(Topic ID: 107846)

JJP has very poor customer service for non pinheads


By vidgameseller

4 years ago



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  • 318 posts
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  • Latest reply 4 years ago by Chrisbee
  • Topic is favorited by 4 Pinsiders

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There are 318 posts in this topic. You are on page 4 of 7.
#151 4 years ago
Quoted from jwilson:

you need to offer in-home service and treat the machine like a standard consumer appliance, like a dishwasher.

Think of all the dishwashers you could buy for 8k.

#152 4 years ago

Hi guys,

I'm a professional pinball repair person. JJP sent me out on a local call to install new lamp boards (all of them!) for a customer who was not comfortable doing the work himself. It was very involved, and I spent the whole day at the customer's house. I was paid promptly for my services by JJP.

I guess I just wanted to provide another data point here. From my perspective, Jack and company are very concerned about customer satisfaction.

Allan

#153 4 years ago
Quoted from Vector:

Hi guys,
I'm a professional pinball repair person. JJP sent me out on a local call to install new lamp boards (all of them!) for a customer who was not comfortable doing the work himself. It was very involved, and I spent the whole day at the customer's house. I was paid promptly for my services by JJP.
I guess I just wanted to provide another data point here. From my perspective, Jack and company are very concerned about customer satisfaction.
Allan

Great to hear and nice to see JJP did stand behind the machine.

#154 4 years ago
Quoted from markmon:

To be totally honest, a pinball machine comes with a cost of ownership. People need to learn how to repair things. When JJP sends parts out, it's done its job. The customer either needs to learn how to install them or expect to regularly be forking out cash to repairmen. New game, old game, $1000 or $30000 game makes no difference.

Wait a second... REALLY? Remember, this customer is not a pinball collector. He's a guy that bought a new pinball machine in the box with a warranty associated with it (not sure if they warranty 90-days or 1-year or whatever). So, the customer expects the manufacturer to service issues. If you buy a TV and it didn't work out of the box, how would you feel if the manufacturer said they would send you a part but then expected you to find your own repairman to put it in (assume you know nothing about electronics).

Jaz

#155 4 years ago

I think its very important for all pinball machines sold to be clearly labeled as pro models designed for a commercial environment and will require regular maintenance. That should be all over the boxes and the websites.
X surgeon can buy a 30k coin op game but should still know the environment it was meant for and what that comes with. The price does not change the items intended use.
A TV has no moving parts and is designed to sit there and work. A pin has steel balls flying around and is designed to have the glass off weekly.

#156 4 years ago
Quoted from Jazman:

Wait a second... REALLY? Remember, this customer is not a pinball collector. He's a guy that bought a new pinball machine in the box with a warranty associated with it (not sure if they warranty 90-days or 1-year or whatever). So, the customer expects the manufacturer to service issues. If you buy a TV and it didn't work out of the box, how would you feel if the manufacturer said they would send you a part but then expected you to find your own repairman to put it in (assume you know nothing about electronics).
Jaz

Does the JJP or Stern warranty really say Parts and LABOR?

#157 4 years ago
Quoted from DCFAN:

Does the JJP or Stern warranty really say Parts and LABOR?

Nope.

#158 4 years ago
Quoted from DCFAN:

Does the JJP or Stern warranty really say Parts and LABOR?

That's a valid point. However, if pinball manufacturers want to sell direct to consumer (not just ops and collectors), that won't fly. While *WE* know these are coin-op machines and what that means, do you think that all these people who buy a machine online do?

I'm just saying if these guys want to sell direct to consumer (which they obviously do) and want to not only have happy customers, but repeat customers, they need to change their model and thinking.

What concerns me most here is that I have not seen Jack (or anyone associated with the company) take the stand and say we didn't handle this right but we're trying to fix it. If vidgameseller hadn't stepped up and tried to help these people out, and put Pinchroma in contact with these people directly, where exactly would this be for them right now? It looks to me like the OP went far an above to help these guys out with no compensation.

