JJP needed a big hit with this game since WOZ and Hobbit sold so well? I don't think Hobbit is going to catch WOZ in terms of overall sales numbers (it's still selling but so is WOZ and WOZ had a big head start), but it did fine overall. The third game is important, no doubt about that, but there are licensed games to come later if everyone's waiting for another of those. As an original theme, Dialed In has I guess an uphill battle but the initial reception among those who've gotten to see and play it has been good. We shall see how it does.

I'm fairly certain I have not seen a thread of someone trying to convince themselves of their decision being a good one and looking for someone else to root them on. I have said it blatantly I think you're crazy and it's a waste of money for suckers but here's to hoping I'm wrong and if you feel good about your decision at the end of the day, more power to ya. I refuse to continue to enable these manufacturers from sucking more an more money out of these already expensive games and not giving even remotely close enough extra to ever justify it. I'm excited to get a Dialed In but less than thrilled with the recent BS of manufacturers and these super LE or CE, blah blah editions. Getting stale.

Not to mention now on both previous titles JJP has released ANOTHER limited edition(Ruby Red and Black Arrow) after the original ones to further throw dirt at the limited aspect of any of these games that were already hardly limited to begin with. Just crappy practice in my opinion and I don't trust anything "limited" from JJP as they've now shown again they don't care even after they got roasted the first time over it, they did it again, no reason in the world to think it won't happen on Dialed In as well.

No way LE Dialed In's price will fall that fast. I still see used STANDARD WoZ selling for $7000. Pretty sure one just went through pinside market like a week ago.

I would have reservations about comparing the two.

Independent of game play which many love and some dislike, WOZ is a timeless theme which looks like a work of art as much as it does a pinball machine. It's a game that has found its way into many homes because of its theme and sheer beauty. These are also the reasons I believe Dialed In will prove to be a tough sell, even if the game play turns out to be stellar.

No matter what I'm really excited for next year. Maybe its going to be Dialed In for me... maybe Stern will announce something really exciting... maybe a legendary remake gets announced (I'd be all over MB)... maybe I go for a couple older games I've been thinking over (TZ perhaps)...

I too would be weary of comparing DI to WOZ just yet... As Mike pointed out, its a thing of bueaty and really in a league of its own. I personally absolutely love the gameplay (when setup right)... but she's a bit finicky and when out of tune does not play well.

Take a hint, just buy an le and use the other money to buy a nice used game also

Probably the best advice on this thread. Honestly the extra "value" for these "collector" machines is marginal at best. Spend the 9K on the regular machine and pocket the 3.5K for the next one down the road.

The ROI on the 3.5K is probably one of the worst investments you can make. You started this thread challenging the "value" of the collector machine. It clearly isn't there. But for some reason people pay for this stuff. I don't get it. You have to find value in the extras.

Personally for me, I was willing to pay extra for my WoZ LE for two reasons. First was the cleared cabinet. I have never seen anything like it before. The second was the wooden apron. Those two things were enough for me.

So far I can't see anything that makes sense for 3.5K on the Dialed In Collectors version.

Either way, best of luck w/your decision.

Exactly the same for me. Also, I liked the green a bit better.

Also the price wasn't all that much more than a standard

That was back in the day where they were selling them for less than they cost to design and build them. That business model didn't exactly work out.

Initially yeah, but ECLE's were still available NIB around the same time RR's were (presumably a few people had traded their ECLE spots for RR's)... and were only slightly more.

Approx and not sure what current prices are but then (direct purchase from JJ):
Standard: 8K
RR: 9K
ECLE 10K

Compare that to the DI tiers.

are you sure on those prices? I seem to remember getting my ECLE for 8000

Those were the prices from JJ around April of this year. Yeah, the ECLE was significantly bumped but I think still in line value wise in the lineup.

here are specs on the collectors edition.

if you would like to order one then contact me and we will get it everything started. All that is needed a $1,000 deposit before the end of the year (12/31/2016).

DI page 2.pdf

Not today. Just like the FT you are trying to sell.

I have #44 Woz ECLE and if I sold it would be happy to get what I paid for it out of it. $6500

These pins, and any others in the $9k plus range will drop like a lead balloon on the secondary market.

