(Topic ID: 290919)

JJP Toy Story (any rumor confirmations?)

By Trojanlaw

1 year ago


Topic Heartbeat

Topic Stats

  • 5,986 posts
  • 659 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 7 days ago by zermeno68
  • Topic is favorited by 127 Pinsiders

You

Linked Games

Topic Gallery

View topic image gallery

AC614DA1-F00B-4054-9170-C4D1150B344E (resized).jpeg
IMG_2068 (resized).JPG
IMG_2067 (resized).JPG
72EC51DA-CB1D-4978-8995-03B6B558B128.gif
IMG_3625 (resized).jpeg
224F7BE6-01B8-447C-A998-C3554FBB37C8 (resized).jpeg
GabbyFacemask.jpg
ken_doll_meet_bensons_dummies_by_noureldeinm2003_df7k99y-350t (resized).jpg
86234446-23FA-456B-AC4A-4CF71F767F09 (resized).jpeg
090C9D93-1C0E-4270-A892-121040E8D562 (resized).jpeg
435E7D06-9C0D-4553-AEA9-BE1CE86855F7 (resized).jpeg
6B64B962-6BD0-422D-9BE2-249F80844320 (resized).jpeg
7CBACD5F-A487-4F5E-A9F2-593649FDCD98 (resized).jpeg
AB374773-1B6A-44D9-9D32-700496F69930 (resized).jpeg
Schermafbeelding 2022-07-19 193844 (resized).jpg
giphy (5).gif

There are 5,986 posts in this topic. You are on page 79 of 120.
#3901 55 days ago
Quoted from jamieflowers:

Sure its more expensive than GNR etc but so is EVERYTHING....go buy gas, milk, cars, houses etc. Inflation is a bitch

Did you just compare inflation on everyday necessities to a $15,000 pinball game?

Wow... just wow.

You, sir, are the problem.

#3902 55 days ago
Quoted from Beechwood:

Did you just compare inflation on everyday necessities to a $15,000 pinball game?
Wow... just wow.
You, sir, are the problem.

Agreed. Inflation is an excuse to charge way more and to be greedy. Funny how many companies are showing record profits even though the cost to do business is supposedly higher.

#3903 55 days ago
Quoted from Goronic:

Maybe that's why there is no standard version on this title. What is left to remove.
I guess you could take away another voice actor callout or two?

They can remove the pointless tablet and the powder coating.

The problem with this is that it saves them maybe $40 so if they’d sell it for $9999 their margin shrinks by almost $2k.

#3904 55 days ago
Quoted from BallyKISS1978:

Agreed. Inflation is an excuse to charge way more and to be greedy. Funny how many companies are showing record profits even though the cost to do business is supposedly higher.

Haha if companies were honest, they’d blame inflation on us idiotic consumers who are showering them with money. *We* are the root cause of inflation. Because we as a society currently have a shitload of money to blow on anything and everything. You can’t even buy a PS5 two years after release even though Sony pumps out millions of them. Or check interstates. Jammed full of cars, regardless of $5/gal gas.
And TS4CE “sells out” in a few minutes.

Don’t blame the greedy companies. Look in the mirror.

#3905 55 days ago
Quoted from Beechwood:

Did you just compare inflation on everyday necessities to a $15,000 pinball game?
Wow... just wow.
You, sir, are the problem.

I don’t think he’s blaming the price increase totally on “inflation” but to deny it’s an issue for the goods, supply chain issues and wage increases that go into the game is kind ridiculous don’t you think?

Especially when the Fed just came out today and raised the Fed funds rate 75 basis points, the largest hike since 1994, in an effort to tamp down rampant inflation across the entire economy. Energy affects everything.

And why would he be the “problem”?

Things cost a lot more today versus two years ago.

Now the coming job layoffs, beyond the tech sector, and wages decreases will slow the consumer spending down, 70% of the economy, making future pins cost less because of Demand destruction.

