(Topic ID: 224963)

Joe Balcer confirms Oktoberfest as American Pinball's next pin.


By PismoArcade

1 year ago



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Topic index (key posts)

3 key posts have been marked in this topic

Post #928 Oktoberfest initial release pics and rule card pic Posted by PinballSTAR (12 months ago)

Post #1686 Updated (final?) Oktoberfest cabinet art Posted by HOOKED (9 months ago)

Post #1954 Link to 3/1/19 streaming video Posted by chuckwurt (7 months ago)


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#135 1 year ago
Quoted from branlon8:

I’ve been to Oktoberfest a number of times. Great idea for a pin ! And for sure all the folks in Cincinnati will know what this is about !
And hearing some polkas coming from the speakers - dreamy !

Damn straight, Oktoberfest Zinzinnati is huge and a great time! All of these posts saying no one outside Germany knows what / when it is are surprising to me because I know a lot of other cities have Octoberfests too, I was in Boise last week and there were signs for their upcoming Octoberfest all up and down the streets. I understand it seems like a strange theme choice but I'll wait and see what they do with it. I love Ghostbusters as a theme but think the game sucks so theme doesn't guarantee a great game and vice versa.

#236 1 year ago
Quoted from knockerlover:

For all those who think theme is everything, go buy a Houdini and don't complain about the shots

Done and done!

#237 1 year ago
Quoted from rubberducks:

This ridiculous puritannical bent is a peculiarly American thing. Whether it be the drinking, or the merest hint of sexuality. I don't think it's even a minor factor in any other market.
Drinking age for wine and beer is 14 in Germany, purchasing at 16, spirits at 18. Not 21 for everything, as in the US. Most European countries it's the same or lower.
If it's made holier than thou it'll be looked on with scorn here.

I love to tell people about the open bar BMW has in the waiting area at the Velt when you are picking up your European Delivery car. No chance in hell you'd see that in the States, especially since there is no one there checking IDs.

That said, I think they can still make a family friendly game that appeals to adults as long as they don't take it to the extreme.

#279 1 year ago
Quoted from greenhornet:

look at what josh said about houdini - they treated it as a licensed theme. all the aspects of houdinis life were already predetermined. they had the mans likeness. his profession as a magician/escape artist. the time period was set. the magic acts/escapes he was renowned for. the films he made. his connection with mediums and the spiritual world. no additional subject matter was required or needed to complete this theme. it was all handed to them on a silver platter. just come up with the art, call outs, some music, and animations.

I think this severely over-simplifies what they had to do, sure they had his likeness and some silent movies to pull some ideas from by it's a long way from having assets given to them. For instance the whole steam-punk direction of the art isn't really dictated by Houdini's legacy or even era of prominence, it was thought-up by the artist. It also means all the animations have to be done from scratch, no movie scenes to loop, etc. I agree that it's not the same as hatching a complete character and theme from out of the blue but it's still a lot of from-scratch work that had to be done.

#285 1 year ago
Quoted from mcbPalisade:

Could be, never got that far or noticed ) - :

So you dismiss potential unique features on a game when you never experienced them.

#290 1 year ago
Quoted from mcbPalisade:

I don't dismiss, just don't appreciate. The menu system in Houdini is very unique. And very costly for little value added. I bet many wish they had just done something simple (and more standard) and put that extra effort into perfecting the game.
I bet AP does the same thing for the UMM-PA-PA game too. Fancy menus and still bug fixing 9 months out.

What is so unique about the menu system? I don't see anything there that appears to have been overly expensive, they need a menu system for the game and future titles so something had to be created. They probably spent a bunch of time writing game routines that they can use over and over in future titles too, it's called development from the ground up. WOZ has a very "unique" menu system too, I guess they should have stuck with a command line interface? As for bug-fixes, that happens and at least they are fixing them and not leaving it to rot.

We get it, you don't like Houdini.

#307 1 year ago
Quoted from vireland:

Where there's sour grapes there's whine.

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#311 1 year ago

So it would appear that maybe it's not just Americans that get offended or upset by some skin being exposed. I guess there are grumpy people waiting to complain in every country. http://www.foxnews.com/travel/2018/09/10/female-oktoberfest-tourists-slammed-for-porno-dresses-accused-ruining-tradition.html

#352 1 year ago
Quoted from vid1900:

Tons of children and families at Oktoberfest
You should attend before you comment.

Agreed, in fact the one time we went it was during the day (Air France went on strike and screwed up our plans to spend multiple days there) and I even commented to my wife that there was WAY less drinking going on than I expected. We made some friends with a great group of people from Dusseldorf that let us squat at their table in one of the tents for a while, enjoyed the beer, food and atmosphere a lot!

#384 1 year ago
Quoted from rosh:

Okay, I've got a whitewood to go shoot and some jokes to write

I think you meant to say "I've got some updated Houdini code to release."

#398 1 year ago
Quoted from PinPatch:

Too soft insult your strength, different level of softness, different insult.

