Seattle, WA
PDX, I'm excited to hear what you have to say. I was going to wait until the end of October for john to post his big reveal, if it's a no show then I will probably have something to say on the blog.
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Quoted from iceman44:Building a certain amount and then having to change course is not the optimal outcome, I think its just simply one of those live and learn things and a mistake was made by John. You can't make 13 or 17 pins of anything at any price due to the part costs, they have to be spread out over a larger number to make it work. Now he knows.
Quoted from iceman44:No money yet. He just said be ready. I assumed expo reveal obviously not
Quoted from iceman44:But then it started at 13, went to 17 and then to 25. You guys should want 50, otherwise its not gonna get done. He's gonna need the $$$ to complete them.
Quoted from metallik:Frankly, anyone still in for MG (or RAZA or AIW or whatever else) should hope he sells hundreds, if not thousands, so there's actually money to get them done.
I know we're all on the same team and want the same thing, and you're aces in my book, but I have to respectfully disagree with you gentlemen with regards to the above.
1. It's not simply a live and learn thing.
He F'd it up, he bares the brunt of that mistake. JPOP doesn't get to live and learn with my money, he eats it. If a commercial construction company wins a contract from the state to do a set job for a set price, and then they go over budget or learn half way through that something they did needs to be amended, they don't get to live and learn at the state's expense, the construction co. takes the hit. I don't want to hear how that's a big corporation and he's essentially a one man operation. He has taken in well over a million dollars...that's big boy money, and JPOP needs to be treated like a big boy and suffer the same setback any larger company would.
2. Original 25 MG owners should want 50 or it's not going to get done. That's not true either.
Look I know it's a good problem to have, but if Lamborghini announces they are going to create 25 collectors edition vehicles and once they sell out of them on pre-order they announce they are going to double production to cover unanticipated costs, those original 25 owners don't necessarily still want it. Well 3 years ago a $17k pinball was sure as hell the collector's Lamborghini of pinball...it still is. JPOP has immediately diminished the value of my machine by producing double the amount. I don't care if it sounds like boo hoo there are now 50 of my precious machine it will be worth less.....as great as he is his work doesn't make it a $17k pin. Why is RAZA only $10k and it's being produce by the same "artistic pinball genius?....because 100 units of RAZA are being made vs. only 25 units of MG. Is MG going to have $7k more worth of toys, NO. That means if the difference between a 100 unit production and a 25 unit production machine is worth $7k, then upping that production number from 25 to 50 should entitle the original 25 to a $2,300 discount. AS ONE OF THE ORIGINAL 25 OWNERS I'VE IMMEDIATELY TAKEN A 14% LOSS IN VALUE TO MY MACHINE EVEN BEFORE THE FIRST ONE LEAVES THE FACTORY.
3. He's gonna need the money to complete them. We should hope he produces hundreds or thousands so there's actually money to get them done. HE OBVIOUSLY DOESN'T NEED THE MONEY.
If as you've said Iceman he hasn't asked for any money from the additional 25 MG owners until the reveal, he clearly doesn't need the money to stay alive, he wants the money to maintain his profit margin at the expense of my 14% loss. Let's also be direct here, and I don't mind saying it because I'm a RAZA owner as well. Zidware is the one single entity (corporation) for MG, RAZA, and AIW. Unfortunately for all, that means from a credit standpoint all the money is commingled as one. So the truth is if he goes over budget on MG then he has to spend RAZA money....which he is...which is the exact reason he doesn't need your MG money yet; He's supporting MG development cost buy dipping into RAZA funds. Sure when it's revealed he'll take your money so his profit is there. When it comes time for RAZA, AIW funds will need to support him if he goes over budget.
