(Topic ID: 290919)

JJP Toy Story (any rumor confirmations?)

By Trojanlaw

1 year ago


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There are 5,987 posts in this topic. You are on page 67 of 120.
#3301 65 days ago
Quoted from Medisinyl:

Seems to be cake toppers

People do love toppers.

23
#3302 65 days ago
Quoted from Lathroum:

No one wants a video mode in a pinball machine. It's why we play pinball.

JJP already has the largest LCD in the business that would be capable of hosting a video mode. Adding another iPad sized LCD with the wacky orientation to make it "fly" is really pathetic. Just poor taste...likely driven by having more programming resources than mechanical engineering resources. JJP graphics on the large LCD is usually pretty impressive. I want more kinetic, mechanical PINBALL and less video game.

#3303 65 days ago
Quoted from Hollywoodbone:

That’s your feeling and there’s no way I can change that. Zach has talked negatively about plenty of pins and talk plenty of shit about pins to the point where that I have been terrified that a distributor is going to call him and tell him to fuck off. Now has he shit on, or I have shit on everything that’s in a pin????….NO that’s why we have the grading system we do. But we are very honest about aspects of the game that we do not like or that fails. But because those aspects are failures and we talk about those aspects as failures that does not mean the whole entire game is a complete mess. If you watch a lot of videos back and you pay close attention you will see exactly this … Honesty. Again if there’s something that is complete ass I normally don’t speak on it and we leave it alone. There are a lot of mods that we have been asked to review or talk about that we have graciously turned down that someone has given us. Solely because we do not believe in it . I know that I’m very redundant in saying this and I feel like every time a review or video comes out I have to stay exactly this. But our values come first. Now we’re not Kaneda and and go over board with shit. (No disrespect Chris) There is a tasteful and tactful way of saying you don’t like something without being an asshole about it. That’s what we do. Now if that is misconstrued into us being shills or trying to sell pins I’m sorry. But I can criticize something without being an asshole to people that worked very hard on it. Still speaking my mind and not tearing them down.

As your business grows, the reviews might have to fade...Just the way it might have to be...I love your content for sure, but can see how others might now question the transparency of your opinions on certain pins...Tis what it is

#3304 65 days ago
Quoted from jorant:

Greg, i genuinely think you're a nice man. I met you once years ago and you were very pleasant. So don't take this personally:
Currently, right this very moment, I'm debating on buying a jjp gnr le. I searched YouTube and saw your review. But now, i have to weigh if this review is actually genuine or not before i spend thousands and thousands of dollars. Being a reviewer to sell machines, I get, as Zach is trying to make a living. I, however, wish to find a non biased opinion on the machine and couldnt find anything but your guy's review. Granted there are some here, but we all know we hype up the games we own here.
You see where I'm coming from, surely. If you praise absolutely everything to make sales, that doesnt give me the assurance that im making a sound decision, considering I know nowhere that i can play this for myself.
I'm just wishing for a truly geniune non biased review. And.... well... as enertaining and informative as your videos may be, I dont feel you guys have anyone's ingerest at heart when it comes to this.
Im not asking you to crap on everything. Far from it. But if a game blows, it would be refreshing for you to give it somehing less than a B for a change. So keep this in mind when reviewing this game. Please.

Every reviewer has a bias

40
#3305 65 days ago

I don't think SDTM would remove negative comments. It's not that bad.

***Public service announcement***

Simple common sense reminder to some - you can't expect a straight review from SDTM when they were literally just paid by JJP to shoot the promo video. Not enough? How about the JJP marketer of this game is literally another friend of these guys. No corners cut on TS4 remember? Still not enough? Well, the same two (SDTM) are literally SELLING the damn game as well.

Now if you still think you're getting an honest view, do yourself a favor and hand your wallet over to a responsible adult so you can save yourself the trouble later.

And this is not a statement on these two - they're not bad people. It's pinball at the end of the day and I have no hostility. I honestly think they don't even know the bias that exists b/c there was a time when they were like you and I but now they're distributors. Other distro's have enough sense to not try and influence pinsiders directly - these guys want to continue doing both which is comical. It's entertainment at the end of the day for me which is why I still listen. Why not.

