Toy Story 4 (CE)
Jersey Jack, 2022
Toy Story 4 (LE)
Jersey Jack, 2022Quoted from Mattyk:Nah. I’ve seen you on other threads. You are garbage and never have anything to contribute. Very unimpressive.
that is what the ignore user feature is for. This thread just got 1000 times easier to read for me, lol.
Yeah, I often forget the pinball world isn't Pinside. We had our reactions about "what could've been?" with the design and theming and the crazy price tag. But if I hadn't heard a thing about it and just saw a TS4 pinball in the wild, I woulda gone nuts. Saw that movie twice in 3D, loved it.
Quoted from m00nmuppet:Yeah, I often forget the pinball world isn't Pinside. We had our reactions about "what could've been?" with the design and theming and the crazy price tag. But if I hadn't heard a thing about it and just saw a TS4 pinball in the wild, I woulda gone nuts. Saw that movie twice in 3D, loved it.
You’re poor mother…..
Quoted from PinMonk:Why are we talking about node board down time in a JJP TS4 thread? JJP uses a driver board in the backbox that's VERY reliable. No node problems there. The only JJP we ever had down for more than a day was WoZ with 1.x lighting issues. All the rest have been rock solid on route as long as they're maintained.
Some of the Dialed In CPU boards failed in use. Don't have a number on that, though two of them were down here in town including my own for nearly a month waiting for the replacement board. JJP came through in the end.
Quoted from BrianBannon:Some of the Dialed In CPU boards failed in use. Don't have a number on that, though two of them were down here in town including my own for nearly a month waiting for the replacement board. JJP came through in the end.
I wouldn't have waited. The PC side is commodity parts. I would have just ordered a new PC motherboard (doesn't even have to be the same model, just the same chipset) and been back in business in a couple days for $100. ESPECIALLY if I had it out on a route. A month wouldn't cut it.
Kind of sad how many lies Jack has told publicly. I vividly remember an interview where Jack said if you work for his company, you have a job for life. As long as you want to work at Jersey Jack, you can.
And yet not long after that interview, they fired Butch Peel (even though he was beloved, and seemingly did a great job as far as could be seen from the public view) And of course, they got rid of Lloyd (who's also great) more recently. And that's not even mentioning all the line workers in Jersey who most likely lost their jobs when the factory was moved to Chicago.
There have been a lot of mystifying decisions at Jersey Jack Pinball the last couple of years. I'd love to know who's really running the show day-to-day, and who's making all the big decisions. I think it's pretty clear that Jack is just a figurehead. I'd hope that when he said he wanted people who worked for him to have jobs for life, that he meant it, and instead he's just been overruled by the Abess's, or whomever they have running the show.
Ah, to be a fly on the wall in some of these meetings.
Quoted from flynnibus:I already have a JP and GZ in the location.. along with every other recent stern title. And guess what... Toy Story is earning right along side them... and more than them right now... alot more.
TS4 costs a shitload more so I'd hope it's earning for you.
Quoted from PinMonk:I wouldn't have waited. The PC side is commodity parts. I would have just ordered a new PC motherboard (doesn't even have to be the same model, just the same chipset) and been back in business in a couple days for $100. ESPECIALLY if I had it out on a route. A month wouldn't cut it.
Well, it didn't start out as being a month lead time, but that is the way things ended up.
JJP has always struggled to get games on location there's 650 JJP pins listed on the Pinside locations map. While Godzilla and Jurassic Park have 850 pins listed for location play by themselves.
It will be interesting to see how TS4 does with location buyers with these sky-high prices.
Quoted from PtownPin:Good for u ! You made my point...
And you missed the point…he was clarifying that you could say that about pretty much any game that’s routed…
Quoted from BrianBannon:Some of the Dialed In CPU boards failed in use. Don't have a number on that, though two of them were down here in town including my own for nearly a month waiting for the replacement board. JJP came through in the end.
AHA! So…
My incoherent blathering WAS relevant.
Quoted from underlord:AHA! So…
My incoherent blathering WAS relevant.
A PC motherboard isn't a node board. And if those fail, that's a conversation to have with ASUS or ASROCK or MSI or whoever made the PC motherboard. JJP just buys them off the shelf.
Quoted from PinMonk:A PC motherboard isn't a node board. And if those fail, that's a conversation to have with ASUS or ASROCK or MSI or whoever made the PC motherboard. JJP just buys them off the shelf.
Yes, I know. Just poking fun.
