The irony of watching you have one of the biggest meltdowns in Pinside history and the meltdown being about Pinside melting down is perfect. You deserve a Twipy or something. Did you plan it?

I was just saying that sentiment to my friend. Ideally, we'd get an in-between, a "here's why we have to be vague in this business (parts allocation, design tweaking, manufacturing issues) and here's what we can announce to give you time-frames to respect your patience, and allow you to plan half a car purchases throughout the year.

I understand they can't be entirely transparent, but last night was proof that a....degree....after the YBR unveil, would have helped us throngs of fans, be satiated and empathetic to their production and marketing situation.

That said, I've watched years of e3/CES/Nintendo Direct presentations and in the video game world, hype and expectations run even more rampant, and subsequently more disappointing, than what we have here in pinball. Ideally, the big four recognize that, and help eliminate those vibes, but hey, Spooky came out, gave a 90 minute tutorial sans it's owner speaking one word to the people that have had $1000 locked up for a year, yet alone reassuring them how issues would be smoothed out, improved upon, and a brighter future exists for it's fandom. But dog photos on Facebook, good on ya man!

These companies and their fans, are a much, much smaller market and niche crowd than video gaming. In that sense, they need greater fan outreach, and less spin. Yet when we have public figures try to frame pinball via media, we get awkward people trying to up their cool value with streams and skits. I like and appreciate the crowd that makes and enjoys pinball. It's a rare last bastion of nerdy folk that don't self label to accrue some chic term for cultural backing. Gaming lost it's nerdish creative roots. I truly hope pinball never does via mainstream cultural indoctrination, for better of the business or worse.

GnR's last tour was the biggest grossing out there, something like 500 million bucks, and they're going out again in late 2019 with an even bigger tour. There are a LOT of GnR fans in the world. If there's 1/100 of one percent of the people that saw them on the last tour that would buy a pinball machine, that's 1000 machines right there. I think JJP will sell a lot more than 1000 if they don't price themselves out of the market.

What kind of answer would you expect?

He made it clear that they were committed to the next game and were not saying anything about why they picked that over more pirates now. You can ask the questions they've already shown they won't answer... but all it does is show you can't read the people.

They aren't going to air internal dirty laundry just because someone asked a follow up question to their intentionally vague and deflecting statement they just made 30 seconds prior.

They repeatedly said they sold out pirates... they specifically avoided making statements about demand for the game.

Not how it works...

At 200 units this means some 2milliion in sales or so. That's what matters.

The factory workers will have plenty to do on the main line after woz wraps up.

Jjp wants to be shipping games when they announce them... that takes time

The revenue is what binds things ultimately

And you people have way over hyped yourselves into what these seminars are.

They aren't marketing launches. There is no press here... there isn't corridinated media etc. this is simply speaking amengagements at a fan convention. More often then not simply retrospectives, some BTS looks, histories, a chance to hear from the team members directly, etc.

You all are so wound up into a frenzy over the next game anything not about it is suddenly bad. That's the sign of addicts.

Jjp seminar showed signs of lack of preparation. They clearly were winging it and chose to recycle topics rather than prepare new interesting content. That's on them. But those making comparisons to E3 or other actual media launches... you are disconnected from reality on what these seminars are.

The worse part of the session was the horrible audio that plagued the room (not jjp's fault) and that JPs topic was a pretty pointless rehash.

When the companies do not do a good job of Defining what the session will be... it leads to fans making up their own topics and then being mad it's not that.

Jack knows what everyone is clamoring for... they needed to plan to offer something else more captivating. They know the woz topic wouldn't fit an hour or appease those hungering

And again, 2 playfield lines in the factory. YBR playfields on the back line not the main line. No plans for any more WOZ on the main line pretty much ever I wouldn’t think. Too many other games to get into production. WOZ will do what it’s doing. Main line is busy finishing up the Pirates run while alongside it is gearing up for game 5 to enter very soon. Pirates is getting down to the end as everyone knows. That’s what is happening, and Pirates production halting after this cycle was decided months ago, not due to WOZ YBR. Two different things going on. Game 5 will hopefully be a hit but time will tell.

I was stating I'm glad these events are nothing like e3. And even e3 is a shadow of what it used to be, only Microsoft is officially showing up this year. I'm saying the glitz and PR spins of that is exactly at the opposite of the earnestness of this hobby that's attractive, at least for me personally.