Nope, as Houdini taught us people get their feelings hurt these days if a pinball machine insults or mocks their lack of skill too much.

1 week later
#479 1 year ago
Quoted from MEuRaH:

A beer-themed/party pin sounds AWESOME to me. You guys are crazy. There's not many like this made and nearly everyone I know loves a good beer. To have a pin themed as such would amplify the fun.
BTW, Dialed In is a destruction-themed game, not a cell phone one. Dialed In Electronics (D.I.E)? The eye inside the triangle? The chaos unleashed on a city that you get to DESTROY if you hit the right shots? Choas mode with that has that creepy voice that says "we cannot be stopped"?
I played this game in the dark by myself one night and got to a point that I realized what was actually happening in the game and got goose bumps as I let out an audible "oh my god...". Dialed In is actually quite a freaky game disguised with a friendly-looking theme. You charge the phone and the eyeball pops up looking at you menacingly for a second, blinks, then disappears..... dude... freaky.

Can you disable the "Crazy" callouts or any of those modes like Selfie and Emoji Overload? I just plaid the game again this past week and those two things are really annoying to me, so much so that I'd never own it. I'm not as enamored with the layout as many others are (I hate blind shots from a third flipper) but it can be fun to shoot if you get some good stuff going.

1 week later
#535 1 year ago
Quoted from rubberducks:

Balcer tends to do very different layouts. I doubt it will resemble Houdini much.

Nirmal discussed this on the podcast and Joe has also said it would be very different more approachable with some more wide-open shots. Looking forward to the reveal!

1 week later
#671 1 year ago
Quoted from LTG:

Think piano. White keys, black keys.
LTG : )

You mean klavier, right and wouldn't a Glockenspiel or accordion be more appropriate?

#755 12 months ago
Quoted from stevevt:

I'm sure it'll be up at some point soon.

That's what she said!

#854 12 months ago

Okay, we need to figure out how to get one of these to Pincinnati next month if at all possible! Can't wait to play it!

#860 12 months ago

If that awesome right "corkscrew" wire form only gets used to release multiballs that seems like a huge waste / disappointment to me. Hopefully it's more that that. Great looking game and definitely a pretty unique layout and set of features, if this is $7K MSRP like Houdini I think the buyer is getting a lot of relative value for their pinball buck.

#866 12 months ago
Quoted from DerGoetz:

You must hate Deadpool and Lord of the rings....

I'm a lover, not a hater. Deadpool was under-whelming to me but I love LOTR, not sure where the comparison applies though.

#1171 12 months ago
Quoted from lpeters82:

I only played one game on it, but my take is that ball times were long. Perhaps settings can make it more challenging. Wire forms are cool looking, but are slow. The yellow ramp was difficult for me, but that may change with more plays. Looks like there will be some deep code in learning which stein to activate for each play style. Fun, but not a game I need to own. Overall a solid second effort.

Joe said he wanted it to be very different than Houdini and considering how many people still cry about the "impossible" shots on that it makes sense that some will complain about long ball times on this. I watched Bowden play two games and he certainly didn't kill it in either one so it can't be THAT easy.

#1252 12 months ago
Quoted from jwilson:

It's not my cup of tea, but belabouring the point won't change it much like it didn't change Houdini at all, which has much the same issues.

I've heard this criticism of Houdini art a lot but I don't get it and nearly every single person that sees mine in person, pinheads and non pinheads alike, comment on how beautiful it is. So maybe these are things that people who are artists or really into art notice and don't enjoy but I think most "other" people find it to be at least generally pleasing if not beautiful, at least in the case of Houdini. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, to each their own, etc., etc.

#1256 12 months ago
Quoted from NimblePin:

Well, if you put Houdini next to let’s say, a Thunderbirds, (like they have in Banning) then, yeah... Houdini’s art package becomes even MORE amazing to look at!

Mine is close to CV and WOZ, two games rarely compared to Thunderbirds (I hope), but yeah.

#1291 11 months ago
Quoted from Rascal_H:

Start a thread for owners. I would but I’m not buying the game (I don’t think).

Or we could use this thread that has "Oktoberfest" in it's name to discuss it.

#1372 11 months ago
Quoted from Ferret:

Fun pinball development trivia: the early whitewood had the coaster ramp but not the coaster lock device. We were shooting the coaster ramp with such speed that occasionally the ball would fly right on through the top stretch of the ramp so fast that it just smacked into the side of the cabinet, instead of following the coaster ramp wireform. Oops.

Since we're talking about CV "issues" this would be kind of like a really, really good shot to the Acrobats wireform flying off at the top and rolling down the side of the cab. I haven't played it yet but the execution of the coaster lock looked really good in the stream I watched.

#1378 11 months ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

Agree. The main theme currently being used doesn't say "Oktoberfest" to me but rather generic rock cover band. Seems out of place as the main theme.

There is (or was, not sure they're still around) a Polka-ish band here in Cincinnati that did a version of "Comfortably Numb", it was awesome in a "I've drank a lot of beer" way. Maybe they can get something similar for the game but with songs that wouldn't cost as much as Pink Floyd would.

