Toy Story 4 (CE)
Jersey Jack, 2022
Toy Story 4 (LE)
Jersey Jack, 2022You're currently viewing posts by Pinsider jfh.
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Quoted from blacklightprod:Toy Story is obviously next and its going to be HUGE! It might be their biggest seller ever. I’m predicting 1000 CE this time around with a price of about $13,500.00 That will be my guess.
I used to agree. Been excited about the possibility of Toy Story for a long time (probably a CE), but that has been greatly diminished by the playfield quality fiasco. Until I’m confident that’s resolved or JJP will take care of impacted customers no way I’m a buyer of any edition.
Quoted from Charlemagne1987:There are other manufacturers out there who build quality machines and STAND BY THEM. I’ll be buying from them for now on.
When my wife questioned me getting a CCr she asked “What about Toy Story?” and correctly noted we currently don’t have space (and probably funds) for both. When I told her about the playfield issues and decline in customer issues she agreed with my criteria for buying TS (also includes strong integration of movie assets). My impression that quality (and silk screened playfields) and customer service are important to Chicago Gaming was a big factor.
Quoted from starfighter:All valid points... NONE of which were addressed by anyone in attendance at the JJP seminar nor by Jack nor a single employee on stage. I streamed the seminar waiting for someone/anyone to say something/anything and I was shocked that no QC issues came up at all.
I gave Jack a super softball question on the playfield issues at TPF in 2019 and he declined to say anything. The JJP response to this has been a non-response collective shrug. They probably don’t think it has any impact on potential sales (which unfortunately seems to be true).
Quoted from Bud:do you honestly believe JJP likes a defective product and wants that product in their machines? I’m sure they don’t, I’m sure they are trying to fix it and I’m sure there are business dealings and contracts we don’t understand or know about. The playfield issues are well known
Of course they don’t.
But trying to fix it? It’s been over two years and there is no evidence of that. More tellingly there has been no public comment from JJP on the matter despite multiple opportunities to do so and in the meantime they’ve neutered the warranty.
I don’t know what the problem is but until JJP convinces me the playfield problems are behind them I’m not going to buy NIB from them. And that pains me to say because I’ve been waiting for a Lawlor designed Toy Story for years.
Quoted from SantaEatsCheese:They appear to still be cranking out G&Rs. G&R and Hotwheels appear to be the only thing available NIB without a markup these days.
Cactus Canyon Remake is available at MSRP. Some dealers even have SEs in stock.
Quoted from arcadenerd925:Agree, but the PF issues would sure be a pretty big elephant in the room to ignore.
And yet they have consistently ignored it at every opportunity.
Yup. Been waiting for Toy Story for a long time. But no way I’d risk buying a game with zero customer support and apparently no plan to address the playfield situation.
Quoted from LTG:Tell them to get LTG : ) back.
Do you really want to go back to a place that doesn’t understand how valuable you are?
Besides, I like that you work with CGC since I have a Cactus Canyon coming to take the spot previously slotted for Toy Story. 
Quoted from PinDeadHead:My distributor just indicated he’s received his initial allocations from JJP and he believes it will be revealed in the next 2-3 weeks. He also said he’s seen the pin, it is Toy Story, and he thinks it will meet or exceed pinhead expectations!
Not going to meet expectations unless the playfield issues are fixed and the warranty is restored.
Quoted from LTG:And they get LTG : ) back.
Well, you’re working for CGC now and I’m putting Cactus Canyon in the slot previously earmarked for Toy Story
Quoted from Nstone4425:Yes it's based on Toy Story 4 and the premises is working through the carnival.
What an epic fail if true.
Quoted from romulusx:I have a feeling you would say epic fail no matter how good it is?
You obviously haven’t been paying attention. I have been waiting for Toy Story for years. It is a dream theme for my family and I got on a CE list a couple years ago. But with the change in warranty support and no assurances that JJP has addressed the playfield quality issues I’m not willing to gamble $15k.
