Pintasia won't be going forward with a plan to produce Magic Girl?!?!!!!11!1!LOLZ
Now they'll never get their own thread.
(Topic ID: 92436)
Linked Games
Alice in Wonderland
Gottlieb, 1948-
Houdini
American Pinball, 2017
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Magic Girl
Zidware Pinball USA, 2017
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Retro Atomic Zombie Adventureland
Zidware Pinball USA, 2012
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Delft
I have a bunch of experience getting PyProcGame based games running on Visual Pinball (the updated VPROC bridge here:
https://github.com/mjocean/proc-visual-pinball makes that easier than the original version that Gerry and destruk authored). I've managed to rework VP playfields and get the software running for Buffy, Second Sortie, ES:Aftershock, and several other P-ROC projects that haven't gotten as far yet.
If it's over at Farsight (of the Pinball Arcade), awesome thought, but last I checked their platform doesn't have a mechanism to run pyprocgame based games, let alone the custom display engine or the intermediate communication layer between the pyprocgame based game and said display engine.
If it's with the Fast/MPF guys, I really don't know what to say. I just hope it's not there, for their sake. It's rapidly becoming a cursed object like some kind of monkey idol.
Anyone who has the authority and assets to make this happen who is interested in porting this game to VP should feel free to me PM me when the time comes to get the software working. But, hey, you guys are developers -- I'm sure you've got this all figured out 
Quoted from PinballBulbs:Shh
It's my understanding if a virtual table got made it would be part of visual pinball in general so everyone would have it free, like all of the other tables on there. Nothing specific to our mini virtual pins. They just run visual pinball (if installed) and no real way to have some sort of exclusive for magic girl. Plus drm sucks so if I were personally doing the virtual pin for magic girl it would be free. I have no skills in that so non issue anyways.
Hillsboro, OR
Quoted from YKpinballer:I dunno, I've posted way too much in this thread and people are probably sick of me.
Agreed. Unfortunately the rest of this was so long winded I couldn't bother reading it.
Quoted from Aurich:I think I'm done arguing about this.
We will see. I am guessing you're not 
Quoted from Mocean:If it's with the Fast/MPF guys, I really don't know what to say. I just hope it's not there, for their sake. It's rapidly becoming a cursed object like some kind of monkey idol
I personally wouldn't touch or be near anything Zidware related. The juju is bad on the MG game, too much "blood".
Quoted from Wolfmarsh:I personally wouldn't touch or be near anything Zidware related. The juju is bad on the MG game, too much "blood".
At this point, if there are no deals to buy the debt and pay off past vendors and refund customers, then the game is a blight.
Quoted from frolic:At this point, if there are no deals to buy the debt and pay off past vendors and refund customers, then the game is a blight.
A pox upon humanity.
Glad this horror story is finally coming to an end. What a nightmare for everyone involved and the hobby as a whole... amidst all the complaining, bashing and finger pointing anyone that sent this whacko money better not forget to look in the mirror and blame the person most responsible for the position they are in.
Tough lesson to learn here... sad thing is some of us won't learn a thing.
Quoted from teekee:Glad this horror story is finally coming to an end. What a nightmare for everyone involved and the hobby as a whole... amidst all the complaining, bashing and finger pointing anyone that sent this whacko money better not forget to look in the mirror and blame the person most responsible for the position they are in.
Tough lesson to learn here... sad thing is some of us won't learn a thing.
No. Just, No.
1. Don't blame the victim. It's not their fault. This is akin to saying "she shouldn't have dressed like that".
2. These people that had the money to send JPop obviously did adult things and made adult decisions to get that kind of money, I'm pretty sure they don't need you telling them that they made a mistake. They already know, and they know better than any of us that didn't send money.
You started out great, but an empathetic person would have stopped after the ellipsis. It became rude shortly after that.