#1383 11 months ago
Quoted from colonel_caverne:

Is the left ramp lifting ramp? Can’t see clearly on pics.
Edit: got my answer on twip.

Yes, it's a lift ramp and I was a little worried when I first heard that because of some poor implementations of lift-ramps in other games. However those that played the game said it does not feel like a lift ramp when you hit it so I'm encouraged.

#1472 11 months ago
Quoted from benheck:

Yup. I lived this 4 years back. That's why I've been so vocal about this game's art.
Pins are all about art now. It'll sell a theme nobody wanted (like Metallica) and it will sink a sure bet (like Beatles)
If yoy haven't noticed this trend you haven't been paying attention.

When I step up to play Metallica I'm happy because I know it's a great playing game, not because off the music or the art. Unless it has an ugly big face in the middle of the playfield or something equally hideous it doesn't matter that much to me as long as the game plays great and has great rules that make it fun. I don't like 95% of Metallica's music but the game is fun and that's what matters the most.

#1474 11 months ago
Quoted from frolic:

I think the art is important to pinball because that is generally the only metric we online people can analyze for a long time. Most people in this thread were not at Expo and did not play it. So what can we do? Look at it. If its not connecting on that level out of the gate it just makes it a bigger uphill climb for the title.

Agreed but I will never buy a game I haven't been able to play, I don't buy games to "collect" or look at them, I buy them to play the hell out of them. I agree there are some weird parts of the art on OKF but I disagree with Ben's statement that "Pins are all about art now", if the game plays really well and is a lot of fun I can get past some questionable art very quickly and I think most others would as well.

#1493 11 months ago
Quoted from benheck:

I think AP should run a contest. Any dude who thinks the twisted waist woman looks OK, snap a photo of their wife attempting that same pose and it it matches you get a free game!

If she's a Cirque do Soleil performer you're getting a free game!!

2 weeks later
#1559 11 months ago

If you are like me and didn't make it to Expo but seriously want a chance to play Oktoberfest American Pinball is bringing it and Houdini to Pincinnati in just over two weeks!

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/pincinnati-the-greater-cincinnati-pinball-show-1130-122/page/5#post-4687167

#1561 11 months ago
Quoted from colonel_caverne:

I wonder if Oktoberfest will be there with its final artwork.

My guess is that it will be one of the games from Expo but that has not been confirmed. There is one-sure fire way to find out for yourself though, make the trip to Cincinnati (or Zinzinnati as we call it during Oktoberfest here)!

2 weeks later
#1633 10 months ago
Quoted from BarryJ:

They were having a competition, so everyone in that game had to sit while they played.

Saturday was over 14 hours for me.. Annnnd 8 am I am at work on Monday. WTH

We had really basic code on the machine with extra long ball save times, so everyone would have the ability to play the machine long enough to get a feel for it.. Believe in me, the ball times are way shorter on the real code.

Great meeting and shooting the bull with you Barry, thanks so much again for making the trip and bringing Oktoberfest, can't wait to see the progress.

#1645 10 months ago

I thought the music was just fine for the game, there are some mechanical and design issues that need tweaked and in my conversations with Barry and Nirmal at Pincinnati it was obvious they know that and are working on it. I think it says a lot about them that they were still willing to bring the game, warts and all to the show and I am very much looking forward to how it progresses, there is a LOT of potential for a amazing game. I also applaud Jeff Busch for his tribute to the monkey on the (presumably) temporary backglass that was on the game, I literally LOL'd.

#1649 10 months ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

It’s just damn hard to hit. I don’t think I hit it once in 20 games.

That was one of the shots Barry told me they were working on. I thought Nirmal was blowing smoke up my ass when I played my first game, hit it twice quickly and he said how difficult it was, he's correct.

2 months later
#1827 7 months ago
Quoted from rosh:

His is a bit of a Frankenstein,

You heard it here first, AP's next game is Frankenstein!

#1846 7 months ago
Quoted from LTG:

Try Chris at Kingpin games or Jesse at Pincades.
LTG : )

I'll second the recommendation for Jesse at Pincades, he's great to work with and is pretty tight with the A.P. guys.

#1851 7 months ago

My wife wanted me to cancel my LAX plans and go to Florida with her for the weekend, can't say I wasn't tempted but I was pretty sure this game was going to be there so I'm happy I'll get to play it again!

#1867 7 months ago

I really liked the long, slow roll down the roller-coaster ramp, it's different. I wouldn't want every shot or even every other shot doing it but used properly I think it's cool. I can see it being an advantageous shot during MBs to (I have no idea if this is possible or not in the code) have the ball take a while to get back to you so you can get control or hit another shot while waiting for it.

#1901 7 months ago
Quoted from greenhornet:

the wire forms obscure the view of the playfield.

From a players perspective they really don't.

-1
#1947 7 months ago
Quoted from zaki:

Where do you get the stream at to see all this? Is this new or is this just the old stuff on you tube?

