(Topic ID: 107846)

JJP has very poor customer service for non pinheads


By vidgameseller

5 years ago



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  • 318 posts
  • 106 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 5 years ago by Chrisbee
  • Topic is favorited by 4 Pinsiders

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There are 318 posts in this topic. You are on page 5 of 7.
#201 5 years ago
Quoted from vidgameseller:

NOt sure who you are talking about here, but Jen called me to see if the customer could hire me to just set up the machine.

Here's the thing. The doctor ordered the machine and he evidently couldn't put the legs on or remove the shipping blocks if the OP had to be hired to set it up. How is the manufacturer responsible for this?

#202 5 years ago
Quoted from Imeh:

I almost hate to bring this up, but I bought both WOZ and STLE from one of the largest distributors in the east. When I experienced issues with both, I was directed to the manufacturers for support in both cases. They did nothing. JJP and Stern took care of the issues.

Same here with me. In my WOZECLE case, JJP mailed me the repair parts. When I couldn't conquer all the problems, they sent one of the very best techs in the whole USA to my home. He drove several hundred miles to get here. I can do reasonable repair myself, but this one was beyond my skill level. I tried to put myself into Jack's shoes, knowing he only had so much profit to work with on my pin. I did my best to save a tech trip here. He had to come anyway, and it got fixed.

With my NIB Stern pin (LOTRLE), my distributor, about 1,000 miles away (got a feeling it is the same "one of the largest distributors in the east"), told me to call Stern. I did. Stern was baffled as to why I was instructed to do this, yet they helped me diagnose the problem over the phone and ended up sending me a new driver board. I replaced it. The pin was fixed, and yes . . . I had to pay for return shipment of the bad board. But, I felt this is a reasonable solution to the problem with . . . again . . . the slim profit margins on pins.

So far, I'm happy with both manufacturers and how they helped me fix my problems.

#203 5 years ago
Quoted from JerseyJack:

We gave everyone a 3 year extended warranty on all parts that Stern covered - at no charge -

You did not "give" the extended warranty at "no charge" You "included it" at no extra charge. The NIB price you charged helped fund that extended warranty. It was worthwhile for home pin owners to buy a NIB Stern from you if they were unwilling or unable to do their own board repairs. I bought two from you and felt the upcharge over Shaffer Distributing was worth the cost. I did not need to utilize the warranty with either machine, so you're welcome.

#204 5 years ago

Here is a simple timeline. Tell me where JJP fell down? I can't see it.

6 weeks ago: game arrived at customer home. Shipper damaged box and cabinet. Customer calls JJP on the spot and is instructed to refuse delivery. Customer did, game is shipped back to JJP, cabinet replaced and shipped back to customer and arrives at customer 2 weeks after initial damaged delivery attempt. Things happen. No big deal and the customer didn't think so either and appreciated the quick turn around in repair.

Customer calls JJP asking for a resource they could hire to help setup the game. Jen gets a referral to vidgameseller from a distributor. Vidgameseller goes there, sets up game but wasn't allowed to test play it. Customer try's to play game, can't, and calls Vidgameseller not JJP to come back and fix it. Vid can't find the problem, calls support and gets Lloyd. Lloyd walks him through what to check for and they get the problem resolved.

Expo happens here which has nothing to do with anything but keeps getting brought up so I'll mention it.

3 weeks of playing go by and a single target breaks from play. Customer calls JJP and speaks to Steve who works with customer to diagnose the issue of the broken switch. The part is mailed out same day but requires a bit of skill to install.

Vidgameseller comes on here and posts this thread saying JJP has terrible support.

</end timeline>

Sorry but there are 2 separate tech support events you are trying to make into one event and you were hired by the customer to perform a task. You went back at the request of the customer which is good customer service but NOT because we asked you to do tech support. You did that out of your own free will. I'm sure the customer appreciates that but don't come on here bashing us when you weren't asked to troubleshoot on our behalf by us.

#205 5 years ago

Alex, Lloyd , Eric, etc. have a passion for this game, customer satisfaction, and a goal for superior customer service. In my opinion, they have surpassed expectations in this area.