Great point Razor re Chap 11, the letter has sunk him on that front unless he has figured out some miracle profit stream since then. Had John not burned every bridge and person he ever came across, he might have actually been able to salvage more time out of this by selling "artwork" with Yeti and other ancillary stuff to generate revenue.
And you look at all the great pinball people willing to help, can you imagine if John had just come clean a year ago and asked for help then, instead of asking for more deposits to pay himself, he might have had a chance. Essentially got a working pin to a show in two weeks from a terrible starting point.
Quoted from Wolfmarsh:No. Just, No.
1. Don't blame the victim. It's not their fault. This is akin to saying "she shouldn't have dressed like that".
2. These people that had the money to send JPop obviously did adult things and made adult decisions to get that kind of money, I'm pretty sure they don't need you telling them that they made a mistake. They already know, and they know better than any of us that didn't send money.
You started out great, but an empathetic person would have stopped after the ellipsis. It became rude shortly after that.
The truth hurts I know... its still the truth. Plenty of blame to go around. Not putting any on yourself is just simply foolish or in total denial.
If you guys at Pinballbulbs think somehow that you are going to concoct some plan to personally benefit or walk out the back door with the MG prototype because you guys suffered and had $$$ in this fiasco, you better think again! Welcome to the Jpop losers club.
The fact that you are trying to hide what you guys are doing is BS! You have aligned yourselves WITH John, gotten his permission, and because "he is ok with it", you are hiding it and making up all these excuses.
It's hard to imagine me even thinking this because you know how the pinball community will react, don't you.
Once again John, open you mouth and start explaining, you can't possibly do any more damage to your legal situation. It does seem though you have found a couple of more guys to continue the nonsense parade.
WTF.........its all that keeps coming to mind.
Quoted from teekee:The truth hurts I know... its still the truth. Plenty of blame to go around. Not putting any on yourself is just simply foolish or in total denial.
You completely misunderstood what I said. It's not about "facing the truth."
Let me break it down for you. It's an asshole move to tell someone they made a mistake when they already know, especially when the only thing they are "guilty" of is trusting another human.
Quoted from iceman44:Once again John, open you mouth and start explaining, you can't possibly do any more damage to your legal situation.
IANAL, but...
Quoted from iceman44:you can't possibly do any more damage to your legal situation.
I respectfully disagree.
Quoted from boo32:Teekee thank you for helping me see the light of how stupid I was and still am. Before you posted, I didn't realize how much I was at fault for John's lack of ethics. It is all clear to me now.
Whatever... I never said anything like that. Read it however you want to read it but nothing like that was ever said.
Quoted from Wolfmarsh:You completely misunderstood what I said. It's not about "facing the truth."
Let me break it down for you. It's an asshole move to tell someone they made a mistake when they already know, especially when the only thing they are "guilty" of is trusting another human.
Tackee.
Quoted from teekee:amidst all the complaining, bashing and finger pointing anyone that sent this whacko money better not forget to look in the mirror and blame the person most responsible for the position they are in.
Tough lesson to learn here... sad thing is some of us won't learn a thing.
While true, it's a shame that so many people got duped by a (previously) well respected member of our hobby, who also happened to be an iconic designer in many people's minds.
People like to be aligned with the stars. Had you or I announced we were going to do what jpop said he was going to do, we wouldn't have receive any pre-order money.
Some won't learn, but most will. You'll see.
Quoted from boo32:Teekee - how did I mis-read the part about the person in the mirror being the most responsible for the position I am in?
Exactly... doesn't make you 'stupid' which is the word you chose to use not me.
Quoted from Chippewa-Pin:Some won't learn, but most will. You'll see.
Hope so...
Quoted from teekee:Exactly... doesn't make you 'stupid' which is the word you chose to use not me.
Eh, it actually makes them more stupid than responsible frankly. Though I dont believe either is particularly fair.
Saying they are 'responsible' is like saying we are all responsible when a company we buy products from engages in corporate malfeasance.