If you want to buy this game, go ahead and send JJP the message that we will pay more for much much less but you can't responsibly look to SDTM to guide you in how you purchase something. Many pinsiders get it but I see some new guys or folks who are just drinking the kool aid and it pains me to see you being take advantage of.

***Public service announcement over***

#3306 65 days ago

I'd be interested to learn the reason for going for Toy Story 4 over the more general Toy Story universal. Money I assume.

#3307 65 days ago
Quoted from MaxAMillion:

NOT SOLD OUT YET

People do love toppers.

I like cake -
chilled carrot with a scoop of vanilla icecream
Or a warm chocolate with whatever the hell

The JJP FB gameplay doesn’t look terrible
Hoping FargoPinball has one coming to his route soon

#3308 65 days ago
Quoted from kool1:

Yes but the upfront cost is almost 2 Stern Pros. There is a reason most operators don't buy premium/LEs.

and there are reasons to buy premiums too - which is why we have a room with lots of them.

The point is Operators care more about what a game MAKES than they care about the upfront cost. That is why locations can have coin pusher and Halo games that cost 20k. Capital costs can be financed and equipment has residual value. You make money by getting money IN - that requires up front costs and vendors will pay it.

We start pushing away on prices when the ROI isn't there. If a game has a high residual value I care less about the upfront cost... it's the opportunity cost that it's really competing with. If that game is only making 1/2 of what another game would make in it's place.. that's when it's a problem... because it's not making what it could.

If a game costs 2x more, and doesn't create any draw or additional revenue.. then that's a problem. The point of this entire discussion is initial investment is not the deciding factor - it's what the game makes vs what it costs to own.

#3309 65 days ago
Quoted from jwilson:

I'd be interested to learn the reason for going for Toy Story 4 over the more general Toy Story universal. Money I assume.

I worked with Disney/Pixar on a video game, and they can be very, very particular about what assets you use and how you use them. I'm positive JJP had a lot less creative freedom than usual, but I still can't justify buying this game for the price they're asking. Just not enough meat on those bones.

#3310 65 days ago
Quoted from snaroff:

JJP already has the largest LCD in the business that would be capable of hosting a video mode. Adding another iPad sized LCD with the wacky orientation to make it "fly" is really pathetic. Just poor taste...likely driven by having more programming resources than mechanical engineering resources. JJP graphics on the large LCD is usually pretty impressive. I want more kinetic, mechanical PINBALL and less video game.

This! The 10" display is taking up space in the back 3rd of the playfield for what is traditionally reserved for a mechanical toy (or two, or 3). Everything on that display could have been replicated on the main 27" display. Sadly it's likely far cheaper to put a 10" display in a game versus a large custom pinball mech. That shouldn't occur though at these insane prices.

The entire back 3rd of the game is void of any mechanical toys which is bizarre to see in a pinball machine that is $12k+ (it's bizarre to see in a Stern Pro at $7k). This may be a first for the modern era.

Screenshot 2022-06-14 120613 (resized).jpg

#3311 65 days ago
Quoted from Scandell:

But your theme integration score should reflect what this could of and should of been...not just "how well did this game encapsulate the single Toy Story 4 film".

Couldn't disagree more. Theme integration is, how well did you do with what you have. Not, what theme did fanboys imagine this would be based on rumors.

Quoted from Scandell:

The official title of the game is "Toy Story". Not "Toy Story 4".

Exactly backwards. It's called Toy Story 4 in all the official media.

#3312 65 days ago
Quoted from jwilson:

I'd be interested to learn the reason for going for Toy Story 4 over the more general Toy Story universal. Money I assume.

My guess is this. Disney was in control here on the licensing front. They needed more attention on Toy Story 4 because it didnt do as well as the other movies. What better way to do this than force JJP to make the pinball machine on TS4. Either they flat out wouldnt allow JJP rights to the other movies, or they made the licensing cost to high for JJP to make money on each game.

#3313 65 days ago
Quoted from snaroff:

JJP already has the largest LCD in the business that would be capable of hosting a video mode. Adding another iPad sized LCD with the wacky orientation to make it "fly" is really pathetic. Just poor taste...likely driven by having more programming resources than mechanical engineering resources. JJP graphics on the large LCD is usually pretty impressive. I want more kinetic, mechanical PINBALL and less video game.