The SDTM guys (chuckwurt) streamed it from the Louisville show yesterday, you should find it on their twitch stream. FWIW I played it a lot yesterday, with many different people, not one mentioned the music and at no point did it ever register as out of place or annoying in anyway to me. It's true I'm at the show with a lot of other noise around me but I still don't think it's an issue.

#1974 7 months ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

It’s a bit like the warp ramp on sttng. You gotta find it.. and it takes a few games. It’s a tough shot, but not because it cheats you or anything.

It is on a different spot on the flipper than you think from looking at it, once I figured that out I could hit it semi-reliably with the mag nab helping. I spent most of my time on the game trying for the Corkscrew MB and hit it a few times over the weekend, when I decided to work on the Beer Barrel multiball yesterday my skills in general just completely left me and I couldn't hit a thing on any game. At these shows there's usually a long wait to play a new game like OKF so you can't get in a lot of games and you have a lot of time between those games so you have to re-find your shots each time.

To back-up your comparison to the warp ramp on STTNG, mine was there all weekend and I saw very few people hit that shot and I don't think the Borg lock was hit once all weekend based on the credit dot that was there due to that. I tested it and could hit it but I play that game a lot, most people at the show don't.

#1979 7 months ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

It’s like trying to setup and make the whirlwind ramp during MB.

Good comparison, I hadn't played Whirlwind in a LONG time and it took me a long time to find that shot on the one there this weekend. Still couldn't hit it reliably once I did and of course it's even harder during MB.

#1980 7 months ago
Quoted from rosh:

Also watching the stream you can see how many folks are not even thinking about the upper flipper and going for the ramp. I kept trying to flip it for them while watching, which made wife think I was developing a nervous tick or something.

LOL - It's like the passenger-side invisible brake pedal to use a cargument.

-1
#1990 7 months ago

I think the male voice is fine, some of had some NSFW jokes about how the female says "corkscrew" but that kind of juvenile stuff will be found in any game by me and the people I hang with.

From a shots perspective the one I think could still use some work is that 'flip' ramp shot on the right, I got a lot of rejects from that one.

#1991 7 months ago
Quoted from ZMeny:

First gameplay of Oktoberfest: Pinball On Tap
Pre-order yours now at Flip N Out Pinball
847.778.4876
zach@flipnoutpinball.com

8:32 for example of mag-nab and beer-barrel lock combo.

#1997 7 months ago
Quoted from mthirkell:

Thanks. I'm sad to say that I just watched 12 minutes and that repetative guitar rif will be in my head for days. Not much going on - maybe just because its new to the player. Zero corkscrew shots - I'm not even sure where it is.

There are multiple instances of Corkscrew locks and several Corkscrew MBs in that video. You light the lock by spelling OCKTOBER and FEST via stand-up targets above the left and right out/in lanes. Then the ramp drops down on the left and what would otherwise be a left loop shot is now up the ramp and locked in the corkscrew lock in the middle back of the backboard. This shot was very difficult to make on the game back in November once the game had been played for a while - I never had that problem with the game this weekend so that has definitely been fixed.

#2029 7 months ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

Most people that played the beer in hand mode had no idea what was going on, but it’s hilarious.

Yeah, I think it needs a real clear warning like the "cross your arms NOW!" sequence for Strait-Jacket escape in Houdini, except maybe (in the adult mode) it would say "grab your beer now!"

#2067 7 months ago
Quoted from BMore-Pinball:

No, but from what I have seen the video graphics are so bad that they are distracting
Why use an LCD if you are going to have crappy graphics - should of released this game with a DMD

The DMD and effort to learn how to do dots for it would likely be more expensive that what they are doing with the LCD.

#2097 7 months ago
Quoted from pinballinreno:

Very much looking forward to playing it a TPF. Might be one of the highlights of the show.
Looks like great fun!

Just be sure you don't look at the display while playing or all fun will be voided.

#2122 7 months ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

I'm also not a fan of the two areas with 5 or so half standup targets, I just don't find large groupings of mini standup targets interesting to hit.

The magnets in those two areas definitely add some interesting things to those shots but I get what you're saying.

-1
#2148 7 months ago
Quoted from pinballjj:

what is your point ? quick is better than good?

How about "they had a lot more time to work on it"?

#2152 7 months ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

They also choose to put the time and money into creating some of the highest quality animations, music, features, and rules in pinball. It shows in all of their games.

Without a doubt, I was just giving an explanation for what jawjaw probably meant with his comment. Time does = $$ though and we know that if not for investors bailing them out JJP would most likely be OOB.

#2276 7 months ago
Quoted from balt:

Now that I've slept on it, I realize rosh and ferret addressed my biggest gripe about the Houdini code on Octoberfest and I hope they'll go back and do the same thing on Houdini. After a ball drains on Houdini, there's a long list of possible achievements showing how many of them were earned. If you had a short ball, you see a looooong list of zeros. That is so negative, I don't need to be reminded of how poorly I played. On Octoberfest, the list of achievements only shows what you accomplished. Positive reinforcement. No zeros shown. I earned a few steins and some ducks. Thank you Josh and Joe.

