Well it doesn’t remind me of any of these guys.

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Bears a passing resemblance to Friedrich Liechtenstein ... once can hope (I do).

That could severely limit the wiener dog racing. People only go to them to see them crash.

LTG : )

You're confused. Stern's warranty is 60 days. They often (but not always) will support products beyond that. It's the same with ALL pinball manufacturers - the printed warranty is for liability, but the ACTUAL support period is often much longer. AP is no different, and their PRINTED warranty is LONGER than Stern. We're 7 months out on an issue with the Houdini on the route I help with and AP has been right there. It's not a problem. You're complaining about literally nothing.

The ONLY company that has warranty issues is CGC, and that's for second owners, in my experience. We eventually got support for THEIR problems (SOL machine board self-destruct ROM & plastics with peeling screened ink), but it was like pulling teeth, and Game Room Guys (their dist for this AfMr) are dicks, for the record. I'd never buy a pin from them. Been a first and second owner for Stern, JJP, and CGC pins, and CGC was the only problem.

Yep. JJP gave out 1.0 version light boards for YEARS after WoZ was manufactured in 2013, initially for free, and then for like 1/2 price. First owner, second owner, third owner, it didn't seem to matter. They had a problem and they took care of customers affected by it. Frank at JJP is great to deal with.

This was DESPITE having a very short warranty period on their printed warranty. They ALL do it this way for liability. If you come across as an entitled prick, they can just tell you to take a hike.

Yes, and that's a completely different story 'cause that lightboard was a design error.

Though that came about, from what I've seen posted, because the guy they initially had do the design work lied about his qualifications.

Obviously they should have been more diligent, but they did their best to rectify a shitty situation.

Probably should have gone straight to something like the 2.0 design, rather than trying to fix his mess, but easy to be wise in hindsight.

Yes but what I wanted to say when putting this in comparison to AP, that JJP sold you a faulty product (intentionally or not) that will definatly brake sooner or later.
Thats kinda attackable even if the Warranty time is overdue.
Plus they could close down doors, for the damaged image that would cause. So JJP did it like they 'kinda' had to (like Microsoft with the RROD on the 360).

That said: I think the warranty times are ridiculous! In the US in general (from what I see) and especially for this product wich should be able to take a good beating when set up in a non-private environment.

Funny... I remember it another way. JJP had a known faulty design, knew their customers would be impacted by it, and instead of tackling the problem head on, required customers to wait to fail, and then would only ship them piece meal solutions... resulting in customers dealing with frustrations for years.. instead of wiping out the problem with broad strokes like anyone who really 'took care of customers' would.

I have no idea when JJP knew the design itself was the problem, I just know that they took care of the issues with light boards as they came along, for me as the third owner, without hassle or issue YEARS after the game shipped. Can't say the same about CGC in that regard. Getting the SOL ROM THAT CAN DESTROY BOARDS was a hassle as Game Room Guys flat out denied to send it since we were the second owners, and CGC had told them it needed to be fixed for everyone. It eventually got worked out, but way more of a hassle than JJP to get fixed. American Pinball support is as good or better than JJP support in my experience so far...

Stay on topic

Can anyone recall any other modern-day pinball themes based on a cultural event? This is a gutsy decision. It beats another rock band or Marvel hero theme.

NASCAR? But it will DEFINITELY be a whole lot better than that turd.

Yes, yes. Back on topic. beer and boobs

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its difficult for me to consider 'oktoberfest' an 'original' theme.

look at what josh said about houdini - they treated it as a licensed theme. all the aspects of houdinis life were already predetermined. they had the mans likeness. his profession as a magician/escape artist. the time period was set. the magic acts/escapes he was renowned for. the films he made. his connection with mediums and the spiritual world. no additional subject matter was required or needed to complete this theme. it was all handed to them on a silver platter. just come up with the art, call outs, some music, and animations.

with oktoberfest, it too comes in a highly regulated package, which leaves very little need for originality/creativity. the polka style of music, the representative country, the beer/food, the maidens, the outfits, the contests/events - all the facets are already there. no work is necessary to create anything new/additional when it comes to this theme. gotta love the development time savings. so again, art, callouts, and animations. QED.

APs first two titles pan out more like licensed themes and can hardly be compared to creating packages like centuar, fathom, or paragon, where the concept is all original thought created from scratch. if those games had voice/speech and an LCD like todays games, developers imaginations could run wild.

Theme != License

But of course a theme is predefined, thats what a theme is.

That gives them freedom nontheless. If you do a WWII movie its still possible to make a comedy.

Methinks you may be overthinking it a bit . Let's see what the game looks and shoots like. I bet they will have a surprise like the Houdini catapult

Does Independence Day count?

Oktoberfest could have been themed as Spring Break. A boutique pin was made with this title but it was pretty tame. A real version might be too politically incorrect, after all, it is about babes, boobs, booze and boners

Some of the Harley Davidson machines could have easily been themed as Sturgis, after the annual ride. Those machines already exude that kind of feel.

Will someone try making Burning Man Festival - Why Are We Here and What Did We Do pin? The ‘cultural’ themes with real legs might be Area 51 or Burmuda’s Triangle pin. But those wouldn’t have much appeal outside the US.

I’m sure Oktoberfest will make a splendid theme.