Look at it this way, NEXT JJP game they're pushing over the P3 Empire, and making the Mirco playfield obsolete with a full screen playfield, on top of a smaller 12" one, and the LCD backglass..!!!

Maybe after that....projected mechs!

And then ideally JJP #10 is just an outright $60 fucking video game. I hope....

#3314 65 days ago
Quoted from tacreno:

My guess is this. Disney was in control here on the licensing front. They needed more attention on Toy Story 4 because it didnt do as well as the other movies. What better way to do this than force JJP to make the pinball machine on TS4. Either they flat out wouldnt allow JJP rights to the other movies, or they made the licensing cost to high for JJP to make money on each game.

Then they should of scrapped TS4 and moved on to something else...We waited a long time for this theme, it was well before TS4 ever came out as a movie; like 5+ years ago that I first heard of it.

JJP Failed, easy for me now; I'd much rather have LOV Deluxe and 4 more grand in my pocket. LOV straight up is a better layout than this atrocity by a mile...

#3315 65 days ago
Quoted from PinStalker:

Once you know your game is littered with $10 worth of cake toppers..... can you ever look at it the same way again?

Oh my... hate to burst your bubble.. but the only molded items on Lord of the Rings are a bunch of figures Stern bought off the toy shelf for like $10!

#3316 65 days ago
Quoted from bbulkley:

I worked with Disney/Pixar on a video game, and they can be very, very particular about what assets you use and how you use them. I'm positive JJP had a lot less creative freedom than usual, but I still can't justify buying this game for the price they're asking. Just not enough meat on those bones.

Right, so walk away. They should find another company to work with.

-1
#3317 65 days ago
Quoted from pluto:

It does, but there are some other factors at play too. My wife loves Toy Story and I've been really wanting to get her more into pinball so hearing that this pin is more accessible (which is insulting to some) makes it a good mix of a theme she will love and potentially a pin she will enjoy playing.

You fundamentally misunderstand your wife (and women in general).

19
#3318 65 days ago

Yeah i don't understand why anyone gets worked up over ANYBODY doing a review of ANY game including SDTM.

It's entertaining, that's it, we can see it with our eyes can't we? Form our own opinions as a result? Maybe not, I'm sure some people need to be told what to think.

There is no amount of "shilling" positive or negative that should change anyone's mind. Think for yourselves.

#3319 65 days ago
Quoted from Hollywoodbone:

And I believe Pat included a neat feature that senses when you are going to shoot for the ramp when it comes up and increases even more power on that left flipper so that you make the ramp with ease.

That's actually a really clever workaround for janky flippers. Progress.

#3320 65 days ago
Quoted from tacreno:

I believe this is the why the lack of toys on the playfield and why the game appears to be geared towards children.

So.. you think Disney forced JJP to make a kid focused Toy Story game... instead of JJP picking a theme they knew was kid centric to start with?

#3321 65 days ago

If the focus really was on little children, and i don't mean the big babies that we all are, then JJP is tone deaf, lacks any sort of self awareness and must be clueless about the pinball market. Which isn't the case? Or is it?

#3322 65 days ago
Quoted from Damonator:

And I know there is a large group of people that buy *only* JJP games.
FWIW - my distributor says sales are strong today.

Totally agreed. They've got a good following for a boutique label -- but those are already pinball people with pinball opinions.

I'm more interested in what happens when the news leaks out to places like Disney fansites. Rush is a good example of a game that could hook into a rabid fanbase even if they've only stopped into a barcade every so often. I'd imagine there's a significant number of Disney Adults who recently bought SW/Mando/Avengers as their first game and now they're eyeing Toy Story as the crown jewel of their Disney collection.

#3323 65 days ago
Quoted from astro_judge:

I also think you're overestimating how much a machine's theme will affect the draw. Pinball people will show up wherever the games are and casual players will drop credits into anything that aligns with their interests just for the novelty of playing. Kids are just as likely to be into Stranger Things, Mando / SW, Avengers, TMNT, Jurassic Park, Rick & Morty... Trying to distinguish between "Kid Themes" and "Adult Themes" is hilarious now that companies like Disney and Marvel have erased any divide between the two to take advantage of Disney Adult nostalgia.

