The layout is my biggest problem with the Hobbit, but not because lack of shots... The 3 target banks and 4 trolls look to play a big part in the game. You also missed 2 VUKs and the captive ball shot. Just look at a barren game like GOT or KISS Pro and say Hobbit is lacking shots...

Whatever #3 is.... The cabinet will be solid red and piss off a lot of people.

I disagree with this. I know several people on my block that would fork down money like that if they saw something they liked. They have no idea of what a pinball should go for. They are boomers that have their kids through college and finally have a little extra spending money. So now they are decking out their basements and trying to relive their childhoods.

I do think their is a market for newbies in this price range.

Most of the people I've talked to that have played it and reviews I've read are overwhelmingly positive. Sure there will always be detractors and people that don't like it for one reason or another.

I backed out myself after last Expo.

However, until you get to play it in depth its WAY too early to determine whether or not it will be really good or great. I wouldn't bet against Keith, Ted and David making this pin awesome.

All i ever heard about Woz for 4 years until it came out was how crappy the layout was, slow and clunky, yet it turned out to be a great and fun pin. Granted, some think its "crappy, slow and clunky". Most don't as the sales, comments and ratings prove out.

People were calling TWD the Walking Dud. Terrible layout, ball getting caught in pops, blah, blah, blah. With Lyman, its turned into one of the best pins ever. Imho, it is my best pin and its not even close.

JJP crew will take the layout they have and make it great to play. Let's see how it works out

Again, put up your money and become a distributor. Let's see how many machines you are going to inventory.

Here's a little fun fact for you. Had i not worked for a couple months beforehand to insure that there would be a machine at MGC, you would have had nothing to complain about. Without the distributors dragging machines from show to show, there would be nothing for you to see. Did you see Jack at MGC? No, you didn't. He wasn't there. If i had not driven to chicago, loaded the machine up, driven back up to MGC, unloaded, set it up, broke it down again sunday, returned it to chicago sunday night, there would not have been a Hobbit there for you to complain over.

How about a "Thank You for bring a machine(s) for everyone to play," or maybe a "thank you for bring a pallet of bottled water to give away for free," or maybe "Thank you for standing in your booth the entire weekend in order to explain to people the ins and outs of the machine." If all you want to do is complain that it wasn't set to your satisfaction, then take over the midwest distribution and I will come see you at the shows. How many machines did you bring for people to play? None, or you would not have been looking for a wristband.

I don't generally get vocal on these forums, but when you come on and attack me for bringing a game to play it really upsets me. You have NO idea how much work it is to be a vendor at a show. if you did, then you would not be criticizing what I did.

Pwnd

Kinpin drops the mic on lordloss' ass!!!!!!

I just want to clear this up. I have no issues with lordless personally. Frankly I don't think I would even know who they are if I saw them in person. The issue I have is being attacked on a public forum for doing above and beyond what is expected as a distributor.

I realize that my rebuttal could be seen as a "personal attack" on lordless and for that I would encourage anyone to report it to a moderator (there are rules here for a reason). I have looked and I can not report myself, nor am I willing to change my post. I have knowingly violated the pinside code of conduct and am ready for the consequences of my post. Warning, thread eject, suspension or removal from pinside are all under the punishments for this type of violation.

My fate is in your hands moderators.

Boom!

I didn't go to the show but I thank you for taking a game anyway. Distributors are definitely pulling their weight with regard to getting games out there for people to play.

Shout out to Pinball Star & Cointaker for taking games to the last York show for everyone to play!

C'mon Christopher, tell him. "no water for you"

It is vern uncommon for CHristopher to post what he did here. You really hit a nerve on him with the comments, and then continued with even more shitty comments. Lordloss, I think that you need to come on here and apologize to him.

soup.gif

And how stupid is it to "spike the ball" on TH before game #1 even rolls out the door!

btw- I agree with everything else you said.... and frankly, I know you weren't necessarily spiking the ball in your post either, but we're all guilty of speculation on pinside!

Hell, pull out speculation and 7,000 GoT posts, and about as many TH posts would *pooff* disappear!

JJP deserves to "spike the ball" on WoZ. No question. The jury's still out on TH and financial stability. Safe to say, signs are certainly improving on both fronts, though.

Just like a JJP fan to feel the need to bash Stern to build up JJP

Great post.

Are you Stern's mom? Who gives a rat's ass?

I'm not really much of a JJP fan if I'm saying I don't like layout of The Hobbit. And I'm not a fan of Stern delivering barebones games either. I'm a fan of fun, full featured pinball myself.

The Hobbit is my first home pinball machine - and I bet WOZ was the first for many as well. So not sure I buy that argument.

And it isn't just JJP I was considering - I was thinking about getting a TRON LE - but didn't want to spend that much so I got the cheaper option (The Hobbit). Also, considered getting a nice Monster Bash (but again...a bit too much for me right now). My budget was 10,000 dollars for a pinball machine.