I mean, it was well into the 2nd page of this thread where the OP finally got someone at JJP to step up on this.

Please don't take this as a JJP bash. I've been a pinballsales.com supporter for quite a while and always felt that Jack did a good job. Heck, he built JJP *BECAUSE* of his reputation from pinballsales.com. But, in this case something happened. We all make mistakes and the good guys do what they can to make it right. But, something happened here and Jack's post didn't help his case since there was no acknowledgement of an "oops".

If we want to grow pinball, we need customers like the one we're talking about here to be happy with their purchase and ready to buy again.

My 2 cents,
Jaz

#159 4 years ago
Quoted from Jazman:

That's a valid point. However, if pinball manufacturers want to sell direct to consumer (not just ops and collectors), that won't fly. While *WE* know these are coin-op machines and what that means, do you think that all these people who buy a machine online do?
I'm just saying if these guys want to sell direct to consumer (which they obviously do) and want to not only have happy customers, but repeat customers, they need to change their model and thinking.
What concerns me most here is that I have not seen Jack (or anyone associated with the company) take the stand and say we didn't handle this right but we're trying to fix it. If vidgameseller hadn't stepped up and tried to help these people out, and put Pinchroma in contact with these people directly, where exactly would this be for them right now? It looks to me like the OP went far an above to help these guys out with no compensation.
I mean, it was well into the 2nd page of this thread where the OP finally got someone at JJP to step up on this.
Please don't take this as a JJP bash. I've been a pinballsales.com supporter for quite a while and always felt that Jack did a good job. Heck, he built JJP *BECAUSE* of his reputation from pinballsales.com. But, in this case something happened. We all make mistakes and the good guys do what they can to make it right. But, something happened here and Jack's post didn't help his case since there was no acknowledgement of an "oops".
If we want to grow pinball, we need customers like the one we're talking about here to be happy with their purchase and ready to buy again.
My 2 cents,
Jaz

I am sure JJP would have paid someone to come and fix the newly shipped game if they did not find someone local to volunteer to fix it for free.
If it were a Stern game you would be at the mercy of the distributor. That is always hit and miss.

#160 4 years ago
Quoted from Jazman:

take the stand and say we didn't handle this right but we're trying to fix it.

From JJP

Quoted from JerseyJack:

The customer has spoken to our people and everything is happiness going forward.

#161 4 years ago

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With many years manufacturing and exporting experience we have gained rich experience for malfunction of machine.,we can put an end to these malfunction.If there is any problem our technicians will handle you a solution in details,insert related instruction photos,make you clearly!"

#162 4 years ago
Quoted from JerseyJack:

"If it ain't broke, it ain't Pinball"
We cannot make an Unbreakable pinball machine for a million dollars.
I own a service company that makes money because things break. That's why there are parts companies too.
I built a company based on customer service. We have provided free parts and countless free service calls all over the world.
Our warranty is the broadest most liberal and longest in the industry. I'm even shipping parts for free on games out of warranty.
I've swapped whole games, playfields, you name it. We have done service calls for free for operators on location. So newbies are not the only ones who don't know how to fix pinball.
I've even been known to show up at someone's home or location to service their game.
A toll free number listed in the manual, on line even on shirts rings on my cell phone that I answer.
There will always be people who fix things with check books.
The customer has spoken to our people and everything is happiness going forward.
We have hired an industry service expert Frank Becker who is getting up to date for the last month at JJP to run the service and support division
We strive to get better every day and we will. It's pinball. I can guarantee it will break!
Thanks.

Years ago I bought my gently used, shopped out LOTR from Pinball Sales (you, basically, as you spent a couple hours on the phone with me as I struggled through what game I wanted, etc.). I was a total noob, and after a couple days of play the flippers were buzzing and really weren't working as well as they should. I called and asked you to fix it. Today I'd get under the hood and fix it myself. Not capable back then. You sent Steve up to fix it for me. I know you were probably rolling your eyes at the time, but you took care of business for me Jack. Thanks for that and good luck with JJP and your other ventures going forward!!

