Hey American Pinball, I’m a freelance audio engineer looking for work. Maybe I can help?
Seriously though, game looks great with some obvious polishing to do with sound and art....but love the mechanics.

Houdini owner and fan. This game looks very fun but I would be out over the music. No place screaming metal guitar riffs in the game and it totally conflicts with what your eyes are seeing. Polka can be a lot of fun. Oompa

To consider a game at 7K+ I think it's got to hit on all cylinders. That means all aspects of the game should contribute to the world under glass. When I first saw the playfield reveal, I was excited: it looks fun and interesting, and immediately draws you into that festive world. But the more that was revealed, the more I saw and heard, the more my excitement faded.

The music reminds me of the kid that goes to town on pinball browser making his own personal customization of his pin. He's really proud and loves it, but others are just bewildered by it.

This said it well

Ben Heck called it. Why is American Pinball so concerned with being politically correct? Agree with jgentry they could have put some good eye candy in the artwork without being overtly sexual. Maybe there is some, not saying there's none, but I'm not looking at the main female character because she's attractive. She only caught my attention because she has an odd look: her face or expression, something seems off and I'm not totally sure what it is, but she looks weird to me. But weirder than that, I don't get why a monkey playing ass-grab is supposed to be something I want to see, but cleavage isn't?

Agree with the other comments on voices and caracitures, the world under glass aren't well served by things like phony or confusing accents.

I think there's still enough appeal and loose wallets that it will sell okay: many seem more willing to overlook the faults. We're getting lots of faint praise.

You dont play the art so in the end gameplay can overcome it.

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The art is totally fine. Even good maybe.

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I can completely put the art and music out of focus if the game is good.

Totally agree, and want to add my question:

Is a monkey playing ass-grab more politically correct than some cleavage? I just find that bizarre.

Notice Backalley Matt on the backglass amongst the weird hybrid photoshop “cartoon” people?

Wow. AP’s artist is terrible. This is just ugly ugly chop-shop photoshop. Legitimately convoluted mash of styles and techniques. You could say GB & DP are busy, but not convoluted. They’re absolutely consistent in their styles, drawn & colored by a real artist.

The real people in the art is weird and eye catching and not in a cameo way.

Interesting comments on the art and music. The only thing I didn't like about it was the LCD animations - or the LCD in general. Just not a fan of that current fad on machines. For most, they just feel tacked on and incomplete. I miss the simpler and more creative DMD days.

The music I can understand would turn some people off, but there IS polka in there, just not constantly. Some of that metal also had accordians playing along with the guitar, so I don't think it is a total miss.

Ultimately though, gameplay and fun factor is the biggest thing to me. I can completely put the art and music out of focus if the game is good.

The different levels of realism on this plastic feel odd, but I'm admittedly not an artist.

You've got the claymation/drawn guy in the upper right. The photoshopped or guy in costume on the left. Then the photo of the girl holding her blouse open with a unibrow and mustache?

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That's it. This game is dead to me.

Look at MBr. They’re still using dots but their display looks a billion times better than anyone else’s...why? ART DIRECTION. CGC is using amazing artists...also I find the wide aspect ratio just “pinball perfect”. When you have to glance up during play, “long rectangle” works better than “square”. With the exception of JJP almost everyone else’s LCD’s look like mid 90’s PC CD-ROM games. This actually makes a game look old, while a good color DMD like CGC’s games make a game look “retro appealing”.

Let's get this topic back on tap; a lot of criticisms and focuses on the negatives. Check out SDTM's quick glimpse with Josh Kuglar. The game overall just looks 'fun' and for a good time. Yes, there's some inconsistencies, but let's applaud what AP has done here so far (remember its early); but they packed this game with pinball and fun, all with a theme not many could think had a place in pinball.

When a game is $7k, critique is fair.

I’ll play it if I see it on location. There, positive? ...but the art guarantees I’d never own one.

The response has largely been very positive. Even posts with criticism have found things that the applaud AP for.

Art and music aside, can somone link up more gameplay please?

Reports from friends at the show are that this is a long player but fun to shoot.

What do pinsiders that have played it think?

What is the thinking of a pretty woman with a moustache? Can't see many males or females liking that....