Better make sure you want to keep it long term and don't give a F.

Customized software. Go on....

I still don't understand the 12,500 money grab, I mean, collectors dialed in.

Are the CE's built first?

Won't take long. All 5 of them.

Well I suppose if they can sell 6 thats an extra 20k they would have otherwise left on the table. Question is, how much goodwill has it cost.

Why are they losing goodwill over having a collector's edition? They have LE and standard models with the same game play features at a lower price point.

If I had crap loads of money and wanted something a little different, I'd probably get the collector's edition.

I can't buy the newer games because of my budget (even the standard editions are a pipe dream) but at least it seems like they're going to make a really cool game and buying experience for that money. Like, look at what they're putting into it. Usually companies that do stuff like this give you some kind of printed-signed piece of paper if you're one of the ones dumb enough to pay the price for that. Looks like they're actually adding some cool stuff.

Also, looks like they're flying anybody who buys, to EXPO? Has that been talked about yet? I don't really follow these threads, but there's a lot of the expense right there.

Because even if you are targeting celebrities and whatnot, your average new game collector who maybe would want to on occasion buy what is considered to be the top of the line model of a game now feels like they are being squeezed or even priced out, and nobody likes that. Even though, yes I agree the LE is going to be everything a JJ game ever has been and absolutely wonderfull... the perception is still there and perception is critical.

This (especially the highlighted) seems like one of those "first world problems" things. Poor guy, can't buy the coolest version. Reminds me of kids in a toy store! Such is life...

haha, nice Lloyd.

Yeah totally is, but then again it's a first world hobby so people with first world problems are the customer base.

So true. JJP could pay bigtime if they don't "get " the psyche of NIB pinball buyers. The ones that were always "rolls royce " customers are suddenly "second-raters". Of course it's largely about ego which could be described as a character negative but if that's what sells you don't want ego death. As mentioned above I feel it's probable that there will be a significant difference in second-hand prices WOZ v Dialed In. If people start to drop out in numbers it will snowball even if the gameplay is good which I think it is.

How much do I hate the theme, name and look of Dialed In?

I am a Pat Lawlor fan. I own Twilight Zone and it is the best game of all time in my opinion. I am not a huge fan of the theme but the machine is still beautiful.
I am a Jersey Jack fan. My Wizard of Oz is my favorite pinball machine of all time and I ordered it never having played it. I just ordered a Hobbit Smaug SE (I've only played The Hobbit twice). They are two of the most beautiful machines ever and WOZ is just a step behind TZ in gameplay for me. JJP just seems to have taken everything to another level.
I am a home collector and have a lot of money to blow on pinball. In the last week I purchased a Tron LE, The Hobbit Smaug SE and The Big Lebowski (though I've never played it).

I am the person that a Dialed In CE is directed towards. Am I buying one? Nope. Am I buying a standard or LE? Nope, never. I have not played it but even if it were the best playing pinball of all time the theme is stupid and the machine is an eyesore. Seriously, what were they thinking? They had everything to make the greatest pinball machine ever and this is what the result is. I'm so disappointed.

My biggest fear is that this will be the beginning of the end for Jersey Jack Pinball. I hope I am wrong because I am still holding out hope of a JJP Superman, Man of Steel or Batman v Superman. I would pay $15,000 for the top version of a Superman themed game from JJP.

So maybe theme and beauty are too important for me? Oh well, that is my decision as a consumer. In this case, I'll keep my money. And not just $3500 of it, all of it.

Well put, many of us feel the same way.

call me crazy but maybe you should PLAY the game before making your decision. I played the game this week for a few hours and I think you will be pleasantly surprised. I still cant figure out why a home buyer is so concerned about the name - maybe you can explain to me?

I thought that the game played great, had a ton of very interesting shots and found the sound/gameplay etc to be really well integrated. I do think that 9K is a hefty price to pay for a pinball machine.

Sorry that your disappointed. I find this game a huge step up from Hobbit which I generally find slow and boring - its not for me.

