Quoted from Razorbak86:

LOL. Why on earth do you care?

Quoted from Razorbak86:

OK, you got me. Yes, I *AM* JPop. My cover is blown!

Quoted from Razorbak86:

OK, you got me. Yes, I *AM* JPop. My cover is blown!

Quoted from Mr68:

Said the man from Seattle. Bold comment my friend.

Quoted from fastpinball:

For now, let's keep positive. We will know before long if this approach is going to gain traction. It it is a non-starter, then we will know before putting in much time and energy and the owners can decide what to do from here. But for now, the optimist in me says "let's see where this goes" and I encourage others to let this run its course before pouring on any more negativity than is already present.
Believe me, I recognize all the signs (history with other devs, etc) that this is going to be challenging. But I also see the glimmer of hope and that's something we feel is worth exploring. We are not going to go broke exploring this opportunity with John. If it works out it will be a big win for pinball. If it doesn't, then all of us who tried to help John can meet up at Expo in the fall to share stories and the first round of beers is on me.
Aaron
FAST Pinball

Quoted from epthegeek:

If the code runs a computer of some kind (as it would with a PROC, Johns Board, OR FAST) then that can output the sound and you just need an amp.

Quoted from benheck:

John has however long the Skit-B shitstorm lasts to get his shit together.
Once they're done there, they'll move into him.

Quoted from Pinballs:

I've lost $4.75k on Predator, and $20k+ on MG and RAZA. I will never pre-order again! They go very quiet when you ask for a refund...
Shysters. Let's be blunt about what Kevin and John Popadiuk are. Prove me wrong, 'Jpop'. Pop goes the weasel indeed.

Quoted from PinChili:

No offense, but Jack has not conquered anything. I'm glad he delivered WOZ's to those who put money on the line years in advance (despite the BS they had to put up with including the 75th Ruby Red edition). However, he still has to deliver a bunch of THLE's as well to a lot of customers who have also put money on the line years in advance.
JJP has to be deep in the red at this point. DEEP. Seriously, if I had money in on a pre-order right now I would be seriously concerned. JJP had enormous startup costs. They endured the board issues and whatever costs were associated. They endured the lengthy delays to getting a game out the door. There is a reason they desperately needed an outside investor to step in. Unfortunately for them (and the new investor) it has been the same story with Hobbit. We're at almost a full year delay from when it was originally targeted for delivery (July 2014.) It costs a lot of money to keep paying for a large factory and for the workers (and everything else.)
Who still believes game #3 from JJP will ship in 2015? Do you really think JJP can afford to manufacture and ship #3 (cutting into Hobbit sales to boot) in 2015? JJP is likely the next major fiasco for pinball on the horizon IMHO.

Quoted from Concretehardt:

Let's ease back on the dramatics here! There are games in sight (see pic) there maybe no code in sight but there are games in sight.
image.jpg (Click image to enlarge)

Quoted from TigerLaw:

I'm curious about this as well. I wonder if you had a machine on rout already and were planning on putting this one on rout if that would change the status . . . (clearly it would be pretty wild to put a 17k machine on rout . . . but who knows, Kingpin is on rout right now and it is a 40k machine).

Quoted from jayhawkai:

No. People are talking about deducting their preorder money on their tax returns. Likely to invite an audit, IMO, and won't have any effect on JPop.

Quoted from RomstarArkanoid:

Can't steal what does not exist.

Quoted from rai:

I wonder if these might some day be built and become 'cult classics' like Kingpin, after many people bail out from waiting, but eventually like 5 years from now they are done and the few still in are richly rewarded with kick ass pins.

Quoted from Mr68:

Top ten all time cowardly post.

Quoted from Mr68:

**"I've been waiting to see if u would post that... My suggestion is just lots of texts!!! But I don't own a throw away phone"**
I see you edited your post. That's you original comment. A throw away phone is what I called cowardly.

