(Topic ID: 214634)

JJPOTC Updates for Production

By Hogbog

1 year ago

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  • 3,327 posts
  • 345 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 11 months ago by Yelobird
  • Topic is favorited by 57 Pinsiders


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Topic index (key posts)

6 key posts have been marked in this topic

Post #593 The new artwork in high-res Posted by pinball_keefer (1 year ago)

Post #2454 Link to livestream of play on one of the first machines off the line Posted by solarvalue (1 year ago)

Post #2464 Picture of first jjPotCs on the line Posted by mountaingamer (1 year ago)

Post #2496 Link to Jack's "shipping" cartwheel for jjPotC. Posted by KingBW (1 year ago)

Post #2561 Comparison of prototype and final under playfields Posted by Join_The_Cirqus (1 year ago)

Topic indices are generated from key posts and maintained by Pinside Editors. For more information, or to become an editor yourself read this post!

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#173 1 year ago
Quoted from Shapeshifter:

Well, Toy Story now becomes a critical release for JJP.

I think POTC is a critical release for JJP

#254 1 year ago
Quoted from TheFamilyArcade:

I can totally understand people’s disappointment. And JJP really shouldn’t release a game until they know what they’ve got. But let’s not just assume the game sucks now.
Remember STLE? I personally thought the coolest feature in the game was the catapult kicker that was to shoot the ball from the lower left side of the playfield up to the upper right flipper. But guess what? Before the game shipped Stern removed the feature because they couldn’t get it to work. Not sure why, since Fish Tales had that feature 20 years earlier, and so did MM. I guess Gary and Steve and all the other folks at Stern just couldn’t figure it out, so they put in a garden variety vertical upkicker instead, that was not just uninspired -oh, let’s have it feed the left flipper via the i lane - but added absolutely zero to the game. At least STLE had the tinfoil to make up for it.
And speaking of Stern, they aren’t exactly brilliant or innovative in their toy output. The trunk in Aerosmith is cool, but outside of that, they haven’t done much of anything since the Ironmonger.
I hope JJP overcomes this setback. And I also hope they offer a lower price point machine at some point. I’m out at $8k, spinning discs or no spinning discs.

Overcomes this setback you need to hope JJP can stay afloat at these prices many are jumping ship

#265 1 year ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

A spinning disk isn't going to be the end of JJP, will take a lot more then that!

Over and over JJP fans are saying prices have gotten too high and that they are out.

#318 1 year ago
Quoted from Psw757:

The right thing for JJP to do is delay the release

It has been 6 months since the unveil that I am sure cut into DI sales and you think a delay is a good idea

#390 1 year ago
Quoted from Pimp77:

LOL, if you think there WON’T be another special art/trim package down the line then you’re a fool. It’s almost a guarantee! Black Pearl edition with black balls and black armor, ship combat art on cab sides. It’s a no brainer.

Funny stuff they have to sell out for a new edition DI has not sold out what makes you think POTC will

#403 1 year ago
Quoted from bigd1979:

Cant sell out of unlimited runs... i believe they are over 2000 dile sold tho which is pretty good imo.

The $8000 standard is unlimited the LE and CE are not unlimited and neither are sold out

#567 1 year ago
Quoted from pinball_keefer:

No one has paid for anything, just made fully-refundable deposits.

WOZ was different since people had made payments for something expected. Plus, it's a lot harder to play a game without lights than what we're talking about here.

Alright this thread has gone too far it has made me agree with Keefer

2 weeks later
#1500 1 year ago
Quoted from frolic:

More an indictment to how bad the DI reveal was, and then how it became a sleeper hit.

I keep hearing DI being called a hit I just don't see it being that neather the 150 CE or 2500 LE have sold out I would like to know what numbers are a hit a 1000 games 1500 game ?

#1504 1 year ago
Quoted from frolic:

Well, I'll speak to what I said, referring to it as a "sleeper hit".
If I look up the definition of that term, wikipedia defines it as:
"In the entertainment industry, a sleeper hit is a title (such as a book, film, song or game) that becomes successful gradually, often with little promotion."
So, by their definition, we're talking about successful. It doesn't necessarily have to light the world on fire, but was it a success for JJP? As opposed to a money loser. It also started slow out of the gate and built fans as more people played it.
I don't think all LEs and CEs have to sell out for it to be a success, and anecdotally we know it has had decent sales.

You should be a politician you said a whole lot but never answered the question LOL

#1508 1 year ago
Quoted from vireland:

I thought the CE were however many they had orders for by 12/31/17, not 150. So unless JJP has moved the post, the CE are sold out.

