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(Topic ID: 92436)

John Popadiuk update thread……MAGIC GIRL, RAZA, AIW…..


By iceman44

6 years ago



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There are 24338 posts in this topic. You are on page 52 of 487.
#2551 5 years ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

Really sad/bummed to hear you say this Ben. More player interaction is always good and IMHO if you are thinking as upper flippers ONLY for the 1-2 shots they are mainly used for then you are missing the beauty of upper/extra flippers. They add a whole additional dynamic to a game for redirecting ball movement, richocheting to other shots or even using them as a new path (i.e. Stern ST under the flipper shot). More flippers can add a whole new level of fun player interaction to a game. The more I can interact with the ball, the better.

Agreed. Tron wouldn't be tron without that third flipper. Quora shot is so satisfying/frustrating.

#2552 5 years ago

A third flipper can completely change the way a game plays. 3 flippers existing before solid state, but lawlor changed the game by making specific things to hit from that 3rd flipper that is impossible or dam hard to reach by the lower flippers. Aiming for a side shot is much more difficult than vertical because you have to adjust for not only what gravity is going to do to the ball (aim higher up), but the speed of the ball as it passes by.

WOOLY is a bit too many with 6 flippers. Rebuilding would be a nightmare.

#2553 5 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

To be fair there's a shot in the video (posted in this thread too) showing the wavy ramp with what looks like a real vacuum-formed ramp, not just hot glued foamcore.

I knoow what you are talking about, and I disagree. I wasn't even referring to the foamcore ramps, I was referring to the plastic ramps. To me, these look like strips of thin flexible plastic hot-glued together to make the basic shape, not a sturdy vacuum-formed ramp.

Totally not vacuum-formed

Same with the instagrammed straight ramps. Thin strips of plastic hotglued together for concept testing.

Also not vacuum-formed

I mean, it's possible that I am wrong, and that he's made vaccum-formed ramps in a way that has messy, right angle joints and looks really flimsy, but If I had to play around with ramps and needed to see how art would look through them, that's the way I would do it. Cut thin strips of clear plastic and hot glue them together while I work on the concept.

Everything about what we have seen with regards to the upper playfield seems very very unfinished.

#2554 5 years ago
Quoted from fosaisu:

Maybe this is common knowledge, but who is he "kept" by? If he's being supported by a wealthy spouse that would certainly change the financial dynamics of his projects.

Hope she signed up for a MG & RAZA. Then we know she won't let this slide too far.

#2555 5 years ago
Quoted from Sjsilver:

I knoow what you are talking about, and I disagree. I wasn't even referring to the foamcore ramps, I was referring to the plastic ramps. To me, these look like strips of thin flexible plastic hot-glued together to make the basic shape, not a sturdy vacuum-formed ramp.

Ah yeah, could be I guess. The plastic looks pretty thick though, I don't think that's really gonna be flexible to do that. It's hard to tell from that blurry shot what's really going on though. The straight ramps I would totally buy are done that way.

#2556 5 years ago

~JPOP 4 LIFE~

... The Real Pinball Wizard...

#2557 5 years ago
Quoted from Strange:

~JPOP 4 LIFE~
... The Real Pinball Wizard...

Don't pay attention to the man behind the curtain

#2558 5 years ago

Why make 3 MGs and not tour 'em around? Instead why tour an empty cabinet, and a KISS prototype(with pf) that wasn't officially in the works?

#2559 5 years ago
Quoted from s1500:

Why make 3 MGs and not tour 'em around? Instead why tour an empty cabinet, and a KISS prototype(with pf) that wasn't officially in the works?

Paranoia.

#2560 5 years ago
Quoted from s1500:

Why make 3 MGs and not tour 'em around? Instead why tour an empty cabinet, and a KISS prototype(with pf) that wasn't officially in the works?

Maybe he had a big ole helping of "crazy mofo".

crazy.jpg
QSS

#2561 5 years ago
Quoted from QuickSilverShelby:

Maybe he had a big ole helping of "crazy mofo".