*** WHAT THIS MEANS IS THAT THE ORIGINAL 25 MAGIC GIRL OWNERS DON'T NEED 25 MORE MGs TO BE PRODUCED SO THAT THEY GET THEIR MACHINES....RAZA OWNERS NEED THE ADDITIONAL 25 MGs SO RAZA OWNERS DON'T GET F'D...AND AIW OWNERS NEED IT BECAUSE IF RAZA NEEDS ADDITIONAL MONEY, AIW OWNERS GET F'D. LAST MAN STANDING IS TAKING A HIT ***
With all that said Iceman, I don't fault you for signing up for MG. I know you've paid money towards RAZA and AIW, but when it comes to Magic Girl you're smart, you know you have a free option. If MG looks great at the reveal, then you pony up for a machine you know already looks great and exists, if it sucks or never happens you lose nothing. All reward, no risk. I'd take that option all day long on MG, RAZA, AIW, and the next 100 titles he wants pre-orders for. The problem is the first 25 owners don't have a free option, we've already paid the $17k in full. In finance isn't it supposed to be the initial investors that get rewarded because they've taken the risk and second round investors, that only commit capital once proof of concept exists, pay a premium for less uncertainty?
This post is directed twards RAZA owners... Drano just posted a pretty strong post on the Blog and I have made a few posts as well. At this point as owners I think the only way we can get anywhere is to stop beating around the bush with John and just post how we really feel..... So if your an owner get on the blog and politely say your peace. That way 3 or 4 owners don't have to do all the heavy lifting and John is more likely to listen.
Thanks!
Quoted from Concretehardt:This post is directed twards RAZA owners... Drano just posted a pretty strong post on the Blog and I have made a few posts as well. At this point as owners I think the only way we can get anywhere is to stop beating around the bush with John and just post how we really feel..... So if your an owner get on the blog and politely say your piece. That way 3 or 4 owners don't have to do all the heavy lifting and John is more likely to listen.
Thanks!
Yes, please. Now is the time.
Quoted from Multiball1:he wants the money to maintain his profit margin at the expense of my 14% loss.
All fantastic points, I will add one more. Buy doubling the agreed upon amount of games produced, he has essentially cut the secondary market in half.
Quoted from Concretehardt:This post is directed twards RAZA owners... Drano just posted a pretty strong post on the Blog and I have made a few posts as well. At this point as owners I think the only way we can get anywhere is to stop beating around the bush with John and just post how we really feel..... So if your an owner get on the blog and politely say your peace. That way 3 or 4 owners don't have to do all the heavy lifting and John is more likely to listen.
Thanks!
RAZA owners....I know it was very long, but please read my post #602 in it's entirety (or at least bullet point 3 and on) because although the main focus is MG, it shows how serious the risks are for RAZA owners. I'm a RAZA owner as well.
Quoted from Multiball1:I know we're all on the same team and want the same thing, and you're aces in my book, but I have to respectfully disagree with you gentlemen with regards to the above.
1. It's not simply a live and learn thing.
He F'd it up, he bares the brunt of that mistake. JPOP doesn't get to live and learn with my money, he eats it. If a commercial construction company wins a contract from the state to do a set job for a set price, and then they go over budget or learn half way through that something they did needs to be amended, they don't get to live and learn at the state's expense, the construction co. takes the hit. I don't want to hear how that's a big corporation and he's essentially a one man operation. He has taken in well over a million dollars...that's big boy money, and JPOP needs to be treated like a big boy and suffer the same setback any larger company would.
2. Original 25 MG owners should want 50 or it's not going to get done. That's not true either.
Look I know it's a good problem to have, but if Lamborghini announces they are going to create 25 collectors edition vehicles and once they sell out of them on pre-order they announce they are going to double production to cover unanticipated costs, those original 25 owners don't necessarily still want it. Well 3 years ago a $17k pinball was sure as hell the collector's Lamborghini of pinball...it still is. JPOP has immediately diminished the value of my machine by producing double the amount. I don't care if it sounds like boo hoo there are now 50 of my precious machine it will be worth less.....as great as he is his work doesn't make it a $17k pin. Why is RAZA only $10k and it's being produce by the same "artistic pinball genius?....because 100 units of RAZA are being made vs. only 25 units of MG. Is MG going to have $7k more worth of toys, NO. That means if the difference between a 100 unit production and a 25 unit production machine is worth $7k, then upping that production number from 25 to 50 should entitle the original 25 to a $2,300 discount. AS ONE OF THE ORIGINAL 25 OWNERS I'VE IMMEDIATELY TAKEN A 14% LOSS IN VALUE TO MY MACHINE EVEN BEFORE THE FIRST ONE LEAVES THE FACTORY.
