(Topic ID: 214634)

JJPOTC Updates for Production

By Hogbog

1 year ago

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  • Latest reply 11 months ago by Yelobird
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Topic index (key posts)

6 key posts have been marked in this topic

Post #593 The new artwork in high-res Posted by pinball_keefer (1 year ago)

Post #2454 Link to livestream of play on one of the first machines off the line Posted by solarvalue (1 year ago)

Post #2464 Picture of first jjPotCs on the line Posted by mountaingamer (1 year ago)

Post #2496 Link to Jack's "shipping" cartwheel for jjPotC. Posted by KingBW (1 year ago)

Post #2561 Comparison of prototype and final under playfields Posted by Join_The_Cirqus (1 year ago)

Topic indices are generated from key posts and maintained by Pinside Editors. For more information, or to become an editor yourself read this post!

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#227 1 year ago
Quoted from FlippyD:

The chest is no biggie but changing the disc is pretty darn disappointing. It was more than just a gameplay element but also an exciting visual element with its lit up inserts. Replacing it with an unlit map is sadly a pretty steep downgrade.
Here are some ideas for alternatives:
Make it a spinning LED disc. You could create wild holographic effects with it. When not spinning you see the map graphics, when it spins different animations are played.
Make it a literal liquid maelstrom. Some sealed blue fluid and some lights and you could have an impressive “analog” visual.

This is pretty cool idea actually.

But to my comments toward the topic as a whole.

-People keep saying drop the price. I could care less about saving a $500 or even 1k off. I was paying a premium for the machine because of its innovations. You take all the innovations away and now your in sterns price point. And theres many more titles to choose from then.

-This is a huge mistake. And something "AMAZING" really needs to be added to make up for this.

-The new disc they showed was so bad this seriously seems like a late april fools joke. They cant really be serious with that>>???

PS: For those that arent familiar with the films. The 3 spinning disc was actually a triple spinning map in the film. Theres a reason it spun like that, to mimmick how the map spins in the film. If the new mech only spins as a whole then having the map in the center as a idea in general for the machine no longer makes sense for the theme and is just dumb. So really ditching the 3 discs should mean ditching THE ENTIRE MAP BEING THERE. Because it no longer makes sense for the theme. It would be like them changing the pirates battle ship to a US ARMY Battle ship with machine guns. It just doesnt fit the theme.


#246 1 year ago
Quoted from vid1900:

The chest is so lame.
How much money could it really save eliminating the operating lid?
I got this one at the Aquarium shop for $8, and the lid has been operating 24/7 for like nine years.


#402 1 year ago
Quoted from spinal:

JJP has proposed a cut and run solution: replace the most complex piece of hardware with a simple motor. Reasons given is that original design at high speeds is unreliable and too loud and a simple motor will be reliable and quieter. Since they are willing to make this very drastic move at any expense to their reputation, I'm assuming two things for now:
1. We're not getting the three disks spinning at high rate as originally proposed.
2. Although looking a bit suspicious right now, im still taking their word that the reason it's being cut is THAT IT DOESN'T WORK RELIABLY AT HIGH SPEED AND IS TOO LOUD.
Many good alternative solutions have been proposed. Here is a poll:
For me the obvious solution is that the hardware remain exactly as is EXCEPT that it's initial intended purpose be modified (just moving slowly now as a cool toy to show progress on lining up interlocking rings). Here are reasons why:
1. The device has been tested at high speed for a long time. So if it operated only at low speeds now, it will probably be the most reliable device ever made (if high speed was the main reliability issue).
2. Yes, we give up the fact that the rings put action on the ball but I'm OK with that. But remember that often not all 3 rings were rotating. In fact, when spinning fast one could not see much of anything and they weren't spinning that fast in the movie anyway. What was cool was SEEING the 3 rings. It's a cool piece of hardware that just looks cool! So, like most of us who voted, it's not a downgrade to have this piece of hardware stay as is just moving slowly, rings moving around slowly while playing.
3. What we gain is that this cool piece of hardware can now be tied even more into gameplay! Remember that each disk can be moved to any orientation by software and the game always knows the orientation of each disk. This allows for making shots that turn the discs on the playfield and the goal is to reach certain configurations for jackpots or finishing modes etc. certain shots could change directions of rings or pops could randomly change directions etc. Making lit shots turns a ring to left or right and you make shots to get rings aligned as you need - exactly like the puzzle theme of movie! In my view this is even better than having just spin a high speed where you can't see anything and does not add much to gameplay (except action on the ball).
4. JJP is obviously in rush mode now and are no longer willing to wait it out. This proposal of using the original hardware just at very slow speeds is best here. No changes needed at all - leave everything exactly as is - only code has to change. In the worst case ship the game with limited integrations as described in 3. and update code later - we will understand.
5. Quiet as a mouse if each ring only moving a bit here and there one or a few positions at a time.
It's not time to throw the baby out with the bath water here - the hardware is very cool even if not spinning at high speed. I have actually come to think it's better slower - to have it more integrated into gameplay, always visible because not blurred away and closer to movie movement, and now reliable and silent.
If the real reasons for completely cutting this hardware are indeed high speed reliability and it being too loud, then this low-speed original hardware solution checks all boxes and is the obvious way forward. We have voted on it as well (poll above) and the majority prefer this over replacing with the single stock motor.
If they don't go with this most obvious compromise then clearly we know that there are other reasons being kept from us and JJP are not being forthright here to their loyal supporters.
If there is anyone who doesn't think this is a good compromise (especially since zero changes to hardware have to be made), please post below and let's hash this out. We are cheering Eric and JJP on here and hope they make the right decisions for this game to reach its greatest potential!