Uhhhh...

4sure.jpg

#2562 5 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Ah yeah, could be I guess. The plastic looks pretty thick though, I don't think that's really gonna be flexible to do that. It's hard to tell from that blurry shot what's really going on though. The straight ramps I would totally buy are done that way.

If you watch that video segment, you can see the messy glued joints on that ramp. You can also see how easily it flexes when he twists it. I think it looks thicker than it is because of the depth of field blur.

Here, I made a gif so you don't have to search for it again.

http://i.imgur.com/wh7rz8q.gifv

So as of a month ago, all of the upper playfield stuff was still in the Concept design stage.

#2563 5 years ago

after seeing this, I am looking forward to the art on RAZA, even though I am not getting one.

RAZA art-356.JPG

Not sure why it is rotating the photo. On my computer it is right side up. Sorry.

Chris

#2564 5 years ago

Once the ramp design is finalized it'll take a couple of weeks (Jpop time) to create a mold and vac new ones. The ramps are the least of my worries about this project.

#2565 5 years ago
Quoted from ChrisVW:

Once the ramp design is finalized it'll take a couple of weeks (Jpop time) to create a mold and vac new ones. The ramps are the least of my worries about this project.

Yeah if it were just the ramps, I think it would be silly to fixate on that one detail. But I point to the ramps because I feel they are indicative of the state of so much more of that machine. (also because people were mistakingly identifying the ramps as a problem that has been solved thanks to that 2 second clip in the video.)

Almost everything in the upper playfield section looks like it is in that same concept stage, i.e. one step past the foamcore stage using hot-glued plastic strips so he can see through it. My point is, if it took him 4 years to get to this point, how long will it take to get to an honest to god pre-production machine, and how much money will be left over at that point to start the manufacturing process or finish the other projects?

I could totally be wrong and he could have masterfully hidden his true progress from adobe (there was a lot of misdirection with his older foamcore models). But I found little in that video to be encouraging, except the fact that he has somehow managed to keep a very talented artist involved in the project for over 4 years and that he has tinkered with some neat ideas. Nothing in that video makes me think he is anywhere close to finishing the games and shipping them.

And from a development standpoint, having a finalized pre-production cabinet and playfield is only part of the story, as programming is the other half the game. I look at how long it has taken JJP to finish the WOZ code, and how even simpler projects like BOP 2.0 have taken forever, and I don't think that JPOP is gonna be the one to show them how to get the code done more quickly.

Also, with a full resolution monitor you now have to engage talented animators as well. I make my living as an animator and it is *not* cheap nor fast. He could easily show dynamite animations in the same way he has shown artwork and that would help show current and future customers that progress is happening. The fact that we have seen nothing in that regard makes me wonder if it has been engaged at all.

I would be really happy for you guys if JPOP started communicating clearly about the state of the project and proved me wrong. But watching the progress of this "On-the-rug" reveal, I don't think that is gonna happen.

#2566 5 years ago

Finally getting to see the video since it wasn't working at work. The art is impressive indeed. The stage I would hope MG to be at, not so much. The first one is always the longest, so who knows.

AIW looks pretty sweet from the glimpses there are. MG is too CV for me, not enough to decide on RAZA's direction yet, but AIW would be pretty sweet if the gameplay was as appealing as the art. Looking forward to seeing more of that one trickle out.

#2567 5 years ago
Quoted from Sjsilver:

If you watch that video segment, you can see the messy glued joints on that ramp. You can also see how easily it flexes when he twists it. I think it looks thicker than it is because of the depth of field blur.

Here, I made a gif so you don't have to search for it again.

Aw yeah, totally see them now, I agree, that's not vacuum formed. Thanks for the gif, nothing like looping a short segment to let you examine it!

#2568 5 years ago

On a positive note (for me, though not my wallet) watching Zombie Yeti work pushed me over the edge and I'm researching Cintiqs more seriously. I'd been thinking of getting one for a while, I'd like to do more digital drawing, this was just the final straw.