I can wait a year and see how things pan out. That probably means no CE but I’m sure the LE will be fine. Unless it’s a TS4 only theme. Then hard no.
The obvious pinball toy is a claw that picks up a pinball and deposits it somewhere else on the playfield
Quoted from insight75:I just received a response from a distributor that they have 1 more CE available. Only $24,999. lol
And the insanity has started. No. Just no.
And yet it’ll probably be sold by Monday.
Quoted from Charlemagne1987:My two cents here (not that anybody asked for it)…it really bothers me to see JJP rewarded for treating its customers like shit on their last game. I’m not a JJP hater or anything. I’m a happy owner of an LE POTC. It’s just that everyone seems to be falling all over themselves for this game, forgetting that JJP essentially gave us the middle finger with GNR: raising the price twice mid-run, giving mostly useless assistance on the playfield issues, changing their warranty policy, not responding to maintenance requests, etc. I don’t need to rehash all that mess. I just wish their was some blowback to their bottom line so they would realize that is now way for them to run their business. Otherwise, I think they make great games and I’d like to see them continue into the future but with more focus on customer service and quality builds. Again, that’s just my two cents.
All reasons why, despite wanting TS for years, I’m out at release. If JJP shows that things are different, I’ll look at getting one next year. But there are too many with short memories or FOMO that will gladly take the slots of those voting with their wallets that it won’t make a difference or offer any incentive for JJP to change.
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:The more interesting questions to me are 1) how many LE’s and 2) when will they sell out? I’ll guess 5k LE’s and they sell out in one week. Therefore total run is 1k CE’s @ $16k (conventional wisdom is $15k but I say, nay) and 5k LE’s at $12.5k (you thought I’d say $12k, nope). Once the dust settles, that’s $20.25M of games sold in one week and produced over next 12 months. Pretty good for JJP, if it happens, and good for the customers.
What the hell are you smoking?
NFW 5k LEs sellout in a week. And, if there are no SEs I suspect LEs will be “unlimited”
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:um, do you know what LE stands for?
Apparently you don’t understand that there has never been a limit to JJPs “Limited Editions”. LE is an artificial marketing construct to drive demand for FOMO. They have never sold out LEs. And, if true that there won’t be an SE, it’s now the de facto base model of the game. JJP will build as many as they believe demand warrants over whatever lifespan they have set for the production run. Whatever number they set for LEs will be high enough that it won’t be exceeded.
But your incredulous statement that they will sell out 5k LEs in a week is what triggered my comment. Nothing to do with what an LE is or how fast they can be produced. No one has seen or played the game. They aren’t going to sell 5k total units in a week, let alone your implication of every LE game that will be produced.
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:We can merely speculate using imperfect knowledge.
Good thing you seem to have a lot of that.
I was holding off on TS because I wanted to see if the playfield issues would be addressed. Now that’s moot. I’ll play this game on location but will never own one.
My family has been waiting for a Lawlor designed Toy Story pin for years. TS4? Imagine if Jack had made “The Wiz” instead of “The Wizard of Oz”. That’s what we have. Not a classic, timeless game but one based on a strange depressing sequel that sapped the life and fun out of the original movies.
The carnival theme could be a good one. But it’s not Toy Story. Toy Story is about Andy’s toys in Andy’s room. Woody. Buzz. Slinky. Mr. Potato Head. Hamm. Rex. Jessie. Army men. The Aliens. And the Claw.
Instead we’re supposed to bash a doll’s head with a pinball? And “Toy Story 4” will date this game into oblivion before it finishes production.
I don’t know who the market for this is. Not my wife or daughter. Not most Disney Fans. Not Toy Story fans. Not this fan.
Quoted from Pinballomatic:The game has characters to collect like slinky dog and Hamm and such. The game is fun which I used to think was what mattered but I understand that things have been changing and maybe I'm missing out or something. I like playing it and the code is pretty much done. Shots are smooth. Maybe none of that matters and if so then I'm misjudging things. That's all cool.