3. He's gonna need the money to complete them. We should hope he produces hundreds or thousands so there's actually money to get them done. HE OBVIOUSLY DOESN'T NEED THE MONEY.
If as you've said Iceman he hasn't asked for any money from the additional 25 MG owners until the reveal, he clearly doesn't need the money to stay alive, he wants the money to maintain his profit margin at the expense of my 14% loss. Let's also be direct here, and I don't mind saying it because I'm a RAZA owner as well. Zidware is the one single entity (corporation) for MG, RAZA, and AIW. Unfortunately for all, that means from a credit standpoint all the money is commingled as one. So the truth is if he goes over budget on MG then he has to spend RAZA money....which he is...which is the exact reason he doesn't need your MG money yet; He's supporting MG development cost buy dipping into RAZA funds. Sure when it's revealed he'll take your money so his profit is there. When it comes time for RAZA, AIW funds will need to support him if he goes over budget.
*** WHAT THIS MEANS IS THAT THE ORIGINAL 25 MAGIC GIRL OWNERS DON'T NEED 25 MORE MGs TO BE PRODUCED SO THAT THEY GET THEIR MACHINES....RAZA OWNERS NEED THE ADDITIONAL 25 MGs SO RAZA OWNERS DON'T GET F'D...AND AIW OWNERS NEED IT BECAUSE IF RAZA NEEDS ADDITIONAL MONEY, AIW OWNERS GET F'D. LAST MAN STANDING IS TAKING A HIT ***
With all that said Iceman, I don't fault you for signing up for MG. I know you've paid money towards RAZA and AIW, but when it comes to Magic Girl you're smart, you know you have a free option. If MG looks great at the reveal, then you pony up for a machine you know already looks great and exists, if it sucks or never happens you lose nothing. All reward, no risk. I'd take that option all day long on MG, RAZA, AIW, and the next 100 titles he wants pre-orders for. The problem is the first 25 owners don't have a free option, we've already paid the $17k in full. In finance isn't it supposed to be the initial investors that get rewarded because they've taken the risk and second round investors pay a premium for less uncertainty?
So you are saying you are a little unhappy? 
I'm sure he absolutely DOES need the money and I believe he is seeking it with 3rd party financial partners. If he didn't need the money why do you think he went to 50? He loses his ass building 25 pins of anything at 17k, per John himself, he's NOT trying to maintain some profit margin, TIME has destroyed that. Thus, it is now a "live and learn" thing for him. If he has to do 50, which he does, then he is going to do them, he has no choice, like it or not. That said, for me now, with this whole experience turning south, at this point I wouldn't pony up 17k to be one of the 50 and I highly doubt anybody else would be dumb enough either until they see a major update and a definitive schedule.
It's been 39 months since MG and 32 months since RAZA, what do you imagine the "cash burn" is on the operation? It's a catch 22, how can you ramp up production/completion when you can't afford the "cash burn" and you have to do everything yourself.
AIW, I'm not sure, even though I'm stupidly in on the project right now, initially just to support him, how he could or should be spending any time on that one BEFORE the other two pins get made? $$$.
Like you said, without RAZA, you have/had zero chance of ever getting a MG completed with 17k worth of stuff in it much less 1,700. Those dollars are going to help get MG finished, if any of those dollars are left. At this point, it looks like MG and RAZA are a combo deal in terms of ordering parts and getting these done. Btw, where are all the parts, cabs, etc. for 175 pins, or 150 for that matter.
What you are saying in effect is that John is running a Ponzi scheme, RAZA dollars pay for MG and AIW dollars will pay for RAZA, as long a they exist. Maybe so. Thus, as a RAZA owner, I'm not too concerned about a 14% loss for the MG buyer, I just hope you get your pin.