This is weak sauce in my opinion, just like getting rid of the heckling for missed skill-shots. Next we'll have to go disable every "Play Better" call out in any S.R. game that has them.

#2311 7 months ago
Quoted from rosh:

We are testing out a change to the right 180 ramp designed to reduce rejects and so far pretty pleased with it. Would be retrofitted to the games already built. Possible this change will be on the machines at TPF.

Very happy to hear about this as it was the only shot on the game I thought needed to be re-worked, I had a lot of rejects from it.

2 weeks later
#2404 6 months ago
Quoted from vireland:

The most frustrating part is the art package can be fixed by just hiring a GOOD artist with experience in art direction specifically for games.

You may not like his style but it's hard to say that he doesn't have experience with art direction for games:

https://www.ipdb.org/search.pl?any=Jeff+Busch&search=Search+Database&searchtype=quick

#2412 6 months ago
Quoted from vireland:

B> 23 years ago for the last credit

Not sure why Houdini doesn't show up there because he certainly did the art for that game. How does one go about getting things added or edited in an IPDB listing anyway?

#2425 6 months ago
Quoted from vireland:

We know he's doing AP stuff now, they were trying to point out that he has experience, but it's a LONG TIME ago and of dubious quality in essentially a different format then, too.
IPDB has been having server problems so lots of stuff is slow to be updated or has fallen through the cracks. This is probably one of them.

Yes, I was the one making the point that he does indeed have experience specifically in pinball - not exactly a top 10 list by any objective means though the era most of his work was in wasn't particularly great in general IMO. I LOVE the art package in Houdini, even the animations seem to fit well and the moving gears steam-punk scoring display is superb. I'm not an artist by any means so if there are "problems" with it I'm blissfully ignorant of them. I think OKT is visually fine from a printed art standpoint but do agree some of the animations could be much better, I don't think that would ever stop me from dumping money in one or seriously consider it for my collection though. Would be interesting to see a poll of how many pinheads notice these things versus those that don't, specifically the relatively minor artwork "issues" the same few seem to find in every game.

#2453 6 months ago
Quoted from wesman:

But Jeff wasn't responsible for the animations in Houdini, and I assume Oktoberfest as well.

He is listed in the credits of Houdini for Art and Animations, I obviously have no idea what his level of involvement is / was though. Not that it really matters I suppose, if you don't like what's on the screen you don't like what's on the screen.

#2454 6 months ago
Quoted from delt31:

btw - if AP determines they need to make their games cost 7500 to include proper/better animations and presentations, I would easily spend the extra 500. I think many would feel the same way. It's not a price thing (for me).

Oktoberfest already MSRPs for $7400.

#2455 6 months ago
Quoted from BMore-Pinball:

I agree animation is not at the top of the importance list in pinball
BUT
I think if you are going to put an LCD screen on your machine, you better have some decent video/animations for that screen.
If you are not going to put in the effort, then you should scrap the LCD and put in a DMD
Compared to what others are doing - Stern, JJP, Spooky - with their most recent machines, these animations stand out like a sore thumb and should be an embarrassment - heck JPOP had better animations on his failed games then this one.
At this point I would do what others have suggested and remove some of the awful animations, like the people walking around, and replace them with higher quality static images. The poor animations just distract from what looks like a really fun game

The DMD thing has been mentioned before, dots are harder to do than animations on an LCD and the DMD would probably cost more than the LCD display.

The comparison to a JPOP game with shots that don't go anywhere and f@#ed many people out of serious cash??

#2472 6 months ago
Quoted from vireland:

The graphics and animation don't compare favorably to Spike Sterns, either. Screen size is not the issue.

No but the build quality, number of toys, light show, etc. is considerably better than Spike - Houdini feels like a 90s B/W or JJP game compared to GOTG.

#2498 6 months ago
Quoted from benheck:

There's no depth to any of this art, that's why it looks flat.
Here's a simple mockup. The beer is closer to the camera, which makes it look more inviting. Like "Here, have a beer!" not "I'm holding this beer against my nipple!"
Give it a slight tilt. Shade around the beer to show it's clearly in front of the subject. I also adjusted the arm so it looks more like the forearm is pointing forward (like the photo of the woman above) which then makes the angle of the fist make sense.
[quoted image]

Come on Ben, you're from Wisconsin and should know if you hold your beer like that some is going to spill!

#2499 6 months ago

I also don't think it's fair to compare the CGC remakes, other than the improved dots (if you buy the version that has them) all their art (and playfield design, etc.) was done for them a long time ago. Even with the improved dots they are just taking an existing product and modernizing it, not creating it from scratch.