Quoted from fastpinball:

This was refreshing to read. It's painful reading posts where everyone is tearing at each other or trying to hammer home some point at just the wrong time.
We really are all on the same side. The side of pinball lovers. It's probably the only thing that binds everyone on this website together. The pinball community needs to be supportive of its people. We don't always need to agree on everything, like all the same games or do the same things with our money. But when some in the community are hurting or others in it are doing wrong, we need to keep that perspective. Pretend for a minute before you post something that we are all sitting in the same room together. It usually helps you give that post a second thought before submitting.
On a personal note, many of you saw me get ripped apart over on the Skit-B thread because I vouched for the wrong guy. I got swept up in all the madness as the truth came out and it was horrible. Even when I was trying to help, it only seemed to draw more fire. But through all the pain I had to remember that people were hurting and reacting to all the developments in their own way. In the heat of the moment, we can't count on how we react. When it was at its worst, so many people in the community reached out privately in PMs, email, Facebook or text and that was amazing. That's the thing about community, a couple bad folks can't ruin it all on their own, if we take care of each other.
After the firestorm died down a bit, there were some posts made by folks who came along and chose to single me out and dig at me again. Not in the heat of the moment, but in what I have to assume they thought was the opportune time to be hurtful and not stand out as just being a dick. As lame as I thought it was I resisted the urge to engage. In fact, others who read it told me about it and advised me not to engage. It wasn't going to make anything any better. If that was how they want act, I can choose to ignore them.
I guess the bottom line here is that we are witnessing a few bad apples souring so much of our pinball community. Let's protect and support our community and not just try to win some senseless forum battle. Believe it or not, I have tightened up relationships with some friends and made new ones through this experience. Glass half full, right?
Aaron
FAST Pinball

Quoted from BillySastard:

This is complete BS. Pinside took a huge step backwards by letting him start another account. How do you let the biggest POS troll on PS willingly start a new account? His first post should've been an explanation of who he is and how he's now associated with JPop.
JPop has officially hit rock bottom. Hopefully he can only go up from here.

Quoted from frolic:

Whatever is happening with these games, I don't expect anything to change any time soon (no playable prototypes). Still no final ramps, I'm going to guess now that the lack of money has stopped them from being produced, and the well documented no programmer.
The games can't be shown until those 2 items have been addressed, and I'm sure there's a bunch of stuff we don't even know about holding them back.

Quoted from BackFlipper:

If I was in on Magic Girl, I would drive over to Zidware with my wife's minivan and take delivery of one of these. You paid for one, you own one. I would ask for all of the parts he has related to the game, and off I would drive, never to allow JPop into my life again. I would figure it out from there. If 5 or 10 partial games are in his shop, that group of owners can figure out where to go next. Maybe for another $3K each, you can get some of the rarest completed games in history. Again, this is what I would do. If he did not cooperate, I would call the police while I was there and show my receipt (It worked with my ex-wife).

386835-i.jpg

Quoted from zombieyeti:

Hello all - I'm the artist on JPOPs 'recent' machines - I haven't heard for him in a few weeks and started doing some diggin which led me here - can someone summarize what is going on? thanks in advance!

Quoted from zombieyeti:

Hey guys - I'm sorting thru things and just spoke with John - I'm hoping for the best.

Quoted from GLModular:

It is simple economics. There wasn't enough money that was going to be generated in the first game to pay for its own development and manufacturing (at least not in the way John was going about it). Everyone, and I do mean everyone (except probably the initial buyers), told him to make MG unlimited so that he would have enough money to do it (especially those of us who weren't interested in BHZA/RAZA).
But John insisted that those who missed out on MG would jump on board with BHZA/RAZA, and then he made THAT a limited run, which also wasn't going to be enough capital to get MG into production and pay for the development of BHZA/RAZA.
Hence why the "unlimited" AIW was "needed". Robbing Peter to pay Paul. Unfortunately it's a catch 22. No one game will ever generate enough money to complete the games preceding it.
If he had simply opened up MG from the beginning, used as much off-the-shelf parts he could, I can only imagine that the game would have been finished and shipping by now.

Quoted from Pdxmonkey:

I played MG the last two days.
That wasn't a lie.

