(Topic ID: 92436)

John Popadiuk update thread……MAGIC GIRL, RAZA, AIW…..


By iceman44

5 years ago



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12
#13801 4 years ago

A Shot map (from left to right) from memory mostly based on the features and playflieds i worked on (as of may 2014)

• Lion saw
• Newton chamber (captive ball)
• Left Loop (Wizard Lane)
• Potion Spinner
• Left Ramp
• Owl Target (captive ball)
• Kings Chamber (Centre)
• Levitate Feature
• Magic Shoppe (Scoop)
• Hare/Million Target
• Right Loop
• Tesla Subway
• Mystery/Coin target
• Shooter Lane

• Kings/Queens Bonus X - Top lanes
• Jinx Wheel - Left Outlane
• Magna Save - Right Outlane

You should be able to see modes and features working for any of these modes if you select 'arcade' at game start, not 'novice play'. Also check the balls per game settings (service mode -> settings -> standard -> balls per game) are on 3 or 5 for a decent length game, not 1 as someone pointed out.

11
#13802 4 years ago
Quoted from Sparky347:

More gameplay...
Watch "Magic Girl Gameplay" on YouTube
» YouTube video

Thanks for video.

Really though, take away the great Zombie artwork and at the moment seeing a game that looks unbelievably clunky.

If I wanted a game like this I would just go out and buy a real nice TOTAN.

-3
#13803 4 years ago

Does anybody own a descent film camera these days?
Are these the best movies we can get?cell phone blur?

#13804 4 years ago

I have to say, it's very anti-climatic. It seems kind of clunky - is that the alpha software or the playfield design?

#13805 4 years ago
Quoted from jwilson:

I have to say, it's very anti-climatic. It seems kind of clunky - is that the alpha software or the playfield design?

Looks like playfield issues to me... Cramped, without a lot of lanes.

#13806 4 years ago
Quoted from pinballrockstar:

Does anybody own a descent film camera these days?
Are these the best movies we can get?cell phone blur?

No! If so they are not carrying that camera around.

-2
#13807 4 years ago

Ohh... this thread is better than any of my 'stories' on TV. Ohh yes......just sitting back and watching the drama unfold....you got your no ramp shots, your mylar overlay, weak flippers, 4 years of design so he could roll all of his games into one......ohh yeah.....what a way to spend the weekend!!

giphy-3.gif
#13808 4 years ago
#13809 4 years ago
Quoted from someoneelse:

Because law enforcement would remind you that you would be stealing from all the other prepayers etc. that have money in this. You could force them to sell the proto and evenly divide the proceedings between everyone having money in this....your share will be very small.
How is this kind of thinking - "I want this machine as indemnification for myself" - and not caring the least bit about the others invested in this better than what JPop did?
You really need to open your eyes to business reality. Companies go bankrupt all the time, people lose most of their investments, the IP is bought out and someone else finishes and goes live with the product - in some cases even making a fortune on it.
A big part of the problem is mentioned by yourself: "...invested hard earned money in good faith...". Tell any investor, businessman or non-pinball friends that you invested hard earned money in "good faith" (and not much more than good faith) and be surprised by what they will answer.
You bet on the wrong horse, you invested in the wrong company, you believed in the wrong person. All natural concerns and clear thinking was thrown overboard in the light of a shiny & rare new toy. A lot of this disaster originates in the wrong and somewhat naive belief that an artist and pinball designer must be competent to run an economical challenging business. I think it's safe to say that artists are among the ones to been known to typically have less connection to "hard facts business" than most other professions.
Now it seems that someone with the necessary financial potential and business competence has stepped in and is trying to evaluate if the IP is worth going for, if there is still enough interest in the machine, if it is feasible and what it would take to produce the machine. Thus the presentation & the "offer" to the original prepayers.
And don't be fooled by the emotionally loaded comments about no one wanting this machine due to it's history. If it is released it will be one of the most collectable pins ever made and the value, depending on numbers produced, will probably go through the roof. Not despite but because of it's history. I'm not saying it's a good move, but if a pinhead friend called me saying he just got a MG I'd jump in the car immediately and be there lightning fast.
Whatever, I still feel deeply sorry for anyone invested in this. There really is no "right" solution to this situation, either way it will cost you a lot of money which makes me very sad.
Maybe the single positive effect of this will be that future projects in pinball will have to be approached in a far more professional and thoughtful way leading to more healthy and realistic endeavors. After the pitchforks have been tucked away again, that is.

