share of Zidware until they sold out? Would they get a share of any future sales/profits? Did it say they were providing seed money to Zidware in hope they "might" create a machine, but there was risk of nothing ever being built.

Based on everything we've heard it appears to be the former: they were just simply a customer in a pre-order model.

Look, I agree with both of these comments but can we please give it a rest. Investor, customer, victim, these are simply euphemisms to describe certain people in this situation. Seems not too long ago that BC Gambit was mocking us for being called "owners" when we didn't really "own" anything. (He really fancies himself a superior, witty guy)

And for the record I don't like being called a victim. But if that helps others convey a point, go for it and move the conversation along.

JPOP, Wizard, Thief
Designing into thin air
Have you built my game?

He sent JPOP funds
Investor or customer?
Hardly matters now

Dreaming pinball dreams
Magic Girl, Retro Zombies
Now we all wake up

Honestly, I was making that point to try to get people to stop looking themselves or others as "owners" (or heaven forbid investors) after the ship had obviously crashed and burned. Not something I took great pleasure in having to type out, but I felt it was a point that should be made at least once in this billion post thread.

I don't think many people like being a victim. But if it helps a person wake up and realize the dream had burned to the ground, so be it.

Nothing about being superior. But I am witty, thank you for that

Come on, with a little work you could be more condescending...but fair point. So how's this:

John asked me a few times across the years to do some pinball programming for him nights and weekends (I think some of that even predated this latest debacle) but life was just too busy and complicated for me to even consider it. (And I'm talking normal day-to-day busy and complicated, not the extra stuff like finding out someone you thought was a good personal and family friend was really just doing all that to gain unfettered access to your sons.) John even just wanted us to come visit his shop and see what he was working on and sad to say I could never find any open weekend to do even that. Last I talked to him was well over a year ago, but recently someone pointed me to this thread.

I know absolutely nothing about his situation or what's going on or what he was thinking through all this, but I am personally all too familiar with the magical thinking that sets in when you quit your day job and throw your entire life into a struggling entrepreneurial adventure, banking your entire existence on fulfilling a dream. Things that seem so obvious to outside observers can't possible penetrate your cloud of hopes and aspirations. I know first hand that feeling that with just one break, just a little more money, just this tiny thing or that big thing, you'll be over the hump, the dream will come true, the future will be brighter. It just has to be, because the alternative is too bleak to consider - not only the dreams failed, but basic life itself crashing down in terms of food and shelter and existence. I had my "adventure" when I was much younger - no wife, no kids, no mortgage. It was a retail environment, where the biggest company hole you could possibly dig was a couple of months' rent and utilities, maybe a shipment or two from any supplier foolish enough to extend you credit - but it's easy to tell yourself those are all faceless corporate entities that build that sort of thing into their business plan. I can't even imagine the level of magical thinking required to start down that path with the middle-age responsibilities of a family, and with large sums of money taken from individuals to fund it. But John's artistical magical thinking was what generated all those other pinball machines you loved, so I guess there's my answer.

I'm not here as a John apologist. (Heck, I was trying to just be here as a lurker.) I know nothing more about this situation than what I've read in this thread, and it sounds pretty crappy for anyone that got involved. I just think that anyone who is imagining John as some evil genius scam artist has clearly not ever run their own struggling business. It warps your mind, it makes you do things you wouldn't normally do, it can even ruin your life and the lives of others. My business partners and I ended our struggling business with a lot of personal debt, and it took me years to recover. I hope John similarly finds some way to eventually put everything right, though from the sound of things he hasn't reached the stage yet where the magical cloud blows away and he can see the situation for what it truly is.

I've boomed and busted a few times in my life. Currently on a "boom", a little bit wiser now, definitely older, having learned from my mistakes I hope to carry this one over the finish line.

Those failures all contributed to where I am today, and my success today is the culmination of my life's work, both good and bad. That is the infuriating thing with John. He will never concede anything, apologize to anything, and just OWN it. I damn well hope the lawsuit forces him to face the music, but based on what we've seen of his thought process, I think when this is all over and he's bankrupt and homeless, he'll have learned nothing and cling to the blame of those he thinks brought him down... his customers.

I know very well the volatile peaks and dark valleys of being an entrepreneur. I spent more than a decade of nervousness, lost sleep and working a second job before I became a "overnight success". (Jealous friends claimed I "got lucky" as they suddenly realized I'd risen from beneath them and blew past)

So I do understand and also agree Jpop did not start out as an evil scam artist. And I actually have great sympathy for he and his family as I will never forget my struggles.

But the man sat three feet away from me and lied. Lies that I couldn't refute at the time but would later discover. Lies that influenced some of my comments in this thread. Lies and confusion that I took back to the owners group I was responsible for.

All of this compounded by being publicly shamed by insensitive and clueless Pinsiders. Imagine how I feel.

That said, I gave you a thumbs up as I agree with most everything you posted. And I compliment you on standing up for your children.

***ALERT, ALERT***

"Owners" is a euphemism and I was caught up in making a point. Be certain to add your insult anyway.
LOL

My sincere apologies if I came off as condescending. Please know that wasn't my intention.

Pinside has recently had a few people start new accounts and immediately make accusations. What I was (poorly) trying to say is that you might want to be careful, just to shield yourself from litigation from the person you mentioned.

Should have minded my own business. Once again, I'm sorry if I offended you.

Never mind..

Funny how that happens.

I always find "the harder I work, the luckier I get" seems to be the phrase that works best in that situation.

rd

The expo seminar list is out. Looks like they had the good sense to not include Jpop. I don't know whether I'm happy or sad about that, would've made for some great drama.