Quoted from jwilson:

But don't have any more details to offer?
I'll never understand this. Everyone who visits comes back saying "everything is fine!" but *never elaborates* or *provides details*.

Quoted from dgarrett:

I was wondering what you guys think about the hurdles on the software side for John.
Lyman and Keith have been doing rules for decades. Ben did one game, but Ben did the boards and all the overhead system code too - and Ben's dots, audio/video controls, and rules turned out pretty good IMO. Plus Heck did the boardset, and all that goes with them: OS and I/O and power control.
KEF (+ later on Ted Estes) and it took 3 years+ of ground-up on WoZ OS, video control and rules. Stern has just released a new operating system platform - which takes years to create and test.
Here's the thing -- Zidware/ Jpop needs everything - op system, I/O, rules, sol drivers board control logic, switch matrix logic, everything... any prototyping on mechs or code left with Ben, right?
Lets say Jpop finds (and can afford) a KEF or a LFS for the rules ... He still needs an operating systems guy to code for the boardset - Does Jpop even have a board set or prototype boards? - plus if you had all the above, the todo list still has storyboard and dots and rules. Design and story, requires close collaboration with the game designer and software (see Ritchie/Lyman for ACDC and Spiderman for example, or Borg & crew on TWD or Iron Man or Tron).
Code is a key critical-path "thing" to get a game done .... I don't think JPop is even at week 1 of a 3 year time horizon for just the code alone.
Spooky, JJP and Stern have proven they can. Dutch Pinball proved to me they can do it, based on the Bride 2.0 (its amazing work all around). Heighway's game looks and plays well - and Andrew will do fine on the "making" part. Common to all the above success projects - a great team, not one or two guys, but usually at least 5 or 10 or dozens.
I'd like to hear discussion about the platform/coding issue facing Zidware, opinions on the feasibility, has anyone seen any dots, code, boards or operating system. And does JPop have anyone left on his team?

Quoted from examiner:

I also think that's his strategy, and it wouldn't surprise me to see him present a single "completed" MG game.
The game will probably have a fair degree of mechanical wow-factor, John will stand on a rug with a banner behind him reading "Mission Accomplished", and he will hope that it'll be enough to suck a bunch of people/money down the next rabbit hole.
If the community falls for that, the next thing you'll probably see would be a single "completed" RAZA in about 5 years. Making one is fun. Dozens? Not so much.

Quoted from rai:

Since I like to look at both sides of the debate, and since there are no 'pro John' supporters here. I would just like to point out the possibility and how there is still a chance for these games.
I will just look at MG because that's the first game the alpha game, and should in any case be completed first or most likely to be completed. And I think it's the better looking game as well.
I'm not saying it looks likely, but that it's still possible, maybe very possible for John to build MG pins and continue from there.
I'm not putting any timeframe into this, because John is horrible at time management as we have seen since it's now 6 months post Expo and counting. But look at Nemo even The hobbit, pins take more time that planned. But just because John passed his timeframe, doesn't mean it can never be completed.
My premises are:
- John has done *some* groundwork already. He has cabinets, art, maybe working mechanisms, maybe rule tree (that need to be coded) maybe some animations or at least directions that need to be implemented, probably a whitewood.
- let's give John some credit and say he's about halfway done.
- let's say John is not completely out of money, let's say he has collected $800,000 from RAZA $300,000 from MG customers and let's say $100,000 from AIW. That's $1.2M
-Let's say he burns $12,000 per month for 4 years that's $576K round up to $600,000 so he still has $600,000 left to finish the work and another 4 years worth of cash burn left. I just picked $12k a month as arbitrary, he could have started out much loser so it is conceivable that he has only spent $600,000. Note if this was the case, it would have made sense for him to show Ice his bank accounts to show that he is still very solvent.
Now going forward:
-let's say he can make MG at least as good likely better tha CV. I say better because it's 20 years later with advancement in computers and graphics and he has better cabinets and hinges and likely better sound and etc,, I would say it's a cinch that he could build a pin better than CV with the superior materials afforded by $16,000 price tag. So all I'm asking is he makes a nice pin that's nice looking, and high quality art and materials that plays as good or better than CV. I think that is possible as Ben did AMH and the NEMO pin had far far less money and they came out. So given John 4-8 years he *should* be able to top CV.
- let's say it costs John $10k to build each MG. Ben said Predator probably should cost nearly $5k to build, so I'm giving Jonn double that. I think $10k just to build the pins is realistic.
- let's say John removes the cap or has a soft cap on the number to be sold, let's say he will sell 50 MG pins at $16k. And let's say the first 25 people still owe something like $4k each.
So that's 25 new pins at $16k equals $400k (plus 25 prior owners still owing $100k) that comes out to $500k new money to build 50 pins and I said $10k per pin equals $500k.
So my theory, he still has $600k left to finish the pins and $500k new money to build the pins.
My contention is that when John does finish the pins, people will still pay $16k if they are good! I would pay for a pin I knew was being built. I'm not saying I'd pay anything up front to John, but if he was building amazing looking MG and it was actually a good fun layout and still very limited, I would really consider and might actually buy one.