Still available at distributors so no not sold out and the number was a even 150

#1533 1 year ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

Pinside number as of right now are indicative I think. My best guess is that pinside accounts for 70% of all route based games and a wild guess but maybe 40-50% of all collector based games. Just WAGs but based on real world observations and trends over time.
Owners/ On route:
DI 363/87
TH 515/89
WOZ 1010/145
To me I would guess real world that DI has sold 1000, TH 1500 and WoZ 2000.
I would say in all 3 cases that those are hits, esp with DI being a non-licensed game that appears to be selling very well as time goes on. I predict it will slowly but surely surpass total numbers of TH in the next year and may even reach WoZ in the longer term since it seems to also be a steady (not great but good and consistent) earner on route along with being liked by players/collectors in the home environment.
Just for the fun of it to compare relative numbers on some recent Sterns
GOTG pro and prem/le combine 190/123
SW combined 516/288
Aero combined 356/197
Any game selling better than GOTG and as good as Aero, while closing in on SW (a hit theme if there ever was one) = a hit in my book.

I find it funny you use GOTG,SW,AERO as hits because as all three regularly get trashed on Pinside

#1534 1 year ago
Quoted from FalconPunch:

The fact that hobbit black arrow is being made means they sold all 1500 LEs..
Then smaug is 0 to 1500
And some black arrows...
I think hobbit would be about 2k unit's plus

Yet no one calls TH a hit

#1535 1 year ago
Quoted from vireland:

That's what the original post was referring to, Dialed In (in a jjPotC thread). So I don't know where he got the 150 number because Jack was making as many CEs as he had orders for by Dec 31, 2016 (I put 17). So technically the CEs were sold out as far as JJP was concerned when the last one rolled off the line.

The CE games are sold out when you can no longer buy one NIB

#1588 1 year ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Man this pin is losing steam fast.
Gotta be able to announce and start shipping.

Do you think they should skip the annual game announcement at expo this yr wait till tex 2019 show

1 month later
#1987 1 year ago
Quoted from Psw757:

I would say these two don't count since they are failing businesses and haven't built many machines.
Didn't post the question as a knock on JJP but shit, it's mid June already and as of the last stream there were still wizard,video modes to be coded as well as more call outs to be done with Gibbs and I'm sure more. October 2018 will be fast upon us!☠️

I would say only non prepay games count if you count prepay WOZ was three yr's

3 weeks later
#2116 1 year ago

I think 3 months ago the spinning disk was an issue now I think the biggest issue is the time an oct 2017 unveiling is too long a wait

#2122 1 year ago
Quoted from screaminr:

I would prefer to wait however long it takes to have it working 99 % rather than have them rush it and have problems down the track.

JJP shipped there first games spring 2013 they have now put out 3 games in 5 yr can they survive at that rate

#2126 1 year ago
Quoted from screaminr:

Well they're still going so I suppose so. quality beats quantity.they make less but charge more so maybe that works for them.

The question is not whether they are still going today but what does there future hold at this rate. The same goes for Chicago Gaming and American Pinball the past few yr have not been kind to pinball startups

#2132 1 year ago
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:

maybe there is no delay

That train has left the station

#2136 1 year ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

It will end up being 4 games in 5 years. Also, JJP is in a different market then Stern and doesn't have to sell as many games as Stern does to be successful. Ferrari sells far less cars then Ford yet is still successful. Quality over quantity.

LOL JJP is no Ferrari and Ferrari put out 4 models in 2018 that is more then JJP has put out in the last 5 yr

#2151 1 year ago
Quoted from iceman44:

I predict Willy Wonka will be a huge seller

At $9500 they will never have a huge seller every $500 cost quite a few buyers. They still have not sold out of there money grab model of DI and that run is only 150 games

#2153 1 year ago
Quoted from Nokoro:

But that's for the extreme collector, is much higher in price than the next model and really doesn't come with anything more in terms of game. I believe JJP sells more LEs than standards even though it is the same game. They know their market, and they know how to price. If this wasn't working for them, they would not be about to launch their 4th pin and actively designing two others.

With $8000 being JJP lowest price point for his games all are for the extreme collector non-pinheads would find $5300/$5400 for a Stern Pro extreme.

#2159 1 year ago
Quoted from Nokoro:

I wouldn’t consider myself an extreme collector. I only have 4 pins, and 2 are JJP. If I get another, I will sell one to fund it. In that way, it is only an incremental cost to me from here on out.

It is not the number of games you own but the dollars you have put into your hobby that most would find extreme your fellow pinsider would not but others may

#2164 1 year ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

Just read JJP Software's latest Twitter post. No live stream today but probably one on Friday.

It is to bad the twitter post is for TH and not POTC

1 week later
#2226 1 year ago
Quoted from LTG:

The JJP Software is the software guys in Chicago. The other JJP is the NJ Factory. Two different places, two different news sources and two different announcements.
LTG : )

A good way for many to miss out on news

#2230 1 year ago
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:

Chillax, you are on Pinside, nothing will by you.