It could be awesome. It could be terrible. It all depends on how it shoots, and not as much on what pictures are drawn on it or what sounds come out the speakers.

I am not sure where I stand amongst the pinside crowd on this but I'm genuinely excited to get another game from a manufacturer I like supporting. Think we have 4 Houdini's out for play and the feedback is mostly positive. Overall I do think the game is hard but here is another chance at making some improvements to what they create. I look at how spooky started to the overall look of their current titles. They've improved different parts of their games. Also p-roc hardware helps this along. They are simplifying what they do, create and manufacture pinball machines. Not creative board sets and electronics.

I hope it's a home run, kind of like Iron Maiden was. Everyone on the site complained about the theme but if you play it, most will agree, it is very fun and has unique geometry to keep the interest of players.

Cant wait until the reveal.

I'll take that bet. Depends on your definition of 'surprise' I suppose

Unusual /unique mech ?

If it is fun and NOT an Oktoberfest business simulator I, as a German and a beer lover, will throw them my money the day gameplay footage, preferably done by Jack Danger, is published.

They hinted at the fact that there *is so much more to Oktoberfest* than people imagine. Hence i hope they do not mean the business behind it etc. I want campy fun, not have to hit left ramp 5 times to get a tent license at the fairgrounds. .. lol

On second thought.... if they turn it into a "Theme Hospital" kind of 'build your business' game... they would undoubtedly have my attention as well if it is quirky enough. That I would play the crap out of.

oh my gosh.

"Mop the vomit"

"Clean up the beer steins"

"Invite the mayor"

"Hire the band"

American Pinball has yet to create either of those IMHO

The stage door is pretty innovative. I cant think of another pin that has this.

I think this severely over-simplifies what they had to do, sure they had his likeness and some silent movies to pull some ideas from by it's a long way from having assets given to them. For instance the whole steam-punk direction of the art isn't really dictated by Houdini's legacy or even era of prominence, it was thought-up by the artist. It also means all the animations have to be done from scratch, no movie scenes to loop, etc. I agree that it's not the same as hatching a complete character and theme from out of the blue but it's still a lot of from-scratch work that had to be done.

The stage door and disappearing / reappearing ball in the stage is definitely unique and unusual. If you are referring to the catapult that is certainly an unusual throw distance of not specifically an unusual “use” of it.

Not really.

Could be, never got that far or noticed ) - : I hear they are hard to fix when the cheap servo breaks.

Several catapults around, maybe we should have a metric something like: inchesThrown * percentSuccessful with separated graph lines for different AC line voltages

“Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.”

I for one am glad that there is a company willing to try something different and not so safe.. than the usual tired bands, movies, comic books, tv shows..

Lookin forward to seeing how the game turns out. While it's not the first theme that comes to mind it's still better then most of the JJP themes for me. Hopefully it's quirky and fun and that it does really well for AP

For the first time ever I have to some what agree with greenhornet. It's not an original theme. It's an unlicensed theme which is different and gives lots more freedom then a licensed theme but we all know what Oktoberfest is and most of what it involves. It's not like AP created Oktoberfest, they are theming a game based off of it. That doesn't take anything away from it. Houdini is not an original theme to me either, it's just and unlicensed theme.

So you dismiss potential unique features on a game when you never experienced them.

I don't dismiss, just don't appreciate. The menu system in Houdini is very unique. And very costly for little value added. I bet many wish they had just done something simple (and more standard) and put that extra effort into perfecting the game.

I bet AP does the same thing for the UMM-PA-PA game too. Fancy menus and still bug fixing 9 months out.

funny... bet many people feel that way about coindoor remotes...

And can be used in future titles.

LTG : )

if they change it to "Rock"-toberfest I'm in.

give us original themes as long as they are based on has been rock bands or the latest superhero movie and we'll go nuts for a week and then move on...pinside

What is so unique about the menu system? I don't see anything there that appears to have been overly expensive, they need a menu system for the game and future titles so something had to be created. They probably spent a bunch of time writing game routines that they can use over and over in future titles too, it's called development from the ground up. WOZ has a very "unique" menu system too, I guess they should have stuck with a command line interface? As for bug-fixes, that happens and at least they are fixing them and not leaving it to rot.

We get it, you don't like Houdini.

I don't get the need to bash a game or company.....when you haven't even seen the game or played it.
No one is forcing you buy any game or play it. Save your quarters and move on.

shots fired!

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I'm looking forward to see what AP can do with Oktoberfest. I like that they are thinking outside the box with a fresh idea. Obviously the success (or failure) will depend on how the game flips, integration of the theme, etc. but kudos for giving us all something to consider prior to launch. I'll be watching closely and wish them the best of luck on this. I'll be at the EXPO reveal and hope to jump on a machine.

One would think, without knowing German or Germany that Oktoberfest is something that has to do with October and a Fest....

Wrong answer

Thought Oktoberfest might involve beer, babes, boobs & boners, but it turns out all about German beer. I like beer, babes, boobs and boners better because I can multitask.

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Why so angry??? Is it because we wouldn't use your product!

Not really.

Ooohh...tell us a story, Uncle Barry!

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Aaaah now this seems to make some sense here. I was wondering where the sour grapes smell was coming from