I finally had a chance to try TS4 at a local pinball museum. My first impression isn't all that different from what others generally say: it plays fine, shots are smooth, but nothing really stood out on the playfield that made it special other than the theme. The playfield monitor was washed out and difficult to read. I'm guessing it was the angle because the playfield monitors in GNR and Star Wars both looked fine.
Digital assets are incredible, though. JP de Win is the Zombie Yeti of pinball digital art. I can't really comment on the sounds as the place was too loud to make out much of anything; the ringing bell was the only sound that I could hear clearly and consistently. (Which may be why JJP went that direction with their sound design, it does stand out in a loud location.)
For comparison, this was also my first opportunity to get hands-on play with Godzilla, Dialed In, and Wonka. Godzilla was adjacent to TS4, and I kept hopping back and forth between them. For someone at my horribly low skill level, the shots I was hitting on Godzilla felt far more interesting and satisfying.
Dialed In was a very positive surprise. Now I understand why fans are so dang loyal to that machine. I'd try to buy one if I had room for a larger collection.
FWIW, we have had our game a little over 2 weeks now and I and my family are really enjoying it. We just watched the movie and we were pleasantly surprised at how well the game meshed with the movie. Lawler and the JJP team did a great job there. The game really is beautiful, fun to play, and the animation and call outs are excellent. The Duke Caboom shot is a fun one to hit. We believe the game provides a good challenge; it isn't an easy match for us. We think it ranks very well with all of our other JJP games and we have had them all. It is going to do very well in the market.
Quoted from Thunderbird:These are definitely not real numbers. Prove they sold and even made 4k GNRs. Impossible with a 40 per week output rate, admitted by JJP. GNR sales were around 2k tops with the time they had to make them, plus parts shortages, labor challenges during that time, etc. GNR was way oversold at that rate and is the reason for slumping HUO prices. JJP does not publish any sales figures ever, so you’re up in the night if you think they sold double the amount that they could actually produce. Do the math, it doesn’t add up any further than around 2k, give or take.
Lol
Quoted from Thunderbird:Lol, TS4 sales are not a smashing success, because they are not sold through to consumers. Only distributors have been stuck with them. They’re going to have them collecting dust for a long time. Wouldn’t have been the case if JJP hadn’t gotten so greedy, even though it’s basically an empty game. Most people feel TS4 is a $6k game tops, not double.
Who in the world is saying that TS4 is a $6k game tops?! There are no $6K NIB games in 2022, not even close. From what I've gathered people are saying $10k LE / $12K CE as the desired price point considering the features (well lack of) in the game.
Quoted from Xelz:I finally had a chance to try TS4 at a local pinball museum. My first impression isn't all that different from what others generally say: it plays fine, shots are smooth, but nothing really stood out on the playfield that made it special other than the theme. The playfield monitor was washed out and difficult to read. I'm guessing it was the angle because the playfield monitors in GNR and Star Wars both looked fine.
Digital assets are incredible, though. JP de Win is the Zombie Yeti of pinball digital art. I can't really comment on the sounds as the place was too loud to make out much of anything; the ringing bell was the only sound that I could hear clearly and consistently. (Which may be why JJP went that direction with their sound design, it does stand out in a loud location.)
For comparison, this was also my first opportunity to get hands-on play with Godzilla, Dialed In, and Wonka. Godzilla was adjacent to TS4, and I kept hopping back and forth between them. For someone at my horribly low skill level, the shots I was hitting on Godzilla felt far more interesting and satisfying.
Dialed In was a very positive surprise. Now I understand why fans are so dang loyal to that machine. I'd try to buy one if I had room for a larger collection.
Glad you got to play it. The animations are great like you said. That ringing bell sound from the spinner can definitely get annoying after a while.
What's odd and a bit sad is that one of the main features of the 10" LCD is for Tiki Pinball yet it plays terribly. It reminds of poor quality 60hz virtual pinball running on lower end hardware. Tiki Pinball is supposed to be the flagship mode for the mini LCD but it's a laggy mess IMO.
Quoted from PanzerFreak:Who in the world is saying that TS4 is a $6k game tops?! There are no $6K NIB games in 2022, not even close. From what I've gathered people are saying $10k LE / $12K CE as the desired price point considering the features (well lack of) in the game.
Agree on price should be 10/12k
There is a $5K pin (Stern home pin). I haven’t played one but likely it’s fun and shoots well and non pinball folks who are a target audience. For example someone never owned a pin and wanted to buy a pin for the kids might just look at JP or SW home pin as costing just 40% the price of TS4.