Most intelligent post in the thread.

#13810 4 years ago

What Patents are pending for this machine as it states in the photo?

And there is a "theater of magic" post in there? Very clever.

image.jpg
#13811 4 years ago

Still haven't figured out the point of those biff bars.

#13812 4 years ago
Quoted from Sparky347:

More gameplay...
Watch "Magic Girl Gameplay" on YouTube
» YouTube video

That playfield cover is REALLY impacting ball movement. You can see it flex and the ball change direction.

#13813 4 years ago
Quoted from MK6PIN:

Curious why someone that has paid for either of these machines hasn't brought a receipt and law enforcement to claim them.

#13814 4 years ago

duplicate deleted

10
#13815 4 years ago

We can only judge what has been put in front of us. I realize the game is incomplete, no toys work, no magnets work, the mini playfield doesn't work, but this is a game 4+ years in development and over 2 years late. As well as grossly over budget.

So the fact that it's only 75% done, or less, well, you can't really blame the players for walking away less than impressed.

I commend those that helped out getting it to the show. The show was a good goal to rally towards, a fixed deadline. If only John had rallied to Expo '13 like he was supposed to, if he had showed the same game that showed up this weekend, but 2 years ago, I think it would have been a totally different outcome.

I'll be curious to hear from Bill what the road ahead is. How does this get completed? Who will do the work? How long will it take? How much money will that cost? Can the machine be produced at a price that will sell?

#13816 4 years ago

Instead of letting the game die at home in bed, it's been draged out into the street for a long painful death

#13817 4 years ago

Magic Girl reminds me of the Dragon's Lair, Space Ace or any other laserdisc arcade games. Beautiful to watch, but no fun to play.

The ramps on X-Files that I picked up for $1500 have way more flow and much higher fun factor than Magic Girl. Heck, any pin in my game room is way more fun...Baywatch blows this away.

Paying $16k for a cabinet with pretty artwork with a dog of game inside is nuts.

#13818 4 years ago
Quoted from someoneelse:

Because law enforcement would remind you that you would be stealing from all the other prepayers etc. that have money in this. You could force them to sell the proto and evenly divide the proceedings between everyone having money in this....your share will be very small.
How is this kind of thinking - "I want this machine as indemnification for myself" - and not caring the least bit about the others invested in this better than what JPop did?
You really need to open your eyes to business reality. Companies go bankrupt all the time, people lose most of their investments, the IP is bought out and someone else finishes and goes live with the product - in some cases even making a fortune on it.
A big part of the problem is mentioned by yourself: "...invested hard earned money in good faith...". Tell any investor, businessman or non-pinball friends that you invested hard earned money in "good faith" (and not much more than good faith) and be surprised by what they will answer.
You bet on the wrong horse, you invested in the wrong company, you believed in the wrong person. All natural concerns and clear thinking was thrown overboard in the light of a shiny & rare new toy. A lot of this disaster originates in the wrong and somewhat naive belief that an artist and pinball designer must be competent to run an economical challenging business. I think it's safe to say that artists are among the ones to been known to typically have less connection to "hard facts business" than most other professions.
Now it seems that someone with the necessary financial potential and business competence has stepped in and is trying to evaluate if the IP is worth going for, if there is still enough interest in the machine, if it is feasible and what it would take to produce the machine. Thus the presentation & the "offer" to the original prepayers.
And don't be fooled by the emotionally loaded comments about no one wanting this machine due to it's history. If it is released it will be one of the most collectable pins ever made and the value, depending on numbers produced, will probably go through the roof. Not despite but because of it's history. I'm not saying it's a good move, but if a pinhead friend called me saying he just got a MG I'd jump in the car immediately and be there lightning fast.
Whatever, I still feel deeply sorry for anyone invested in this. There really is no "right" solution to this situation, either way it will cost you a lot of money which makes me very sad.
Maybe the single positive effect of this will be that future projects in pinball will have to be approached in a far more professional and thoughtful way leading to more healthy and realistic endeavors. After the pitchforks have been tucked away again, that is.

