http://www.textem.net

Use this to hide your IP address:
http://hideme.be

True, but John posted his number on his site for business/customers. People on pinside are posting his number with bad intentions so it comes across as "threatening" even though they're saying "oh, I just want to ask him a question". Sh** hit's the fan 9/10 times when someone owes you money and you see them face-to-face. I think the mod's are 100% right taking down information given the type of situation he's in now. You might be normal, but the pinsider above your post your below might be a psychopath and do something bad with that information that was provided here. If the psychopath gets it off of John's website then it's John problem. I can just see on the news, "Crazy Pinside member goes to famous ex-Williams pinball creator JPOP and puts him in the hospital". I'll tell you now, if I posted info on the forum and that happened the next day I'd go into hiding.

Anyone that posts personal information on this site given the situation needs to check their moral compass. It's not only creepy/stalker-like but damn man, people carry guns in the states like it's nothing. Pretty sure John has a nice sawed off shotgun lying next to his Magic Girl prototype .

Violence is not the way.

I agree, that's his business number posted on the website.

No business can function by not responding to their customers. If we've entered that stage now, then there is no business here anymore.

I think there's a difference between:

"Hello kind sir, can I have the number to Stern's customer support? I have a question about a magnet that's failing in my TWD"

as opposed to:

"Yo dawg, give me JPOP motha f***** numba. B**** owe me money"

LOL

I get that those with a horse in this race are pissed. What I don't get is this kind of thing (taking Money, and producing nothing, or taking forever, or both) has been going on ever since I got into this hobby.

Tossing thousands of $$$$ around hoping for something that may or may not be?

This is just like those Elio cars. I've been hearing about those things for years, people are still buying into them. I have yet to see a production model produced.

Good luck to all those who tied up funds they wish they currently had. If MG or RAZA come to fruition great! You'll have a pin you're to afraid to play because it's so rare and valuable.

Do they answer their phone?

People sometimes compare the jpop delays with WOZ, but Jack was always out there and available, taking phone calls, Jen was in the office taking phone calls, they were showing their prototype. They had a different answer for production start every day, but at least they answered. As far as I know anyone with a deposit was also able to get out of it.

Not taking calls, not responding to texts, not returning emails, not treating customers as valued, not managing a crisis.... not going to survive.

I had my cell phone number accidentally show up for a split second on a device in an episode of my show. It was a very annoying few weeks afterwards.

I've never understood people that insist on dialing every number they see on TV. Damn people are strange. That said Ben, you know you're a sexy hunk of pinball celebrity worthy of stalking. You shouldn't be surprised.

I hope you enjoyed the pics I sent you. *wink* *wink*

I don't know how harassing JPOP will somehow help. Yeah, it might feel okay to blow off steam but there is no way I would sacrifice the moral high ground for that.

He is currently clearly the jerk in the situation; don't make it confusing by being a jerk too

That being said I would understand the kid gloves coming off to try to get resolution. People stating "this is no Skit B" or "he just needs more time" or "maybe someday" all COULD be right. But all logic points to a much less positive outcome based on available information.

SkitB got away with what they got away with for so long because people without a horse in the race by and large ignored it and people involved generally did not ask the tough questions as the answers can hurt.

It honestly speaks to how generally positive Pinside is that so many red flags can be present for so long without getting caught.

Well, Pinside loves its drama so here we go. I've been quiet about this but no more.

Let’s begin with Iceman posting Jpop’s phone number on Pinside. The owners already have this number and it’s available on his web page. So what was his purpose? In my opinion he only wanted to incite the crowd. He wants people with no financial interest in this project harassing Jpop. Flood him with text messages was an immediate suggestion posted here from an outsider. And with a throw down phone. This boggles my mind.

For what purpose, why is Iceman doing this? Because Jpop cut him off and his ego is hurt. He’s acting immature and this is nothing but spite.

How do you guys feel being manipulated by this man to do his bidding? Are you incapable of independent thought?

Now we come to why Jpop cut him off and if you go back in this thread you can find my quote where I predicted he’d fail. According to Jpop, Iceman was phoning him intoxicated. Repeatedly calling and when not getting through leaving inebriated voice messages. Things eroded quickly as you can imagine.

So what have I done behind the scenes while Iceman has been grandstanding here on Pinside?

I flew to Chicago a month ago and met with Jpop face to face as representative of the owners group. This was a very uncomfortable meeting for Jpop I promise you. I don’t yell but I’m direct and forceful. Last week I file a complaint with the Illinois Attorney General. This past Tuesday Jpop was served with my demand letter via courier, signature required.

