Well, at least the swirly ramp return doesn't take as long as I thought it would.

BTW System 11s fold .

you wanna commend the guys for working on this game and bringing it to this show that's fine. This whole scenario just doesn't sit well with me. Too much money was stolen and not one pinsider will end up with this game in their game room. That pretty much sums it up.

True but if you can spend 16k or even 20k for a game then you got to much money and need give me some

All this talk about the ramp shot, and we finally get a video of it....made by hand....and it's completely anti climactic.

Overall I think the pin itself looks great though. If it plays good/shoots well and there is decent flow, I'd consider buying one at half it's original price (in the unlikely even it gets made).

A vacuum? Cool. It's about time we had a game that cleans up after itself.

Okay. What does that have to do with thumbs up to people posting videos?

Jpops next jobimage.jpg

Hey....What are you, a hater? Just pipe down and look at the pretty lights.

Maybe Pintasia's second game will be "Pinball Lemmings."

The art is OK ? You call that OK ? I dont know if you could downplay your work more by calling it OK.

Yeti, I dont think you understand that YOUR art is the ONLY reason this project has the slightest chance in hell of ever getting produced.

Lets say this machine was a whitewood.. yeah i dont even need to go there.

It's not Yeti's fault, but the art is kind of a jumbled mess, IMHO. Perhaps it looks better in person? John's art direction (too complex, to many ideas jammed into small places, too much purple, etc) diminished what could have been great.

In a perfect no-strings-attached world I would love to see this game made. Too bad that's not the world we live in. The history of this game is littered with too many negatives for it to ever see the light of day.

The road to the finish line is long, steep, and full of landmines.

The challenge of doing the impossible will turn from fun to misery long before the end of this odessy is reached.

Yeah ... They should notice that there is a market of 16 people and only 183 more are needed to make it happen.

Stern sell 1000s. Not dozens.

rd.

I'm curious why any programmer who was not getting paid didn't drop some kind of "time bomb" into the code?

I once wrote a piece of software for a car dealership that kept track of people who walked on the lot for marketing purposes. I had heard they had a problem paying suppliers but I took the job anyway. They never paid me the last payment, but I had an algorithm in the code, where a certain (very obscure) name, if entered into the database, would cause the whole system to lock up. When they didn't pay me, I had a friend walk onto the lot and give them the secret name. The next day I got paid

Classic

Maybe there was a no ramp shot time bomb.

Awesome thanks for posting. Forgot about posting it since upload took sooooo long

Awesome thanks for posting. Forgot about posting it since upload took sooooo long

Yeah but to be fair this was 16K to "speculate" that a small number of "collectable" machines would get made. Not quite the same thing... apples and oranges and all that.

But with pins barely hanging on I guess every title will have to be a familiar, flavor of the month kind of thing. Oh well...

It got made of course about 2min after I made the vid.

Why would someone that wasn't already in, pay for this game knowing that a large percentage was going to fund games for those who already paid? It seems like the game is starting at zero and anything it costs from here on out to build should be born equally by anyone getting one, even if you paid $16k already. So if it costs $7k to build, anyone getting one should pay $7k. I think it would be hard to swallow funding someone else's game for most people.

I can't disagree with this more strongly. I am blown away by the art and think its incredible. This game would not be nearly so compelling without his touch. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion - mine is that ZY's work here is right up my alley! I'd be thrilled beyond belief if a pinball with his artwork makes it to production one day.

You'd be paying for the development cost which was paid by the "investors." The game build would be on top of what is already been spent on the game.

downer.jpg

And you have HOW much money invested in this?? I have $9500 up Jpop's ass and I'm pretty damn excited to see what Bill has done in the past several weeks. So Jpop shot his wad playing pretend pinball manufacturer. That chapter is over, he's done, caput, out of these games. Now there is one good chance to get something produced, Bill is behind the project and moving things forward in the past several weeks more than I have seen in 2-3 years.

Trolling to try and make Jpop look bad is too little too late. The train has left that station.

No way they have a hundred K into this game! Only if their deal included 90 K to Jpop first . They just want you to think they have more skin in the game than you. Everytime someone claims they helped, they say they did it for free. On what exactly did they spend that kind of cash ?

No. It's not too hard. It's nothing like replacing a playfield.

I agree, watching the twitch feed and hearing stories from many of those artists is great stuff and sorely missed in today's new machines. I think that's in large part what drove the success of Woah Nellie.

All quiet here crazy.!

I've read the last several pages when it appeared the game would show up at this event. Did I miss the part as to why it was rushed to this point, last minute, and brought there?

Is there an active marketing push, or just a one- off " look at me" machine?

None of this makes sense...preorder, loyal customers / vendors have lost at least 6 figures, over a period of several years, but the machine can be brought to an event for what purpose? Certainly not to be resold as a proto to new buyers ( that would be major fraud).

What am I missing here? If I preordered and paid in full, that "proto" would be coming home with me, as is. At least some recoup of investment....

Sorry for everyone involved....don't give a shit what the machine looks or plays like, something not right here....mark

After the truly miraculous events of today and with the public clamouring for this machine, I really don't know how Bill and PDX won't make the cover of Forbes magazine.

Yes, the majority of us are confused as to why this was done.

I don't have a horse in this race TL;DNR, but could someone recap this post?

Re-cap is still the same.