Quoted from examiner:

In order to do so, you'd have to demonstrate:
1) the loss was the result of an "investment" (don't think the IRS will buy that argument), or,
2) the loss was the result of theft/fraud.
as always, consult your tax advisor.

Quoted from rotordave:

The facts .... Quick summary:
- a lot of money paid
- a long time ago
- not much to show for it
- lots of art revisions
- lots of angry punters
- lots of angry vendors
- zero communication
- phone answering fail
- great harm
- generally not positive
Think that about sums it up.
rd.

Quoted from benheck:

My biggest issue with RAZA is the radical theme shift. John sold people on a ZOMBIE game, years before TWD. Remember how badly everyone wanted that theme? It was the Iron Maiden of its day.
Having a zombie lab under an amusement park, that's fine. The visuals of an old park would be cool, and kind of like that one movie, Zombieland wasn't it?
But then he added all this sci-fi crap which is a TOTALLY DIFFERENT GENRE. There are more clowns than zombies now which is a big No-No.
Plus he removed zombies and added all these copyrighted things like Mars Attacks, Robbie the Robot and Not Godzilla. No matter how obscure Mars Attacks is I guarantee it's still protected (so I'm basically saying all the RAZA art would need to be redone)

Quoted from Aurich:

Yes, he discovered his glass doesn't hit the shooter rod!

Quoted from BC_Gambit:

Yeah, but this is the thirdish post in the last few weeks?
But this bit of "luck" makes me wonder even more what the odds are of the ramps turning out perfect on the first go. Oh well. If he is hauling his game for the Pacific NW show, I can see in person.

Quoted from frolic:

nope, how was it different from what we've seen?

Quoted from Wolfmarsh:

Here is the picture. Great Harm abounds.
IMG_1308.JPG (Click image to enlarge)

Quoted from zombieyeti:

I don't disagree at all - but I really expected everyone to be screwed and end up with nothing. And at best - a bandaid solution that prolongs a future that fails. What I see now is the exact opposite. Again - I'm not unbiased

Quoted from applejuice:

Me neither. Please update your list of contractors and vendors owed to list my official business name.
Orange Cloud Software Ltd. instead of 'original programmer' and thank you for keeping a list updated of all vendors/contractors owed.
Some history:
My company was a contractor for Zidware from June 2012 to May 2014. We worked on many things including: hardware design, os software, game software, graphics, effects, rules as mentioned by others in this thread. We were forced to stop working with them due to unpaid invoices going back 3+ months at the time, now over a year ago. We were working on things full time until then.
I am still chasing the outstanding amounts, or any communication on this matter and am still bemused as to why much of the work i created has never been publicly shown. I have until today tried to keep an open mind (despite being owed a large sum of money) that the projects may be finished and delivered for people. It was extremely difficult for me personally being a very small business to soak up 3 months of non-payment, but i still feel worse for every customer who put their faith in Zidware/John and have been repaid like this..