I have called on cell phone lines after 11pm est on several occasions, and the phone was answered, and some very basic tech questions were addressed professionally EVERY time. They take a lot of pride ( I believe) in their customer service, and believe some have the right to feel " testy" when challenged on their integrity.

Can't imagine Alex ever acting unprofessionally ( verbal or otherwise) to an end user. This is, however, a public forum, and he can certainly defend discuss, or even debate situations. I'm not sticking up for him ( he doesn't need it) , but you have to believe their was simply a communication issue, plain and simple.

If the original Tech wasn't allowed to verify his repair by the Client for whatever reason, it's on them ( completely unheard of in ANY other industry). OP obliged , but good grief.

Hats off to OP for doing the right thing, and JJP for clarifying, and closing the situation.

#206 5 years ago

BTW, I literally didn't know how to turn my first pinball machine on, and have progressed quite well after several years in the hobby. I believe new enthusiasts should take the same " hands on" approach, or insure there is a competent repair facility close before diving into this arena.

Sorry for excessive rant.....surfing a couple of football games, and bored during the commercials....mark

-4
#207 5 years ago
Quoted from Pinchroma:

Here is a simple timeline. Tell me where JJP fell down? I can't see it.
6 weeks ago: game arrived at customer home. Shipper damaged box and cabinet. Customer calls JJP on the spot and is instructed to refuse delivery. Customer did, game is shipped back to JJP, cabinet replaced and shipped back to customer and arrives at customer 2 weeks after initial damaged delivery attempt. Things happen. No big deal and the customer didn't think so either and appreciated the quick turn around in repair.
Customer calls JJP asking for a resource they could hire to help setup the game. Jen gets a referral to vidgameseller from a distributor. Vidgameseller goes there, sets up game but wasn't allowed to test play it. Customer try's to play game, can't, and calls Vidgameseller not JJP to come back and fix it. Vid can't find the problem, calls support and gets Lloyd. Lloyd walks him through what to check for and they get the problem resolved.
Expo happens here which has nothing to do with anything but keeps getting brought up so I'll mention it.
3 weeks of playing go by and a single target breaks from play. Customer calls JJP and speaks to Steve who works with customer to diagnose the issue of the broken switch. The part is mailed out same day but requires a bit of skill to install.
Vidgameseller comes on here and posts this thread saying JJP has terrible support.
</end timeline>
Sorry but there are 2 separate tech support events you are trying to make into one event and you were hired by the customer to perform a task. You went back at the request of the customer which is good customer service but NOT because we asked you to do tech support. You did that out of your own free will. I'm sure the customer appreciates that but don't come on here bashing us when you weren't asked to troubleshoot on our behalf by us.

There seems to be some inconsistencies with your timeline. Don't forget to include:

1. The text received 20 minutes later by the OP that said the JJP service person told them (direct buyer of the WoZ), and i quote, "you need to suck up to Jack to get this repaired".

2. JJP is sending out a replacement part that will need to be soldered in, They (direct buyer of the WoZ) are told by someone at JJP (the mystery person) that they do not service the machines and only provide warranty parts.

3. The OP calls Jen at JJP and explains the situation and the problem, her response was, "I heard that this person was a problem, thanks, bye"

4. At the 2014 Pinball Expo, the OP sat down with Jack and explained the situation and how Jen was short to the customer and the OP. The OP mentioned that Jack thanked him for bringing it to his attention and that he will contact the customer to let them know that this is not the standard JJP type of response.

5. Over a week after the 2014 Expo, the direct buyer of the WoZ contacted the OP about the new problem and stated that Jack had not yet reached out to him and that they are having the same run around with the new problem.

11
#208 5 years ago

Enough already. Sheesh.

#209 5 years ago
Quoted from Craig:

Enough already. Sheesh.

I agree. What was the purpose of this thread?

#210 5 years ago
Quoted from Craig:

Enough already. Sheesh.

Agreed...is Florida State or Louisville win this game?....who cares....

-2
#211 5 years ago

4 yrs later and some of you guys just can't let it go, Woz is great, the service is great, PERIOD!

The rest is BS.

