I agree but I think what Sean was saying is why should he or any one else join the lawsuit? As long as there are several already doing this John is not getting away with it. He's going to have to face the music. So what 's the benefit in having another few or another dozen or several dozen more join the lawsuit? I know the lawyer would like that but what's the point?

Smart move to pull the plug Bill. Way too much design remaining. Heck of an effort to organize a possible rescue, but it won't have paid off. Your quick evaluation and decision brings closure to the dream. Anybody left in the game who still expects to receive one of these games, may have dropped acid once too many times.

In fact, I'm so sick of this priveledged behind the scenes crap. You've been doing this "I know something you don't know" thing for months. Well you did know something we didn't know, for years. That the machines were a disaster and the whole thing was a scam. People counted on those who were allowed in the shop to be doing due diligence and have a real idea what was happening in there, and the damn games didn't even have ramps after 4 years. Yet it was okay to let everybody believe everything was going swimmingly.

I'll start trusting you and Brandes and whoever else is in your crew once they start talking instead of lurking off into the shadows and keeping silent.

That's a fair point.

Although hopefully the attorney is more motivated to work at this with more clients.

Sorry the situation is stressing you out bro.

say what?? So now there are four not three prototypes? hmm, I do recall talk of more than three ramp sets being made, but this is the first I recall hearing there are four prototypes in varies stages of construction.

From the sounds of it, there is a lot we don't know. And certain people are going to benefit from that.

I think all the prototypes and/or artwork e.t.c. should be auctioned off to some of the high end collectors who collect weird and/or very rare stuff (most of you know some of the people I'm referring too) and all owners who got shafted could split it. Then again, just seems like more of a pipe dream...

It's good to know that people can move forward with their lawsuits and do something to try and recover some money, but I'm still so bummed out about how this all ended. I know it was over a long time ago, but I really hoped that that last hail mary would connect and that at least some people would ultimately see games delivered. Dang.

Good luck to everyone looking to collect some money. I really hope there's some success to be had. It's going to get even uglier from here.

Vendors would be first in line for any money left (I think). Buyers get sloppy (nothing) seconds.

Even better, turn it into a fully functioning grill for the event.

Screw it!

I'm just gonna get in the custom T-Shirt business. Simply send a check for $50 along with the total amount you gave John and I'll whip out one of these shirts for you.

Pre-order now! Only 16 will be made! (or maybe 20, or maybe 50, or maybe I'll even announce a few more shirt designs all together!)

t-shirt.jpg

When fattrain fails to deliver the shirt, I'll bail the project out.

Make sure you take the prototype shirt to Canada for development.

One thing pintasia efforts did was get john comfortable enough to send the email saying there was no money left and was basically done vs non stop "soon" bs. So good for closure / legal efforts. Without them trying, it would of prob gone on like it was or worse gotten more money from people.

I've seen these shirts and can attest they're 95 percent done. Nothing to worry about.

Thank you for trying !

LTG : )

Look, everybody who visits that screen printer comes away a believer. You need to wake up and realize that the last 5% isn't going to happen.

Yes so do I but I wouldn't be telling anyone who hasn't. Not fair what could happen to that person. The person who has it is absolutely not keeping it so no worries. I know how concerned you are this gets back to jpop asap.

You could volunteer to pay the sti bill maybe. Deal?

The motivation to not have zidware pay sti and get it out to the NW show asap was obvious. Now the project is dead who wants to let jpop not have to be financially responsible for even more? Definitely not me. He's paying for shipping to get it back. The end. I suppose he could drive and get it. If bankruptcy demands it gets sent back they will pay for it. No one is holding it hostage. It's poison. I wouldn't want it for sure.

Stop implying pdxmonkey is somehow scamming to keep it. That's getting old and offensive.

So what now...document the emails...the stringing along? This is not personal it's business. I have a lot to share, can we create a timeline?

What the hell are you talking about? "Conspiracy theories"?

It is not a conspiracy theory that at least one of the MG prototypes is not in possession of Zidware.

It is not a conspiracy theory that you know who has one of the MG prototypes, but won't say who or why.

It is not a conspiracy theory that you said this in response to my statement that the MG proto should go back to Zidware:

It is not a conspiracy theory that Zidware didn't pay a dime to STI to get the MG Prototype to the NW show.

It is not a conspiracy theory that we were told that the MG prototype was on loan and still belonged to Zidware.

It is not a conspiracy theory to say that if the MG prototype is not returned to Zidware, it could possibly cause legal trouble for those in possession of it at some point.

Stop being so defensive. I know you did a lot to get MG to the show and I understand being disappointed and even pissed at this point, but don't go around making bold comments inferring that you or whoever has the MG proto isn't giving it back to Zidware until the transportation is paid for (unless that was part of the agreement that you had when Zidware agreed to let Pintasia borrow it).

Good lord. I don't have time for people who aren't capable of being remotely reasonable.

You asking that game gets sent back means nothing.

Zidware hasn't asked yet neither has the court those on the other hand matter.