Wanting to play the game is a whole lot different than wanting to own it.
I’ll play it, but I’m not going to own it. As a huge pinball and Toy Story fan this is an epic fail. It looks like Disney screwed JJP again. 
Quoted from PtownPin:Without reading a 1000 posts have they confirmed pricing and the number of CE's?
1000 CEs. Price unknown.
Quoted from Richthofen:The 4th Toy Story was a great movie. It was the first one I was old enough to see with my kid, all the other ones came out before he was born. The film was a technical triumph with crazy realistic lighting and animation, etc. But it was also a good Toy Story story; the first one was about making new friends, the last one was about going on new adventures with new friends. I don't understand the negative reactions people are having. It looks like how you'd expect a Toy Story pin to look.
Ok, so there’s at least one game sold …
Quoted from Dexter:Strange they send an AVAILABLE NOW email and nothing works.
Not any stranger than releasing a TOY STORY pin based on TOY STORY 4.
Quoted from jfh:My family has been waiting for a Lawlor designed Toy Story pin for years. TS4? Imagine if Jack had made “The Wiz” instead of “The Wizard of Oz”. That’s what we have. Not a classic, timeless game but one based on a strange depressing sequel that sapped the life and fun out of the original movies.
The carnival theme could be a good one. But it’s not Toy Story. Toy Story is about Andy’s toys in Andy’s room. Woody. Buzz. Slinky. Mr. Potato Head. Hamm. Rex. Jessie. Army men. The Aliens. And the Claw.
Instead we’re supposed to bash a doll’s head with a pinball? And “Toy Story 4” will date this game into oblivion before it finishes production.
I don’t know who the market for this is. Not my wife or daughter. Not most Disney Fans. Not Toy Story fans. Not this fan.
Update:
My wife and daughter have weighed in -
Daughter: WTF? That’s not Toy Story. Good thing you are out of room.
Wife: Toy Story 4? Hard pass. Please god tell me you didn’t order the CE.
(FYI - my daughter is now 31 and loved TS1&2. My wife is a big Pat Lawlor fan and a big Toy Story fan. Both love Disney).
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:If you bought a CE today, you’ve already made money.
Not unless you sold it. To someone silly enough to pay a premium for it.
Quoted from JohnTTwo:I had three distributors call me today to see if I wanted a CE.
I got a similar call. I’m 100% positive I would not have gotten one if the demand was everyone thought it was going to be yesterday as I haven’t talked to this distributor in over two years.
Quoted from iamabearsfan:I feel like I owe the designers and JJP an apology. Why? Well I had expectations that were maybe not practical AND JJP probably can't say anything about it. This is what happens when you work with a company like Disney. They are control freaks. So maybe we need to back off the TS4 vs. TS1-3 bashing just a bit? Because the only other option would have been to walk away from the deal entirely
JJP knew better and went forward anyway. They didn’t learn from the assets debacle with POTC even though Jack has come out since stating how important it is to have assets for the theme. Disney isn’t going to care whether a TS4 pinball is a success or not but it’s pretty important to JJP. If JJP had done a Toy Story pin like they did for WOZ they could have sold TS for years. But they bet that TS4 would be the same as TS and anyone who wanted a TS pin wouldn’t really care.
If they couldn’t afford to do Toy Story right they shouldn’t have done it at all. All they would have had to say is that a theme they were interested in was no longer economically viable. We would’ve known instantly what that meant and why. And, if we are to believe the roadmap leaked long ago, JJP was interested in Toy Story before TS4 was even a property so clearly TS4 was not the original intent for the theme.
I hope this isn’t the beginning of the end for JJP but it’s pretty clear the company Jack envisioned with WOZ is not one we will likely ever see. Too many missteps and compromises.