I love my two JJP pins DI LE and Woz RR but I don’t see half as much toys etc in TS4 not even close. The theater in DI is amazeballs. Woz flying monkey, witch, house, castle etc.
I’d take any two Stern pro all day for a bit more than the TS4 cost.
Quoted from PanzerFreak:Who in the world is saying that TS4 is a $6k game tops?! There are no $6K NIB games in 2022, not even close. From what I've gathered people are saying $10k LE / $12K CE as the desired price point considering the features (well lack of) in the game.
Okay, your opinion, but many think it doesn’t have much more in it than a Stern home pin, sold in 2022 well under $6k. So under that guise its a $6k game tops. Home Pins go as low as under $5k and have more than a bash head and simple jump plate. $10 LCD and $26 cake toppers. BOM similar to a Home pin…that is the pricing comparison you may not be thinking about. The argument could be made, most pro’s have more in them, so would cost a little more. Even Black Knight Pro has the elaborate knight mech, TS4 has no ball interactive mech to its equal for example.
Isn't it amazing that the cake toppers are more than twice as expensive as the lcd screen? We're living in the future.
Quoted from PanzerFreak:Glad you got to play it. The animations are great like you said. That ringing bell sound from the spinner can definitely get annoying after a while.
What's odd and a bit sad is that one of the main features of the 10" LCD is for Tiki Pinball yet it plays terribly. It reminds of poor quality 60hz virtual pinball running on lower end hardware. Tiki Pinball is supposed to be the flagship mode for the mini LCD but it's a laggy mess IMO.
Part of my problem with Tiki Pinball is that qualifying the multiball mode simply requires switch hits. So it's often advisable to let the ball drain while the timer is still counting down, so that the ball can go back up into the pops.
So depending on luck, you can often get by without even really flipping th3 tiki pinball anyway.
Quoted from Thunderbird:Okay, your opinion, but many think it doesn’t have much more in it than a Stern home pin, sold in 2022 well under $6k. So under that guise its a $6k game tops.
The animated light board at the back of the game people would be paying over a grand for if it were a mod for another game. It's actually a major toy in itself that isn't really appreciated till you see it in action. It's actually pretty phenomenal what they've done with all those RGBs.
Quoted from DakotaMike:Part of my problem with Tiki Pinball is that qualifying the multiball mode simply requires switch hits. So it's often advisable to let the ball drain while the timer is still counting down, so that the ball can go back up into the pops.
So depending on luck, you can often get by without even really flipping th3 tiki pinball anyway.
Right strategy is to let it drain once so you can complete the rollovers quickly to get 2x tiki pinball 
Quoted from flynnibus:The animated light board at the back of the game people would be paying over a grand for if it were a mod for another game. It's actually a major toy in itself that isn't really appreciated till you see it in action. It's actually pretty phenomenal what they've done with all those RGBs.
Yeah.. Great point. The light animation is amazing.. And the style is perfect.
Kind of loops back to many later comments here are potentially mitigated by future code.
I had a lot of fun playing it at a friends place. I felt he had the difficulty dialed in quite well.
Quoted from Thunderbird:Thanks, but Jack is a typical salesman and super bias, lol. Need to see a real ledger sheet/receipts to confirm, which no pinball company has ever offered. Sure hope for all the GNR owners they didn’t make more than 2K, otherwise kiss your ROI goodbye, unless you plan to keep it. No real proof of the numbers made will ever be offered.
No real proof has ever been offered, so how can you be pretty sure? JJP is a tiny boutique pinball maker, only able to make on a good week no more than 40 games. Jack in an interview is all hype, which he does a lot. Yes, we might know POTC, because of the mess it became. They stopped production because no one wanted it, until collectors figured out there was not going to be anymore.
I know for a fact they sold over 4500 GnR’s.And all you have is what’s floating around in your airspace!
“”***** Pre-order yours today with a $250 deposit - a few available! *****””
I thought deposits were a 2-3k? I also thought it was “sold out”.
Quoted from flynnibus:Why do you think they have anything to prove or protect? It's the opposite... unlike hobbyist they treat their games like mules instead of personal trophies. If it doesn't work, they cut and run by selling the game early.
Meanwhile.. Scorbit is telling me ToyStory is earning great this week.
With TS4 being such a great earner how many more will you buy? 5-10?