Betting I'll ship something I do with it before Jpop does!

#2569 5 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

On a positive note (for me, though not my wallet) watching Zombie Yeti work pushed me over the edge and I'm researching Cintiqs more seriously. I'd been thinking of getting one for a while, I'd like to do more digital drawing, this was just the final straw.
Betting I'll ship something I do with it before Jpop does!

So it sounds like the Adobe video was effective then .

#2570 5 years ago
Quoted from Sjsilver:

My point is, if it took him 4 years to get to this point, how long will it take to get to an honest to god pre-production machine, and how much money will be left over at that point to start the manufacturing process or finish the other projects?

Really good summary Sjsilver.

This is the big elephant in the room that John simply won't address and is at the core of all of our frustrations with him.

Ok, here we are, this is where we are at, now tell us HOW we are going to get to a "finished product" ready to be built and WHEN will they all be delivered.

Financially, it just simply can't take another 2 years even to get MG complete and out the door. Or RAZA for that matter.

We have gotten down to the "lick log", status quo and operating as usual won't be good enough in the near term future, for him or for us.

We need timelines, like he promised us from the "production manager" he hired, if he's still there, and someone to make him to stick to those timelines.

Without transparency, disclosure and some guarantees, I don't see how he raises the $$$ to keep funding these projects.

Apparently people are getting money requests on RAZA and AIW, I'm not, but it doesn't surprise me due to the shoddy accounting as an afterthought.

Like Bill and others have said, John is a "good man", with great passion and love for pinball. I'm afraid he is just trying to buy time while he waits for the white knight to ride in, team up, and save the day.

Obviously making a pinball machine is a complete "bitch". He's gotta get more help, yet how do you get more help without funds?

Regardless, a new way forward with a vision shared with everybody has got to be forthcoming soon, very soon.

#2571 5 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Without transparency, disclosure and some guarantees, I don't see how he raises the $$$ to keep funding these projects.

People don't require a NDA when transparency is their goal. I know it's easy to say now, and it is, but that should have been a mild warning. John is a great designer and artist. But it's obvious he doesn't know a lot about manufacturing. IMO he seems to have a very hard time staying focused on one thing which doubles the risk on this. When he showed that KISS foam proto it lowered my guess on probability of the machines being made.

#2572 5 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Like Bill and others have said, John is a "good man", with great passion and love for pinball.

I think we're literally living this proverb : "The road to hell is paved with good intentions".

Quoted from iceman44:

I'm afraid he is just trying to buy time while he waits for the white knight to ride in, team up, and save the day.

I've said it before, but he is already financed - BY US. This project has been 100% crowd funded. Where is the upside for an investor? Machines have been sold, and mostly paid for. You would bring an investor in at the BEGINNING to get the project to market. Not at the end. Only way an investor would come in at this point is if the limited nature of the pins are thrown out the window, because otherwise what is there for an investor?

#2573 5 years ago
Quoted from chessiv:

When he showed that KISS foam proto it lowered my guess on probability of the machines being made.

That wouldn't bother me. Vendors claiming bills aren't getting paid would. (I'm pretty sure that's what I saw in here - correct me if I'm wrong and I'll delete.)

#2574 5 years ago
Quoted from frolic:

So it sounds like the Adobe video was effective then .

Haha, yeah, if you think about it I was really their target market, not pinball people. Of course joke's on them, because they won't see a dime of the Wacom money I spend, and I have no real desire to upgrade to the stupid subscription cloud version of Photoshop etc, I haven't found a compelling reason to over CS6.

#2575 5 years ago
Quoted from chessiv:

People don't require a NDA when transparency is their goal. I know it's easy to say now, and it is, but that should have been a mild warning. John is a great designer and artist. But it's obvious he doesn't know a lot about manufacturing. IMO he seems to have a very hard time staying focused on one thing which doubles the risk on this. When he showed that KISS foam proto it lowered my guess on probability of the machines being made.