**Note to Jpop. I hope you're reading this cuz I'm just getting started.

Iceman has only made phone calls and then brag on Pinside his version of events.
There’s more I could reveal but I think you have the gist of things.

It’s fine with me if you guys want to follow him and believe him to be a hero. But you might want to look closely at who your leader is.

Edit/Add Post 6389 below:

I've had someone tell me he doesn't even respond to certified letters, just throws them in the trash. Unless it's court ordered something, I believe John feels like its a free world he doesn't need to respond.

I hope I'm wrong, but it doesn't look good for this project.

I'm not sure how the law treats 'contracted to build something', if he tries and fails, he can say he was ok before people started pestering him etc..

My feeling is the design and quality he is aiming for is too high in relation to the sales volume. Jjp and PPS, both had 1000++ sales numbers leading to multi-Million dollar budgets to hire people and get things done. Customer service, etc.. Also Jjp and PPS had the ability and foresight to let people out of their contract when they over ran their time schedule.

I had my doubts initially but had stars in my eyes initially, blinded by the light. But let's just look at MG with a $400k budget if he sold 25 units. How could that possibly fly when the BOM is obviously much higher than a Stern LE for example.

The BOM was doable, but only if he had stuck with OTS (off the shelf) parts and minimized the custom parts to cabinet, playfield, plastics, and ramps.

Obviously that didn't happen!

I know this is serious stuff for those with money in it.

Not trying to make light of it,but the calling while high is,well,hysterical.

That could be but that's out of my control. Establishing a paper trail and documenting everything is what matters at this point.

My point, he was redesigning things like hinges and all lights and every thing was being examined and improved on like he was building the Space Shuttle. He was acting like money was no object and only the best was good enough.

Early on I asked how about Fiber optic for ramp lights they're easy and cheap relativity. No that's been done before he said, he was going to do glass filled neon lights for ramp lights. Can you imagine how costly and difficult that would be as opposed to using a tried and simple method like fiber optic or surface mounted LED lights, not to mention the replacement or maintaince cost of neon light tubes.

Cool, but do you not see that is an enormous cost vs a fiber optic light wire?

***

I missed that, if Ice was intoxicated, that's not cool. But I'm not sure if I believe that to be the case. Maybe I'm wrong or some part of the story is being told by John in a way that deflects blame from himself which is his MO.

It seems a convenient explanation to never talk to Ice again because he left some drunk dialing messages. So, even though he has Ice's money he's never going to return a text or call him back at his office or something the next day.

I'd have to also further guess, and Ice can confirm this, but the "repeated" calls was because John wasn't answering in the first place.

In my own business, I will fire a problem customer, but that is ALWAYS with handing them their money back, apologizing that this just isn't going to work out and lets part friends.

Even the Soup Nazi gave George Constanza his money back before kicking him out.

anigif_enhanced-buzz-20018-1424722978-11.gif

Hell, come to think of it, didn't Rick at PPS "fire" some of the MMR buyers for being a pain in his ass? He cancelled their order and gave them their money back and refused to sell to them.

You can't just keep the money and decide not to talk to that person again.

It was only a matter of time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law

Is there a Law for Seinfeld references? This one doesn't quite apply.

Wut?

Yeah, I know it's the soup nazi and not real nazis, but I thought it was funny.

Godwin's Law says "As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches 1"

Haha, come on now, even Ice will have to cop to going on some drunk forum rants.

You forgot the third "make my letter sound official" trick - notarizing it!

I want to officially start Nibble's Law, which would state "As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of posts only composed of pictures involving great 'T an A' approaches 1"

That's a law I can get behind.

I went ahead and emailed my resume, credentials, a nice one-page introduction and additional information to Jpop. I've heard what you all have to say, but I am the best programmer that I know. If Jpop decides to let me work with him on the project, I will drive this to completion I guarantee it. The unknowns that could cause this relationship to fail:
1) He requires a legal relationship. I have no interest in forming any documented relationship with him. I just IPO'd, my lawyers would shit on my face if I even thought about a formal relationship with him.
2) He doesn't decide to open up. I'm not asking for open source, I'm asking for him to provide me with what he has so I can build upon whatever he has...I don't care what but I need to actually get what he has to start. He might just keep the door closed, or he might try to trickle some stuff out to me to get a few piecemeal development features implemented. I run companies, I don't fuck around. If he fucks with me it's over.
3) He doesn't understand LOE estimates, timelines, project schedules, testing, development and productization, but wants to own those aspects of the development process. He should be owning features, IP, integration, and the theme. If he tries to own the entire process it will fail, because you can't wear that many hats unless you've done it a lot, and even then it sucks. If he doesn't realize that it sucks to be where he is he won't delegate anything and I'll have to leave the project.