-4
#212 5 years ago
Quoted from MrBally:

There seems to be some inconsistencies with your timeline. Don't forget to include:
1. The text received 20 minutes later by the OP that said the JJP service person told them (direct buyer of the WoZ), and i quote, "you need to suck up to Jack to get this repaired".
2. JJP is sending out a replacement part that will need to be soldered in, They (direct buyer of the WoZ) are told by someone at JJP (the mystery person) that they do not service the machines and only provide warranty parts.
3. The OP calls Jen at JJP and explains the situation and the problem, her response was, "I heard that this person was a problem, thanks, bye"
4. At the 2014 Pinball Expo, the OP sat down with Jack and explained the situation and how Jen was short to the customer and the OP. The OP mentioned that Jack thanked him for bringing it to his attention and that he will contact the customer to let them know that this is not the standard JJP type of response.
5. Over a week after the 2014 Expo, the direct buyer of the WoZ contacted the OP about the new problem and stated that Jack had not yet reached out to him and that they are having the same run around with the new problem.

You read most of the thread incorrectly.
I can't comment on the text message. It didn't come from me and wasn't seen by me so who knows.

#2 isn't a mystery person if you read the thread and is entirely accurate. By default the warranty is parts only however many times over exceptions are made and people are sent out to fix games. But that doesn't make #2 any less factual.

#3 I think you are paraphrasing. I read it differently. But again and this is a fact: JJP did not send OP out there. A few People said he should be commended by JJP? For us referring a paying customer to HIM? Yeah. No.

#4. Jack likely did say that because we hold ourselves to a very high customer support level. Don't see an issue here.

#5. 10,000 people at expo. 5,000 conversations. I'm quite sure the follow up slipped his mind amongst the million other things he had going on that week and the fact only a few days later he is on a flight to Europe. And what "same runaround"? There was no runaround with the initial issue and there isn't one with the new one either. Customer calls in gets diagnosed and part ships the same day. That sure is one hell of a run around? I know you hate JJP and especially me but stop trying to make something out of nothing. OP tried and just looks bad for doing it. Could things have been handled better? Absolutely. They ALWAYS can be. But the fact is OP was a customer paid intermediary who was not there on our behalf. Period.

#213 5 years ago
Quoted from Pinchroma:

I know you hate JJP and especially me but stop trying to make something out of nothing.

Hate is such a strong word. I don't hate you, JJP (the company) or Jack. I believe you are pompous, arrogant and truly, in your own mind feel that you are perfect. You have proven this many times here.

I don't feel like going over all of the items I pointed out in my previous post on this board. I think a phone call between Jack, the OP and yourself would bring out the truth. But, to start, ask Jack about the text since it was shown to him. Otherwise, the OP just may post a screenshot of it and then what? Will you accuse him of faking that?

#214 5 years ago
Quoted from Pinchroma:

I acknowledged you fixed the first problem however your previous post made it sound like the game never worked. Let's be honest here the first problem which you say took 3 hrs to diagnose should have taken 5 mins maybe 10

Good point.

I think JJP should return the fee they paid the OP for his inefficient diagnosis and repair of SOMEONE ELSE's NIB machine....

OH wait....

Pinchroma, you have an uncanny ability to come off as incredibly abrasive- even when you're likely on the right side of an argument .

Anyways, this incident aside, it seems most RAVE about JJP service..... Having been helped by Lloyd myself, I find it easy to believe....

This guys situation sounds like an oddball case....

#215 5 years ago

After reading through this thread, I have come to the following conclusion:

If I own a JJP game and need to call the support number, I sincerely hope I receive help from only one of the two service techs. I would likely wind up pissed off and hanging up on the other. Just an observation.

#216 5 years ago
Quoted from MrBally:

Hate is such a strong word. I don't hate you, JJP (the company) or Jack. I believe you are pompous, arrogant and truly, in your own mind feel that you are perfect. You have proven this many times here.
I don't feel like going over all of the items I pointed out in my previous post on this board. I think a phone call between Jack, the OP and yourself would bring out the truth. But, to start, ask Jack about the text since it was shown to him. Otherwise, the OP just may post a screenshot of it and then what? Will you accuse him of faking that?