I completely agree with everything you said.

However your assuming the original mech can work as your describing without serious modification and reengineering. So it's not a guarantee the mech is even capable. Probable yes but you know what I mean.

I'd also like to see what jjp has come up with first. But I do like the idea of the map acting as a key map for the player to find out which mode or what shot he should be shooting.

#507 1 year ago

Didnt i hear somebody say eric was due to appear on a certain podcast today>? I wonder if that appearance was cancelled>??

#518 1 year ago

Just reading into keefers comment. It doesnt shine a very good light on any chance of good reaction coming from the JJP team after this debacle. Seems like they are content with what they are doing

#563 1 year ago
Quoted from Yelobird:

While I did cancel my CE order I must admit I do still have my order and deposit still locked for an LE. For Me, I just did not feel the changes justified the exclusivity or 3K up-charge. I guess I was hedging my bets from the start shame on me. This Is an incredible game No question granted the changes are rather drastic with minimal explanation but time will tell what they come up with. LE seems to be a fair bet for now for Me anyway.
Regarding the map detail at update. (Pizza as its been called). I actually asked Eric about this at the MGC show and Holly Wow if his answer wasn't 100% fact. The map they originally had on the prototype was something JJP created. The actual Movie map is what they went with on the revised version granted I suspect this was as seen a Low Res possibly spinning photoshop illustration of what we seen. Could be wrong? But he did say he was surprised as this is the True map from the movie which they thought would be more correct given the changes. The map photo below is from the actual movie. Granted its not spinning or photoshopped but for me it does look pretty cool. Not as cool as the JJP created one but rather nice. My guess is we will see and hear more Wednesday. No ship in the bottle topper for me but I am also not fully jumping ship just yet.....

I knew it was a Photoshop as soon as I saw it. And I familiar with the pics of the actual map online. However I keep thinking the one in the movie had better detail to it. I'm going to go back and try to watch it tonight to see if I'm right in that. But either way I think the map needs some led inserts to snazzy it up a bit.

#636 1 year ago
Quoted from danastude:

Where and when is this stream on Wednesday?

Nobody knows as of now. It's a big question mark if they will even stream tomorrow. Keefer posted again. Once again inferring this change is already final. I sure not. I at least hope it's up for some debate.

#661 1 year ago
Quoted from danastude:

Stream at 3pm where? Is it video?

Ill try to post the link here when and if they go live. It was mentioned in the update video by eric they planned to stream today. However a lot has happened since that video.

Im actually kind of hoping they dont stream today. And still remain silent because that would mean our(Customers) revolt to the decision has ruffled some feathers and they are back at the drawing board trying to come up with a different answer. If they do stream today its most likely going to mean this decision is more final than we want it to be.

#809 1 year ago
Quoted from Psw757:

Is the ship still going to be outfitted with sails as they previously mentioned?
Or did they mothball that idea too?

They didn't mention it in the stream. Somy guess is that got "tweaked" too.

#895 1 year ago

They literally would have been better off leaving the old mech in and just have the little center disc spin. Or hell none of them spin at all. Or with a disclaimer ehhh we will fix it later type thing. But we need to ship now.

The new mech is a serious eye sore. The new mech needs lights or something to spice it up. Its just plain ugly. And that (Pizza) is the worst of all this. Go back to the original video and as soon as it shows the picture of the new mech, The mass majority puked a little bit in their mouths. And thats literally what started all of this. So any other idea at all then what they put out there would have been better.

#936 1 year ago
Quoted from o-din:

I prefer the honest approach-
"Sure, everybody's been canceling and now I'm going to be stuck with twenty of these things. Are you really sure you still want yours?"
......will nail down a sale every time.