Well if you watch the posted video it talks about the art direction and that there's a bunch of 'hidden things'. I don't know all the details of the festival, but my guess is it is common costume. I think it is supposed to be painted on, just hard to see in that photo.

Good morning all, exhausted and a little hung over from a crazy, crazy week with almost no sleep, the reveal, and some celebratory beer and tequila shots, but wanted to pop on and answer few questions, at least the ones I can remember.

First off, happy to see such a positive response to the game, but can't say I am surprised. We knew that much of the doomsayers on the theme just did not know much about it and what we could do with it. Obviously some won't like the theme and no matter what we did, some will say there is too much beer and babes and other would say not enough. Even on the team, we have differing opinions of where we should be and where we are. To let you know where I stand, any time I saw our artist, I said 'more cleavage'. But it is a tricky balance, plus I don't always get my way.

The mustache girl freaks me out a little but that plastic says, 'mustache contest', or so I have been told, but yeah.

The playfield is packed with lots of little things that will take time for folks to spot and see. There is a lot of fun little stuff tucked away. I am not surprised at the diverse opinions on the art package. It is often the part of a machine that has. the most differing opinions.

As far as the music, I have not watched the dead flip stream, so don't know which aspects of the game were shown, regardless, there is a very diverse selection of music in the game. While there is a some heavy metal/polka mashup stuff, which Balcer wanted, there is also plenty of tunes with a Polka and Oom-Pa style that Ferret and I wanted. What is important to me, is to have the variety. There will be four out of mode main tracks and then each mode will have its own. Currently only one main track is on the machine, which does have the heavy metal feel. 'Ride' modes will typically have the heavier music, the beer modes the oom-pa and the midway game modes the polka. In some cases a track was used in a different place for now. The main out of mode tracks will be also be a mix. As more footage comes out you will hear more of that variety. Right now it is probably 50/50 as far as heavy to oom-pa/polka, but I would expect the final mix to be more 25/75.

Some of the animations are what we want and some are works in progress and some are not much more than fancy storyboards (e.g. the mystery duck pull). Some will like what we do, some won't, but at the same time to me it is the least important part of the machine, since it has the least value to the actual player and at some point you have to decide where you spend your time and money, if you do everything to the ultimate degree, you get a much more expensive machine and that is not where I want to see us be.

I think most are going to find the game a blast to play. The rules fun and challenging, with lots in there for enthusiasts as well as competitive players.

I look forward to more people getting to play the machine.

I do want to thank the Straight Down the Middle, Head2Head, Dead Flip, and This Week in Pinball (despite their little screw up), for helping us get some quality info and video of the machine out there for you guys. I think links to all of those are already in this thread. However, Greg/Zach, next time I would like more than 3 minutes warning, so I don't look like I am hungover from a night of binge drinking (or the reality of days of no sleep while trying to get the machine ready for its debut).

I'll try to pop back on later to see what questions pop up.

In the meantime, PROST!

85 min of gameplay from the stream last night
https://www.twitch.tv/deadflip

Thanks! I assume you are there, what is your first impression of gameplay?

Skoal!

Has there been a ship date floated yet? Wanted to see if.it will be built in the current facility or new one

Any Weird Al polka fans?

This reveal thread is making me wonder if I should put up one of my own on how Circe's Animal Alehouse would have looked for layout comparison purposes, since it's one I've tinkered with on and off for a few years, but suddenly a number of the same ideas have completely coincidentally turned up here - 'exotic beer and fun' theme, player controlled magnets, models on the pops, left drop ramp with a shot underneath (though not an orbit), cross-field ball entry and third flipper in a similar place (although this last one has been fairly common). On the other hand, mine would be a widebody (but aiming for the 'shoots like a standard' feel that Full Throttle had), uses drop targets more (tied to rules strategy in particular), and is a game that I do still ultimately want to make.

Yes please, we’d love to see.

Yeah, AP is killing it on most fronts, but a consistent problem is art direction and animation for the video. They really need some hires from the console video game area.

The only complain I get with this is...this screw very badly placed...