I think you grossly overestimate how much you think you know about the casual pinball customers. Theme is everything to get them to try a game.

Kids run past every title you just mentioned to play Super Mario Bros when they've never even seen the pin before.

#3324 65 days ago
Quoted from tbutler6:

I like cake -
chilled carrot with a scoop of vanilla icecream
Or a warm chocolate with whatever the hell

pasted_image (resized).png
#3325 65 days ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

Oh my... hate to burst your bubble.. but the only molded items on Lord of the Rings are a bunch of figures Stern bought off the toy shelf for like $10!

But that was a $5k CDN NIB pin. Apples and oranges to me.

15
#3326 65 days ago

Gameplay video:

-4
#3327 65 days ago
Quoted from delt31:

I don't think SDTM would remove negative comments. It's not that bad.
***Public service announcement***
Simple common sense reminder to some - you can't expect a straight review from SDTM when they were literally just paid by JJP to shoot the promo video. Not enough? How about the JJP marketer of this game is literally another friend of these guys. No corners cut on TS4 remember? Still not enough? Well, the same two (SDTM) are literally SELLING the damn game as well.
Now if you still think you're getting an honest view, do yourself a favor and hand your wallet over to a responsible adult so you can save yourself the trouble later.
And this is not a statement on these two - they're not bad people. It's pinball at the end of the day and I have no hostility. I honestly think they don't even know the bias that exists b/c there was a time when they were like you and I but now they're distributors. Other distro's have enough sense to not try and influence pinsiders directly - these guys want to continue doing both which is comical. It's entertainment at the end of the day for me which is why I still listen. Why not.
If you want to buy this game, go ahead and send JJP the message that we will pay more for much much less but you can't responsibly look to SDTM to guide you in how you purchase something. Many pinsiders get it but I see some new guys or folks who are just drinking the kool aid and it pains me to see you being take advantage of.
***Public service announcement over***

You sir are right!!!!! Let’s not forget though that we were never like you or anyone else on pinside. Because I can show you countless messages where that we were ridiculed prior to Zach being a distributor because we simply knew people in the industry and we were always accused of being biased and never hurting our friends feeling that worked in the industry. So I’m sorry to say you may be right about everything else in your message but you are completely wrong in the fact that we were ever just like you and everyone else on pinside!!! We have always been biased assholes that are clueless to being biased from the start!
Now you sir I always question your motive on here. Who’s paying you and what are you doing to always tear us down! Are you being paid by deep root? Are you being paid by multi morpic? I question this bias that you present as simple disdain for our biasness!
Side note, please show me where we were paid for any of the videos we have done for JJP or any other manufacturer. Especially prior to Zach being a distributor!

#3328 65 days ago

Well that’s what happens if the last few loaded pins have disappointing sales and then the market turned into a sight unseen buying frenzy where a new machine sells, regardless of design.

Why would JJP bother with a world under glass like POTC, if it’s super expensive to make, doesn’t sell while y’all shower them with $$$ if they just put in a couple hundred LEDs, a pop up doll, a rotating disc and a pop up ramp!

I think it’s a fun looking average pinball machine. Nothing more, nothing less. It’s not anything special.

But I totally understand JJP. Once the customer base is irrationally buying anything, why bother with excellence?

#3329 65 days ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

So.. you think Disney forced JJP to make a kid focused Toy Story game... instead of JJP picking a theme they knew was kid centric to start with?

Maybe but thats an odd decision from JJP. This price point is a little high to make good money on location which means the target audience is 30-60 years old.