If a paid in full preorder individual went in with even basic law enforcement, and claimed ( with a receipt) these were the machines they had paid for, there would at least be a question, machines confiscated, and everyone would know where they were ( from my reading, many people doubted they even existed).

Addressing " personal indemnification for myself"....negative. At least one person who paid for the machines would have ownership...goal is to not let these " assets" vanish again.

" opening my eyes to business reality", " investing hard earned money in good faith", and " betting on the wrong horse" explanations would only enrage me more, if I were vested.

My eyes are wide open to business reality, I live it everyday. Didn't see business "ethics" tied into your response in anyway, guess I'm not that intelligent.

And now the " good faith/ betting on the wrong horse" people were idiots for doing so? No way. They bought ( and were sold through good faith tactics, btw.) a bill of goods, that is sitting in their face at the moment. They were grossly misled, lied to, and now "force fed " into whatever this was suppose to accomplish.

I would suspect that there will be a fair amount of people that look in from the outside ( of this hobby)in disbelief.

Slept on this last night, so I would be calmer in my posting/ reading today. I'm just tremendously sorry and feel for the people that have to endure this ( and the other fiasco). I enjoy pinball as a release from my business world, and suspect others do too. Suffice to say just reading this is not a release that would be best for pinball.

If a paid in full owner does not have these at least confiscated until details are crystal clear for all of the current owners, I hope justice is swift.......mark

11
#13819 4 years ago

After 4 years this is the best he could do? Although this game looks spectacular and different, the videos sure make it look like a dog. 95% of the shots went through the spinner and just bounced around the bottom part of the playfield. I fail to see anything revolutionary about this game that needed so much secrecy. he just didn't have anything worth showing it looks like. If I was in on this game I would be crying right now, because weather this game gets made or not you lose unless tons of changes are made.

15
#13820 4 years ago
Quoted from mrgone:

Jpops next job

Not a chance. Little Caesars' pizzas are "Hot & Ready" when you walk in the door.

10
#13821 4 years ago
Quoted from Squeakman:

I fail to see anything revolutionary about this game that needed so much secrecy

this is not the first time a comment like this has been said this weekend and I have to agree. A ton of time and money was spent reinventing the wheel, over and over again. new cabinet (patented!), coils, hinges, pop bumpers, new board system, new led lights, custom this, custom that... to what end? How did any of that bring pinball to a new level? The end game is not head and shoulders above WOZ, Hobbit, Lebowski, Full Throttle, and for that matter many recent Stern titles.

The art is the real differentiator, but that could have been done on any game. Someone in the past mentioned we could get great art from a $2.99 comic book. Considering I'm getting NOTHING for my thousands invested, not even a comic book or a print... yeah a $2.99 comic is looking pretty good right now.

14
#13823 4 years ago

You know what also burns me on this? The unpaid vendors are having their work on display, yet in almost every case the vendors are not being given a fair chance to shine.

- Jim's code has been nerfed with weak flippers and single ball play
- ZombieYeti's gorgeous art is being bombarded with super bright purple and blue LEDs that are distorting how things look (in pictures at least)
- the awesomely bright GLM boards and cointaker LEDs have been set in colors most don't like, and are producing insane glare on the lcd display and the playfield art

Look, it's bad enough these guys didn't get paid in full, but the fact that now, when their work should at least be generating some free publicity, they aren't able to shine as they should? Well, that's a real shame.