You think the game is a POS? Ok

#3906 55 days ago
Quoted from Beechwood:

Did you just compare inflation on everyday necessities to a $15,000 pinball game?
Wow... just wow.
You, sir, are the problem.

Um, you obviously don't understand how inflation works. Their costs have been inflated just as much as yours. Therefore, they must raise prices to makeup for their increased costs. Economics 101.

#3907 55 days ago
Quoted from Scot0308:

Um, you obviously don't understand how inflation works. Their costs have been inflated just as much as yours. Therefore, they must raise prices to makeup for their increased costs. Economics 101.

Yeah, but pinball prices following along with the inflation rate for a ‘full featured’ game - are more like where stern premium pricing is, not 12-15 grand. Cactus Canyon was $4300 retail in 98, that’s like 7800 now adjusted for inflation.

#3908 55 days ago

I think it was this thread that set the prices, no?
Everyone said 12k le and 15k CE.... Lookie what Cha got...
Jk?

#3909 55 days ago

The average person is still clueless on how inflation is devaluing the dollar. I remember back in 2012 when a Stern LE's were going for $6500. Most pinsiders were irate about prices then too. We need to see where inflation settles prior to evaluating whether this pin is overpriced. Unfortunately, I believe inflation this year is closer to twenty percent than ten percent. Apparently, JJP agrees with me.

#3910 55 days ago
Quoted from epthegeek:

Yeah, but pinball prices following along with the inflation rate for a ‘full featured’ game - are more like where stern premium pricing is, not 12-15 grand. Cactus Canyon was $4300 retail in 98, that’s like 7800 now adjusted for inflation.

I think Stern and CGC is underpriced at this point. Unfortunately, their prices will catch up soon.

#3911 55 days ago
Quoted from epthegeek:

Yeah, but pinball prices following along with the inflation rate for a ‘full featured’ game - are more like where stern premium pricing is, not 12-15 grand. Cactus Canyon was $4300 retail in 98, that’s like 7800 now adjusted for inflation.

So the remake should be selling for $7800? Greedy bastards!

Your math is off considering the average inflation rate during this period was 2.5% roughly. So it would be around $8600

#3912 55 days ago

The market will dictate the secondary market price obviously, just like on every other high priced Stern LE or a declining pin like Halloween, whether you like it or not

maybe it’s so high they don’t actually sell through the CEs and the LEs become the lesser quantity version.

Maybe this is the tipping point time. We will find out soon

-1
#3913 55 days ago
Quoted from Scot0308:

Um, you obviously don't understand how inflation works. Their costs have been inflated just as much as yours. Therefore, they must raise prices to makeup for their increased costs. Economics 101.

Inflation 8.6%. Explain the 30% for JJp????

14
#3914 55 days ago
Quoted from Beechwood:

Inflation 8.6%. Explain the 30% for JJp????

Over the last 18 months you think Gas, housing, food, lumber, other commodities etc have only risen 8.6%?

That measures the “rate of change”.

Put your house in zillow and check your zestimate. Think it only went up 8.6% over that period of time?

That’s how inflation works

I understand where you are coming from and why you don’t get it though.

Successful companies, with fortress balance sheets, free cash flow have pricing power to pass along the increases. Many don’t. Crypto companies are failing and laying off people right and left. Coinbase example. Netflix. Tesla. On and on

About to find out whether or not JJP has “pricing power”

#3915 55 days ago
Quoted from yancy:

i got u fam
[quoted image]

You win the internet for today. Thread should be locked until tomorrow.

#3916 55 days ago

People buying LE's really want the game, that is a fact.

#3917 55 days ago

To me, much of these arguments remind me of Mac vs PC (JJP vs Stern) in the early days of the arguments around 2010 or earlier.
PC's are cheaper, they're what we are used to, there are more choices etc., Macs are more expensive, more elegant, more a closed system.
I think JJP is like Apple in some ways, that is, changing the game, making them more user-friendly and more elegant. Clearly thinking Different.
There will always be fans of both, so it will never end.
Buy what you like and can afford.