Quoted from pinlynx:

IANAL, but if ZombieYeti hasn't been paid for his artwork on the Zidware games, I'd think that he'd have a case to claim that they are still his assets. If so, he should be able to do what he wants with them (e.g. sell prints, license the art to Stern, print Papadookie toilet paper with MG art on it, whatever).

Quoted from applejuice:

I hope all my other projects on pinside go someway to explain that i am a decent person and tried my best to help these projects succeed. Indeed, the journey almost brought me to my knees, as i relied on being payed in a timely manner, but wanted to keep the projects moving forward. I had to sell around 7 pinball games from my personal collection that i built up over 25 years to keep myself afloat. I was lucky i had them.
John actually sent me an email once telling me to stop sending invoice reminders as it was "annoying him" ...

Quoted from jlm33:

I slept over that idea... and haven't changed my mind. These guys have shown their ability to produce a game on the same scale (a little bit less than 200 units) and deal with someone who was not easy (Gene Cunningham). That was 8 years ago.
Anyone to comment? Stupid idea?

Quoted from applejuice:

If they are using what was already in place code wise a year ago, then you should be able to do a lot more than just cycle the ball around.

Quoted from applejuice:

I got in touch with pintasia over the weekend through pinside pm and they asked me to send over confirmation of the unpaid invoices and what i worked on, as they were unaware of the problem. I gave them a quick update summary of what i worked on during my time there and have sent all the detailed info over this morning. I also sent a pm to wcbrandes pinside account. I'm waiting now for a reply.
I'd just like to re-iterate my earlier comments that i'm not looking to cause trouble and tried to support the original projects for as long as i could, anyway i could, i just want to paid up for what i did and for what my company worked on to be acknowledged. Almost going bankrupt in the process along with other things was not easy to get over
John Popaduik caused me and my family 'great harm' and still refuses to apologise

Quoted from turbo20lbs:

As Ben mentioned, it might have been cost related, or a combo of cost/"vendetta".
Regardless I miss those early Woz cabs with the Charlie method done.
Have you taken a close look at the latest Woz Standards? They have extra "circle" cut out around the flipper button area. Pretty tacky IMO.

Quoted from zombieyeti:

Apologies if that wasn't a clear given. Since I fall in that category as well...checks in the mail I'm sure

Quoted from Shapeshifter:

Yup, Pat's unlicensed game would look pretty cool with Zombieyeti artwork. Wonder if JJP thinking this way? Time will tell.

Quoted from dmesserly:

How about the other 100+ customers?

Quoted from dmesserly:

Joking or not, the attitude that MG owners should come before RAZA owners is a crock.

Quoted from benheck:

» YouTube video

Quoted from Pdxmonkey:

Soon as Zidware floats the bill for STI.

Quoted from RobT:

This isn't about "him". This is about the owners/creditors getting some small slice of the pie back from bankruptcy. The protos can be sold in bankruptcy and divided among the owners. Sure, it might not be a lot, but that's the right thing to do.
Pdxmonkey, Bill, etc. are not entitled to keep any of the prototypes.
Who knows how much they could sell for at auction?
Did Bill pay to have the prototype delivered to the NW show? Why won't he pay to get it back to Zidware?

Quoted from YKpinballer:

I'm guessing Zidware paid a lot of money to John for the "privilege" of being able to use his patents for development of their prototype. However if he developed the patents while being paid a salary by Zidware, and using materials in the Zidware shop, there could easily be a claim on them by creditors.
Edit: not to mention they would have a claim on all the fees paid to John for the patents that should rightfully be Zidware patents.
I'm sensing from your smugness that you take pleasure in thinking John is a genius for swindling everybody and you think he's so smart he's going to get away with it. If I were you I wouldn't be so sure about these guys. I'd be careful about being involved, actually, lawsuits have a way of spreading to anybody nearby.

Quoted from sevenrites:

Jpop-home.png
It's another beautiful day in the neighborhood...

Quoted from TaylorVA:

But why defend him? That's the question.