Quoted from cooked71:“”***** Pre-order yours today with a $250 deposit - a few available! *****””
I thought deposits were a 2-3k? I also thought it was “sold out”.
I wonder if this will be like Beatles platinum and diamonds and dealers stuck with unsold CEs.
Quoted from rai:I wonder if this will be like Beatles platinum and diamonds and dealers stuck with unsold CEs.
What a debacle that was. Not the finest moment in pinball history. Up there with the video application for B66SLE.
With 1000 Ts4ce’s there’ll definitely be plenty sitting with dealers.
Quoted from seenev:Isn't it amazing that the cake toppers are more than twice as expensive as the lcd screen? We're living in the future.
Not really, look at the price on Ali express and also when you buy three sets you already get extra discounts. This is for a 9 piece set so little above one dollar a piece when you buy only one set.
Schermafbeelding 2022-07-19 193844 (resized).jpgQuoted from JohnTTwo:With TS4 being such a great earner how many more will you buy? 5-10?
Not the model we have - based on our type/number of locations.
By the way I was a big fan of JJP because they really wanted to change the Pinball world and give us better pinball. I bought everything up until GnR, but now they are even worse at taking advantage of their customers than Stern is. Will buy nothing anymore and no matter how good the game shoots or whatever, there are plenty of games that shoot good and cost a lot less. Buy those if you want but when you buy this one you will get even less next time.
When sales are going through the roof, JJP will never ever go back to giving us better pinball. Problem is: JJP probably sold out so they are laughing all the way to the bank. They do not care at all if the distributor that bought the game will sell it or not, they have their money.
I was SO looking forward to Toy Story from JJP but now I wish Stern made it (wow cannot believe I just typed that).
Quoted from ronaldvg:I was SO looking forward to Toy Story from JJP but now I wish Stern made it (wow cannot believe I just typed that).
Stern has a good relationship with Disney. They can still license/make a true Toy Story or TS1-3 pin when JJP is done with their run. JJP did Pirates after Stern already did it....fair play, baby!
Quoted from yancy:There's a setting for Tiki to make it one-drain-and-done.
Yeah, but Tiki Pinball isn't controllable enough for that. And starting it is kinda random too, since it's a wheel award. So you can't just get right back in it if you drain out, like you can on say Mandolorian.
Quoted from cooked71:“”***** Pre-order yours today with a $250 deposit - a few available! *****””
I thought deposits were a 2-3k? I also thought it was “sold out”.
Here’s one you can get for only 100 over MSRP
Quoted from Rarehero:Stern has a good relationship with Disney. They can still license/make a true Toy Story or TS1-3 pin when JJP is done with their run. JJP did Pirates after Stern already did it....fair play, baby!
I’m pretty sure that Toy Story would not appeal to the the Stern demographic.I keep hearing kiddie theme from them on themes like this.
C300
Quoted from JohnTTwo:Interesting
https://pinside.com/pinball/market/classifieds/ad/139289
Let’s see would a person rather order directly from a great distro or second hand deal?
Could this start the losses for the flippers?
Automated is the biggest pin distributor, They will have a ton of CE'S for sale, don't believe only a few spots left line .
Quoted from Thunderbird:Okay, your opinion, but many think it doesn’t have much more in it than a Stern home pin, sold in 2022 well under $6k. So under that guise its a $6k game tops. Home Pins go as low as under $5k and have more than a bash head and simple jump plate. $10 LCD and $26 cake toppers. BOM similar to a Home pin…that is the pricing comparison you may not be thinking about. The argument could be made, most pro’s have more in them, so would cost a little more. Even Black Knight Pro has the elaborate knight mech, TS4 has no ball interactive mech to its equal for example.
Look, I'm all for turning my nose up at this game but this is just disingenuous
Quoted from mtp78:C300
Automated is the biggest pin distributor, They will have a ton of CE'S for sale, don't believe only a few spots left line .
They are a very good distro and are now selling TS4 LE’s below MSRP.
Going to get real interesting quick.
Quoted from zaphX:Citation needed - looks like they are quoting $12K on pinballs.com
Lower than MSRP prices are never published. They're between distrib & customer.
Quoted from Rarehero:Lower than MSRP prices are never published. They're between distrib & customer.
Yep, unless JJP operates differently, often distributors can't advertise a price below a certain threshold (sometimes MSRP, sometimes a price below MSRP). I don't think we'll know the real market price - whether higher or lower than MSRP - until the secondary market matures.
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Livermore, CA
Surrey, BC
Sydney