#3918 55 days ago
Quoted from wackenhut:

People buying LE's really want the game, that is a fact.

Might not be many of them though!

I blame those greedy Disney bastards for jacking up the licensing fees. Have you seen the park fee increases? Wow. Talk about inflation.

Maybe that’s why their stock is down 39% this year

#3919 55 days ago

True, it is probably going to be the most Limited of All
I am sure they did their marketing (not my area of expertise), but feel they missed on not having a 9K price point version.

Never say never though. They might have one in the future with sluggish sales on the LE.

-1
#3920 55 days ago
Quoted from JayH:

To me, much of these arguments remind me of Mac vs PC (JJP vs Stern) in the early days of the arguments around 2010 or earlier.
PC's are cheaper, they're what we are used to, there are more choices etc., Macs are more expensive, more elegant, more a closed system.
I think JJP is like Apple in some ways, that is, changing the game, making them more user-friendly and more elegant. Clearly thinking Different.
There will always be fans of both, so it will never end.
Buy what you like and can afford.

Read Apple case studies. JJP is like Apple in it needed money and was likely close to going under.

No comparison today as JJP quality is nothing like Apple. Apple is sleek marketing with very high quality.

#3921 55 days ago

Pinball Market Trends!!!!

Down $1005 after the relisting

Screenshot_20220615-191545_Chrome (resized).jpg
#3922 55 days ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Over the last 18 months you think Gas, housing, food, lumber, other commodities etc have only risen 8.6%?
That measures the “rate of change”.
Put your house in zillow and check your zestimate. Think it only went up 8.6% over that period of time?
That’s how inflation works
I understand where you are coming from and why you don’t get it though.
Successful companies, with fortress balance sheets, free cash flow have pricing power to pass along the increases. Many don’t. Crypto companies are failing and laying off people right and left. Coinbase example. Netflix. Tesla. On and on
About to find out whether or not JJP has “pricing power”

Ice,

Glad your posting as your last few posts were so right on.

The issue with JJP is quality and we will see if the customer support is there for first time owners as I think there will be a lot on this title.

#3923 55 days ago

Pat Lawlor on making Toy Story 4 for Disney...

they-wanted-me-to-build-them-a-bomb-so-i-took-their-plutonium-and-in-turn-gave-them-a-shoddy-bomb-ca.jpg
#3924 55 days ago
Quoted from hank527:

...JJP quality is nothing like Apple. Apple is sleek marketing with very high quality.

Gotta disagree with you on that. I own several Sterns and several JJP's. JJP's are clearly better built in my opinion. And true, JJP does better Marketing than Stern as well!

-1
#3925 55 days ago
Quoted from JayH:

Gotta disagree with you on that. I own several Sterns and several JJP's. JJP's are clearly better built in my opinion. And true, JJP does better Marketing than Stern as well!

Really? I honestly don't see a difference in quality between the two products. The old JJP used to pack games and have incredible code....those days are long gone brother (although their release code is far more advanced than Stern, but they only build 1 game a year)....the new JJP is all about efficient BOM's, reduced warranties and support, and turning a profit....the profit on TS4 CE must have set a record

-1
#3926 55 days ago
Quoted from JayH:

Gotta disagree with you on that. I own several Sterns and several JJP's. JJP's are clearly better built in my opinion. And true, JJP does better Marketing than Stern as well!

It's sort of weird how inconsistent quality is between the two companies. I only have two machines. A recent stern and a recent JJP. In some ways JJP has much better quality, but stern has better quality in some areas. Obviously stern wins hands down on flippers. The software also seems more polished and engineered with stern. JJP games almost have this half-baked feel with software and the architecture. I tried getting Bluetooth to work with my JJP and it was clear that the software was just too poorly done to get it to work. I've also had some odd errors when starting up that eventually just went away, but after a while I got the feeling that the game was pretty shakey when it comes to edge cases.