Huh? It's obvious why they did it. We were clambering for a reveal. So they finished it up to an alpha prototype as fast as they could to get it to a show so people could see it.

That's not the problem here. This is exactly what people were asking for years ago. It's not Pintasia's fault John is a screwup and basically abandoned the game to go play with other ones, in some kind of cascading intention to never finish shit. So yeah, the proto is rough after 4 years. We all still wanted to see it.

If you're in this thread, and you claim you weren't curious to see Magic Girl flipping, in any format, then I don't believe you.

Wasn't this done to avoid pre-order folks from suing? Suing JPOP/Zidware would have an adverse effect on the contract Pinvasion has with them. Maybe the showing will build some confidence?

I'm curious, alright...Curious why someone that has paid for either of these machines hasn't brought a receipt and law enforcement to claim them. I have nothing financial involved, but view it as a blatant insult to fellow Pinsiders to have paid for a game and have a version " rubbed in their face" at a trade show .

Admit, it is really infuriating to read, as a lot of people invested hard earned money in good faith, and something like this happens.....and it is getting praise? Wtf.....

Outside of the art, it hasn't gotten much praise. In fact, it's been a pretty disappointing reveal.

What's more disappointing to me is this was done at all.....tank the " company" ( loosely used in this instance) , liquefy assets ( personal and business...John has to be seen as a personal guarantor , regardless of corp.), move on.

I think it would hurt me more to see ( I'd never touch or play) a machine I believed in and paid for, but couldn't be had for reasons beyond my control. To even have it there further tarnishes the finish on a hobby that had been re surging .

Will drop out for now, as my anger is rising, and that fixes nothing. Just know there are fellow Pinsiders out there that have no " skin" in this game and are hurting for those that do....wrong man, just wrong....peace...mark

I don't know... I think it was kind of a necessary reality check to see where things are at. Now that everyone has seen how far away from completion the game truly is and how much of a dog it is to play they can put it to rest and concentrate on going after John and trying to recoup some of their losses. The fact that there are barely any reviews of the gameplay speak volumes for how poorly this game was received besides having great artwork. The game needs a playfield redesign (the flow blocking genie lamp has to go!) and at least a couple more years of work to bring it up to snuff and I can't see anyone willing to put in the time or money to make it happen.

1) I hope Yeti makes millions selling his art.....and I'd gladly help him get started
2) I hope Jpop is never seen or heard from in this community again
3) This pin will remain a "one-of" and never even see completed code
4) I hope that "pre-order pinball" is dead forever
5) I'm sure I'm wrong about #4

After Predator and this, anyone who loses money depositing on phantom games deserves zero empathy. I bet they'll still be a few people throwing pre-order money at this prototype that will come away shocked when they have nothing to show for it.

To be clear you are referring to the whole package, not the playfield art or backglass? I can easily list off a dozen highly acclaimed pinball machines with denser artwork and dozens more that have artwork that makes no sense. All the extra artwork on the plastics and overhead magnets do add to the jumble, but it's no where near a mess.

What kind of law enforcement exactly?

The Pinball Police, of course.
KeystoneCops.jpg

So in other words, psychotherapy.

What are the features of the MG playfield? Anything magical to set it apart from the latest Stern?

I could not agree with you more on #2 and #4.

Yes it makes your money disappear.

A shot under the playfield.

20150606_164813.jpg

More gameplay...
Watch "Magic Girl Gameplay" on YouTube

Because law enforcement would remind you that you would be stealing from all the other prepayers etc. that have money in this. You could force them to sell the proto and evenly divide the proceedings between everyone having money in this....your share will be very small.

How is this kind of thinking - "I want this machine as indemnification for myself" - and not caring the least bit about the others invested in this better than what JPop did?

You really need to open your eyes to business reality. Companies go bankrupt all the time, people lose most of their investments, the IP is bought out and someone else finishes and goes live with the product - in some cases even making a fortune on it.

A big part of the problem is mentioned by yourself: "...invested hard earned money in good faith...". Tell any investor, businessman or non-pinball friends that you invested hard earned money in "good faith" (and not much more than good faith) and be surprised by what they will answer.
You bet on the wrong horse, you invested in the wrong company, you believed in the wrong person. All natural concerns and clear thinking was thrown overboard in the light of a shiny & rare new toy. A lot of this disaster originates in the wrong and somewhat naive belief that an artist and pinball designer must be competent to run an economical challenging business. I think it's safe to say that artists are among the ones to been known to typically have less connection to "hard facts business" than most other professions.

Now it seems that someone with the necessary financial potential and business competence has stepped in and is trying to evaluate if the IP is worth going for, if there is still enough interest in the machine, if it is feasible and what it would take to produce the machine. Thus the presentation & the "offer" to the original prepayers.

And don't be fooled by the emotionally loaded comments about no one wanting this machine due to it's history. If it is released it will be one of the most collectable pins ever made and the value, depending on numbers produced, will probably go through the roof. Not despite but because of it's history. I'm not saying it's a good move, but if a pinhead friend called me saying he just got a MG I'd jump in the car immediately and be there lightning fast.

Whatever, I still feel deeply sorry for anyone invested in this. There really is no "right" solution to this situation, either way it will cost you a lot of money which makes me very sad.
Maybe the single positive effect of this will be that future projects in pinball will have to be approached in a far more professional and thoughtful way leading to more healthy and realistic endeavors. After the pitchforks have been tucked away again, that is.