What is your goal here? JJP has the best support in the business...even if one customer is unhappy. 1000's are VERY happy.

#217 5 years ago
Quoted from Pimp77:

What is your goal here? JJP has the best support in the business...even if one customer is unhappy. 1000's are VERY happy.

Sometimes I wonder that as well. I picture the dudes in the balcony on the Muppet show whenever I see his posts.

-12
#218 5 years ago
Quoted from Pimp77:

What is your goal here? JJP has the best support in the business...even if one customer is unhappy. 1000's are VERY happy.

His Goal is to try to make JJP look bad as is the goal of the OP when there was absolutely no reason.

He is a pedantic and cranky name dropper and attacks me at every opportunity usually with snide remarks. My biggest gripes are his annoying history lessons. What Father Time doesn't realize is other people can read Wikipedia too

#219 5 years ago
Quoted from lost8ball:

Sometimes I wonder that as well. I picture the dudes in the balcony on the Muppet show whenever I see his posts.

Bwaaaahahhahahahah

image-611.jpg

#220 5 years ago
Quoted from Pinchroma:

His Goal is to try to make JJP look bad as is the goal of the OP when there was absolutely no reason.
He is a pedantic and cranky name dropper and attacks me at every opportunity usually with snide remarks. My biggest gripes are his annoying history lessons. What Father Time doesn't realize is other people can read Wikipedia too

At least I am not pompous or arrogant. Never heard of the word pedantic so I won't comment on that one. Virtually everything I mention is from my actual experience, not an internet search.

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-1
#222 5 years ago
Quoted from MrBally:

At least I am not pompous or arrogant. Never heard of the word pedantic so I won't comment on that one. Virtually everything I mention is from my actual experience, not an internet search.

But the thing is.. We don't care. No one asked for encyclopedia ballytanica in every single thread.

We could be talking about something innocuous and you come out with a war story about how you were part of x and y. Starving for attention is about the only reason someone does that. It's like the person who walks up to a conversation to interject with their own barely relevant story. Good god. Stop it.

P.S. Pedantic means overly concerned with tiny details and formalities especially in teachings. Seems like the perfect description to me.

#223 5 years ago

And it all ends horribly ... Like car accident . Gross

#224 5 years ago
Quoted from Pinchroma:

If I sound like a d-bag that's likely because I won't be walked on or let someone with an agenda skew facts in an attempt to look important

Well Alex, I'm starting to see two trains of thought here. JJP is strong on phone support, but is weak on field support. If JJP had field support that was equal to the phone support, Jen would never had made the call to the OP in the first place. Everything else is spin.

BTW, the fact that the customer can not turn a screwdriver is irrelevant.

#225 5 years ago

Yea wtf is going on here? Does any of this matter enough to really get this upset. Kip offers good service to pin people, they need some improvement in service if they have now decided to sell direct to customers who aren't pinheads. Can't that be the end of all this? Jjp- if you cut out the middle man (distributors) you should use that extra profit to fund warranty service and parts. That's just a suggestion and my opinion. I think it will keep those direct customers happy and coming back for more. Other than this simple point I made, why is this blowing up?

#226 5 years ago

Please read ^^^^^

#227 5 years ago
Quoted from starfighter:

Well Alex, I'm starting to see two trains of thought here. JJP is strong on phone support, but is weak on field support. If JJP had field support that was equal to the phone support, Jen would never had made the call to the OP in the first place. Everything else is spin.
BTW, the fact that the customer can not turn a screwdriver is irrelevant.

Except we don't technically do field support. Neither does any other pinball company. We do it on a case by case basis and front the bill for third parties to go out and do support where necessary. We aren't really light on something that isn't actually a service we advertise.

#228 5 years ago

Thanks Alex, I'm going to start using "Encyclopedia Ballytanica" in the future (versus Encyclopia).

Since you note my penchant for tiny details and formalities, it comes with the territory of working with safety-related products.

OT: We never attack each other regarding cars though. I pointed out that R8's with V10 engines can be bought new with a stick where you said only the V8. I see the gated manual six speed is still available today with the V10 and V10plus.