#2506 6 months ago
Quoted from Aurich:

"You people who have studied this stuff for years are incapable of seeing it". Just stop.
The whole package matters. If you can't see that it's not because you have some magic common man vision that the hoity toity elites just don't get, it's just that you don't know what you're talking about, and are dunning krugering all over the thread.
Nobody is attacking the AP team. I like Rosh, I've met him, Joe is a friend of mine. I hope the game does well. We're all looking to help them be stronger, for the future if nothing else. We're encouraging them.
Alice Cooper has a kick ass LCD. If Spooky can do it AP can do it, they just have to make it a priority to be smarter about it.

I don't think those of us who "don't see it" think you are attacking the AP team, and those guys have been vocal about accepting constructive criticism. However the nit-picking of the art in games does get a little old with those of us who don't see what we think are really minor things. Take the sword in the Black Knight SOR backglass angle, or the shield position, I bet 95% of people on this thread looked at those pictures and thought "man, that looks cool!" but others see issues with it. I'm not saying they shouldn't voice their opinion but just like Otto's wrist here, most don't see any problem with it as we are taking the picture in as a whole rather than dissecting each aspect.

As for Art Direction and experience, IIRC Aurich some people were shitting all over your Alien PF design when it was first posted. This is no more an attack on you than your comments are on the API team so please don't take it that way, and I know you were working under licensing constraints but art is a very subjective thing and if you believe that everyone sees the same thing you guys do then that is the disconnect. It also means that they could hire someone as widely revered around here as Zombie Yeti and some people would still have problems with aspects of the art.

The animations are a different story and obviously API chose a certain style or styles if you will for OKT (and Houdini), when I played the game at LAX I thought it was a lot of fun and the playfield looked great. I did notice that many of the animations aren't fantastic and I would like to see them up there game there but as Ben said I seriously doubt they are going to scrap the whole thing and start over. They have probably started at least preliminary work on their next game if they are really going to release as many titles as they aim to so it's likely resources are allocated there. They are also a startup from scratch with only the revenue from ~600 Houdini's over the past two years so it could be that belt-tightening is a further constraint. I guess the only good in all of this is that we've moved on from Monkeygate.

#2510 6 months ago
Quoted from benheck:

Just because you don't notice something is wrong doesn't mean there isn't something wrong. A carpenter, a doctor, a dentist, a mechanic can all look at things and see issues others can't. You wouldn't ask Aurich to fix your teeth but he could tell you if Luci's hips were drawn wrong.
Broken wrists and pretzel women are a result of making a game entirely out of clip art and not in an effective Chris Franchi way. Pretzel woman was made from at least 3 different women and they used an ass shot to form the front of her skirt. They fixed it, but the fact it was there in the first place speaks to the lack of cohesion.
There's a reason animators on G rated movies sketch nudes or what DaVinci dug up corpses and Python Angelo chopped up animals - to understand anatomy and apply it correctly to art.
As Kaneda says the theme is a tough sell so EVERY other aspect has to be top notch. It's frustrating to see a company put so much work into the physical game yet cover it with a frosting of puke.
Lastly, David van Es and I designed the ACNC display. Thus I know how much work it takes to do this right which means I can also tell when something has been done very lazily.

But a toothache isn't subjective, it hurts everyone who has one. Art is very subjective and much more subtle. Quoting "K-man" is a sure-fire way for me to discount just about everything you have to say following that quote BTW.

#2539 6 months ago
Quoted from mthirkell:

I like the AMH art, too. This is all so subjective; not everyone is going to agree on art.

I think that's exactly the point some of us have been trying to make multiple times in this thread.

#2554 6 months ago
Quoted from Bond_Gadget_007:

I like the art and style overall, except for the grainy band clip when entering tents. Just doesn’t fit.
I know code isn’t finished, but I noticed you can keep going into Juggler mode and get a myltiball every time. So right now it’s Juggling tent all day until they figure this out.

You can only re-visit the tent until you finish it. ferret explained this pretty well a couple pages ago I think, and while you can keep doing that as long as you don't finish the tent you won't necessarily benefit very much points-wise in comparison to other strategies.

#2555 6 months ago
Quoted from Yelobird:

And Peggle only costs $4.99 Shows you can do cool animation on a budget.

My guess is that they re-use a crap-ton of the code for those mobile apps so the costs get distributed widely.

#2575 6 months ago
Quoted from arcadem:

I too thought that BKSR's animations looked great. But I thought the rest of the game was just OK and I do prefer OKT's uniqueness over it. But, in watching last night's stream I could not help thinking how much more OKT could have been and how much it's animations will hurt it. I hope that OKT succeeds but it truly has some stiff competition coming from a pin that is about $1400 less. I shudder to think what WONKA is going to do to it tomorrow night. Yes, WONKA will likely be about $1100 more than OKT but if it sets the new standard, people will gravitate to it. I for one, am keeping my powder dry until I see WONKA. I'm tempted to put my money on it instead of an OKT. I cannot wait until tomorrow's reveal so that I can make a final decision.

Are you expecting street price on a BKSWOR Premium to be $6300? If not then I don't think you should be comparing the pro to OKT which will have full-color RGB inserts and art blades plus all no missing / removed features.