#163 4 years ago
Quoted from DCFAN:

I am sure JJP would have paid someone to come and fix the newly shipped game if they did not find someone local to fix it for free.
If it were a Stern game you would be at the mercy of the distributor. That is always hit and miss.

True, but again the distributor should back it up since they make money on the game. Selling direct is the difference between the two companies. Stern realizes that they do not have to deal directly with customers therefore they allow distributors to make money on the games. Distributors make money at the risk of needing to service those games under warranty. JJP can not sell direct, keep the entire sale for themselves by cutting out the middle man and not be expected to provide support for the product, even if that means sending out a guy to do the work. Sounds like they have been doing that though, this was just a instance that it didn't initially work out is all.

#164 4 years ago

Why does it often seem like Pinside members living in Illinois are the hardest on JJP?

#165 4 years ago
Quoted from markmon:

To be totally honest, a pinball machine comes with a cost of ownership. People need to learn how to repair things. When JJP sends parts out, it's done its job. The customer either needs to learn how to install them or expect to regularly be forking out cash to repairmen. New game, old game, $1000 or $30000 game makes no difference.

Can you imagine if any other industry was ran this way, what if Ford just sent you parts?

You can't make this a mass-market product if you can't provide some sort of onsite service.
Maybe they don't need it to be mass market and are fine with the niche they are in.

#166 4 years ago
Quoted from DCFAN:

Why does it often seem like Pinside members living in Illinois are the hardest on JJP?

I'm not being hard on JJP, please look back and my comments. I am hard on manufacturers who sell direct and cut out distributors yet don't provide the service that distributors bring to the table. I feel that way because my company is a distributor of 60 different product lines. Its what I deal with everyday and every so often one of the lines wants to sell direct to a customer and cut us out. When it all falls apart, they come running back to us.

#167 4 years ago

...and it's VIZIO by the way...

#168 4 years ago
Quoted from vidgameseller:

I keep thinking about this post and just got to say, Bu#$ S*(&. I really dont see how you are even getting thumbs up on this Jack. These comments from you are strictly the salesman in you. Not coming from someone that actually cares about the individual customer. In my opionion, which since im not paying you anything for so i doubt you care. The only comments that you should have made were things like.

I dropped the ball on this after saying i was going to call. Although Alex has called and it looks like it will be rectified, Im still going to call them directly so that they know we do appreciatte our customer.

and

I know that pinball machines WILL break, its going to happen. But a game not working out of the box is just not acceptable, We have to do better than that.

for your statement how you send parts all over the world and even free service calls. Great, let me get you a cookie. Because i think that if anyone deserves a free service call, it should be a customer that doesnt even get one game played on their machine because it was broken. Although they did get a free service call, from me, and im not the one that made thousands off of them.

I read this post and all I can think of is that JJP should be more than thankful to Alex for potential saving a customer and allowing for some potential future revenue, instead of a customer badmouthing JJP up and down costing them future sales.

#169 4 years ago

(service by phone)

noob: "My machine is broken, these thingamajigs won't work."

Lloyd: "Okay, first take the matrix reciprocitor and disconnect it from the freight intake converter. Now check the extractor and see if the switches register. If not, just solder in a new pyronix capacitor. That should do it. Did you get all that?

noob: "Uhm... ya... but hold on my wife is calling me, bye." [click]

Lloyd: "Hello? ...Hello?"

#170 4 years ago
Quoted from DCFAN:

Why does it often seem like Pinside members living in Illinois are the hardest on JJP?

Having to watch the Cubbies and Bears year after year would do that to any one of us.

#171 4 years ago
Quoted from DCFAN:

I am sure JJP would have paid someone to come and fix the newly shipped game if they did not find someone local to volunteer to fix it for free.
If it were a Stern game you would be at the mercy of the distributor. That is always hit and miss.

The person we sent was recommended to us by an authorized JJP distributor.....