8:00 p.m. Banquet - Lake Michigan Ballroom
with Special Guest Speaker

...or did they???

Aaron
FAST Pinball

Awwwwww man, I was coming to Expo just for that.

rd

Someone who knows about the court case?
Date, pronunciation, ...

Well, hopefully there is a shop visit by a group of "owners" that he is still pretending to be working for.

John P really is a great guy. I met him at expo last year. He has a family and you can really see his passion. For all those that lost out on their deposits, you had the money to burn for a toy that noone needed. You got to ride the rollar coaster of ups and downs. You were in the loop and out of the loop. You had the money, now you don't. Consider that payment for your ticket to this fun ride. As for Joh, he really is a great guy. Yea he only had a box of lights at the expo, but he is a great guy. He has a family and a house and probably pets as well. Don't extract your pound of flesh from him as he has already suffered enough. Remember he has a family. Just consider your loss as a risk you took. You bet the house and lost. This is what pinball is all about......

Wait what happened I just blacked out! Where did the above message come from?

shop? he continues to go in there and do what ?

Same thing he's done for 4+ years... pinball arts & crafts.

aiw_sander.png

He still goes to his shop and posts pics on the blogs like he is still making machines. The con continues until someone stops him.

Time to go and sand quadrant C-3 on that playfield

Your comment of the obvious so elevated the sophistication of this thread that I forwarded it along to our attorney. Yesterday in a Chicago courtroom our lawyer proclaimed "Your Honor, the owners don't really own anything"

Fact is you've been a troll through out this threads history. Try owning what you really are and quit playing spin doctor.

If you want to dredge up every post I have ever made in this thread i would be willing to stand trial in the pinside court regarding whether I have been a troll throughout this thread's history.

I can't think of a constructive response back to you without being deliberately hurtful. You seem to be in either the "anger" or "grief" stage in terms of dealing with this crapfest, and that I can understand.

I honestly don't think trying to rub your face in your past posts in this thread would be particularly beneficial, if you choose not to extend me the same courtesy that is on you.

Feel free to quote my recent apology to Iceman. I don't like making mistakes but I take pride in self awareness and having the strength of character to own up to them. But thats just me.

Uhhh... no. I don't think so. That was in the times of pinball prohibition. It's 2015. Pinball manufacturing is not a new thing....it's actually possible. Jpop portrayed himself to his buyers as a seasoned professional. Capable of going beyond what we have ever seen in pinball. I don't need to go on.

Fair enough; I do not honestly remember antagonizing you or others in this thread to the point of warranting this.

I generally don't shy away from calling BS and foolishness where I see it, granted. IF I had thought I had devolved into "el Trollo", I would happily apologize. At this point it leads to a quote hunt or me delivering a non-sincere apology, neither of which is my style.

I am certainly not above apologizing when I screw up, or admitting I screwed up, I am old enough to have checked my ego and pride long ago. Every once in a while I get my turn at being the guy who has egg on his face, happens to everybody on a long enough timeline.

IF I recall correctly, you are taking legal action against JPOP? I genuinely wish you closure on this in whatever form you are seeking.

So, I pay this guy $6500.00 for pin , he say's he can't deliver pin, and won't give me back my money.
I check flight to chicago, rountrip $550.00, hotel $130 a night.,
I promise you, I come back with my money...

Even better to drive there and use cash for the entire trip. Including road tolls. May not be a bad idea to put a different plate on the car. Rental car preferred. Have someone else rent it and let you use it. Switch the plate. I've found several license plates over the years. Some literally laying on the street. Always handy to have.

Many people fly to Chicago, many people check into hotels...hahaha.

Makes me think...
He might as well have re-themed something instead that already worked and added new art and a mech or two...

Gottlieb's Atlantis/Sheriff/Lawman has a tried & true layout. He could add a ramp and post between the flippers and make it new again.

There's a lot of things "he might as well have" done. He might as well have worked as a Subway sandwich artist the last 5 years.

Nahhhhhh, bad call, as he wouldn't have been able to handle that fast paced/deadline based environment...

Yeah ... Imagine waiting in line for 4 years for your $10,000 foot long. That'd suck balls!

rd

He should have worked at Jimmy John's after he was canned from Williams. Maybe he could have learned about "Freaky Fast Delivery" {other pin manufacturers could learn from this too}. Also, if he was broke and didn't want to work, All Jimmy John's let you smell the food for free. They even have neon signs advertising this fact.

I wonder if "Duke's Neon" made those signs? I wonder if the "Duke" himself heated and formed the glass tubing and injected the gas and sealed the tubes himself or did he CONtract that out and bill the work as his own?

Here's another blast from the past jpop quote:

The Best Pinball Owners!

Forgot to mention on this forum I think I have the best pinball owners period. You guys are willing to put up with a lot of extra bulk to allow mw and my team to create pinball again, a notch or 2 above the rest of the pinball crowd. We try to work honestly, ethically and appreciate every day this special time in pinball. The only way we can say thanks is to create amazing pinball. From art, to design to all the other small things most others miss.

"From art, to design to all the other small things most others miss"... that sums it up, really. Was all about the art and design, and small things (vents, hinges) and never about, you know, actually delivering machines to anyone.

And it's a real knee slapper now that he specifically mentions "honestly and ethically"... why even bring that up? Just a part of his continuing narrative since the beginning. He was never honest about the state of things, his progress, his bookkeeping, or anything else.

And ethically? Drawing a salary and delivering nothing once all the funds had been paid to himself? Stiffing all the contractors and leaving them high and dry?

He was the one that brought those words up.

Already posted.

I can't believe it, but It doesnt seem like this madness is going to end anytime soon. How long can this DBAG keep getting away with this nonsense?