Bummer..... Thought there was going to be more news re: JJP #3, but its just a whole page of snarks....... I missed the removed post with any real info, but I know that Mr. Lawlor, years ago, stated in an interview what he would put in a machine given adequate freedom of design and budget: More 3D effect, interactive software, current technology. My hope is that it actually does NOT require player to integrate a mobile device of some kind. That will be very short sighted, I feel, given how quickly technologies change and manufacturing companies come and go. Look at the original pin2000 set ups. Who here still has a laptop running windows 98? Better if it can stand on its own over time, I am hoping. I don't know enough to know if opensource code is the future for pinball or not. I DO know that the cute little QRM boxes at the end of my WOZ game (is that what you call them?) will look quaint one day if I never update the software from here out.

I will bet there is a 3D element, however....

Also, If they're gonna plug oculus rift glasses into it....please don't make me puke!

Secretly hope theme is Asteroids v dinosaurs.

Well fuck me, might as well have a sign up saying no complaints in your personal space. Take any complaint with a grain of salt and don't expect people to kiss your ass for bringing a machine. The whole reason you brought it was to make commission on sales, right? 2000 people played the game, 5 % had a probem with it and that leaves 100 people leaving the machine with a negative reaction. One of those 100 people actually mentions it and everyone loses their mind. If it makes you feel better, I'll say the hobbit sucked and it had nothing to do with how you had it set up. One thing i've learned about MGC is that its perfect and any deviation of opinion from that idea of perfection makes you an asshole and you should not bring it up.

Still not seeing how the after party pass is part of this, but if you guys want to keep your old boys club the way it is and not let people from out of state easily be part of it, i'll cancel my car reservation and not bring a pin. It would have been $500, but I guess i'll put that towards something else.

That isn't true. My brother bought a 8K game off of Kingpin at that very show and he was new to pinball at the time. And he and his family are very happy. There are many people out there that went to college and are making some serious salaries. They know they live only once, and they can't take it with them.

Kingpin brings so much inventory to the MGC show - I'm amazed he does. He is a huge asset to the MGC show.

Are you JJP's mom?

Nothing barebones about GOT Premium/LE. Or any of their Premiums/LEs.

pretty sure that has absolutely nothing to do with MGC and is a pre-existing condition

I suggest pulling your head out of your ass, realizing that Chris does a TON for the local community, supports all the lcoal shows, and goes well above and beyond what most do.

If you took 2 minutes to actually talk with the guy then you should have realized he does all the hard work because he wants to support pinball and the community. ANY and Every sale he possibly makes is secondary to why Chris does what he does!

Funny part is that I am pretty sure that while Chris did all the work of bringing all sorts of games to MGC, the gurilla distrubtor sales were way higher than his.

Despite what Lordloss is claiming, MGC is the exact opposite. Probably the most welcoming, hard working, and fun group of people at a show that I have personally seen. Lordloss seems to think everyone has an angle they are working when in reality he is the one that was trying to game the system last year.

After you get done pouting, just relax and come hang out next year. It is a good group of people that will overlook any assholish online behaviour (trust me, I know) and still happily offer you a shot and a beer while taking your dollars on pinball games till the wee hours of the night.

I am fairly new to the hobby and The Hobbit also will be my first machine.

I went to MGC with intent to try out as many games as possible to help me decide what I would want to purchase as my first machine. At the time, I had seen videos of The Hobbit but it was not on my shortlist. NIB games were not even being considered. Then I saw Kingpin's booth and got that "ooh, shiny" feeling. I played the game and was very impressed. My wife liked the game as well and we ended up placing a pre-order at the show. If Kingpin had not brought that machine to MGC, then I probably would not be buying one.

Thanks again for bringing these games to shows and also for the water.

Yo, buddy, you do realize that us JJP fanboys are helping keep Stern in business as well, right? Personally I'm glad I'm a JJP fanboy because that means I can still buy new Stern games as well.

And it wasn't really a bash. He was stating that Got is pretty sparse. GoT does kind of lack... but I bought one anyway because when I played it, I had fun. It was an enjoyable pinball experience. Pointing out facts isn't really bashing.

I did not promise you a wrist band, I told you a few people that I knew (kingpin-vidgameseller-pincades) that bring multiple games and that YOU should contact them. Get your shit straight and quit whining. Bring a fucking game if you want in the after party. Douchebag!

take it to the basement, mofos!

Hope that dialed in theme is true. sounds halfway decent

but aren't you there to generate business?

The jury is always out with anything pinball related

I'm def not spiking the ball on TH. I got out and have no regrets, in fact, I don't know how I could have made it this past year after what I went through with Woz and all of those delays!

JJP still has a ways to go to get their shit together but it looks like they are making progress at least. Based on what I've seen with TH I'm back to considering it anyhow.

Hopefully #3 is a Stern like announcement like they say it's going to be.

Yeah to Chris at Kingpin ! Glad to finally see a fellow distributor standing up for all of us.