These shows, with industry panels and debuts for product launches, are entirely analogous to e3 style conventions. Where else do these companies announce, describe, and show off new product lines other than at seemingly two of these types of conventions a year?

And obviously this industry is maybe 1% the size of video gaming. And for that I am glad. You can only do so many things with pins, and an overflow of games wouldn't necessarily be appealing.

I can feel the tone of your messages and I'm halfway around the world .

It's not like it's the same movie with less Assassin's and a different coloured actor and they charge you more to see it.

Someone needs a chill pill

I normally hate “whataboutism”, but... we already know the market handled $15000 SLE Batman games from Stern where you sent in a video begging for the game. Super Limited Edition with only 30 made... oh, they are buying them... wait... only 80 ever to be made! And oh, those “unpriced” Beatles games where you could line up to make an offer to a distributor. Hell, these YBR games might be underpriced compared to what the market has already handled.

Dude, chill. I dont know if you saw the jokey emoticon at the end of my statement or if you were just too preoccupied working yourself into keyboard badass mode that you missed it. It is obvious from your postings and your appearance on Kaneda that you have a lot of opinions and think highly of them. That does not mean that others opinions of the launch are any less valid. A lot of people, including me, thought the launch sucked.

Agreed.

JJP seminar and what they have for product was disappointing. Done. Hopefully they’ll work harder for my pin dollars. Otherwise, good luck. MY OPINION.

I’ll take a GNR over Wonka, could give two shits about Wonka.

Whatever you say... but I also doubt 10,000,000 people saw them on their last tour.

I could give two shits about either one. As much as I like JJP machines, I wouldn't pay $8,500 for a "baseline" pinball machine, let alone $12,000. Enjoy your GNR when it comes out.

G&R Put out the 5th largest tour of all time the year. Stern put out the Stone's game the year they did the 3rd largest tour of all time look how that went.

what happened to the toy story rumors?

uninformed speculation: the 4th movie trailer shows the toys living in a pinball machine.. JJP is trying to switch over to so they can announce along with movie (June 19) due to the tie in of pinball into that universe.

it seems plausible to me they had to cut POTC short due to the delays eating up their fixed length window before they had to switch over for toy story and meet some kind of deadline coinciding with movie. and maybe due to not wanting to order more parts for a closing window on POTC they actually ran of parts even sooner than expected and now are in this hole in their production schedule

this seems as reasonable as other speculation? or did i miss something about toy story vs everyone seeming to focus on wonka as #5

drfrightner has entered the thread

Dude. You need to wander on over to CampbellSoupSide cause everything over there is condensed.

Jesus.. at least I know who to block this week. Learn to sing or something if you need this much attention

Pinball companies don’t have to reveal at pinball shows because they know we are already paying attention. By launching at non-pinball specific trade shows they can attempt to target a base that isn’t already hooked. I came to Texas to play games I won’t be able to play in my small market, not to see games get revealed. If that happens, cool, but that’s a bonus.

Kaneda's brother?

Did Stern show a new title at TPF?

I agree with this; they are selling to people who already know what’s going on

The dude’s opinions and posts are like mixtapes: nobody wants to listen to them.

Nope, he was on Kaneda's a little while back and embarrassed himself there as well, Chris disagreed with most things he uttered.

JJP can't sell pinball machines with movie assets from Toy Story 4 before the movie actually comes out. There is even likely a timing contract/license clause that it can't be revealed for XX number of days until after the movie is released. The production for JJP #5 is currently being changed over on the JJP main line - per Jack in the seminar. Usually it is a month or so for the changeover, so it's "likely" JJP#5 will be revealed before May. Toy Story 4 will be in theaters in late June. Since Jack said that 2 machines will be revealed this year, they aren't going to let that main line sit idle until July. There have been some leaks (maybe intentional) to people from JJP employees that Wonka is next. This has been talked about in a few threads. Toy Story is not the next JJP pin.

Hey Chris, I know you are reading this so a pro tip for you: screen your guests a little better. Make sure they are smart, funny, have a point of view, or something. Anything.

It worked.