I truly wish that the Jpop ship can be righted and sending my resume and introducing myself to him is the least I can do for you all and him. Customers who want a great product, and an "inventor" who has a vision are a recipe for success, and that's why people are vested in the project. Unfortunately, your vestment in the project doesn't allow you to force me into the door and let me help, but I'd encourage you all to push Jpop to let me help. Tossing him a lifeline and a badass programmer are things a struggling startup shouldn't scoff at, but who knows...maybe it's his first startup...

Is this supposed to be a boy or a girl?

Good Luck.

We all wish you luck. I think the hope is gone that anyone can do this, this is not a question of your ability rather a question of the targets receptiveness.

^But this is apparently the problem. This IS why it has likely already failed. I doubt JPop will be so open about what money is left at this point and I see no way he gives up control of so many aspects of this project.

I'm sure you're a great programmer, but this project certainly appears to be well beyond just needing a first class programmer to save it. Although very brave of you to insert yourself into such a heated situation that may very well turn into something criminal.

It sounds like you're headed into this with your eyes (mostly) open, which is key. Someone I greatly respect once told me, "you're not getting robbed if someone is trying to steal something you're giving away for free." That quote doesn't work perfectly here, but I think the gist applies.

I don't know that letting the pinside masses know about this is necessarily the best idea for any number of reasons (this thread is a pretty volatile place that's rarely supportive), but I wish you the best of luck.

Best laugh I have had in days. Isn't that what Iceman was saying just a few weeks ago.

Amazing how many times we hear someone with that attitude, start down the road with jpop and then quickly retreat, since basically all of those unknowns, are known. Based on past history, he will want an NDA that will be incredibly restrictive. He is incredibly protective of all he does (or thinks about doing), and does not share or play well with others. He has no clue or desire to understand timelines and still wants to remain in total control, and only share the info he feels is necessary. Nothing is ever exactly the way he wants it, so therefore nothing every gets totally complete. He will pretty much ignore any input on what he needs to be doing differently.

I'm sure he will be happy to work with you, he will promise you the moon and the stars, and then, well, you will likely join the large club of those who have done work for him in the past who have walked away for all of the above reasons.

Who knows, maybe you will be the guy to finally change all that, but as a betting man, I'd put my money on that not being the case.

Best of luck!

image.jpg

I wish you the best, for all the owners.

If things don't work out, you are more than welcome to join us for drinks at the JPOP'd Happy Hour at Expo in the fall.

Aaron
FAST Pinball

so are you reserving the large large ballroom for that?

1. He will. He requires everyone to sign an NDA, no matter how small of involvement. Someone writing the backbone of what runs the machine, I guarantee it
2. That's implying he can actually extract the existing code, or actually has a ruleset written down and not floating in his head
3. This has already been proven. His schedules have slid for more than 2 years. LOE estimate? You're asking someone who says innovation takes time (but not defined time), it'll be done when it's done.

If he is going to rip people off , he should. No one to blame for that but himself.

I'm withdrawing my official complaint against Jpop and will excitedly continue on with Magic Girl and RAZA.

I cannot and will not explain further. No private emails please.

Crap like this sounds more like skitB than ever before….

Did he offer you 10% of the company?

Sexual favors are more likely.

But would actually be worth even less!!!

Seems anyone who visits Jpop gets mesmerized by what they see, or get hypnotized by jpop's excitement and enthusiasm or maybe he serves them some type of koolaid.

Regardless, I find that you making the first post which was ripping on others and telling folks to be careful of who they follow, and talking big of how you are going after jpop, and then posting something along the lines of "I'm 100% in and don't ask why", as being flippant and disingenuous.

IMO, it would have been better if you just left the thread then make a post like that.

I hope you're at least explaining things to the private owners group on FB.

He is

Can Ice at least give you a call tonight on his way back from the bar to discuss?

Just to add to other's comments, this is precisely the kind of secretive BS that gets folks to feel like they're missing out on something and foolishly risking their money. Please look up the definition of "shill". You are playing the role to a tee.

Could you elaborate here for the sake of us actual stakeholders who are not subscribed to the FB page?