#3927 55 days ago
Quoted from wisefwumyogwave:

The only comparison that really matters is which companies games have mirco playfields and which ones dont...

I have a Big Lebowski. Mirco and bulletproof after 500 plays.

15
#3929 55 days ago

Oh this thread - haven’t revisited all day and over 200 new replies. The new one I love reading from JJP apologists is this…….

“So much complaining and yet no one on these boards has even seen it or played it yet. How dare you judge!”

Spoiler alert - we’ve all seen it. JJP tried to Cromwell us. We should want the game based on toy story 4, with no toys except cake toppers on the pf. Problem is we’re smarter than that - hence the negative feedback. We’re not here to interview Pat and stand by while he says it’s the most innovative pinball ever. But don’t worry it shoots well and it’s fun. Buy Buy Buy!

All these sales of CEs - majority are flippers who are already nervous or dealers like the idiots out in Arizona charging 25k. Yeah how’s that going?

As for playing it - newsflash! We’re all expecting that this game will shoot well. We’ve already given them credit for that. It’s in the plus category. It’s a Pat Lawlor game. It will shoot like DI and Wonka. Sweet. Imagine it didn’t though? This place would burn down.

On top of all of this disappointment, you really haven’t even heard about those Marco pfs. Imagine that isn’t fixed either?

But hey……No corners cut right? Thanks Ken for standing up for this community and allowing us to get all of this for only 12-15k.

-1
#3930 55 days ago
Quoted from seenev:

Obviously stern wins hands down on flippers.

I couldn't disagree more. One of the worst parts of Sterns IMHO is the flippers. Way to slappy and clunky. I *adore* the flipper feel on the Williams WPC/WPC95 titles. Both American Pinball and JJP do a fine job of providing hardware and drivers that replicate that feel. One of the things I like most on the JJP games, in addition to the stellar build quality. This may be a generational thing. Those that grew up on Sterns in the last 20 years likely consider that the standard for flipper feel. My pinball heyday was the late 70s to 90s. WPC games were the best.

#3931 55 days ago

One thing I haven’t seen mentioned yet is if this game uses any of the new light sensors that JJP created and used in GNR. Maybe there wasn’t a good use case for them in this one? GNR uses them for the skill shot and the guitar locks and I’m sure there could be other unique elements where they could be handy. Perhaps this game was mostly completed when that was being created for GNR?

#3932 55 days ago
Quoted from DiabloRush:

I couldn't disagree more. One of the worst parts of Sterns IMHO is the flippers. Way to slappy and clunky. I *adore* the flipper feel on the Williams WPC/WPC95 titles. Both American Pinball and JJP do a fine job of providing hardware and drivers that replicate that feel. One of the things I like most on the JJP games, in addition to the stellar build quality. This may be a generational thing. Those that grew up on Sterns in the last 20 years likely consider that the standard for flipper feel. My pinball heyday was the late 70s to 90s. WPC games were the best.

While I agree WPC flippers are the gold standard, JJP games don't do a fine job of replicating the feel (mostly a software/board problem, since the flipper mechs are the same IIRC). Spooky flippers are constantly changing, along with their boards/OS.

#3933 55 days ago
Quoted from DiabloRush:

I couldn't disagree more. One of the worst parts of Sterns IMHO is the flippers. Way to slappy and clunky. I *adore* the flipper feel on the Williams WPC/WPC95 titles. Both American Pinball and JJP do a fine job of providing hardware and drivers that replicate that feel. One of the things I like most on the JJP games, in addition to the stellar build quality. This may be a generational thing. Those that grew up on Sterns in the last 20 years likely consider that the standard for flipper feel. My pinball heyday was the late 70s to 90s. WPC games were the best.

I've owned every JJP game, about 15 Sterns, and several Bally/Williams games along with all the remakes. I do agree that the JJP game flippers are roughly the same feel as old BW games. Stern flippers are very different, but I don't consider that a good or bad thing...just different. I used to think JJP's build quality and warranty was great, but those days are long gone. The new JJP build is more like Stern, and their warranty is far worse.