My best story was at ReplayFX the vendor area closed at 8:00pm and every damn night I kept my booth open til midnight from 10 am (14 hours per day for 3 days) so everyone can keep playing the Hobbit. Not one other vendor was open that late. At 12:00 one night I cut the line and after an physically and mentally exhausting day as I'm shutting games down and I figure, Damn I haven't even played one game myself - I'm going to treat myself before I go collapse in bed and play ONE game... I play my game, turn around and OMG there's a line again of a few folks... And I nicely said, 'Sorry guys we're shutting down, I was just getting a test game in'. Everyone was really cool about it said, 'Ok we'll catch you tomorrow'. Except one douchebag who says 'So you close the booth but YOU still get to play ?'. Dumbfounded I finally lost my shit and told him to get the hell out of my booth and don't bother coming back tomorrow.

For each show we have to take a week or more off our regular job prior to prep, pack and also again after, we typically rent a 28 foot truck for about $ 1,500 to bring as much stuff as we can to a show, gas, hotel, food, vendor space, etc... and for the most part everyone is great and appreciative. But at many shows we LOSE money. Tomorrow I'm having surgery on a finger I injured at the York show breaking down a game - so that sucks too, my body and wallet take a beating. So ya we do a lot and the thank yous are few and far between. But I do also usually have a few friends at each show stay late and help me break down, and at York I even had a father and son I didn't even know stay and hour late and help me load up.

As Chris mentioned, you guys think it's easy to put all the money out we have to for inventory, YOU do it. I just put out nearly $ 200,000 on WOZ inventory only to get slapped in the face with a new 'special edition' released to only one distributor essentially slashing the rest of our throats. Maybe one time soon this complaining about distributors won't exist because there will be none of us stupid enough to do what we do for so little return and support.

The post above Chris was bent out of shape about was WAY out of line. Good for you Chris ! Keep up the good work, brother...

Joe Newhart
PinballSTAR Amusements
[email protected]
570-357-0042

My favorite thing about centerflank's posts is how subtle they are.

Yeah...just imagine how he talks to you when he DOESN'T like you...

You do mean the collapse of Pinside right?

Ohhhhh wow!

Yeah I'd say that's total BS.

Here's one guy giving you guys a for all you do

Let's get this thread back on topic. We still know basically nothing about JJP #3, let's discuss.

Hopefully jjp3 will feature a kick lord loss in the vagina mode.

Back on topic...

Pat Lawlor was obviously EXCITED about working with JJP during his seminar stint at Expo - which was great to see given Pat's sometimes past doom and gloom outlook on the industry... You could see he was a kid ready to burst at the seams about what is coming... Good stuff...

I posted a video snippet of Pat talking on our PinballSTAR Facebook page during Expo and I would assume that PinballNews has the whole JJP Fireside Chat... Check it out.

Whoa whoa... sounds like a speculative claim without fact to me man!

You do shows to get your name out and make sales. If the shows are so hard, Don't do them.
You put out 200$k on woz to make money. You chose to be a distributor as a way to make money.
What am I missing?

It's quotes like this why we need to get the thumbs down back!!

His dollar sign placement alone is worthy of a downvote.

Shows are hard work. Do you bring games to MGC or Expo/Explo?

Rock Shock Jayhawk headed to ICT soon -- that was funny

Not hating, but TH was not fun to play. That's not to say it will be bad, but overall to me, it has a poor layout.

And I can say the same for Iron Man.
No worries. Everyone likes different games for different reasons.

IM is a poor layout?

All I'm saying, is TH has fishtail-like ramps (kind of lame, if you have 3 years to develop the game and you pick fishtails ramps with a captive ball between), not saying it's horrible, but to me just kind of meh.

The upper flipper is just flat out dumb, and could not be less dumb due to the layout. Is there is a shot dedicated to the upper flipper? Needs a ramp or a subway (like TZ camera shot in the worst way).

Lots of drop targets ( ) ok that's it's biggest PF feature along with the trolls (which I agree are cool).

But overall, on the cool/not cool meter, to me TH is kind of in the middle.

I'm sure code will make it nice (like WSP which I admit I don't understand the rules, but people say the rules are what makes that a great pin).

Again, I don't want to be a hater, but Ice said that 'most' people said it was great, but to me it's not really that great. I've played it, was fun because it was new and different and had nice art and cool LCD, but the overall gameplay was quite average (not good or bad).

Look at the videos and I want to just go to sleep. For sure maybe the pitch is too low and the rules are not complete and people are more or less just keeping the ball in play, but to me that's what I'd call the jury is still out rather than calling it a great pin. It might be great, but to me it's way to early to say.

I don't disagree with that. And no, I don't bring games. It's too much work. But I'm not in the business. It totally different. I pay an entry fee for entertainment. Business go to show off new products, sell inventory and try to acquire new customers. Their expenses are a business expense and their time and work are for company gain.

I cant speak for PinballStar as Ive never met but Kingpin has brought at least ~50 games~ the past 2 years to MGC for people to play and have fun. Id rather help them than give them any grief for it, just saying.....