15
#172 4 years ago
Quoted from inhomearcades:

I'm not being hard on JJP, please look back and my comments. I am hard on manufacturers who sell direct and cut out distributors yet don't provide the service that distributors bring to the table. I feel that way because my company is a distributor of 60 different product lines. Its what I deal with everyday and every so often one of the lines wants to sell direct to a customer and cut us out. When it all falls apart, they come running back to us.

I've sold games all over the world since 1999 full time. I have paid for people to go everywhere and take care of our customers.

I was never reimbursed for anything ever when I was Stern's #1 distributor. We gave everyone a 3 year extended warranty on all parts that Stern covered - at no charge - I sent cabinets, playfields, mechanisms, swapped games,picked up games across the country - and have 15,000 loyal customers to prove it - that's how JJP started -

So many people figured if I would do that for a company I don't own - what would I do with a Pinball manufacturer I do own - there are probably hundreds of loyal PBSC/JGSC/JJP customers with stories of support that I don't need written here - we are only as good as our last sale - this customer is a newbie - game #2 or #3 - he may learn to take the glass off - maybe not - that's why there are qualified people to fix pinball machines - next time we will do better....

#173 4 years ago
Quoted from JerseyJack:

The person we sent was recommended to us by an authorized JJP distributor.....

NOt sure who you are talking about here, but Jen called me to see if the customer could hire me to just set up the machine. I was never hired to do a service call and im the only one that has been to the customers house. I went and worked on the first problem and was not hired or paid for by JJP so just curious who you sent that JJP hired

Im a retailer myself and service what I sell. SO service is not an issue for me, and if JJP wants to pay me to go work on the machine, thats fine. This is what i told the customer as well, that the repairs/service should be hired by JJP so that they cant try to void a warranty. The closest JJP distributors is about 3 hours away

#174 4 years ago
Quoted from BMore-Pinball:

Can you imagine if any other industry was ran this way, what if Ford just sent you parts?

How many times has Ford sent someone to your house to work on your car?

#175 4 years ago
Quoted from juanton:

How many times has Ford sent someone to your house to work on your car?

You take it to a dealership equipped to work on them. Dealerships are everywhere since there is a larger customer base, so it's usually not to much of an issue to get it there, unlike with pinball machines.

#176 4 years ago

Exactly. Like it or not, a pinball machine is like no other consumer product. There is a cost of ownership imo.

12
#177 4 years ago
Quoted from HunchbackHodler:

Lloyd: "Okay, first take the matrix reciprocitor and disconnect it from the freight intake converter. Now check the extractor and see if the switches register. If not, just solder in a new pyronix capacitor. That should do it. Did you get all that?

I hope you are joking.

I have spent countless hours helping new owners with basics like how to turn the game on, open coin door. Walk them through learning about their game.

The more they know about their game, the more they'll enjoy it.

LTG : )

#178 4 years ago

Could the OP change the thread title to something a little less inflammatory?

#179 4 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

I hope you are joking.
I have spent countless hours helping new owners with basics like how to turn the game on, open coin door. Walk them through learning about their game.
The more they know about their game, the more they'll enjoy it.
LTG : )

Lloyd, You have been nothing but awesome to talk to and work with. JJP is lucky to have you on their team.

#180 4 years ago
Quoted from juanton:

How many times has Ford sent someone to your house to work on your car?

Ford has sent a courtesy car to my house to drop off a loaner, and pick up my van because it was a warranty repair.

Ford has GREAT dealer service.

#181 4 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

Ford has sent a courtesy car to my house to drop off a loaner, and pick up my van because it was a warranty repair.
Ford has GREAT dealer service.

Lol. Sorry Vid. I wasn't picking on Ford in particular. We had a Flex and the Ford dealer was ok. The quality wasn't that great so we traded it in.

#182 4 years ago
Quoted from juanton:

Lol. Sorry Vid. I wasn't picking on Ford in particular. We had a Flex and the Ford dealer was ok. The quality wasn't that great so we traded it in.