I think the game Dialed In looks amazing and I can't wait to play it. I think JJP is making the best pinball machines in the business right now. I also think Stern is making wonderful games as well, and we are in the middle of a pinball manufacturing Renaissance that should be making every player joyful that such amazing new games are being created.

I'm not a gloom-and-doom "the crash is coming" type of person -- in general, I think the health of this hobby and this industry is pretty good. but I do think what JJP and Stern are doing with the "Super LE" model is potentially very destructive, and may have a negative long term impact on all of pinball, from the casual hobbyist up through the top manufacturers. I don't think it's in their long term interest to scam customers by charging a $3500 premium for such marginal and intangible benefits.

It reminds me of the 90s comics industry, when the market was flooded with overpriced "Collectors Editions" of comics every month, each one struggling to justify its price and indeed existence with hologram covers or extra-glossy finishes. here is a quote from an article about the comic book crash; tell me if it sounds familiar: "Over time, early comics had become valuable, mostly because not a lot of them had survived, and the possibility that new comics might be valuable started to drive the market." hmm.

Just to clarify, the comics industry of the mid-90s and today's pinball industry are indeed very different. every industry has its own unique market factors and exists in its own context. but i do think you can look what happened there to see the potential downside of cynically over-exploiting what is, essentially, extreme enthusiasm for your product on the part of your customers. i would sincerely hate for Stern or JJP to squander that by leaving customers with a feeling they have been ripped off.

You need bigger fears.

Dialed in is the start in a new chapter in JJP history.

LTG : )

I'm not "concerned" about the name. I just don't like it. If I find the opportunity to play it, I will, but I don't see myself paying so much for a machine that is really visually and thematically unappealing to me.

I do have a pretty posh life, haha! I hope you're right. I want JJP to continue making machines for decades to come.

Seriously...it's not the end for JJP. There are games coming behind Hobbit and Dialed In. Hopefully Dialed In will sell but if not there are more games in the que.

It's so far from the end. I know this forums slants negative and I can't blame it - LOTS of people have been burned in pinball. But offline, among the ops, distributors and private collectors I talk to, Dialed In orders are flying. I know several locations who have already made their space and placed their orders.

I think on this issue, the forum is slanting a little toooooo into the negative. Keep your chins up.

And if it turns out to be a sales flop, maybe they will re-theme the layout.

Yes, this is what someone who values gameplay would do.

But he buys games based on looks and theme.

He admitted he never played Woz before purchasing.

I'll take ugly and fun over beautiful and dull.

I agree. WPT over WOZ any day.

I had a WPT. It's not a bad game, but I prefer Woz by a wide margin.

But your opinion is valid.

The problem is that it really doesn't have to be a choice of one or the other. There are a lot of pinball machines out there. Everyone has a list of machines they want that are desirable for both theme and gameplay. Unfortunately, Dialed In loses this large pool of buyers and enthusiasts.

It sure as hell shouldn't be at a base price of 8K.

wasnt the name and cab art going to be changed? any updates?

Name stays confirmed. Artwork I cannot say for sure. Jack said this at FPF and IAAPA among other places.

And if that's the new chapter that JJP is entering then they won't be selling as many pinball machines as they think they will.

The $8k plus pin market is gonna end badly as the realization of losing $$ on the secondary market starts to go widespread. Gonna happen.

good used pins that used to be gone in a day lingering for weeks.
i was gonna get nib hobbit and see so many for sale. gonna take a step back and sit out till next year.

I played Dialed In! for the first time today. This game looks amazing in person. The color scheme of the artwork is really eye catching, the light show sparkles and the toys look really well made. There are a ton of little details on the playfield that I didn't notice when looking at the photos. The graphics on the LCD looked really polished. One thing I didn't realize is that the various playfield elements are all a part of the cityscape which appears on the LCD. The pop bumpers are the tops of three buildings, the Einstein theater is on one of the streets and the electricity mascot is part of a sign on another building, it's really clever. The whole game just looks next level, more modern and polished than any other game I have seen. The things that people have been complaining about (the name, the guy with the phone and the phone toy itself) are not a huge part of the game and it all works really well together when you actually see and play it in person.