Imagine Quantum City instead of Dialed In, Pirates and Toy Story the way they should have been and silkscreened playfields.
Instead we have TS4 with cake toppers and a $10 tablet on a Mirco playfield offered up as what the best in pinball can be.
Quoted from LingBot:Anyone concerned about how they cut back on the warranty for this pin or is this the norm (it seems to exactly match Stern's warranty when I checked against GZ Premium). Also if the machine sits at a distributor for 2 months, I guess you're SOL on the logic boards?
What is covered on the game? Our Limited Warranty covers only the items listed below (“Covered Parts”) from the date the machine is shipped to JJP’s authorized distributors (or directly to the original owner), for the period of time indicated (the “Warranty Period”):
1. Printed circuit boards (game logic). Warranty Period – Sixty (60) Days.
2. LCD monitor. Warranty Period - Two Hundred Seventy (270) Days.
What is not covered on the game? JJP’s Limited Warranty does not cover anything other than the Covered Parts during the Warranty Period.
It looks like a fun game to play, though I do hate the big LCD. At $12k I'm finding it hard to convince myself to take a risk on a product whose warranty inspires low confidence. They are specifically not covering the PF at all.
You must be new here.
JJP gutted the warranty quite some time ago.
Quoted from 6S3NC3:Can we all agree that the biggest problem with TS4 is the price? If it was priced correctly I think it would not be getting all the hate.
Nope. Had it been Toy Story (without the iPad) and not TS4 price wouldn’t be a problem with creative mechs and proper IP. I would have bought my CE in a heartbeat.
The biggest problem with TS4 is that it’s TS4. Price is it’s second biggest problem.
Quoted from blacklightprod:At least someone or a few of us have some common sense. Someone on this very site RIGHT NOW is offering a Munsters Premium for $16,500.00. Okay lets break that down Munsters which is not really a hot in demand license vs Toy Story a top 5 World wide license. Hmmm… and people complain about the price.
If we went up and down ALL of these threads and looked at everyone and I mean everyone who’s complaining about the price and we looked at their asking prices for games they’ve tried to sell what would we see??? So the very people on this site has created the market where Stern also raised prices from the 9k range for a limited edition to $11,099 and they want to complain.
NEW GAMES such as Toy Story are STILL CHEAPER than the USED games the VERY people on this thread are selling right now. Makes no sense at all to complain about $12,000 when they’re selling a Munsters Premium for $16,500.00
Furthermore look at the ads for this game right now people are asking $17,500 for the CE right now. Who created that number not JJP. Also before the release of Toy Story we saw STERN putting out 199 Elvira 40th and putting their distos up to selling the game for 25 to 30k. ELVIRA STILL DIDN”T COME WITH A TOPPER… Toy Story CE has a topper and its HALF THE PRICE! HELLO… why the double standard
Price of pinball and what people are willing to pay was created by the pinball buyers market about 2 years ago to today. If all of us are hating on prices, why don’t we ALL agree to go on our listings and drop the prices across the board 30%. Who would do that? No one obviously. We all want the max we can get out of anything we sell a car, house, or a pinball. We created the numbers now we complain about a supplier raising the price is so hypocritical.
Bottom line Toy Story brand new in the box is cheaper RIGHT NOW than Munsters Premium apparently.
Good God man - give it a rest. You’re just flailing your arms like a lunatic now.
What’s saddest for me is that this is/was/might be Pat Lawlor’s last game.
Can you imagine what he could have done with the actual Toy Story license, a good BOM budget and some innovative pinball toys worthy of the license and Jack’s original vision for JJP games?
I would have almost certainly have paid whatever price JJP asked.
Quoted from TheLaw:Just like Munsters. So if you love that I guess you can love this.
I’m sorry, Munsters is much better than TS4.
Quoted from PiperPinball:I think the bubble will burst when the next generation comes of age. That would be my kids and most millennials.