I always viewed the NDA as more of a marketing gimmic, maybe not...did it have a forum selection clause in it just out of curiosity?

#2576 5 years ago

Software is the long pole in this tent. Unless there is a room full of programmers in India or something that we don't know about, I can't see this ending well. If this was just one game I would give it a chance, but with multiple games in the mix I can't see this ever getting past the playable proto stage without a huge influx of money. Hopefully something can eventually be shipped and people can band together to write software over the next several years.

#2577 5 years ago
Quoted from btw75:

That wouldn't bother me. Vendors claiming bills aren't getting paid would. (I'm pretty sure that's what I saw in here - correct me if I'm wrong and I'll delete.)

You are not wrong.

#2578 5 years ago
Quoted from TigerLaw:

I always viewed the NDA as more of a marketing gimmic, maybe not...did it have a forum selection clause in it just out of curiosity?

I haven't seen it.

#2579 5 years ago
Quoted from John_I:

Unless there is a room full of programmers in India or something that we don't know about, I can't see this ending well

Why would you think that? Just because Stern's code is always late even with genius programmers like lyman sheats on staff (who also work on code off hours and during holidays because they're so committed) >sarcasm<

"code is hard" - Nate Shivers

#2580 5 years ago
Quoted from frolic:

I've said it before, but he is already financed - BY US. This project has been 100% crowd funded. Where is the upside for an investor? Machines have been sold, and mostly paid for. You would bring an investor in at the BEGINNING to get the project to market. Not at the end. Only way an investor would come in at this point is if the limited nature of the pins are thrown out the window, because otherwise what is there for an investor?

Of course we all know the answer to this question, John is just figuring it out. Nobody outside of his own Jpop world thinks much of his accomplishments to date. Expo had to be quite a blow to him.

I just like talking to myself Frolic because John won't communicate! It's coming to a head very soon, there is no "white knight" coming in and the US "crowd funding" is over.

If he believes in himself, he'll have to fund the remaining part out of his pocket, prove he can actually do it, and then he might have a gold mine on his hands for the future. We can dream can't we?

I posted on the blog again, after the latest artwork reveal.

#2581 5 years ago
Quoted from TigerLaw:

I always viewed the NDA as more of a marketing gimmic, maybe not...did it have a forum selection clause in it just out of curiosity?

It's been so long since I looked at it Tiger, 3 and 1/2 years now? Anyhow, it was very weak, didn't include "future disclosures" and I don't think had a venue clause designating Chicago, which as you know makes it impossible on him!

Can't imagine him running around all over the country in 200 different jurisdictions going after people for violation of the NDA.

Plus, there is NOTHING left of it with what has been disclosed by him to the public, certainly not patents filed. It's a joke and was born out of pure ego imo.

Yes, a gimmick. One that is backfiring on him now.

#2582 5 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

John won't communicate! It's coming to a head very soon, there is no "white knight" coming in and the US "crowd funding" is over.

that's what scares the hell out of me. He's out of cash and stalling, hoping somehow more cash flows in.

#2583 5 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

It's been so long since I looked at it Tiger, 3 and 1/2 years now? Anyhow, it was very weak, didn't include "future disclosures" and I don't think had a venue clause designating Chicago, which as you know makes it impossible on him!
Can't imagine him running around all over the country in 200 different jurisdictions going after people for violation of the NDA.
Plus, there is NOTHING left of it with what has been disclosed by him to the public, certainly not patents filed. It's a joke and was born out of pure ego imo.
Yes, a gimmick. One that is backfiring on him now.

The nada would at this point be a reason for him to kick u out and keep the money..(or not have to count for where he wasted it).... But any good lawyer will say he violated his own agreement when he didn't meet deadline so the nada is bullshit anyway... But to get to all that would cost u money one way or another so the nada is a strong hold till someone breaks it

#2584 5 years ago

How many of you guys would be really angry if he announced that Magic Girl would be produced to anyone who could afford one?
Cause I can't imagine this being completed unless he opens it up to all and sells a whole lot more.
-and would likely only be able to get them sold by using an investors money, as I don't think anyone else will be sending in cash after reading all these posts.