Were you part of the original 13, 17 or did you come in when it got bumped to 25? What's the difference on those bumps? I recall them like it was yesterday, just shows how 3+ years can fly by.
I hope this has a happy ending for all of us! If not, it will be a "live and learn" moment for me. 
Quoted from Concretehardt:This post is directed twards RAZA owners... Drano just posted a pretty strong post on the Blog and I have made a few posts as well. At this point as owners I think the only way we can get anywhere is to stop beating around the bush with John and just post how we really feel..... So if your an owner get on the blog and politely say your peace. That way 3 or 4 owners don't have to do all the heavy lifting and John is more likely to listen.
Thanks!
You and Frolic had some great posts on the blog, Frolic especially. I think people are afraid to say what they really are thinking!
Quoted from iceman44:You and Frolic had some great posts on the blog, Frolic especially. I think people are afraid to say what they really are thinking!
I will be posting mine in the morning.
Mississauga, ON
I've kept my comments directed to John personally and have tried to offer strong, but balanced and understanding posts here and on other forums.
I have had huge issues with communication for over two years... Despite having spent an afternoon with John at his studio. I don't think I'm the only one that has made these feelings known to him. Maybe they are just becoming more public now, but they have been there for a long time.
This has never been treated as a business, or us as customers.
Quoted from Multiball1:RAZA owners....I know it was very long, but please read my post #602 in it's entirety (or at least bullet point 3 and on) because although the main focus is MG, it shows how serious the risks are for RAZA owners. I'm a RAZA owner as well.
With what I know and think, the risks, after all of this time, are HUGE.
Like I've said before, there will have to be "proof of life" before another $$ from me goes into anything, or don't care what list I'm on. And it's not just some "reveal", but it has to come along with the proven ability and funds to get it done.
It's so clear to me that from a "business standpoint" that he doesn't understand when he says you can get only 2 of 3, PRICE, QUALITY, SPEED. We know SPEED has left the building and to expect it up front is crazy anyhow. However, to survive within Zidware, his own company, SPEED has to be part of the equation, he doesn't work for Bally anymore!!!
It's called CASH BURN.
He gave us a "production timeline" in the original packets. Zero update since, yet he must have thought it was important then?
If he changed the timeline so readily why would anybody think he wouldn't change the quantity? John is obviously a pinball genius, and a business _____ fill in the blank.
I think Hank's offer to sell his spot is the tip of the iceberg.
Also. Lots of questions here regarding a few things. This is my take on some of them:
1) the Alien.
Ben was the main character... A mad scientist hold up in a ruin amusement park churning out zombies amidst all manner of kitschy retro stuff (robots, UFOs, etc..). Pretty damn cool even though I didn't know Ben from Adam and wondered why his name was on the title...
Ben and John part ways...
Ben helps Spooky on their zombie game...
JPOP soon posts new comps for backglass art 'ideas' where Ben slowly gets morphed into a Mars Attacks character 'lovingly referred to as Neb'.
I was one of the first to comment a distaste for that direction on that post in the blog... But it's John's game. Was it sour grapes? Did he really feel the move from mad scientist to Martian was a good play? Who knows. You'll have to decide for yourself when it's all said and done. I personally don't think any licensing issues were addresses and I would be the first to cheer if this character gets altered.
2) the custom parts
Yes. John had/has the option to use many existing parts from day one.
Was it a lack of 3D cad files as someone proposed? Hell no. If he can draw a 3D file for a new part then it would be nothing to redraw an existing one that does not have to be produced and engineered.
My OPINION is that this has more to do with John than it does with necessity.
John keeps promoting "new pinball". I don't know if he has some pent up negativity regarding his former employer or if he just wants to show the world that he's his own man and did it all himself, but the creation of many new parts seems (to me) to be by choice. Some of it is surely out of necessity and a desire to improve on old tech. I can also attest to the fact that he is doing it right; everything does seem to be an upgrade over what we're used to. Sure, he likely has some supplier issues too. I seriously can't speculate on how much of a setback was caused by re-making standard mechs? Most of his other stuff is simply custom because the design demands it (cabinet included).