Quoted from Pinfactory2000:Nor does it make them 'responsible' for his actions.
Thats like saying we are responsible when a company we buy products from engages in corporate malfeasance.
Again, read it how you want to read it. No one said you are responsible for HIS actions. Sorry the point got lost in the fog of anger and denial.
Quoted from YKpinballer:I'm guessing Zidware paid a lot of money to John for the "privilege" of being able to use his patents for development of their prototype. However if he developed the patents while being paid a salary by Zidware, and using materials in the Zidware shop, there could easily be a claim on them by creditors.
Edit: not to mention they would have a claim on all the fees paid to John for the patents that should rightfully be Zidware patents.
I'm sensing from your smugness that you take pleasure in thinking John is a genius for swindling everybody and you think he's so smart he's going to get away with it. If I were you I wouldn't be so sure about these guys. I'd be careful about being involved, actually, lawsuits have a way of spreading to anybody nearby.
John doesn't have the money to repay people, but people think he has the money to sue over patent infringement? Good luck with that one, the patent is a scare tactic to stop others from doing similar items. The cost of protecting them is more costly then filing for them...
Quoted from Pinfactory2000:Saying they are 'responsible' is like saying we are all responsible when a company we buy products from engages in corporate malfeasance.
Not in the least... totally different. This was not a company with products this was a guy with no products, no nothing! No products just a dream that turned into a nightmare because of his stupidity and stubbornness. A dream that we CHOSE to finance. We put way too much faith in a guy with nothing.
Quoted from iceman44:WTF.........its all that keeps coming to mind.
Edited in light of Pinballbulbs post & subsequent denial of possession &..... I guess I just believe the guy
Until there is a bankruptcy, that is John's machine to send to whomever he wants to try and make whatever deal he can get.
At this point I welcome the legal intervention just to end this and put us all out of our misery.
Quoted from teekee:A dream that we CHOSE to finance. We put way too much faith in a guy with nothing.
I assume you are using "we" as in Pinheads, not as a preordered yourself? 
Quoted from TecumsehPlissken:so am I following this correctly ? the proto that went to the NW show is now residing at Pinballbulbs in Oregon for "evaluation" of some kind with Johns blessing & they have aligned with John in some way ? really ?
Sounds about right.
Without the full truth being known, we're only left with speculation. This speculation is as valid as any, I suppose.
Those who put money down did not make a "mistake", they took a gamble, they looked at the info available and felt the risk would be worth the reward. They felt that they would risk betting this money on a new company, side are, and get a unique and rare game. They were betting on getting an outcome like BBB.
Unfortunately the gamble did not pay off. All they can hope for now is minimizing the losses.
No guts, no glory. These guys had the guts to put their money down, unfortunately they bet on the wrong horse -- or maybe I should say jackass.
Ultimately they may only end up with a "red badge of courage", but I applaud them for having the guts to take a chance.
Halifax, NS
He probably could sell it also before he goes to court. To pay some of his legal bills coming soon. Or it might return to his shop. Anything is possible at this time.
Quoted from iceman44:If you guys at Pinballbulbs think somehow that you are going to concoct some plan to personally benefit or walk out the back door with the MG prototype because you guys suffered and had $$$ in this fiasco, you better think again! Welcome to the Jpop losers club.
The fact that you are trying to hide what you guys are doing is BS! You have aligned yourselves WITH John, gotten his permission, and because "he is ok with it", you are hiding it and making up all these excuses.
It's hard to imagine me even thinking this because you know how the pinball community will react, don't you.
Once again John, open you mouth and start explaining, you can't possibly do any more damage to your legal situation. It does seem though you have found a couple of more guys to continue the nonsense parade.
WTF.........its all that keeps coming to mind.
Well I can say, after all of this mess and now pinballbulbs acting so secretive I can decide never to buy from pinballbulbs again.
All of us can do a full boycott. I know I'm going to vote with my wallet and that I can buy my LEDs from Cointaker who has lost more than anyone else in this mess.