#3934 55 days ago
Quoted from DiabloRush:

I couldn't disagree more. One of the worst parts of Sterns IMHO is the flippers. Way to slappy and clunky. I *adore* the flipper feel on the Williams WPC/WPC95 titles. Both American Pinball and JJP do a fine job of providing hardware and drivers that replicate that feel. One of the things I like most on the JJP games, in addition to the stellar build quality. This may be a generational thing. Those that grew up on Sterns in the last 20 years likely consider that the standard for flipper feel. My pinball heyday was the late 70s to 90s. WPC games were the best.

Have you only played Whitestar Sterns like LOTR & TSPP? SAM Stern flippers are great & Spike are even better.

#3935 55 days ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

Have you only played Whitestar Sterns like LOTR & TSPP? SAM Stern flippers are great & Spike are even better.

I currently own several Spike 2 games. Rush, JP, Mando. Also have a Whitestar (LOTR). Not much difference between them IMHO.

#3936 55 days ago
Quoted from JohnTTwo:

I had three distributors call me today to see if I wanted a CE.
I understand the hype train but something smells funny on this release.

Yeah. Overpriced child’s theme. 15 grand buys a shit ton of kids toys.

And the art will probably stick on most of those toys.

#3937 55 days ago
Quoted from DiabloRush:

I couldn't disagree more. One of the worst parts of Sterns IMHO is the flippers. Way to slappy and clunky. I *adore* the flipper feel on the Williams WPC/WPC95 titles. Both American Pinball and JJP do a fine job of providing hardware and drivers that replicate that feel. One of the things I like most on the JJP games, in addition to the stellar build quality. This may be a generational thing. Those that grew up on Sterns in the last 20 years likely consider that the standard for flipper feel. My pinball heyday was the late 70s to 90s. WPC games were the best.

Come on dude. I’ve owned many WPC games and have played or owned all the current manufacturer’s games. I started collecting in the late 90s with mostly WPC. Stern flippers are the gold standard today. JJP and Spooky in particular, aren’t even close. It is the biggest issue with non-Sterns today.

All IMHO but I think this is a common opinion from pinball folks I know.

#3938 55 days ago
Quoted from delt31:

Oh this thread - haven’t revisited all day and over 200 new replies. The new one I love reading from JJP apologists is this…….
“So much complaining and yet no one on these boards has even seen it or played it yet. How dare you judge!”
Spoiler alert - we’ve all seen it. JJP tried to Cromwell us. We should want the game based on toy story 4, with no toys except cake toppers on the pf. Problem is we’re smarter than that - hence the negative feedback. We’re not here to interview Pat and stand by while he says it’s the most innovative pinball ever. But don’t worry it shoots well and it’s fun. Buy Buy Buy!
All these sales of CEs - majority are flippers who are already nervous or dealers like the idiots out in Arizona charging 25k. Yeah how’s that going?
As for playing it - newsflash! We’re all expecting that this game will shoot well. We’ve already given them credit for that. It’s in the plus category. It’s a Pat Lawlor game. It will shoot like DI and Wonka. Sweet. Imagine it didn’t though? This place would burn down.
On top of all of this disappointment, you really haven’t even heard about those Marco pfs. Imagine that isn’t fixed either?
But hey……No corners cut right? Thanks Ken for standing up for this community and allowing us to get all of this for only 12-15k.

Damn Marco playfields and to heck with you Kenny!

#3939 55 days ago
Quoted from romulusx:

Damn Marco playfields and to heck with you Kenny!

So did u roll the dice on a CE or LE?

#3941 55 days ago
Quoted from TinyBlackDog:

Come on dude. I’ve owned many WPC games and have played or owned all the current manufacturer’s games. I started collecting in the late 90s with mostly WPC. Stern flippers are the gold standard today. JJP and Spooky in particular, aren’t even close. It is the biggest issue with non-Sterns today.
All IMHO but I think this is a common opinion from pinball folks I know.