Sometimes the hardest thing to do is walk away from something you want to save. But at the end of the day the problems here weren't your doing and the enormous amount of energy needed to correct them could be better spent elsewhere. The effort you and the many who rallied around you put forth to get all of this madness out in the open is certainly respectable.

It was great to meet you and many of those who worked their asses off to get the game to the show this weekend. Not to mention those who put time into the game over the years who were also at the show. This weekend really did allow a lot of those hurt by the Zidware experience the opportunity to talk and have a little community.

Aaron
FAST Pinball

Haha, so Pintasia foots the bill to get it to a show for their own business purposes, but then says John will get it back when he pays the STI bill himself, even though having the machine attend the show was not for Zidware business. What kind of dog and pony show is this? It just doesn't even make sense at this point what you guys are up to. That's why people are digging at you and asking questions. Because a machine (one of four? I think?) that represents $1M of pre-order money went missing and a bunch of sly foxes won't say where it is. They won't say what they're doing with it. They say Zidware is dead and JPop is a bad guy so why give it back to him. Pintasia has stated that they are not taking this pin into production, so which "volunteer" now has the right to work on it? Until the assets are legally sorted out, you all look like pirates burying booty.

If it means nothing, why did you get worked up enough to respond with your ridiculous post about having Zidware foot the bill to ship it back?

Did Zidware foot the bill to have it shipped to the NW?

Did you and/or Pintasia have some type of agreement with regarding to shipping it back to Zidware after the show? Or did you just think it would never have to go back? Or did you put any thought into it at all, one way or the other?

What did you think was going to happen? What did you base it on?

Do you think that whoever has it now can just keep it until someone pays to have it shipped back to Zidware? Who do you think has the responsibility to get it back to Zidware? Anyone?

Holy hell. This actually makes some sense. Jim had one, right? But it had no playfield art. No way anyone stripped everything off of it (and I'm sure keeping an original whitewood would have some appeal from a "lookie here" perspective). Perhaps the one everyone saw was actually the whitewood jim had, with art applied via sticker print (hence the ripples) and the other three are still there but far less along?

Hey, how about one of you insiders actually tell us what the deal is so we can stop speculating? I mean, what's the benefit of keeping it a secret anymore? Inquiring minds and what not...

Oh never mind, you are pirates burying booty. My mistake, saying none of this makes sense. It's exactly what it looks like.

The 3 MG's seen in the Adobe video were mockups to look good on camera (more BS smoke & mirrors) So scratch those off your list.

If MG was that incomplete, there's probably only 1 prototype, at least in anything resembling a playable condition.

No, they weren't. They existed long before adobe ever came by to shoot a video. They weren't done. Couldn't be made whole without serious rework due to fitment issues, but they weren't just mockups for that stupid video.

Probably true, but the mockups have subjective value for certain people. This is another thing pdxmonkey would easily be able to clear up, since he would know exactly what they are (and could have revealed ages ago).

It would be a most interesting sequel to "Tilt! The Battle to save Pinball".

Can they be played? No? Mockup.

Once again re posting for those who missed it the first time.

Too much purple.

Now that the what ifs are answered I'm looking forward to seeing people make JPops life difficult to the fullest extent of the law.

I really couldn't care less what happens to the MG proto, or who keeps it. But wherever it ends up I hope someone is opening their wallet to keep it, and that the money (as well as anything else that can be sold) can be used to try and help all the vendors that John screwed first, and divided up amongst the owners second if there's anything left.

I will say that these coy games from the "insiders" are disappointing though. Apparently this whole thing will die just like it started, with secrets and bullshit. Nothing learned.

Rob - this isn't worth fighting with PDX over, is it? And why would he know the answers and why does he own them to you, personally? John asked me to put him in touch with Michelle at sTI/NAVL, they talked and he has a quote, and he intends to use that company to get it back to Illinois. The speculation, finger-pointing and accusations over stuff is crazy - you have nothing to base it on!?

Yep that's exacly my thought process at this point.

Suggestion.

Next major show- bring it- set it up in the parking lot-

$100/swing with a sledge hammer, all proceeds to go to the victims fund.

What are you talking about Aurich what secrets and bullshit? The game is out west, John was suppose to handle getting it home regardless of an announcement being made. Sounds like he is making arrangements. You guys really need to chill. There is no conspiracy theories here just a few that would like to make it seem like there is. I re posted what I said from the beginning and nothings changed. I hope that makes everyone comfortable.

You're right. Turns out the shirt was just a lazy rehash of some of fattrain's prior work and he was trying to capture some of his former glory. Because of this we'll be selling "I bought a Jpop scammer t-shirt and all I got was this lousy hat' hats. For an additional fee of course.

Well Ice unfortunately for me I am the dummy here.. for ever putting faith and trust in JPOP I have no more money to throw at this. It's been a rough year and this is the icing on the cake I guess. My hope is that maybe some of the vendors will get something out of the bankruptcy. My payment has already been recieved in the form of a very painful lesson.

Also known as, "telling the wife"