#229 5 years ago

SOMEBODY PLEASE
IT IS TIME TO POST PICTURES OF BOOBIES

( . )( . )

#230 5 years ago
Quoted from Pinchroma:

If the shoe was on the other foot and you were doing what I do I doubt you would react differently.

Meh... you're probably right there. I can be a sarcastic asshole....

I think this whole thread is a bit overblown.
The thread title is a pretty broad generalization, regardless of this singular incident. There are PLENTY of things I would criticize JJP on, but service isnt one of them.... certainty not compared to Stern.

There *IS* a broader issue here that probably IS relevant. As manufacturers continue to market pins to home collectors (and especially first time collectors), the traditional service model probably needs to adapt.

Do any distros out there sell a more "white-glove" service plan as part of their offering?

#232 5 years ago
Quoted from Pinchroma:

Except we don't technically do field support. Neither does any other pinball company. We do it on a case by case basis and front the bill for third parties to go out and do support where necessary. We aren't really light on something that isn't actually a service we advertise.

Uhhh.... if you're in the High-End Home Market, you may want to rethink this policy.

#233 5 years ago

Janet jackson 2014.jpg
#234 5 years ago
Quoted from Pinchroma:

Except we don't technically do field support. Neither does any other pinball company. We do it on a case by case basis and front the bill for third parties to go out and do support where necessary. We aren't really light on something that isn't actually a service we advertise.

Stern does not sell direct. That is not a fair comparison.

#235 5 years ago

Pinchroma please respond to my posts up a few.

#236 5 years ago
Quoted from MrBally:

Hate is such a strong word. I don't hate you, JJP (the company) or Jack. I believe you are pompous, arrogant and truly, in your own mind feel that you are perfect. You have proven this many times here.

I feel like Alex backs his statements up with facts - all the time. And people get all emotional against him since they don't really have good data to argue against the facts. Your statement here was uncalled for in my opinion. Being right doesn't make someone pompous and arrogant. It makes him right.

#237 5 years ago
Quoted from inhomearcades:

Stern does not sell direct. That is not a fair comparison.

I didn't mention stern. You did . And neither does JJP. People bought from pinball sales. (that changed recently but isn't relevant to this discussion as its a very recent change). And I do support for JJP and I guess by proxy pinball sales and I bend over backwards to help folks. I am not paid in any way shape or form but go to people's houses to fix games that are local to me. I can't drive 1000 miles to spend 5 mins fixing a game. That's just not feasible.

#238 5 years ago
Quoted from markmon:

I feel like Alex backs his statements up with facts - all the time. And people get all emotional against him since they don't really have good data to argue against the facts. Your statement here was uncalled for in my opinion. Being right doesn't make someone pompous and arrogant. It makes him right.

My statement there was not in any way related to this thread's direct customer's incident. It was addressing Alex's statement that I "hated" him. I do not hate him. I clarified what I thought of him. Some here will disagree with my statement while others will agree. Just like his statements about me a few posts above mine that you cited.

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#240 5 years ago
Quoted from Pinchroma:

I didn't mention stern. You did . And neither does JJP. People bought from pinball sales. (that changed recently but isn't relevant to this discussion as its a very recent change). And I do support for JJP and I guess by proxy pinball sales and I bend over backwards to help folks. I am not paid in any way shape or form but go to people's houses to fix games that are local to me. I can't drive 1000 miles to spend 5 mins fixing a game. That's just not feasible.

What other company is worth mentioning that non pinheads are going to purchase from? I was asking you to reply to my previous responses asking why if they are going to sell direct to customers(relevant) they aren't using the extra profit to support those customers for service as well as parts?

Also please don't even begin to compare stern and jjp in terms of service. Not a battle I'm getting into and not one that jjp would win.

#241 5 years ago
Quoted from Pinchroma:

Except we don't technically do field support. Neither does any other pinball company. We do it on a case by case basis and front the bill for third parties to go out and do support where necessary.

But can you see how "case by case basis" could be (loosely) connected to "suck up to Jack"? You guys could be creating the very environment that you can't/won't be able to control.

Why not just develop a third party network across the states to cover the potential problems that can not be covered by phone support? IMO, it's the old 80/20 rule. 80% problems solved by phone support still doesn't address the 20% that are going to need face time, especially in a growing home market that demands service after the sale.