#2585 5 years ago
Quoted from lllvjr:

The nada would at this point be a reason for him to kick u out and keep the money..(or not have to count for where he wasted it).... But any good lawyer will say he violated his own agreement when he didn't meet deadline so the nada is bullshit anyway... But to get to all that would cost u money one way or another so the nada is a strong hold till someone breaks it

Wouldn't cost me any money, I am a lawyer, and yes he has rendered his own NDA worthless.

And no he couldn't "kick me out and keep the money"

The point is the NDA would cost HIM a fortune to enforce and where is that $$$ gonna come from. No lawyer would even represent him, well I guess scumbags would lie to him and take a big retainer from him and then poof its gone.

And like Tiger was alluding to he'd have to sue me in Bexar County, Texas, as he didn't put a venue clause in his agreement (i believe) which means wherever he got it from was clueless at a basic level.

So I don't even want to hear about the NDA excuse to cover up his lack of transparency anymore.

#2586 5 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

The point is the NDA would cost HIM a fortune to enforce and where is that $$$ gonna come from.

Game 7 pre-orders.

12
#2587 5 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

So I don't even want to hear about the NDA excuse to cover up his lack of transparency anymore.

Generally speaking if you're working on something that's protected by an NDA you don't invite a press crew into your shop with cameras and sit down for an interview with them, while showing off all the secret stuff. Total show.

#2588 5 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Generally speaking if you're working on something that's protected by an NDA you don't invite a press crew into your shop with cameras and sit down for an interview with them, while showing off all the secret stuff. Total show.

Ya think! Pretty much common sense right?

Good news is I think this drama is all coming to a head really soon, for better or for worse.

Man that digital drawing was crazy stuff Aurich. Some amazing art output by that guy with that device/software.

#2589 5 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

.... Some amazing art output by that guy with that device/software.

And "that guy" has been working with John for "about the past 4 years"... Sounds like about the entire project time for Magic Girl and beyond. Maybe it's not just pie-in-the-sky.

This thread vacillates more than Kim Kardashian on her new dong toy.

#2590 5 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

I posted on the blog again, after the latest artwork reveal.

And I seconded your comment on the blog.... Someone has to be reading it... hopefully.. maybe...

11
#2591 5 years ago

I was just looking through my paperwork.
The Timeline
Ben Heck's Zombie Adventureland pinball will follow a normal pinball development schedule of approximately 14 months at a minimum. Yeah no shit John, maybe 14 years at a maximum.

Then at the end of the paragraph, I about spit up my beer.
Any compressions, delays or extensions to the planned schedule, will be communicated in a timely manner.
I guess ignoring your damn customers is a timely matter.

Does anybody remember how we were supposed to be able to personally customize our game? You, the purchaser, will have an opportunity in the design process to create, select and/or change certain features, decorative parts, mechanics and/or artwork.
Well John, I select to have my money back ya squirrelly jack wagon.

#2592 5 years ago
Quoted from ChrisVW:

Once the ramp design is finalized it'll take a couple of weeks (Jpop time) to create a mold and vac new ones. The ramps are the least of my worries about this project.

I've never seen a ramp take 'a couple of weeks' ... couple of months maybe ... there is alot of modelling that need to be done, proofing, etc ...

#2593 5 years ago
Quoted from PPS:

I've never seen a ramp take 'a couple of weeks' ... couple of months maybe ... there is alot of modelling that need to be done, proofing, etc ...

A couple weeks in Jpop time is a couple of months!

#2594 5 years ago
Quoted from PPS:

I've never seen a ramp take 'a couple of weeks' ... couple of months maybe ... there is alot of modelling that need to be done, proofing, etc ...

Hmmm, not sure you should be spouting on about time and delays at the moment...get your ship righted first, quarter 2 of 2014. LOL!