The game was counting in German and a smattering of other German calls on the live stream, but it's very German-lite. I agree that the voicing is completely off. Dude does not sound German - at all. He also sounds too young for the main character picture.

Yes it was and the picture had only 15 thumbs up.

Needs a decal and pull the nut!
Josh I agree 100%, more cleavage.
Totally cool game.

I'm sure everyone would like to see. But I don't think it's really in your interests for everyone to see, unless you're still working on something physical to show potential interested parties.

Got to give AP props for getting their second title revealed already. They are on a much faster game pace then JJP is at the moment which speaks volumes about their team and management. Hopefully they can handle the influx of orders that this game should bring.

They "hid" a completely naked chick in plain sight on a plastic right in the center of Houdini's playfield. I don't think that smacks of a "politically correct" ethos at AP.
houdini-window-chick (resized).jpg

As someone from the console video game area, it really isn't feasible at this level. I struggle with this on every pin but I realized you just have to accept its a different industry with entirely different parameters. Hiring one or two guys is not going to make much of a difference.

JJP is killing it in the animation and UI department on every pin. I don't think they have a large team of animators, and they only have one art director to my knowledge. It can be done.

Fair point, JJP does seem to take a lot more time as well. He did specifically say:

Show a video of ACNC first!

I like it, its a funny game looks great.
BUT WHERE ARE THE BOOBS.
Put a family mode in the software so we can see more funny stuff.

For my opinion and only speaking for me:
- I love this chick with moustache. Why? Coz disguise is part of Oktoberfest. We also see man with dress and blond long hair with braid
- about music: my ratio is more 0 metal / 100 polka, ompah music. Can you imagine 25% polka music in a Star Wars pin?
I hope you would let the possibility to replace this metal sound for those who don’t want it.
- about a more expensive game for an ultimate degree: those who pay 7k a pinball machine can do 8k or more. They already do it when they buy a LE machine for a limited number, a sign, goodies, a meal with the engineer, what else...Paying more for a work that is a real asset for the game ( improving sound, animations lcd..) is not a problem for me if I get a better and immersive experience

Ugh. Stop encouraging manufacturers to charge more. Why do I have to keep saying this?

LCD screens are not a fad, and DMD is not coming back.

Some of you need to get over this.

What mistake did TWIP make??? I must have missed it.

Music is really BAD!

Gameplay looks fun to shoot. i hope Joe can reel in the naratives that josh likes to go on with code. Simple call outs with comedy are what this game needs, not 30 sec overly long descriptions.

I think players will give AP a pass on poor animations and some of the bad art like Houdini and what's been shown on this one, but as they get more well-known and successful, they will have to improve the art and animation package. Buyers, especially, will not excuse it in the same way they have for a startup. Even if it bumps the price $200 (that's close to $400k extra budget), I think most people would pay it to get some professional art and animation. You can EASILY get a nice crew for a year for that kind of budget if you're shopping in some of the more depressed areas of Europe. I have a buddy that does AAA console games that has an immensely talented crew in Kiev he could never afford in the US.

Let's face it, the direction of LCD's so far is...less than stellar. It's not about DMD coming back, it's about that currently for the most part, the LCD direction looks cheap and unfinished (in the majority of games it is in). Sure it probably costs them more on the licensing side for clips of movies, etc -- but to me, those are cheap and easy and is a big turn off for many of the newer games. He stated it just like one would assume, LCD animations are the bottom of his list of important. I would agree - however the backglass/screen is a major part of the game. DMD's while they may seem low tech by today's standard allowed for more for less. Dialed In is one of the few pins where I think it actually fits and looks good. Probably just the old school in me, and just an opinion, but we can do without the "just get over it" comments.

I encourage manufacturers to built machines the most immersive as possible with the theme.

better original theme than i thought it would be, looks busy, i like it. party zone type head is neat.
rated R version would be even better

Yeah, that's what I'm kind of torn about. I just don't want folks to think I pinched ideas from this game, and it's refined enough already that to change anything significant would require a start from scratch - and buggered if I'm going to do THAT yet again.

JJP is FAR ahead of all the other pinball manufacturers for video animation and UI. It's not even close. So, one manufacturer is killing it, the rest are languishing or don't care enough.