3) the robot
There were always robots in theme but I was also surprised to see Robbie and I'd suspect that, like Mars Attacks, no licensing agreements exist to use him.
That being said, there have been umpteen versions of the art package and the team working on it seem like they turn stuff around pretty fast. I expect that some of what we are seeing is still a WIP and, definitely in light of these latest concerns, may change. John has probably just been too busy creating 'new pinball' to worry about these details. But again, that's just conjecture on my part.
Maybe if he'd answer direct questions we'd all have a better idea 
Hopefully that puts a couple of these smaller issues into perspective for those seeing these things for the first time.
My biggest fear is that we have all been collective "patrons of the arts" in a sense.
I have never once had any impression that JPOP was running a proper business. He is the creator, engineer, artist and customer support... such as it is.
I am myself a designer and I still understand the importance of things such as customer service and proper book keeping. I could never create the work I do without them.
Quoted from jayhawkai:Have you guys seen playfield layouts for MG and RAZA at least?
blurred ones, with certain sections unblurred.
Quoted from Drano:My biggest fear is that we have all been collective "patrons of the arts" in a sense.
I have never once had any impression that JPOP was running a proper business. He is the creator, engineer, artist and customer support... such as it is.
I am myself a designer and I still understand the importance of things such as customer service and proper book keeping. I could never create the work I do without them.
That sums it up right there as I've been saying. I run a business, I rely on others to do my marketing and creative work.
If you are like me, it's been LONG ENOUGH, its time for some definitive answers.
I'll say it again, he used a "production timeline" in our original packets to sell us. I want an update and schedule that he holds himself to. Period.
Who's doing the code, how are they getting built, and after all of this time, where is the $$$ coming from. Don't like it, I don't care, send me a check. I don't need a pin that bad.
A great experience is turning into total frustration. Expo set it all off and was the straw that broke my back. I'm now in on TBL, out on TH (and getting a refund check, imagine that) and on the fence with TWD. Also love Alien.
How about that, with ALIEN, they actually have a production schedule! How did that happen?
Well if you click on their webpage you can count 13 employees, I'm sure one of those is a bookkeeper.
As the saying goes, its time to shit or get off the pot. No more eggshell nonsense. NO EXCUSES.
I love the guy and what he's done and is capable of doing but enough is enough.
The whole idea of the NDA at this point is a JOKE, take a look around, other guys are building pins without worrying about what kind of IP he has or doesn't have!
I'll have more comments tomorrow. I just don't think it does any good on the blog, especially if he will control the comments.
If you don't agree with me then feel free to publicly denounce me!
Did I miss something?
This thread has exploded.
Looks like the RAZA and MG owners who have been patient as hell are finally getting fed up given the joke of a showing by JPop at Expo. He sure seemed to be proud of those empty RAZA cabinets though!
A lot of this is a real disaster, and some of it I am really having a hard time comprehending. Seriously, some of the original MG owners weren't even aware of the fact that JPop is increasing the production number on that pin?! That's completely inexcusable.
Then the RAZA artwork. WTF? Is it a zombie pin, or an Alien pin? Or a robot pin? Or a Godzilla pin? How can the main focal point on the backglass be an alien, not a zombie?
I seriously hope that you guys that are in on this have a hell of a lot more information than those of us who aren't in have. Because from the outside, things don't look good.
Those empty cabinets at Expo are a perfect metaphor.
Quoted from kvan99:The martian in a suit has been around since the atomic age. I doubt if there is any copyrights on file for it. Bring on the Pinside lawyers....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mars_Attacks
Created in 1962 by Topps, you can even see it on your image. They're still actively doing things with it, so yeah, I'm pretty sure they're protecting it. You might be able to do some small art projects with something, like my under the radar translite stuff, but selling $10k pinball machines is going to attract more attention.
Quoted from iceman44:That sums it up right there as I've been saying. I run a business, I rely on others to do my marketing and creative work.