You think "A good way for many to miss out on news" is worked upon Pinside that's funny

#2247 1 year ago
Quoted from pinlink:

Why are you here?

I follow Stern and JJP on FB Twitter and Pinside I am sure there are many others that do the same. The fact that my post stating that JJP having two Twitter accounts has been deleted is stupid as well as I am sure there are many that do not know of the second Twitter account and are missing out on news. Deleting the post may keep people in the dark.

#2249 1 year ago

Don't you mean #twotwittergate

#2258 1 year ago

When I saw the news on twitter I thought for sure this thread would be on fire?

2 weeks later
#2473 1 year ago
Quoted from mountaingamer:

I’ll take your spot if you were a early day 1 order

There is no need to take spots or pre-order just walk into any distributor and buy one it's not like there in short supply

#2474 1 year ago
Quoted from mountaingamer:

Great info! Thanks for sharing your well thought out, on topic contribution.
Is it just the angle, or is that playfield crazy packed?[quoted image]

It's the angle if you look at a POTC the bottom half is the spinner slingshots and out lanes everything is packed tight into the top half

1 week later
#2636 1 year ago

was this the thread the cartwheel was on?

1 week later
#2795 1 year ago
Quoted from Ericpinballfan:

Personally...I dont care if they build 1 a week.
Quality or quantity anyday of the week.
We've all waited this long, we will all get our machines....eventually.

You can't be serious at 20 a week that's only 1040 a year with say 300 to 400 units going to WOZ,DI,TH that leaves 600 to 700 POTC. I dought JJP is building only 20 units a week and the fact people think building more than 20 is bad is just sad

#2822 1 year ago
Quoted from frankmac:

How many CE will be made?

After two yr DI CE at a run of 150 has still not sold out chance is less than limit run as will never sell out there is a limit two what one can charge

#2873 1 year ago
Quoted from rubberducks:

I really don't understand the angst about locations and distributors (for test) getting games in advance of early buyers.
They're the guinea pigs, so that you hopefully get the best tuned, trouble free games as soon as you set them up. They won't just be tweaking setup and assembly, but there will inevitably be fixes and small changes to the code based on early feedback.
You're in no way getting screwed.

I call BS the prototypes that go to the shows are the game to work out the small changes. DI had the chipping playfield POTC had the chest and spinning disk talking about working things out after the cartwheel is just an excuse

#2908 1 year ago
Quoted from drfrightner:

I've seen this game and played it at IAAPA and Amusement Expo. I think this game is a mis-step for JJ. Couple reasons why...
1) They pride themselves with Hobbit and WOZ using a lot of clips from the movies. With that being said they should have picked a different them, because this game has almost NO CLIPS from the movie. So if you expect to see Depp as Captain Jack you'll be disappointed. I think this game would have been incredible had they had access to those film clips. So why pick this theme a fading series and no access to the clips as you had with WOZ and Hobbit.
2) No game should take 2 years to develop? NO GAME! Jersey Jack has been out of sight and out of mind due to the time they took to make the game. Stern for what their games are worth released what 856 new games since Dialed In. LOL
3) The spinning disk in the center... personally this was another missed opportunity but not because they removed that prop but because it shouldn't be there in the first place. It has nothing to do with the movies. So they promote this then take it away probably because it was going to break but still upset people. Here is what they SHOULD HAVE DONE... create the biggest lower playfield ever on a pinball machine. WHY? DUH... Pirates is a water theme and alot of the films took place UNDER WATER. So the lower playfield could have been UNDER THE OCEAN! Missed opportunity big league.
The spinning disk is dumb... a big giant lower playfield would have been award winner.
1) Stop thinking you need to create some sort of masterpiece with every game for several reasons... for one if you don't hit a homerun you get hammered even more. Secondly you need to produce more games. Why not a non-wide body theme to build up your catalog at least 1 or 2 games a year. And then produce 1 SUPER HIGH END collector game every 1.5 years. This might be better for your company.
2) No reason JJ can't produce a game that is between Stern and what they typically do... they can jump into the ROCK THEMED pinballs and produce a couple games a year. They should create two different kind of lines to keep their company out in front of people more than once every two years.
3) Don't promote a game for two years without ever releasing it. I like the fact that JJ let people know what they're working on ... so now you're working on Toy Story great. Tell people sure thing... but do it about 3 to 6 months out from production not almost two years.
Cheaper (Stern Style)
Music themes just as Ozzy - Beastie Boys - whatever cheaper games in the 5 to 6k range.
Quicker Themes Smaller Games: You're working with Disney a great theme would be Disney's Haunted Mansion. Stern is coming out with Munsters fight fire with fire... but make the game cool but cheaper. Universal Studios Monsters would make a great theme, some of the titles you have now that are down the line just do cheaper versions. Stuff you can't really see as an up to 2 year development game switch to a cheaper version and produce more games.
BIG THEMES: Jurassic Park would be up your alley... Fast and Furious, Dark Knight (Series), Harry Potter, Jaws would be bad ass, ... the list goes on. Save the coolest movie franchises for your all out mode and start making other themes with a faster process.