Highly unlikely they will buy new pinball machines or used for that matter. They don't care about nostalgia like all of us here on Pinside.
The demographic will change once us 40+ year plus olds stop buying or slow down.
Just my 2 cents.
I think it’s worse than that. So many new folks here don’t care about pinball unless the game was made in the last few years and certainly don’t care about pinball history in general.
Quoted from Haymaker:The SE has consistently been JJP's worst seller. I totally understand why they axed the SE from their lineup. The fact so many people are clamoring for an SE version of TS4 says a lot about the game....
No - it’s says a lot about the pricing of the game, not the game itself.
Quoted from Noma2017:Someone new to the hobby probably won't even notice it
Most people new to the hobby aren’t going to start out paying $12k+ for a game.
Quoted from Freakyguy666:Left sling is not functioning properly…
Sure it is. That’s the hypnovolley feature. Track the ball as you get hypnotized to think TS4 is a great value for $12k.
Quoted from Noma2017:Originally had TS 1-3 in 2014. Wonka license had a short time period and there was a lot of competition for it so it had to go first.
While they were planning TS, TS4 movie came out earlier than expected. Turnover of Disney license people and they pushed TS4. He says Pixar is really happy with the machine.
So, effectively Willy Wonka killed the Toy Story everyone wanted.
Pixar forced JJP to make a movie specific game that would quickly become dated (like before the game was released) rather than a timeless franchise classic.
Quoted from AJC3030:The distributor he ordered from said that" the deposits were turned over to JJP already" when he asked about transferring the deposit to a different game with a distributor. What exactly does that mean ? Doesn't that defeat the purpose of a deposit with a distributor?
That means the distributor doesn’t have the $1k to transfer to another game that the distributor would have to place on a different game. That is why some insist on a deposit up front. They would use the deposit from the buyer that eventually buys the TS4. For games that are incredibly popular a distrib could resale that spot instantly. That he wouldn’t front that might indicate TS4 isn’t selling as quickly as some people think.
Quoted from explosiveegg:Last I knew distributors took a much larger cut than that.
I thought it was around 25-30% of the MSRP of the game.
Good god no. Dunno what it is on TS4 but it’s way closer to $1k than $4k.
Quoted from PtownPin:fine with paying a premium for JJP as they always packed games with shots, mechs, great animations, great code, and prior to GNR I always felt like they would take care of me if I had an issue. My issue now is they have raised prices, dropped quality, and have reflected this in their lack of warranty and customer support. Thus I will never purchase another NIB JJP game, and will just look to the secondary market for a nice HUO game.
Got to agree 100%. Sadly, JJP has a lot of work to do to win back my trust and enthusiasm for owning one of their games.
I’ve only had one JJP (Hobbit) but sold it quickly because it just didn’t resonate. Wanted Dialed In but my wife just thought it was a stupid name/theme (though would have been fine with Quantum City) and I should have bought a WOZ Emerald or RR when I had the chance. And as much as we love Pat Lawlor games there were just too many missteps and questionable decisions on DI, Wonka and TS4. And Pat wanted Butch gone so guess what?
The playfield and warranty debacle really soured me on JJP and the horrible decision to drop an evergreen TS 1-3 game in favor of a dated and lackluster TS4 at a ridiculous price doesn’t inspire confidence moving forward. They seem to shoot themselves in the foot every game about something.
Their first game may end up being their best and yet that was the opposite of Jack’s original plan. I’m still rooting for JJP but no longer see myself buying a game without seeing a significant change in direction.
Quoted from SirMachismo:Gabby Gabby and the pin looked really dirty already.
Bad enough that JJP thought of and Disney approved bashing a little girl’s face. Bashing a little girl in blackface is worse.
Quoted from Freakyguy666:She’s an evil TOY DOLL…think Chucky except instead of slashing a human open she wants to rip out the insides of Woody…
Yes I know she is evil. It’s still not a good look.
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West Des Moines, IA