If you are like me, it's been LONG ENOUGH, its time for some definitive answers.
I'll say it again, he used a "production timeline" in our original packets to sell us. I want an update and schedule that he holds himself to. Period.
Who's doing the code, how are they getting built, and after all of this time, where is the $$$ coming from. Don't like it, I don't care, send me a check. I don't need a pin that bad.
A great experience is turning into total frustration. Expo set it all off and was the straw that broke my back. I'm now in on TBL, out on TH (and getting a refund check, imagine that) and on the fence with TWD. Also love Alien.
How about that, with ALIEN, they actually have a production schedule! How did that happen?
Well if you click on their webpage you can count 13 employees, I'm sure one of those is a bookkeeper.
As the saying goes, its time to shit or get off the pot. No more eggshell nonsense. NO EXCUSES.
I love the guy and what he's done and is capable of doing but enough is enough.
The whole idea of the NDA at this point is a JOKE, take a look around, other guys are building pins without worrying about what kind of IP he has or doesn't have!
I'll have more comments tomorrow. I just don't think it does any good on the blog, especially if he will control the comments.
If you don't agree with me then feel free to publicly denounce me!
Great post, coming from an ardent JPop supporter who has shown a great deal of patience and has been very optimistic about these projects.
Too many other great options coming up to put up with this.
Quoted from jayhawkai:Have you guys seen playfield layouts for MG and RAZA at least?
I found these pictures today. I don't know if they were ever posted before, so excuse me if they are old news. The resolution stinks because they were enlarged from much smaller pics. They both seem to be the same playfield.
RAZA-playfield.jpg
RAZA-playfield-B&W.jpgQuoted from iceman44:I just don't think it does any good on the blog, especially if he will control the comments.
If you don't agree with me then feel free to publicly denounce me!
I totally agree with you except on one point. I think the place it matters the most is on the blog. That's where John is most likely to see it and realize it's time to change course and deliver us some answers.
It feels like those boutiques with the earliest head start did the least to capitalize on it.
Thanks for posting those pics.
Quoted from ChrisVW:blurred ones, with certain sections unblurred.
Wow, seriously? I thought you guys with magic NDA access would at least see everything. All this time I've been assured that shit is real, and wait until I see it, etc etc, and you're not even seeing full photos?
Quoted from RobT:A lot of this is a real disaster, and some of it I am really having a hard time comprehending. Seriously, some of the original MG owners weren't even aware of the fact that JPop is increasing the production number on that pin?! That's completely inexcusable.
Then the RAZA artwork. WTF? Is it a zombie pin, or an Alien pin? Or a robot pin? Or a Godzilla pin? How can the main focal point on the backglass be an alien, not a zombie?
Well its time to go ahead and pull the scab off!
What he said leading up to Expo and then what he brought is actually beyond belief. What's even further beyond belief are some of the expo comments he has posted on the blog discussing his huge success.
Two empty cabs and all he can talk about is how perfect his cabs are and the others are garbage.
What happened at Expo overall is a game changer, pinball changing. Too many other great projects going on, people actually getting shit done, to put up with non stop EXCUSES.
Again, 39 months on MG and 32 months on RAZA, WTF! Anybody with any business brain at all knows nobody can double the production time and maintain that CASH BURN and actually survive.
At this point, after Expo, its just turning into a nightmare, I really don't give a shit anymore. Like Hank, I'll take the pin or a check. No more walking on eggshell BS.
Quoted from iceman44:I'll say it again, he used a "production timeline" in our original packets to sell us. I want an update and schedule that he holds himself to. Period.
Who's doing the code, how are they getting built, and after all of this time, where is the $$$ coming from. Don't like it, I don't care, send me a check. I don't need a pin that bad.
A great experience is turning into total frustration.
Wow, you really made a 180 here. You have always been the guy defending JPop, and posting to the tune of "When it gets done it gets done. I have no worry about the timeline. " Interesting how the Expo really changed everything.