#3330 65 days ago
Quoted from Hollywoodbone:

You sir are right!!!!! Let’s not forget though that we were never like you or anyone else on pinside. Because I can show you countless messages where that we were ridiculed prior to Zach being a distributor because we simply knew people in the industry and we were always accused of being biased and never hurting our friends feeling that worked in the industry. So I’m sorry to say you may be right about everything else in your message but you are completely wrong in the fact that we were ever just like you and everyone else on pinside!!! We have always been biased assholes that are clueless to being biased from the start!
Now you sir I always question your motive on here. Who’s paying you and what are you doing to always tear us down! Are you being paid by deep root? Are you being paid by multi morpic? I question this bias that you present as simple disdain for our biasness!
Side note, please show me where we were paid for any of the videos we have done for JJP or any other manufacturer. Especially prior to Zach being a distributor!

This back and forth digital slapfest is more compelling than the digital slapfest JJP showed today..!

#3331 65 days ago

"I was never like you; I always knew important people!"

#3332 65 days ago

I pictured Buzz standing atop the back corner of the playfield, boots at the start of a looping hot wheels track/wireform, mechanical wings popping out with lights blinking, just before saying “to infinity and beyond - multiball!!!” and releasing a 3 ball flurry down the loop de loop via a VUK just beneath him.

#3333 65 days ago
Quoted from OleSilverBalls:

I pulled the trigger on an LE. Wasn’t easy after initially being very underwhelmed by the information leaked prior to release. I hope you’re right about everything you mentioned above. The YouTube video pushed me off the fence. Even though it’s TS4, it’s still Toy Story. Having 3 young kids will hopefully it a good purchase. After the YT video I’m cautiously optimistic it will exceed my expectations…mainly because that bar is set pretty low at the moment.

You have 3 young kids and haven't figured out they they get more enjoyment out of angry birds on mom's iphone than a $15k pin they may play twice?

#3334 65 days ago
Quoted from dnaman:

But that was a $5k CDN NIB pin. Apples and oranges to me.

Also missing from this story... any boasting from JJP about the figurines as if they are driving the value in the pin. They simply list 'Officially Licensed Toys' - not 'custom sculpts' or boasting anything else.

#3335 65 days ago
Quoted from ShooterMcD:

Gameplay video:

Looks like it could fun.

#3336 65 days ago

I was never going to be a buyer of this game unless it was the most amazing thing I've ever seen but I AM impressed they got Tim Allen, Annie Potts and Jim Hanks (Tom doesn't do any voice work for video games or anything) to do custom call-outs for it. I'll definitely dump some dollars in one if I ever see one in the wild.

#3337 65 days ago
Quoted from tacreno:

Maybe but thats an odd decision from JJP. This price point is a little high to make good money on location which means the target audience is 30-60 years old.

Customers have no idea what a game costs and doesn't factor into their decision to play or not. So again.. the price point has little to nothing to do with the draw to customers as a location game.

JJP made a point to also call out home buyers who want a kid friendly game in their house. There are plenty of retail consumers out there who buy pins based on theme and the desire to have a game.

#3338 65 days ago
Quoted from yancy:

People do love toppers.

And cake! She has also been known to do custom callouts.

59d501fc743ccaf05360639bc40c6ad9.gif
#3339 65 days ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

I think you grossly overestimate how much you think you know about the casual pinball customers. Theme is everything to get them to try a game.
Kids run past every title you just mentioned to play Super Mario Bros when they've never even seen the pin before.

Yeah, that's exactly what I meant when I said casual players drop money into whatever happens to line up with their interests. I was trying to say that I don't think the presence of a specific theme like Toy Story vs. Godzilla would affect the type of crowd the venue draws like sataneatscheese mentioned with the Birthday Parties vs. Beer argument.

12
#3340 65 days ago

I'm confused, there's not enough to be disappointed about that we're going to go after Zach and Greg?
For real though, how dumb do you have to be to base your decision to buy something on one or two people's reviews. Isn't a review showing off different aspects of the game, shots, modes, call-outs, things you want to see? Would you not be able to determine on your own if you're interested in it.
Pinball is fun. Most pinball machines are fun to play.
If someone thinks everything is fun in this hobby, they may just enjoy the hobby.
You don't have to be crass and negative to be authentic. Some folks just like pinball for fun.

I on the other hand, am still pissed this is TS4.
Bring on Venom I guess...