#242 5 years ago
Quoted from starfighter:

But can you see how "case by case basis" could be (loosely) connected to "suck up to Jack"? You guys could be creating the very environment that you can't/won't be able to control.
Why not just develop a third party network across the states to cover the potential problems that can not be covered by phone support? IMO, it's the old 80/20 rule. 80% problems solved by phone support still doesn't address the 20% that are going to need face time, especially in a growing home market that demands service after the sale.

They have this covered, it's called a distributor. When a customer only has the option to purchase a game from a distributor that should be their point of contact, not direct to the manufacturer. This is what I have been attempting to point out for pages now. If jjp would keep their model as distributors only, they won't have the support issues that are bound to come and in the mean time they won't be taking sales away from the very distributors who are out there selling and supporting the machines.

#243 5 years ago
Quoted from inhomearcades:

They have this covered, it's called a distributor. When a customer only has the option to purchase a game from a distributor that should be their point of contact, not direct to the manufacturer. This is what I have been attempting to point out for pages now. If jjp would keep their model as distributors only, they won't have the support issues that are bound to come and in the mean time they won't be taking sales away from the very distributors who are out there selling and supporting the machines.

I agree.

The network I questioned was for support with the direct sales. Still not sure why they would leave the distributor concept for a flawed direct concept though.

#244 5 years ago
Quoted from vidgameseller:

which he thanked me for bringin it to his attention and that he will contact the customer to let them know that this is not "normal" reactions to things like this. However, when the customer contacted me yesterday about the new problem, he stated that Jack has never reached out and that they are having the same run around with the new problem.

I think this speaks VERY well to the character your dealing with.
He was blindsided... and he told you EXACTLY what you wanted to hear and walked away.
He had no intention of calling the customer.

You fanbois are going to say... he just forgot; give him a break. to which I say; sure he did... He forgot 3 seconds after the op left him alone. Jack is a salesman with zero eithics.

-1
#245 5 years ago

I've trashed Jack before, but for this... no way. Yes Jack is a businessman, and like all businessmen, he has to make some machiavellan sacrifices, like ignoring the petty whinings of Vidgameseller.

And Vidgameseller blind-sided Jack with petty customer service complaints at a time when his 2 million Hobbit game was getting trashed. Such a flop can finish his company, he has bigger fish to fry right now, the fact that he's even taking the time to chime in here...

There's a lot on Jack's plate, he can't think of every customer (to which he has thousands). Vidgameseller should have contacted a lowly minion instead (like Pinchroma or Lloyd), it's more effective.

Jack is too close to the trenches, he should just stay away like Gary Stern. Gary doesn't give a sh!t about you guys and no one starts a thread like this one attacking him, so maybe Jack should just do it the Stern way.

Jack, the more you feed us, the more we ask. It's like that sign at the zoo, it says "don't feed the animals" for a reason.

Now where are my boobs!!! I want pictures of boobs damn it!!!

#246 5 years ago

Stern just laughed, said JJP cut into 1% of their sales.

Gary will not be taking the trip to Thailand this year, instead bought all rights to Arnold Scwarzegger's visual rights.

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#248 5 years ago
Quoted from centerflank:

Stern just laughed, said JJP cut into 1% of their sales.
Gary will not be taking the trip to Thailand this year, instead bought all rights to Arnold Scwarzegger's visual rights.

307028.jpg
#249 5 years ago
Quoted from inhomearcades:

Idk, that's how I purchased my machines. I just called them up and placed an order. So I know the phone part is true. I must be misinformed though, I thought the website was theirs. I figure if I am on JJP website and I click on order and it takes me to a page to order that it would be their page. It may be a distributor but how would that be fair to all the other distributors?

He (JJ) owns Pinball Sales.com

#250 5 years ago

Irrespective of who is right and who is wrong, I find it fascinating that an employee of any company would act like this in public forum. Engaging in conflict publicly with customers and/or vendors and throwing around words like douche bag, shows very bad taste.

No good can come from this type of behavior. It might make you feel better, but it reflects poorly on your company.

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