I was there and I played TWD, WOL, TBL, LL, etc. They were all amazing and drumming up a lot of excitement. (TBL is a work of art...) I went there hoping one of JPop's games would be finished. I think he really missed the boat this time. If he is not done by Expo next year, I think that he will literally be sunk.
Quoted from Aurich:Wow, seriously? I thought you guys with magic NDA access would at least see everything. All this time I've been assured that shit is real, and wait until I see it, etc etc, and you're not even seeing full photos?
No, when he does show photos they are very strategically positioned photos. Like of a 4-8" section of the slings for example. Basically if you want to see anything you have to buy a plane ticket to Chicago.
Quoted from woodworker:Wow, you really made a 180 here. You have always been the guy defending JPop, and posting to the tune of "When it gets done it gets done. I have no worry about the timeline. " Interesting how the Expo really changed everything.
I was there and I played TWD, WOL, TBL, LL, etc. They were all amazing and drumming up a lot of excitement. (TBL is a work of art...) I went there hoping one of JPop's games would be finished. I think he really missed the boat this time. If he is not done by Expo next year, I think that he will literally be sunk.
Honestly, my patience meter just ran out. You said it, the TBL is a "work of art".
Then we get the whole "translite fiasco". And the "Empty cab gate"
I put money down on TBL today. It's not about the $$$, its about the excitement of being part of something with your friends here and being able to enjoy and discuss the whole thing. That is totally gone now with RAZA and he doesn't get it.
All of my optimism went down the tubes after Expo and then reading what John had to post on the blog.
And like Rob said, while i think the versions of RAZA i have seen look great, its become a cartoon Alien game more so than any zombie related theme.
Nobody has a choice now, we are all stuck, like it or not. I do feel like he won't destroy his 33 year pinball history and ruin his life and reputation by not putting these pins out at some point.
Let me just say this, having a MASSIVE EGO can be a good thing, you gotta believe your great, but when it completely clouds your sense of self awareness to the point where you have no idea what is happening around you, it's NOT a good thing.
Quoted from ChrisVW:Alright...sending my opus on the blog now. Please everyone else do the same if you haven't already.
Bravo! Thanks for your post on the blog.
Villejuif
Quoted from iceman44:I put money down on TBL today.
We need you for WOOLY too! Don't stop here! 
Jokes aside, I have been waiting for Nemo for 30 months now. I know how it feels. Got a firm delivery date by mail this week end: before November 30.
Quoted from Concretehardt:This post is directed twards RAZA owners... Drano just posted a pretty strong post on the Blog and I have made a few posts as well. At this point as owners I think the only way we can get anywhere is to stop beating around the bush with John and just post how we really feel..... So if your an owner get on the blog and politely say your peace. That way 3 or 4 owners don't have to do all the heavy lifting and John is more likely to listen.
Thanks!
I have raised these same issues on the RAZA blog in the past and only a few owners will stick their necks out, or say anything at all of these concerns.
The problem I find is that Jpop takes these reasonable questions the wrong way, gets upset and it ends up turning into some kind of love fest with owners praising him instead of pressing for answers and the concerns are forgotten about, at least for a while...
Figured these types of questions must be taboo, the nerve of us requesting such details.
I see the blog really lit up today.. I will try to help again.
Damn. Well I've mocked the project a little before, because the whole secrecy thing just struck me as ridiculous, but I'm sorry that everyone who put money and faith into it is getting screwed over.
I don't honestly expect the games to ever ship, I'm sorry to say, but I hope I'm wrong.
I know people love Jpop, but you've gotta have someone with business savvy running the show, or at least an equal partner.
The reason I bought into TBL is that Dutch Pinball convinced me that they both have the vision, and passion, and dedication to pinball, but also the business smarts and ability to Get Shit Done™. You gotta have the last two parts too. Making pinballs is a big ass complicated endeavor. Jpop doesn't have the Williams machine to do things for him anymore. Who's handling things beyond just the vision of the game?
Quoted from slapshot:I have raised these same issues on the RAZA blog in the past and only a few owners will stick their necks out, or say anything at all of these concerns.