#13824 4 years ago
Quoted from brent149:

After Predator and this, anyone who loses money depositing on phantom games deserves zero empathy. I bet they'll still be a few people throwing pre-order money at this prototype that will come away shocked when they have nothing to show for it.

Kind of like people who buy unproven games sight unseen... They'll swear they'll never do it again after being burned... Act like they can't believe this can happen... And will just do it again the next time its offered up to them

#13825 4 years ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

Kind of like people who buy unproven games sight unseen... They'll swear they'll never do it again after being burned... Act like they can't believe this can happen... And will just do it again the next time its offered up to them

Very insightful.

#13826 4 years ago

Chris at Cointaker and Tony at GLM should be there ripping out the parts they never got paid for Too classy for that.

17
#13827 4 years ago

Walking in with a receipt for a paid preorder from a failed business would not entitle you to ownership of the prototype. Stop with the bad advice and hyperbole.

#13828 4 years ago
Quoted from MK6PIN:

If a paid in full preorder individual went in with even basic law enforcement, and claimed ( with a receipt) these were the machines they had paid for, there would at least be a question, machines confiscated, and everyone would know where they were ( from my reading, many people doubted they even existed).

Thats not how any of this works.

These arent the products people bought. This is a development piece - customers have no claim to it. The police don't interject and decide civil matters on demand based on a receipt - they enforce court orders. This is the property of zidware until its sold or the court forces otherwise. The police don't perform vigilante procession... Smh

10
#13829 4 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Chris at Cointaker and Tony at GLM should be there ripping out the parts they never got paid for Too classy for that.

But Chris and Tony won't because they want to see this thing to the finish line as much as the rest of us suppliers and / or owners. We can waste our time being negative, or we can pick ourselves up and get things done.

And Fantasygoat.. of course it's "clunky". It's very much an alpha stage, both physically and electronically. Many parts (including the ramps) had to be bent or broken to get them to fit on the playfield. It's the sad truth. At first I thought "there's no way this thing could need ANOTHER 2-4 years to be finished!".. but after following along "elsewhere", I totally believe that to be true. It's truly a miracle that this thing is even flipping right now, and Bill and everyone else that banded together to make that happen need to be applauded! NOT beat down.

#13830 4 years ago
Quoted from pinball_customs:

But Chris and Tony won't because they want to see this thing to the finish line as much as the rest of us suppliers and / or owners. We can waste our time being negative, or we can pick ourselves up and get things done.

My sarcasm didn't come through loud enough! Yes, I hope the vendors are able to get made whole first, and if this goes forward, I'm happy Bill is going to do that up front for you guys.

If anybody wants Zidware assets such as that prototype, get a judgment against Zidware and then have the Sheriff execute it.

There are plenty lining up to do just that.

#13831 4 years ago
Quoted from ChadH:

Somebody do us all a favor and pick up the ball and throw it up the ramp so we can at least see the ramp flow.

yep waiting for a ramp shot.

#13832 4 years ago

Some people seem to be starting the game in novice mode which locks out some playfield modes, arcade mode is the mode with more features. Personally I will keep an open mind until I actually play a completed game with all the software modes in place and all the features 100% working. Some people don't seem to have the ability to understand the game is in a very rough prototype stage right now and can't seem to resist the urge to criticize it. What pisses me off is that this is all that's finished after all this time and the criticism for that should be directed at JPOP. As usual he's a pathological liar to the end, and recently claimed the machine was 95% finished which obviously it's not.

#13833 4 years ago

I think Jpop means he is 95% finished with it which still leaves the game at 50% for anyone else to pick up. So from his lying prospective he is telling the truth

#13834 4 years ago
Quoted from NYP:

Some people don't seem to have the ability to understand the game is in a very rough prototype stage right now and can't seem to resist the urge to criticize it.

Shouldn't be a surprise at all. It's any and every pin that gets that treatment, from Stern and JJP, ad nauseum!