Agreed. My profession is sales. And I'm pretty sure I have the same distributor as the guy who posted. I also called him today. And he gave me the same word. However I don't blame him. If it was my business the last thing I'm going to say is oh yeah everybody's been canceling. He admitted to one CE cancel. However I'm sure there is more. I don't believe everyone is lying. Now I'm not sure I believe the poll numbers. But I believe the people that posted. I called just to confirm and give a heads up that Im now strongly on the fence but I'm still holding out hope. Just to make sure I still had time.

#948 1 year ago
Quoted from estrader:

Who is your distributor and what time today did you call him?

All of us Ohio guys called him lol. He told me we all called him.lol

#951 1 year ago
Quoted from estrader:

My understanding is he only had one ce allocated to him which I reserved in December I think and I canceled today.
Point was I don’t even know if the other guy calling people out even called a distributor.

Well your the one he told me about then. He said at least 3 guys from Ohio called him when I talked to him. He thought we all knew each other. Lol. But the other guy was from dayton so I'd assume he's the other Ohio guy.

#954 1 year ago
Quoted from estrader:

Did you order one?

Yes I made a big long rant post on one of these threads.

As of now my LE is still on. But I called and and confirmed I can cancel at anytime. Which I most likely will unless jjp changes something.

#1114 1 year ago
Quoted from OnTheSnap:

Potentially moving to the back of the line.
Anyway you can get a refund all the way up until it’s ready to ship. Although it’s critically important for us to send a message by cancelling orders as well.
I cancelled my order but my distributor spoke with JJP and convinced me this is still up for discussion. So he’s kept my spot in line. 100% will cancel if I don’t get the 3 disc mechanical engineering art for my $9500.

Only reason i havent cancelled is because i feel like theres still a small chance this situation improves. I wonder if i talk to my distributor i can cancel to help send this message to jjp as disapproval from their customer base but still hold my spot in line.

its more than just the discs at this point. Im not happy how the company itself handled this entire debacle. They need to make it right. For now i feel the customers are being ignored and force fed.

#1247 1 year ago
Quoted from ViperJelly:

Does anyone know if there is a live feed this afternoon? Didn't see anything on facebook.

i have not heard either. im doubting there will be one. Seems JJP are going to crawl in a hole until production starts and hope people forget or ever find out.

Personally im still on the fence. And imo jjp should be doing everything they can to persuade people like me. But im starting to realize apparently jjps most passionate collectors are not the bread winners in jjp eyes.

#1299 1 year ago
Quoted from pinball_keefer:

Well we'll be crawling out of the hole doing one tomorrow. As I announced on twitter, we were going to do it yesterday, but had to move to Thursday because reasons.

Thats great news. Trust me im just as excited as everybody to see more of the game.

#1300 1 year ago

oh and btw a little birdie told me once production starts games will start shipping within a 2-3 weeks. At least thats what i heard.

#1323 1 year ago

Two discs would be better one. But the discgate is over. I'm anxious to see the final art on the disc.

Unfortunately I was expecting sails to be on the ship. I was actually really excited to see what they up with for that. But I asked today and that was said to be a miscommunication and there will be no sails on the ship.
Oh well. That's a mod waiting to happen.

But I was decently happy with what I saw. May be leaning towards staying in on my LE. I liked the variable speed disc. Much better.

I'm heading to pinfest. Playing both acnc and potc. Unfortunately it's going to suck. Because I'm sure the potc they are going to have there will have the 3 discs.

#1356 1 year ago
Quoted from JimB:

They should have added some magnets to the spinning disc, not enough action from what I saw.

Why do people keep asking for more action from the spinner. The one on the stream had plenty of action. Caused at least 3 drains as is.
Why in the world would you want even more chaos right in front of your flippers then the spinner is already doing? You get any more chaotic then it already is and you start brushing with frustration and not fun anymore.

#1410 1 year ago
Quoted from flashinstinct:

I like the boats, but would have made them in the blue, feel like orange is just too much. Personal choice.

I tend to agree when I first saw it I thought it kind of clashed. It's not terrible. Ships are cool tho.

#1525 1 year ago
Quoted from Psw757:

Finally got to play this today. Stood in line for an hour watching it so got to see quite a bit.
It’s going to be interesting to see how long these stay in people’s collections.
Talking to several people at the show, the impression I got is you either love it or hate it.
I think the code needs to be developed so there is a little more immersion to the theme as several mentioned earlier.
Even though no games can really ever be the same,the chapters and multiballs even though named differently and score differently all feel the same visually.
Music and callouts are good and it really is a nice looking machine.
I like it so keeping my order but it sure helps that I’m a fan of the franchise in general.
There are some clever and difficult shots with the layout and cool subway system so from a shooting perspective it is pretty good.
Something with the theming is just slightly off though in my opinion. I think it’s little things they can tweak without infringing in licensing issues so hopefully this evolves a bit more.
Just my 2 cents!