So pinballbulbs has effectively lost me as a customer. I no longer need to support any company that wants to act all secret. I do not have the patience for any more of this crap.
I will retract my position if it is proven that you do not have MG
Quoted from tamoore:Sounds about right.
Without the full truth being known, we're only left with speculation. This speculation is as valid as any, I suppose.
Maybe John has a convoluted "plan" to recoup some money by porting the VP pin to a payable playable VP app type game. He did one in the past, however it was a fairly simple game. I played it a few dozen times or more on my phone....of course this whould be a bad idea, and I would not support it.
I'm thinking it would be best for him to get a job somewhere/anywhere outside of pinball ASAP. While we are all upset with him, I don't wish him or his family an entire life of poverty for his actions.
Speculate away, this is Pinside!
Quoted from Aurich:This isn't my first brand rodeo. I was incredulous that something so shitty was in the style guide (speaking of the dwarf font stuff), not that JJP had to follow it. I admitted it was crazy but true when the t-shirt images got dug up. I've spent decades of my career working with Fortune 500 and huge brands, I'm well aware of what it means to have to follow their rules.
And the revised Hobbit playfield looks miles better, still following the rules, so I really don't retract a thing I said.
I will admit I'm getting a new appreciation for how byzantine the movie industry is specifically though, no question. And I've said this already in another thread, I'm crazy jealous of all the high rez assets a new film like the Hobbit has available. You don't get that with movies from 1978, that's for sure!
I was referring to a previous comment about "Choosing a license that won't handcuff you" (Or something like that on a hobbit thread). Which you really can't do as you don't understand the intricacies of the license and the boundaries until after you actually hold the license. But yes it's certainly difficult to work within confines when you don't have complete creative freedom.
Quoted from Pinchroma:But yes it's certainly difficult to work within confines when you don't have complete creative freedom.
JPOP proved its difficult if you have complete creative freedom too
Quoted from PEN:Maybe John has a convoluted "plan" to recoup some money by porting the VP pin to a payable playable VP app type game. He did one in the past, however it was a fairly simple game. I played it a few dozen times or more on my phone....of course this whould be a bad idea, and I would not support it.
I'm thinking it would be best for him to get a job somewhere/anywhere outside of pinball ASAP. While we are all upset with him, I don't wish him or his family an entire life of poverty for his actions.
Speculate away, this is Pinside!
There is certainly foreshadowing for this... when I said why didn't he prototype virtually first... Check out the response from our friends in Oregon..
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/jpop-update-thread%E2%80%A6%E2%80%A6%E2%80%A6%E2%80%A6%E2%80%A6mg-raza-and-aiw%E2%80%A6/page/230#post-2476049
Quoted from hank527:I will retract my position if it is proven that you do not have MG
How can you prove you don't have something?
"insiders club" is the new "skin in the game" for this thread. Fascinating!
Quoted from YKpinballer:Here is what it appears happened based on these posts, but obviously I could be wrong.
Given the options of:
1) This is all some elaborate scheme John designed 4+ years ago to rake in money, pay himself a big salary and cash in, then evaporate
2) John's an idiot
I'm going with option #2.
Quoted from tamoore:Sounds about right.
Without the full truth being known, we're only left with speculation. This speculation is as valid as any, I suppose.
Its all speculation.
So sorry to all who got burned in this.
If it was me I would of course sue,its really the only way to end the speculation.
Zidware needs to be legally compelled to show the books.I just went through this.I was told there was no money.I was "strong armed" into what was a bad (lie) deal.Thank god for my lawyer.Turns out there was money and more than we thought. once our forensic accountant got involved things moved REAL FAST.All of a sudden they wanted a meeting and a chance to settle out of court.
I got a settlement.So IMHO go for the lawsuit and stay the course,you might be pleasantly surprised.Also any attorney fees after the request to show books,should be paid by the defendant for delaying the process.My lawyer asked for this and the Judge said yes almost before she finished her sentence.