#2611 6 months ago
Quoted from mthirkell:

Didn't mean to sound harsh? Come on! "...a musical cluster f@#$& and felt like 10lbs of shit in a 5 lb bag" - If you're going to be a prick at least own it.

LOL, really if that was trying not to sound harsh I'm curious what their un-moderated opinion would be.

#2666 6 months ago

Let's see who would possibly want to put an Oktoberfest game in their location - how about all the breweries that have popped up all over the place the last 5 years or so (longer in Portland and some other places)?? If you don't understand that Oktoberfest is about a lot more than beer that's fine, but I think most people can at least recognize / relate to the them when they'd see it in a lineup.

#2686 6 months ago
Quoted from BMore-Pinball:

If people don't understand it's about a lot more than beer, then that's AP's fault with not correctly conveying the theme
same thing with JJP and DI not being a cell phone game

Yep, it's their fault for not putting some tents, balloons, a roller-coaster, bumper cars, etc. in the game.

#2709 6 months ago
Quoted from Swainer80:

Someone on YouTube commented about the music on Oktoberfest. He referenced this slot machine and it's music. Skip to 1 minute and 30 seconds. The voice acting sounds pretty solid as well.

This is supposed to be better than what's in the game already?

1 week later
#2775 5 months ago
Quoted from iloveplywood:

Interest piqued a thousand times seeing a knocker integrated with modes. You guys really do a great job at trying to give modes a unique flavor.

Yeah, it's great in Bullet Catch in Houdini especially if you have a MB going during the mode, it's popping like crazy some times.

1 month later
#3025 4 months ago
Quoted from mfresh:

Apparently mine is being made next week - one of only two to be shipped to the UK. Can't wait for it to make its way over here!
I'm having part of my collarbone removed soon which will mean left arm in a sling for a while, but I am hoping that I will be able to play it anyway using my right hand to control both flippers. Can this be done, or do the two buttons on the right only work for certain modes rather than the whole game?

Ouch, talk about adding insult to injury! I believe the current code has a way to start the game in one-handed only mode, search Ferret's posts in this thread as it's definitely mentioned. If you play that way for a significant period of time you'll get good at it I'd bet and then you'll kill that mode during regular games later, great way to beat others during league or tourney I'd think. I wish you a speedy recovery and shipment of your game.

#3057 4 months ago
Quoted from Aniraf:

Oh, here are two slo-no videos of that wire form failing if anyone would like to see.

The one at Helicon did that to me several times too, I forgot to mention that to them. Very frustrating and I think a ball save should be added to code until they can come up with a physical fix for this.

2 weeks later
#3176 3 months ago

I had the distinct pleasure of helping viggin900 unbox and setup his game yesterday and man was that fun! The game was perfectly packaged just like my Houdini was and we really only found one small issue while setting it up; one of the small black screws for the Beer Barrel ramp was not screwed all the way down - quick fix with a few turns of a screwdriver. Other than that it plays very, very well (not a single ball came off the wireform after the VUK kick, all ramps very make-able though 180 can still reject) and we were both really impressed with the code updates since we last saw it back in March. I don't know how many games I played but my general pinball slump was continuing and I couldn't break 1 Million until I suddenly had a monster game and put up over 10.4M! I had almost all the Tents lit, had two Roller Coaster and one B.B. MB and then got to what I think was a mini-wizard mode called duck race (I think). I was so shocked that I was having such a good game my memory fails me on what was going on but shots were alternating from Blue to Red, I'm sure this is covered in a post from ferret somewhere and I'll go find it in case I ever get there again. What a fun game!

One question we did have is about use of the shaker, it was set to heavy utilization and medium intensity and I think I only felt it go off about three times. Is that normal? It works in test (although just very briefly).

#3184 3 months ago
Quoted from rosh:

Imho, the screws should be kept loose or removed. It is my belief that if the screws are with it creates a more abrupt change in slope that makes the ramp harder. Can't say I can back that up with facts, but, just saying.

We have good knocker usage, but the shaker is still under utilized, we will be doing more with it. In fact, yesterday I was doing some shaker stuff.

To clarify, most coils pulse at their normal strength in test, however the shaker, and coils that are use for thinks like lock release or up posts will not operate as they do in the game when in test, but will just briefly fired.

In this case the screw was high enough the ball could actually hit it so it had to be tightened.

We never felt the shaker when the pops where going off and viggin900 had one particularly great bumper-car run (~300K just from that) so it's not like we didn't have the ball in the pops a lot.

One other thing I forgot, it seemed like the magnet action when the Oktoberfest standups were hit was not as severe / strong as in other ones I've played. There were a few times it gave it a really good fling but not a lot. This isn't necessarily a problem but I didn't see an adjustment for that in settings, did I miss it or/and has that been dialed back some in the latest code?