Probably any dealer nowadays is bending over backwards with free loners and free courtesy shuttles, not just Ford.

#183 4 years ago
Quoted from juanton:

How many times has Ford sent someone to your house to work on your car?

Actually My chevy Cruze would not start so the dealer pick it up at my house and towed it to the dealer no charge .

#184 4 years ago

Cadillac picks my truck up and leaves one when I need anything, including an oil change for no charge. Its been great.

#185 4 years ago
Quoted from vid1900:

Probably any dealer nowadays is bending over backwards with free loners and free courtesy shuttles, not just Ford.

Subaru and Nissan seem to operate in a similar fashion as well.

#186 4 years ago

lol. Ok everyone, I stand corrected.

#187 4 years ago

If only I had an actual pinball dealer in my town. I'd settle for one within two or three hours.

#188 4 years ago
Quoted from vidgameseller:

Because i think that if anyone deserves a free service call, it should be a customer that doesnt even get one game played on their machine because it was broken.

I must've have missed it, but what exactly was broken and had to be replaced?

-3
#189 4 years ago
Quoted from BoozeMarlin:

I must've have missed it, but what exactly was broken and had to be replaced?

The OP is actually incorrect. The game was playing for 3 weeks and then one of the leaf arms on the skill shot target broke during game play. That's it.

#190 4 years ago
Quoted from Pinchroma:

The OP is actually incorrect. The game was playing for 3 weeks and then one of the leaf arms on the skill shot target broke during game play. That's it.

ALex, your wrong on this. The game was not working out if the box, The ball trough was not getting power and after a couple of hours of reseatting all the connections, I found one that the +5 pins on a molex connector was not pushed in causing it not to get power to the through. So AFTER i fixed the first problem, the game worked, but then about 2 weeks later is when they had the problem that you are trying to help them with. If your post is correct, then your saying that they never had a problem out of the box

#191 4 years ago
Quoted from Pinchroma:

The OP is actually incorrect

i think an apology is in order.

#192 4 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

I hope you are joking.
I have spent countless hours helping new owners with basics like how to turn the game on, open coin door. Walk them through learning about their game.
The more they know about their game, the more they'll enjoy it.
LTG : )

It's a joke, with some truth to it. I witnessed something similar right here on pinside with you involved. It was funny to me. I don't think everything could be solved by distance, it's difficult, so I'm on Jack's and your side on this one. You're doing the best you could.

-6
#193 4 years ago
Quoted from vidgameseller:

ALex, your wrong on this. The game was not working out if the box, The ball trough was not getting power and after a couple of hours of reseatting all the connections, I found one that the +5 pins on a molex connector was not pushed in causing it not to get power to the through. So AFTER i fixed the first problem, the game worked, but then about 2 weeks later is when they had the problem that you are trying to help them with. If your post is correct, then your saying that they never had a problem out of the box

I acknowledged you fixed the first problem however your previous post made it sound like the game never worked. Let's be honest here the first problem which you say took 3 hrs to diagnose should have taken 5 mins maybe 10 if you had to break out the multimeter. The ball not feeding into the shooter lane can only be but a few small items and a quick run through the test menu to see if the coil fired and that the trough registered properly would have pointed someone in the right direction. The whole posting of this thread and the extreme terse nature of your original post isn't exactly something any company would want to deal with regularly. I jumped in and helped the second I found out about the problem as I always do. Not to mention the fact that the customer had spoken to another at JJP (not Lloyd as you incorrectly assumed) to identify the problem switch and send a replacement right out. A little more tact would have been appreciated. Since Im handling it now. We are going to get a local resource to assist if necessary. Thanks .

25
#194 4 years ago

ALex, maybe you are the one that needs a little tact. You continuously post false information. I know for a fact that Llyod was the first person to talk to them, since i called Lloyd personnaly and gave him the phone number for the customer to which he called them instantly, However, this is the call that ended with them being told that and i quote "need to suck up to jack to get it repaired" Ask Jack, I showed him the text at expo. So quit calling me a liar.