That would be cool as unique for sure

I'd say a huge part of anyone that played it and don't like it was due to how broke it was. I waited to play it as well. The old triple disc worked better then the rocking ship. The rocking ship was broke to one side. Never shifted to the other side. So it made the upper pf useless and no fun. Then the treasure chest was unmakable. Which not only takes out dvey Jones locker MB. But also hurts on completing some of the chapters because the chest shot is a part of those. . .

4 weeks later
#1923 1 year ago

well tomorrows stream (If there is one) Will be interesting to see if eric Is there in chicago or not. They kind of avoided the question last week. But it was still may last weds. So first weds of june. Maybe eric will be in Jersey Getting pirates ready to start!

1 week later
#1986 1 year ago

I still think its going to be august like some others have said in this thread. 3-5 more weeks of live streams then they are going to hit the line.

1 week later
#2022 1 year ago
Quoted from Psw757:

Geez several weeks isn’t what I would consider soon. Several weeks could be 2-3 months in reality.
If this is the case major bummer. Was really thinking it would happen in July.

Ehh i think it just confirms August is the month they start shipping. Like what was said earlier in this thread.

3 weeks later
#2169 1 year ago
Quoted from JY64:

It is to bad the twitter post is for TH and not POTC

you sure about that they already did TH stream last week.

3 weeks later
#2414 1 year ago
Quoted from Yelobird:

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mod couple is killing it. Ill be in touch soon. Ive gotta have all of this!

1 week later
#2469 1 year ago

With deadpool being announced and looking awesome. Im finally cancelling me preorder. Picked up a SW premium and will be getting a Deadpool premium in a few months. POTC Lost every bit of HYPE for me and im not the only one clearly.

I had a bad taste in my mouth about buying the first model anyways. JJP has had mechanical issues where they had to send out parts to owners with almost every machine. Not to mention i hated the thought of buying the first LE. Then a year and a half from now a sweet BlackPearl Version being released.

I still love the game. And ill probably be back on board for the Black Pearl addition a year or two from now. Also gives them time to polish out whatever problems for this model arrise.

Fact is however if they would have stayed on schedule. Not had a disc gate situation. And released in q1 of 2018. They would have had my money no doubt. Mistakes were made.

#2477 1 year ago
Quoted from Zavadoza:

Deadpool does look tasty and we haven't even seen it played yet. I put in a deposit on an LE (b/c i love depreciating assets). I totally get where you're coming from being out of patience. I pre-ordered at the reveal. But so you know, Jack Guarnieri said that there will not be a Black Pearl edition. you're basically getting that with the LE. Also, Hobbit LE > Black arrow imo. You'll be able to get a game later, just don't expect a new version to come out. This game will sell with the current editions.

Not hobbit LE> Smaug edition though imo. Which is what i have. I have a serious doubt JJP will not have another version of this. But maybe im wrong. Either way i dont like how they release different more cool versions later.

3 weeks later
#2954 1 year ago

He means spot lights^^^

#2956 1 year ago
Quoted from evh347:

My only nit-picky critical obeservations:
1) The ball occasionally stalled between the ship’s ladder ramp and the edge of the rocking ship. I actually got the ball stuck there a few times. The ball could be dislodged by repeatedly activating the ship’s upper left flipper, but it took that and some slight nudging to get the ball to fall free from that area. Lloyd said JJ was sending him some parts to remedy this.

3) Not sure if it’s me, but I still had a few shots to the chest denied and this is the chest with the top permantely open. That’s a shot that’s going to take some practice, but I swear I hit that shot fairly a couple times and the ball just dribbled back out rather than going up into the lock.

[quoted image]

See this drives me up a wall.

I played a handful of games on a prototype at two different shows and had the same exact issues. If a regular joe blow can see these problems after only a few games how can they not have this remedied on the production machine. You would think such things would be no brainers and priorities.

The chest has been an issue. They tried to fix it and then tried to cover up that their fix really didnt work all that well. A problem with the chest still persisted. But yet they just ignored it. More evidence of the higher ups had said enough is enough get the game on the production line. Which isnt good for us. And in the end wont be good for JJP. I can maybe understand the chest. Even though it seems like a very simple mech. However the ball stuck on the ship is inexcusable.

Also the ball stuck on the ship not only happened to me personally but also happened at least once on one of JJPs own streams.

Im just being real here guys.

There are definitely some situations JJP has done throughout this "Waiting experience" That has rubbed not only me but very many others the wrong way.

And PS: I feel for you guys still waiting. I made my decision to hold off over a month ago. But i really suspected to come into this thread, after another month, and see some you guys with pics of these in your gamerooms. It sucks they aren't yet.

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