I could not upvote your post as I think it was overkill. But I did think the lower playfield would have been very cool better than spinning disk last Beastie Boys really

#2941 1 year ago
Quoted from romulusx:

All the folks slamming JJP,let’s not forget they made one of the best pins ever produced Dialed In!!!

DI is good because the game does not have a foolish number of modes

#2984 1 year ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

honestly. I am not sure how else an operator can afford the price point on some of these games.
I still hear people complain daily about $1 per play on 8k games that are well maintained. The hobby cant survive on that mentality.

I disagree as I keep hearing time after time JJP games are for colectors

#2988 1 year ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

way more $8000 JJP games out on route than Stern ones...
Pretty sure SternLE are exclusively built around the home collector market with only a small % seeing route.
JJP games on the other hand are found all over on route, but the price point is hard to stomach unless the route player is also willing to pay the higher amount per game. I will say that with JJP games, they player seems more than happy to pay the increase for what they get.

LOL everything to you is JJP vs Stern sad

#3032 1 year ago
Quoted from LTG:

I've had that happen, unless someone is playing it. For some reason people think it's the Stern version ( which I have here too ) or it's a remake.
If someone is playing it, it doesn't take long to get attention.
LTG : )

It could be as simple as the cost to play is more

#3037 1 year ago
Quoted from LTG:

Not here. My customers know the pricing. I currently have eight pins at a dollar a game. ( varies a bit if you put in more money )
LTG : )

At $1.00 a game all good I have seen JJP $1.50 Stern $1.00 non-pinball people may go for cheaper or different theme. Also earlier in thread people were talking $2.00 a game

#3038 1 year ago
Quoted from dnaman:

No more videos, updates etc... from JJP? On to the next title for everyone?

JJP has owned Expo should game 5 should be revealed at Expo Texas or whenever JJP feels the urge

#3041 1 year ago
Quoted from heni1977:

I am thinking this as well. I think JJP will wait till they are closer to a complete project. Maybe a hint at what their next title will be.

They may have a complete project but that does not mean they should reveal it

#3053 1 year ago
Quoted from DCFAN:

To survive, JJP likely will need to increase production and lower prices eventually, but we don't really know their true financial situation making it hard to judge.

I don't think price need to drop a lot $8500 would be the sweet spot but any price increase at this point could really hurt them

#3054 1 year ago
Quoted from Psw757:

I wasn't jumping to conclusions just making a point that I think JJP should stay the course and continue with their business model. They have a history of announcing at expo and I think that should continue.
Now I do think they should change how they do the reveal and perhaps just announce the title with no details other than game designer etc... don't promise any specific features until finalized and definitely don't mention a timeline.

I disagree no good come from one more six month wait. A spring or Texas reveal with a 6 or 8 week wait is the way to go

#3070 1 year ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

Stern is now charging close to $9k for their latest LE games that have no where near the amount of toys, features and code (rules, animations, sound) work that Pirates has. I don't see a sub $8k Pirates happening with what JJP is offering. The standard at $8500 is fairly close to that target.

I myself think LE games are for fools and have said so many times. Stern DP LE run of 500 JJP LE run of POTC 2500 I believe can you really even call that a LE. For those who want to pay up for a limited game at least they get it with Stern.

#3091 1 year ago

I suspect JJP is trying to get the games to all distributors at once. They do not want to send a truckload to one distributor and another distributor does not get his for two weeks so they may build several truckloads before shipping out games. If not that then there are real issues

#3093 1 year ago
Quoted from Eskaybee:

I think the problem is

The problem is not a single one has shown up in a home over a month after the cartwheel

2 weeks later
#3131 1 year ago
Quoted from Psw757:

Very disappointing process..this will likely be the last JJP machine I buy until they get their shit in order.
We are now into Oct and not a peep on US homeowner orders, are we really going to go beyond a year from reveal/orders to delivery?

You don't need to pre order JJP games there is no shortage of games just wait till the distributors have them in stock less stress

#3214 1 year ago
Quoted from TimBoch:

I think they should have given me the machine for doing the impossible

I think Jacks cartwheel is turning into Bushs mission accomplished

2 weeks later
#3288 11 months ago
Quoted from Tranquilize:

I have both. Stern makes inferior machines. It was a satirical statement.

Yet you just spent money on a brand new Stern Iron Maiden seems to me you just like to bitch

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