As for Taking two hours to fix it. It actually only took a second to fix it, but to find the connector that wasnt properly affixed inside a molex is what took two hours. If you think that your such a bad ass at repair then, let me have you come out here, and i will make one molex pin not be properly seated on the wire harness and see if you find it in 10 minutes. I bet you wouldnt, and that is with you knowing ahead of time that it is a pin not pushed in. Troubleshooting often takes more time than the repair.

Lastly, since you keep calling me a liar on things, ask the customer, he will tell you that I reseatted every connector and such to find the issues, per Lloyds advice, but then again, you say it wasnt lloyd that i was talking to. (you want me to show my phone numbers to show you, i dont think that JJP will show up as SSBilliards direct line)

Its real classy getting on me for posting something that brought light to a customer that was nt getting good servie from the place that sold the machine to them. And as far as me having a multimeter, I didnt even have a screwdriver, I went out of my way on my way home from dinner without my tool kit, just to try to get this game going so that his 2 young children could get a game on it before going to bed. To me, that is customer service, As for you blaming other things and saying that i have lied, well, that is kinda the reason for this post in the first place.

To think, i didnt make a penny on this sale, and selling games is what i do to put food on my table, but i went out of my way to help a JJP customer, and to try to get them additional help, when maybe, someone at JJP should have just got up and taken care of the proble to start with. Im not a multi-million dollar company, but i went far and above for a JJP customer, without any appreciation from JJP at all. Now thats class

-1
#195 4 years ago
Quoted from DCFAN:

Why does it often seem like Pinside members living in Illinois are the hardest on JJP?

Why do you think? Stern employee haters.

Say what you want about Jack and JJP but their customer service is phenomenal.

-7
#196 4 years ago
Quoted from vidgameseller:

To think, i didnt make a penny on this sale, and selling games is what i do to put food on my table, but i went out of my way to help a JJP customer, and to try to get them additional help, when maybe, someone at JJP should have just got up and taken care of the proble to start with. Im not a multi-million dollar company, but i went far and above for a JJP customer, without any appreciation from JJP at all. Now thats class

BS.........total nonsense, you "sell games to put food on your table" and then come on here and start up a bunch of BS, man, all I can say is good luck to you, you'll need it.

-14
#197 4 years ago

They worked with Steve to diagnose the switch problem just the other day. That was what the customer told me and I verified that today as well. WELL after expo so we are talking about 2 different problems. I don't care about the original problem. That's fixed and is not what the issue is now so stop bringing it up it's irrelevant. SMH. In any event thanks for the help. I've got it.

#198 4 years ago

Vidgame, you should be commended for what you did. !!!
I think we can all see, you go above and beyond to satisfy a customer.(especially not your own).

#199 4 years ago

Even the Fonz had trouble admitting he was w, wuh, wuuh......

25
#200 4 years ago
Quoted from Pinchroma:

They worked with Steve to diagnose the switch problem just the other day. That was what the customer told me and I verified that today as well. WELL after expo so we are talking about 2 different problems. I don't care about the original problem. That's fixed and is not what the issue is now so stop bringing it up it's irrelevant. SMH. In any event thanks for the help. I've got it.

Wait, what?!?

You don't care about the original problem because it's fixed. Exactly how did JJP or pinballsales make that happen? Did you pay the tech who did the repair for his time?

I just re-read this thread from the start and realized that JJP didn't *SEND* vidgameseller out to do any work. They simply put the 2 in contact with each other and let them work out an arrangement. Then he went back out on his own time to fix a problem. Was he paid for that first repair (or even thanked)?

Wait, you know what, I don't want to know anymore. It sounds like there is probably some blame by all the parties involved. The customer is now working with JJP to fix the current problem. Hopefully JJP/pinballsales has learned a few things here and everyone can move forward a little smarter.

Alex, you're speaking here as an official JJP party. Remember that a ton of potential customers read this. I for one would not want a representative of my company behaving/commenting as you are here.

Jaz

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