#2595 5 years ago
Quoted from Chambahz:

How many of you guys would be really angry if he announced that Magic Girl would be produced to anyone who could afford one?
Cause I can't imagine this being completed unless he opens it up to all and sells a whole lot more.
-and would likely only be able to get them sold by using an investors money, as I don't think anyone else will be sending in cash after reading all these posts.

I'm curious about that too. Hypothetically if the choice was a 20% chance of delivering all 3 games by 2020 (2 more years each), or having a manufacturer buy all 3 games from JPop with finished designs and 100% chance and mass producing them for, say, 60% of the price with no production limits, would that be a bad thing?

#2596 5 years ago
Quoted from Baiter:

I'm curious about that too. Hypothetically if the choice was a 20% chance of delivering all 3 games by 2020 (2 more years each), or having a manufacturer buy all 3 games from JPop with finished designs and 100% chance and mass producing them for, say, 60% of the price with no production limits, would that be a bad thing?

So in your scenario I get to fund this guys startup company while assuming 100% of the risk (since it was started with crowd funded money) while he breaks his own contract (repeatedly), lies to me and ignores me as a customer for years and my repeated requests for timelines and details all while working on other projects and still requiring me to uphold my end of the agreement (NDAs and no refunds after a certain date)...and the next guy in line is 100% guaranteed a game at about half the cost I paid? Where do I sign up =\

#2597 5 years ago
Quoted from Shrub_Light:

I was just looking through my paperwork.
The Timeline
Ben Heck's Zombie Adventureland pinball will follow a normal pinball development schedule of approximately 14 months at a minimum. Yeah no shit John, maybe 14 years at a maximum.
Then at the end of the paragraph, I about spit up my beer.
Any compressions, delays or extensions to the planned schedule, will be communicated in a timely manner.
I guess ignoring your damn customers is a timely matter.
Does anybody remember how we were supposed to be able to personally customize our game? You, the purchaser, will have an opportunity in the design process to create, select and/or change certain features, decorative parts, mechanics and/or artwork.
Well John, I select to have my money back ya squirrelly jack wagon.

yeah and here we are 3 years later and he is still making revisions to the backglass art. It's now gone through so many revisions it doesn't make sense anymore.

Purple on pink on blue looks bad, and even worse when backlit with purple LED strips.
Why is Robbie even there? Robots have nothing to do with the game. (for some reason they originally did, but don't appear to anymore)
Why would Godzilla even appear on the backglass?
The same backglass art appears to be just reused on the playfield, I wouldn't expect a game with no less than 5 cabinet art designs to reuse the same art from the backglass in the center of the playfield.
When Ben was replaced by the Mars Attacks! alien, why does the alien still have Ben's hot glue gun?! That doesn't even make sense, it reminds me of the end of Empire where after so many revisions and edits Lando is left wearing Hans clothes.

I hate to even say this but at this point the backglass art should probably be thrown out and redrawn.insanity.gif

#2598 5 years ago
Quoted from John_I:

Software is the long pole in this tent. Unless there is a room full of programmers in India or something that we don't know about, I can't see this ending well.

John refuses to talk about this, pretty much completely.

And for all the "hand drawn" art we've seen, I don't know how any of it translates to an animated display. Then there's the whole issue with game rules and depth.

#2599 5 years ago

I was just going over the original flyer... I had stars in my eyes when I saw this back in the day!
It's funny my daughter even drew a zombie cat and I sent it to John. I got an email from him right away saying he would put it up on his idea board, It was really cool! John used to be way better on the whole communication thing!
image-235.jpg

#2600 5 years ago
Quoted from frolic:

John refuses to talk about this, pretty much completely.

As I mentioned before, I really think some of you need to just "tour his shop" and corner him and ask these questions. A JPop intervention if you will. At this point, you guys deserve some answers.

Some feel this could freak him out, jeopardize the project, etc -- but honestly, if the project is that fragile... it most likely wouldn't come to completion anyway.

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