I dont think BW or JJP flippers are bad....just very different than Stern flippers. I do however feel a difference between TSPP, and my TWD and JP

#3942 55 days ago
Quoted from TinyBlackDog:

Stern flippers are the gold standard today.

Quoted from PtownPin:

I do agree that the JJP game flippers are roughly the same feel as old BW games.

Quoted from snaroff:

While I agree WPC flippers are the gold standard

This is obviously a matter of preference. Some think Stern; some think WPC. I'm in the later camp. One of the features I like on JJP titles.

#3943 55 days ago
Quoted from Xelz:

The kicker is, aside from the larger backbox monitor and "complimentary" hot rails, this machine doesn't have much going for it beyond a typical Stern premium. In fact, you could argue that Godzilla Prem has more features than TS4.
So if JJP can sell a boatload of Stern-level TS4's at $12K a pop, why wouldn't Stern start selling their premium pins at the same price point?
Speaking from the marketing perspective rather than as a consumer, the question isn't whether TS4 is priced too high, it's whether Stern has been pricing too low.

Stern premiums are not equivalent to JJP LE’s. With that being said I agree with you about Godzilla premium / LE having more in it then Toy Story models. In terms of mechanical features Toy Story is JJP's weakest game to date IMO.

JJP LE = Stern LE
JJP CE = Stern Super LE, Signature Editions, etc.

#3944 55 days ago
gabby (resized).jpg
#3945 55 days ago

I can't believe this is Pat’s last game.

I was really hoping to see Fun House 2 before he was done.

(Obviously something different than the recently released 2.0 kit).

#3946 55 days ago

The ce on eBay sold for $20600! Plus tax. Sure eBay took a lot of it.

#3947 55 days ago
Quoted from JayH:

Gotta disagree with you on that. I own several Sterns and several JJP's. JJP's are clearly better built in my opinion. And true, JJP does better Marketing than Stern as well!

Neither are as good as CGC

#3948 55 days ago

So...Anyone played this yet?

#3949 55 days ago
Quoted from beltking:

The ce on eBay sold for $20600! Plus tax. Sure eBay took a lot of it.

Assuming the sale is legit then after Ebay fee's, fee's from having to claim income on profits (Ebay's now sends a tax form), and having to give JJP a $1,000 transfer fee's the seller may have broke even.

#3950 55 days ago

Can anyone confirm the 1,000 transfer fee? Totally agree with it.

Promoted items from the Pinside Marketplace
From: $ 18.00
Apparel - Men
Pinside Shop
$ 30.00
Cabinet - Other
Rocket City Pinball
$ 12,000.00
Pinball Machine
Classic Game Rooms
$ 15,000.00
Pinball Machine
Classic Game Rooms
$ 399.95
Lighting - Led
Pin Stadium Pinball Mods
11,999 (Firm)
Machine - For Sale
Essex, CT
12,000
Trade
Machine - For Trade
Kaysville, UT
$ 15.00
Cabinet - Sound/Speakers
Gweem's Mods
$ 23.00
Flipper Parts
Precision Pinball prod.
$ 649.95
Lighting - Led
Pin Stadium Pinball Mods
$ 12,000.00
Pinball Machine
Maine Home Recreation
From: $ 13.50
Flipper Parts
Precision Pinball prod.
Great pinball charity
Pinball Edu
There are 5,986 posts in this topic. You are on page 79 of 120.

Reply

Wanna join the discussion? Please sign in to reply to this topic.

Hey there! Welcome to Pinside!

Donate to Pinside

Great to see you're enjoying Pinside! Did you know Pinside is able to run without any 3rd-party banners or ads, thanks to the support from our visitors? Please consider a donation to Pinside and get anext to your username to show for it! Or better yet, become a Pinside+ member!