All I care about right now is hoping Bill can put the right pricing structure together to get the quantity we need to have these pins get made.

As for the vendors, you guys will still have a good chance to get paid even if/when Zidware goes through bankruptcy, which is really how Bill should proceed anyhow. You get rid of the owner issues and then you can take care of the vendors and figure out what if anything you want to do with the prior owners.

#13835 4 years ago
Quoted from gambit3113:

Walking in with a receipt for a paid preorder from a failed business would not entitle you to ownership of the prototype. Stop with the bad advice and hyperbole.

Seems there has been a lot of entitlement and hyperbole already associated with all of this.....thank you for your advice( taken), and keep any of my thoughts that may perpetuate to myself.

#13836 4 years ago
Quoted from Pinchroma:

That playfield cover is REALLY impacting ball movement. You can see it flex and the ball change direction.

Agreed, I was noticing that too. Maybe it was the right call to install it rather than show bare wood, people wanted to see the package, but I wouldn't judge the way it shoots too harshly, it's obviously nothing like a "final" playfield will play.

#13837 4 years ago
Quoted from ledge:

yep waiting for a ramp shot.

Video already posted of this

#13838 4 years ago
Quoted from Fulltilt:

And you have HOW much money invested in this?? I have $9500 up Jpop's ass and I'm pretty damn excited to see what Bill has done in the past several weeks. So Jpop shot his wad playing pretend pinball manufacturer. That chapter is over, he's done, caput, out of these games.

What makes you think JPop is not involved? Bill has said it's in his licensee contract that he's going to hire/pay JPop. Nobody knows the exact detail of the agreement anyway. In all likelihood, JPop/Zidware still owns all the intellectual property and Pintasia simply has a license -- we don't even known if it's exclusive. JPop could sell as many licenses to the game as he did pre-orders for all we know. Until the actual contract between Zidware and Pintasia is made public, it's foolish for anybody to assume anyone but JPop is in control of things.

The big problem with the whole deal seems to be that JPop always had to have things done his way. He's surrounded himself with sycophants and cast out anyone who criticized him. Why should the deal with Pintasia be any different? This could simply be a shell game.

Bill appears to be a decent person - I have nothing against him, but he's avoided discussing the exact terms of his deal with Zidware, and that's absolutely critical if anybody wants to know to what degree JPop is involved and still profiting from the new shell.

Quoted from Fulltilt:

Now there is one good chance to get something produced, Bill is behind the project and moving things forward in the past several weeks more than I have seen in 2-3 years.

I'm sure you're a very nice guy - I have nothing against you, but statements like this are why it's honestly, really hard to be sympathetic to some in this predicament. There is zero indication this game can be made in any decent amount of time, even for the double-sized amount of money Bill is claiming. The "purplewood" proto is nowhere near being finished. Bill hasn't pledged the money needed to make the machine -- he's simply fronted a little money to make the prototype semi-presentable. I understand to you all this appears to be light years of progress, but to the rest of us, it's still a very shady situation.

I think your first priority shouldn't be to worry about whether this game will get made. Even if all the other pieces were in place, it would probably still take years to produce the game. If I were you, I'd worry about getting your money back. The time to get reimbursed is right now, while there are still assets. If you wait around, distracted by the shiny lights, by the time you realize this game isn't going to appear any time soon, you'll have lost your chance to get your money back.

Quoted from brent149:

After Predator and this, anyone who loses money depositing on phantom games deserves zero empathy. I bet they'll still be a few people throwing pre-order money at this prototype that will come away shocked when they have nothing to show for it.

Obviously, there are people right now who are still wanting to deal with JPop, thinking they'll get made right. I still haven't heard a good reason why there isn't a more aggressive campaign to pursue criminal charges. It's an interesting demographic of people Zidware managed to hoodwink, that are still at this late juncture, unwilling to admit the reality of the situation.