I can't be bothered to downvote anymore.

tell-me-again-why-you-like-the-sound-of-your-own-voice-because-noone-cares (resized).jpg

I sure hope the toy story pin isnt based off the new movie and only the new movie.
If it’s based off the original 3 there is no reason to wait.

I haven't been able to make it to Texas, first because I didn't have the money, and now because I have kids that would make it really difficult to go, but I can answer why I would want to go...

To hang out with the people at the show and play pinball.

Full stop. If there is something new, that's a bonus. If there isn't, if that is all that I'm going for, chances are I'll be disappointed.

The MGC up in Milwaukee that I run has never had a full game reveal in it. That doesn't mean that I am going to go shut down the show and say hey, no one should be excited to come to this! We have enough other stuff that I hope that it's entertaining to come to, and if it isn't, then that's fine, go to a different show instead and we'll entertain the people that came as best as possible. If someday we get a game announcement or release, then cool! I'll be happy to promote that and add it to the bunch of other stuff going on, but it is ultimately just one part of the show.

I've been reading all the TPF posts wishing I could have made it this year like I tend to do every year. Hearing that the lack of a game announcement makes the show less exciting is just silly. I'm really excited for TPF, and I'm stuck in Wisconsin.

Many manufacturers release more than one machine a year. Production schedules don't always line up with those shows. Promotional strategies change. Expecting everyone to target the same show and use that for a launching point is a fundamental misunderstanding of how the business works.

Do we know the date of the show he was on?

I agree. Bring on the down votes for me to.

You don’t like it don’t buy it. But leave Jack alone. Your all tough behind the keyboard. He is a personal friend of mine and how he looks or acts has nothing to do with pinball. How about we thank him for supporting the hobby and for coming to Texas. That’s what this hobby is about.

Bring it on Mary’s

If the unsubstantiated rumors are true, the Toy Story pin was started to be designed a few years ago, but was delayed because Disney/Pixar delayed the movie. They pushed the pin back in the schedule as a result. I would think that movie footage assets with the pinball machine in the movie would be very coveted by JJP for the pin. We would all be complaining if it wasn't included … well at least some of Pinside would be.

yikes. the white knights have arrived.

JJP's 'presentation' was objectively terrible for anybody that has attended any sort of industry convention. Not even sure how it can be argued or whitewashed.

Why would we thank a manufacturer for attending a convention where they can drum up more business? Its a cost of doing business and its in their best interest to have a presence there.

If anything JJP should be thanking the fans for wasting 60 minutes they could have used to play more pinball.

4 days ago, "Dream Theme Discussion"

Stern hasn't been launching games at fan shows. They've been launching titles with media and industry events... online media coordinated launches... etc.

Since Zach took over they've been doing more and more industry and media focused launches and not fan stuff. That's why they've been setting up ign exclusives etc.

These are community organized events. Smaller groups try to make their splash here because they have no reputation or limited history with the potential buyers. They have no market media pull... so they have to get their product out in front of people. These big shows are their best opportunities to do so.

yikes. the white knights have arrived.
JJP's 'presentation' was objectively terrible for anybody that has attended any sort of industry convention. Not even sure how it can be argued or whitewashed.
Why would we thank a manufacturer for attending a convention where they can drum up more business? Its a cost of doing business and its in their best interest to have a presence there.
If anything JJP should be thanking the fans for wasting 60 minutes they could have used to play more pinball.

They came and showed a new model game and added something to the lineup.

I understand your opinion but without manufactures support and new games we would have nothing to buy in the way of new machines. But I just dont think its right to drag someone over the fire. You don’t like the game don’t buy it. But there is no need to attack someone’s looks or appearance.

Look, I believe what mayboyz is trying to say is that if you have disgruntled opinions about this reveal and the decisions the COMPANY makes they are your own personal opinions, but no one has the right to criticize an individual on a personal level as has been done the past few days. Jack is a guy who put it all on the line to breath new life into an industry that was barely hanging on with the junk games Stern was putting out. He and his team forced the community as a whole to innovate.

In my eyes if people stood up and became WHITE KNIGHTS more often the world would be a whole lot brighter.

Also, for people who were not there and have only read this thread, you should watch all of the seminars because JJP was the only one that did anything of importance. The others looked through a photo album and/or played a shabby game of jeopardy.

Dude, you need a girlfriend.

If this is what you’ve got going on for your birthday, it’s pretty sad.