#3341 65 days ago
Quoted from Ballderdash:

I pictured Buzz standing atop the back corner of the playfield, boots at the start of a looping hot wheels track/wireform, mechanical wings popping out with lights blinking, just before saying “to infinity and beyond - multiball!!!” and releasing a 3 ball flurry down the loop de loop via a VUK just beneath him.

Again, the gameplay doesn’t look to have obvious issue-and if the sounds are consistent with the video, seems to have less slot machine vibe i got from other JJPs

The art (while it looked good on the line in SDTMs video) is quite unexpected-

Toy Story (to me) screams a predominantly white armored cabinet with bright blues and yellow- more like the Wonka style i suppose.

I’m sure in person it will look alright

#3342 65 days ago

I don’t know, maybe I’m in the minority, but Toy Story 4 might be my favorite in the series.
The adventure takes place in an antique shop and carnival, so what’s not to love?

As for the game, well I have to say that I don’t see anything that necessarily blows me away, however the gameplay from that 1 or 2 minute teaser does look like a lot of fun.
$12,000 worth of fun? Probably not because that’s a load of cash, and the theme aside (which for me is great in TS4) you will get about the same amount of gameplay fun for nearly half the money in a game like Godzilla or Stranger things,
and it’s not like half of a dollar here when I say nearly half, we’re talking $5,000 between the two games.

There’s no question that Disney was stingy and protective with their license, and I’m sure to incorporate all four films wasn’t financially viable or possibly available. If you think about the available merchandise that is from the earlier three films in 2022, there is none that singles out or is surrounded or labeled by any of those first films, unless Disney is doing it themselves at a theme park or something.

#3343 65 days ago
Quoted from dsmoke1986:

Then they should of scrapped TS4 and moved on to something else...We waited a long time for this theme, it was well before TS4 ever came out as a movie; like 5+ years ago that I first heard of it.
JJP Failed, easy for me now; I'd much rather have LOV Deluxe and 4 more grand in my pocket. LOV straight up is a better layout than this atrocity by a mile...

#3344 65 days ago

So the upper right bat hits the left spinner and that's it ?

#3345 65 days ago
Quoted from Hollywoodbone:

As far as I know it’s still plays like a JJP. But they fixed the flipoets I believe so that you don’t lose flipper feeling and power the longer you play. And I believe Pat included a neat feature that senses when you are going to shoot for the ramp when it comes up and increases even more power on that left flipper so that you make the ramp with ease. Again that’s kind of secondhand knowledge. So I can’t completely confirm everything but that’s my understanding

I hope this means they have redesigned the driver board and are using a circuit that can do sub-millisecond duty cycles so flipper holds are finally competitive with Spike's magical system. Did you get a look at the electronics?

And censor...CENSOR.

#3346 65 days ago

Another dumb game.

#3347 65 days ago
Quoted from adol75:

So the upper right bat hits the left spinner and that's it ?

It's a normal looping shot like we've seen on many games before. Who doesn't like a good looping shot?

#3348 65 days ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

If a game costs 2x more, and doesn't create any draw or additional revenue.. then that's a problem. The point of this entire discussion is initial investment is not the deciding factor - it's what the game makes vs what it costs to own.

Kind of my point - even the same coins going into a $6900 Godzilla Pro. Much better return.

I don't think TS4 will draw in more money. I would argue less.

#3349 65 days ago
Quoted from shacklersrevenge:

I don’t know, maybe I’m in the minority, but Toy Story 4 might be my favorite in the series.
The adventure takes place in an antique shop and carnival, so what’s not to love?

Um, yeah I can go with this as well. Plus it's the only one I've watched in decades so there's that.

#3350 65 days ago
Quoted from ShooterMcD:

Gameplay video:

Are they purposely including annoying effects in Pat's games? That spinner bell is really cringe worthy. It's prob the worst part of Wonka's very poor sound and they now are using it for a spinner shot? A few others - very slot machine heavy. Damn.

Game seems very straight forward to shoot. Tom's brother really does sound like his brother, def not Tom although it's better than nothing. Tim sounds like I would expect - bored but it's tim's voice so still a plus. Jump ramp doesn't or look feel nearly as epic as NGG considering it just goes right in regardless.

EDIT - is there only one magnet (in the back right) or are there more?

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