Good luck guys,I really hope you get a least something for your trouble and lose.
Quoted from ZenTron:If a movie is made, the hardest part would be figuring out the genre, horror or comedy?
Total.... Drama .... .Island (originated in Canada, of course) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Total_Drama_Island,
pick your avatar and your pairings for the post-Pintasia bout
total_drama_island_pairings_by_anime_luv3r-d6089nt.jpg
TDI pinheads.jpg
Quoted from RobT:Ironically, one of the reasons that I got in on BHZA when it was first launched was, in a funny sort of way, because of the NDA.
I figured "holy shit, you mean I have to sign an NDA to be part of this project? That must mean that I am going to see some cool-ass shit along the way. It might take awhile, but at least the ride will be cool, seeing all this new shit that JPop is going to come up with!"
lol
So one of the reasons I decided to get out and get a refund is that it became obvious that we, as owners, weren't really going to be seeing much of anything, and the alleged need for a NDA was a complete joke.
Those with $4500 lost, you subscribed to $100/month "Pinball Dynasty Meltdown". They rest of us got to watch it free over the internet.
Quoted from Wolfmarsh:I personally wouldn't touch or be near anything Zidware related. The juju is bad on the MG game, too much "blood".
Quoted from Pdxmonkey:For the record
4 prototypes
2 whitewoods
1 mutant thing
Whitewoods have more features but less art.
Mutant thing has art but hardly anything else.
RAZA
4 cabinets, BG
At least 1 in-progress whitewood
AIW
full cab and Backbox in foamcore/Nordmanite w/Jeremy's B/W drawings on cab, and BB.
The rational for pre-ordering was if the games turned out to be good or very desirable like BBB or AcDc LE, they could be worth more than sale price, and not just that if they turned out to be really good they wouldn't be easy to come by on the secondary market because they would be so rare.
I think games like AMH also limited, but don't really pull in big money, kind of is the normal. But people had stars in their eyes and didn't want to pass by the once in a lifetime pin.
No one expected John to be such a jerk.
Quoted from slapshot:Thanks Bill for getting the game to the show and your efforts.
I wonder if John is ringing your phone off the hook trying to make a better deal?
Rather than seeing the game in the museum or burned in the desert in Vegas, it'd be cool if we could get back everything we had already paid for from the auction for cheap. We could then sell off whatever machinery, equipment and such to give back money to the vendors and since it is apparently not feasible to manufacture the games, we could try to just finish the prototypes and share them.
Put one in the States, Canada and Europe and all of us that have money into the games can share them in some kind of rotation. I could see it now, meeting up on stretches of highways passing them off, like the olympic torch
Any other ideas?
Skip the court costs: This would bring emotional and financial peace for everyone.
Oct Chicago Expo, first sell all remaining parts at the show, then $5/ticket to watch (cathartic for pinsiders; owners are free, of course) - split the $ in this kitty amongst the vendors based on invoice $ outstanding.
Video record the 8 cabinets and partial PF, 130 orders, 1 chainsaw - everybody gets around 1.5% of the remains - Ice & PDX and WcB get to share the saw. Pieces handed out with first choice of the bits going to #1 in the pre-order queue? The video proceeds from the next 4 years are divvied up amongt vendors and owners
Quoted from Aurich:Cool shit like the Theater of Magic Post, Magna Flips, and upside down lamp spinners. He didn't invent the popup center post. He didn't invent magna flips, and he didn't invent the lamp spinner, which was done first on EMs.
Maybe they'd all be fun features! I'm okay with taking old ideas and remixing them, that's part of pinball. But it seems more than a little ridiculous that he was trying to protect ideas like that from being "stolen".
Yeah, but the patented purple lightening-bolts on the arpon and scorecards (and almost everything else) are valuable ideas.lightning-bolts-backgrounds.jpg
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