3 weeks later
#3285 88 days ago
Quoted from Aniraf:

First, why are there three distinct posts on Oktoberfest? Can we all just agree this one is the “club” since it has the most history?
Second, I found a new place for the ball to get stuck tonight. I am actually completely surprised my this one, but it needed the glass lifted for sure![quoted image]

This may have been where mine got stuck when playing my friend's game a couple weeks ago, I drilled and I mean DRILLED the beer barrel ramp and stood there wondering why I didn't get the lock animation. After about 15 or 20 seconds I gave the game a couple nudges thinking the ball just wasn't sitting in front of an opto or on the switch (not sure which is in there) and the ball came rolling back down the end of the ramp. Completely surprised both of us, it could have been somewhere else though, not sure as we could not see it and the owner was standing to my right so he had a better angle on the back of the barrel.

#3305 85 days ago
Quoted from Aniraf:

Does anyone recognize this chip? I found it in the cabinet during the cleaning I did right after my tournament. I cannot imagine that it fell off of anything as it looks like the legs were cleanly clipped, but I don't know. Sorry the photo is a bit blurry, the chip is super small.[quoted image]

Hard to tell for sure from your picture but it looks like a SMD (surface mount device) capacitor. My guess is that it is probably off one of the PD-16 driver boards mounted under the PF. https://www.multimorphic.com/content/uploads/2017/06/PD-16_585x411_small.png

Visual inspection of those boards should confirm which one and where the device came loose from. Most likely a cold solder joint caused this and you could re-solder that cap back onto the board, just be absolutely sure to get the polarity right if you do otherwise you'll probably get a nice smokey bang as a reward for your troubles.

#3307 84 days ago
Quoted from Aniraf:

Yeah, I think you are correct. I'll get the machine open again and take a look. Oddly it does not seem to be impacting anything.

It is almost certainly a filter cap for a power supply and therefore not 100% required for operation but can cause problems in certain situations and / or long-term.

1 month later
#3561 33 days ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

Cincinnati is huge for Oktoberfest. Just ask my pal viggin900 I’ll be serving beer at a booth next weekend, and he’s going to be dancing his face off all throughout the festivities! German people are everywhere around here and NKY and Cincy come out on droves for this every year. AP needs to come setup here one year!

That would be awesome to have a an AP or FlipNOut tent with some Oktoberfest games setup at the festival, would almost certainly sell some games to first time buyers and people who never considered buying a pinball machine before. Of course they may not remember that purchase the next day but that's okay too.

#3574 32 days ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

It seems though with Houdini and now Oktoberfest, there isn’t much in the way of super exciting moments. I’m doing a lot of “wow that’s cool” or “love the rules of that mode”, but I’m not getting the adrenaline pumping moments that some other games have.
The first hour I spent on Black Knight SOR or GOT I was blown away by the excitement and fast brutal gameplay and exciting moments.
But that’s not a bad thing. Just another option in the market and games like this do a really good job of mixing up the gameplay in a lineup.
I find myself just trying to see as much as possible in this game as opposed to going for score as I typically do. So much to do in this game. That’s going to keep me coming back.
Well done.

You missed it last night, Brady got to closing time where the flippers are really show reacting and you have to spell Sober to gradually improve them, it was hilarious to watch! He also put up a pretty nice score of 4.8M.

I got to Duck Race and had a ton of blue shots to choose from and easily won it so I think it may depend on how many ducks you've collected or something before you start it. I did drill the very first shot too so maybe that played into it.

As for exciting moments in Houdini I think there are plenty especially Man From Beyond stacked with any MB, those shots are tough and very rewarding. Not the same kind of frenetic style you mentioned but then I think the theme doesn't really suit that anyway. Of course I am biased as I own the game.

I

1 week later
#3687 20 days ago
Quoted from Ferret:

How does the PinStadium interact with that tent? Or with the game overall, for that matter?

The PS kit includes a flasher trigger which is two wires on alligator clips, these can be connected to anything like a motor or flasher but cannot be connected to a coil as the voltage is too high. This is a challenge for games like OKT, Houdini, WOZ / maybe all JJPs, all Capcoms and others that don't actually have Flashers. The shaker motor is a good alternative in general but it depends on when / how often it's used. I haven't played enough OKT while thinking of where it would be good to activate the PS flasher to give any better insight into integration with the game. It's one of those things you really need to balance out, you definitely don't want it going off too much. I was thinking the knocker may be cool since it's integrated well into the game but you'd have to connect to the control for that transistor on the driver board since it's high voltage coil.

EDIT: Now that I think about it, since all the driver boards are mounted under the PF you could connect to one of the coil drive transistor inputs which should work. Maybe the pop bumpers would be good or the knocker since it's integrated pretty well? viggin900 I'll give you a call to discuss how this would be done after taking a look at the boards in Houdini a little closer and see if it's something you might want to try. I don't have them on Houdini but it does give me an idea for the ones I have on Pinball Magic.

2 weeks later
#3808 6 days ago
Quoted from DanDanDAN:

I was going to ask if Joe isn't here anymore who is the guy sitting at his desk and working on new projects everyday?

It could be a Zando-Zan that's working on "The Last Starfighter" design!

#3820 3 days ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

Haha. Absolutely not. Entertainment only people.

This is what I think of anytime someone mentions the tool.

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