-4
#13839 4 years ago
Quoted from PinballHelp:

I think your first priority shouldn't be to worry about whether this game will get made. Even if all the other pieces were in place, it would probably still take years to produce the game. If I were you, I'd worry about getting your money back. The time to get reimbursed is right now, while there are still assets. If you wait around, distracted by the shiny lights, by the time you realize this game isn't going to appear any time soon, you'll have lost your chance to get your money back.

Aren't you a software guy? Is this your professional opinion again, over and over? Did you stay at a Holiday Inn last night

#13840 4 years ago

Instead of rehashing all the same old bs...How about some gameplay talk!

Does anyone know how the upper playfield is intended to work? Is it isolated from the rest of the game (magnets control the big ball only) or does it interact with the regular game balls?

Any ideas on the levitating ball mech?

#13841 4 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Aren't you a software guy? Is this your professional opinion again, over and over? Did you stay at a Holiday Inn last night

This is so DEJA VU.... everybody is so enamoured with the "purplewood" that they're willing to ignore the reality that each and every moment that goes by without an aggressive campaign to get people their refunds, that money is drying up and will never materialize.

But I digress, how about that artwork! Awesome! Great job Zombie!

It's an interesting, neat game, but it's hard to look at it and not be overwhelmed by it being a symbol of exploitation.

#13842 4 years ago

Another video of MG Proto Pin that i took on SAT from NW pinball show.

Very Pretty pin, but obviously far from complete.
Apparently game was only semi-working in the novice mode,
or whomever was controlling/monitoring people playing
instructed them to choose novice (2 ball play)

#13843 4 years ago
Quoted from shlockdoc:

What Patents are pending for this machine as it states in the photo?
And there is a "theater of magic" post in there? Very clever.

image.jpg

No idea, but maybe calling it a Space Shuttle Of Magic post was too obvious. That one had it a decade before Theatre Of Magic.

#13844 4 years ago

another video perspective. my apologies for poor video quality.

Weirdest contraption was the plunger skill shot, needed the softest touch to make otherwise ball comes blasting back into plunger start lane. Would get annoying after a while.

#13845 4 years ago

Put me down for a game or two if VFW Pinball ever gets one. Or, if one shows up at a show I attend or is in someone's collection that I get to see. No way would I be buying that unless they end up selling for under $2k in 2015 dollars.

#13846 4 years ago
Quoted from TOK:

No idea, but maybe calling it a Space Shuttle Of Magic post was too obvious. That one had it a decade before Theatre of Magic.

I don't think Theatre of Magic has a center post like that... I don't really understand the reference, honestly.

#13847 4 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

Really? Because every shot I've seen so far has the ramps blocking part of the screen. The scoring seems to be put into a "virtual DMD" in the center to alleviate that.
That includes the one above. But I'd love to hear first hand reports on it.

First let me say that the game is stunningly beautiful! As for the screen placement, I played it and the ramps were not obstructing the display.

Disclaimer... I am 6' 1" so I can speak to what a 5 foot tall player would see.

10
#13848 4 years ago
Quoted from roffels:

I don't think Theatre of Magic has a center post like that... I don't really understand the reference, honestly.

The prototype Theatre Of Magic playfields did indeed have a center post between the flippers that never made it to the production games (the Magic Girl center post appears to reference it).

You can see the center post in this pic of a TOM prototype playfield (it was labeled the "Magic Post"):
109509.jpg

#13849 4 years ago
Quoted from gambit3113:

Walking in with a receipt for a paid preorder from a failed business would not entitle you to ownership of the prototype. Stop with the bad advice and hyperbole.

What if the receipt clearly says prototype #4 or whatever number this is, with a fully paid note?

#13850 4 years ago
Quoted from Concretehardt:

First let me say that the game is stunningly beautiful! As for the screen placement, I played it and the ramps were not obstructing the display.
Disclaimer... I am 6' 1" so I can speak to what a 5 foot tall player would see.

You can bend your knee's a bit when playing..

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