The problem I find is that Jpop takes these reasonable questions the wrong way, gets upset and it ends up turning into some kind of love fest with owners praising him instead of pressing for answers and the concerns are forgotten about, at least for a while...
Figured these types of questions must be taboo, the nerve of us requesting such details.
I see the blog really lit up today.. I will try to help again.
The love fest is over! I will back any owner voicing concerns on the blog.... That is a promise!
Quoted from Concretehardt:The love fest is over! I will back any owner voicing concerns on the blog.... That is a promise!
Nope...love fest is over at TBL threads! Not over, just moved! LOL!!
Quoted from Concretehardt:The love fest is over! I will back any owner voicing concerns on the blog.... That is a promise!
Same here. 100%
MG owners should be upset that he is spending time on RAZA. Both MG and RAZA owners should be upset he is spending time on AIW. What will be next year's pre-order? It will be exciting, people will willingly put money down, but he has obviously lost focus on delivering 1 single game: his first.
Quoted from iceman44:Just saw your post, followed up with another one of mine on the blog!
Damn....!
I sugar coated it, but my hats off to you for being blunt!
Wow. I've read this thread from the beginning (I read way too much of pinside). I don't think I've even posted in it (once maybe). I was amazed at the amount of patience that was being shown. You are fully in the right to start making some demands. The revolution appears to have begun. I hope it works out.
Quoted from sammiesguys:Wow. I've read this thread from the beginning (I read way too much of pinside). I don't think I've even posted in it (once maybe). I was amazed at the amount of patience that was being shown. You are fully in the right to start making some demands. The revolution appears to have begun. I hope it works out.
Agreed, but honestly I hope this doesn't come across as a mob, but as an intervention.
Quoted from Aurich:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mars_Attacks
Created in 1962 by Topps, you can even see it on your image. They're still actively doing things with it, so yeah, I'm pretty sure they're protecting it. You might be able to do some small art projects with something, like my under the radar translite stuff, but selling $10k pinball machines is going to attract more attention.
Yep, it' over 50 years ago...how long does the CR last?
Quoted from ChrisVW:Agreed, but honestly I hope this doesn't come across as a mob, but as an intervention.
I don't know what you posted on the blog, but it doesn't feel like a mob on here. It feels like a bunch of people who are rightly frustrated and have decided to finally voice their opinion (just all at once).
Quoted from Aurich:I don't honestly expect the games to ever ship, I'm sorry to say, but I hope I'm wrong.
The pins will get done, he won't ruin his 33 yr reputation in pinball and massive Ego by not delivering.
At this point, I don't really even give a shit, I'm excited about TBL, Alien and maybe TWD, the true zombie pin.
Yeah Chris, mob, intervention, I don't know what it is, just complete and utter frustration on our end.
I've said it from day one, if I lose my money it was a risk worth taking. Onward and upward.
My guess, and I hope not, is that John will first act like a petulant child and not respond at all.
Quoted from iceman44:The pins will get done, he won't ruin his 33 yr reputation in pinball and massive Ego by not delivering.
At this point, I don't really even give a shit, I'm excited about TBL, Alien and maybe TWD, the true zombie pin.
Yeah Chris, mob, intervention, I don't know what it is, just complete and utter frustration on our end.
I've said it from day one, if I lose my money it was a risk worth taking. Onward and upward.
My guess, and I hope not, is that John will first act like a petulant child and not respond at all.
I hope you are wrong Ice, but I fear you are right. I have serious doubts if this will be addressed.
Yes...this is just extreme frustration.
Quoted from ChrisVW:Who is Jim? I have seen his posts on the blog many times and always love his bluntness.
Is that you gprotein?
No, I wish. But I'm just as disappointed as you all are. The white wood should have been shown at the expo at the very least.
Quoted from slapshot:that's me ChrisVW.
Ah ok. Well it's nice to finally meet you. I always enjoy reading your posts as you usually cut through the bs and just say what everyone who doesn't post is thinking.
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