(Topic ID: 292168)

Haggis Pinball - 2nd game = Fathom + Fathom 2.0 confirmed

By FalconPunch

9 months ago


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#1751 57 days ago

Perhaps Haggis believe that this is the prize we have paid for and we can unwrap it ourselves?

They are all sold, so it's not as if they need to drive sales.

I'm all good if that is the case, but I do agree in part and if that is the case then they should say that in the next update.

#1752 57 days ago
Quoted from Cheeks:

They have shown a prototype, so that talk just isn't accurate.
That said, we're almost 6 months past when they were supposed to start building Fathom, and there has not been a single hint of what the new rules are. To me, there's no excuse for that. Face it, the main (only) reason to buy Mermaid was the new rules. Supply chain doesn't impact their ability to code. Not showing us anything about what we bought this far into things is not cool at all.

I believe Marty has stated a few times on multiple podcasts that he doesn't want to show the code off but have buyers experience it for the first time when they get it in their homes.

#1753 57 days ago
Quoted from Pmaino:

I believe Marty has stated a few times on multiple podcasts that he doesn't want to show the code off but have buyers experience it for the first time when they get it in their homes.

Correct. He has said it is finished now though.

#1754 57 days ago
Quoted from Pmaino:

I believe Marty has stated a few times on multiple podcasts that he doesn't want to show the code off but have buyers experience it for the first time when they get it in their homes.

A kind of fruitless concept though as not everyone gets their games at the same time and once the first go out the reveal is done. All that does is shorten the time people have to mull things over before experiencing it.

#1755 57 days ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

A kind of fruitless concept though as not everyone gets their games at the same time and once the first go out the reveal is done. All that does is shorten the time people have to mull things over before experiencing it.

Well i promise i won't be the one to spoil it for you, princess.

#1756 57 days ago

History has shown that pinball manufacturing is not easy.Haggis have not only started up at probably the worst time but in the worst state for Covid lockdown time.There is no doubt that this would slow any business down.Try ordering a new car today(as I have done recently)12 months if you are lucky waiting time.The thing that I do not want Haggis to do is to cut costs on these machines because that would be retrograde A bit like the Heighway Alien pinball versus the remake.Lost count of how many comments have been made about the cheap quality of the remake.Haggis needs to push quality over costs IMO as there will be plenty of buyers lining up to purchase a great product.

#1757 57 days ago
Quoted from Pmaino:

I believe Marty has stated a few times on multiple podcasts that he doesn't want to show the code off but have buyers experience it for the first time when they get it in their homes.

And Haggis was going to have a most Merman’s delivered by Xmas. Now it looks like none will be built by then. So the original plans have changed. I wish Haggis would adjust accordingly and stream before yearend, so that we can see what a final game looks and plays like. IMO the Merman’s will start shipping in Spring. It might take until the end of the 2022 to build all games.

#1758 57 days ago
Quoted from Pmaino:

I believe Marty has stated a few times on multiple podcasts that he doesn't want to show the code off but have buyers experience it for the first time when they get it in their homes.

This is totally pointless unless they are going to ship every game at the same time. The first person to get theirs I’m sure is going to share with the rest of us. They will be the only ones to experience it this way. The rest will have spoilers everywhere.

#1759 57 days ago
Quoted from Boof-Ed:

This is totally pointless unless they are going to ship every game at the same time. The first person to get theirs I’m sure is going to share with the rest of us. They will be the only ones to experience it this way. The rest will have spoilers everywhere.

I’m not saying I agree with this, I’m just simply stating the facts.

#1760 57 days ago
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:

And Haggis was going to have a most Merman’s delivered by Xmas. Now it looks like none will be built by then. So the original plans have changed. I wish Haggis would adjust accordingly and stream before yearend, so that we can see what a final game looks and plays like. IMO the Merman’s will start shipping in Spring. It might take until the end of the 2022 to build all games.

I had a feeling when I order my GZ LE that despite the super slow shipping from Stern to down here, I'd end up seeing it before I saw my Mermaid. My money is definitely on seeing GZ first here in Jan.

#1761 57 days ago
Quoted from Pmaino:

I’m not saying I agree with this, I’m just simply stating the facts.

I know. I’m saying that the facts are silly. It makes zero sense. You can’t have everyone experience what the new offerings are unless they all get delivered on the same day. Spoilers will be all over YouTube and face book the first day people have them.

#1762 57 days ago

I'm not allowed to comment apparently as i'm not nice? So you guys figure it out. Lucky i didn't call anyone a rude fucking name i'd be shot.

I've upset soemone's best mate with too many buttons.

11
#1763 56 days ago
Quoted from punkin:

I'm not allowed to comment apparently as i'm not nice? So you guys figure it out. Lucky i didn't call anyone a rude fucking name i'd be shot.
I've upset soemone's best mate with too many buttons.

The Australian tendency to speak plainly and directly to each other regardless of one's status can often be a challenge for other cultures to....fathom.
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#1764 56 days ago

Parrently.

#1765 56 days ago

You drink beer by the Skid! You get a pass from me for anything you say.

#1766 56 days ago

Dunno about that, i need pulling up at times.

#1767 56 days ago
Quoted from punkin:

Dunno about that, i need pulling up at times.

The world is full Xf SXFT CXCKS , buy a vowel?
I cant type anything anymore because of soy boys.

1 week later
#1768 45 days ago

Ok. Starting to become impatient.

Haggis, we need some kind of substantial update about the production schedule for fathom.

As a mermaid edition “preorderer”, I’d sure appreciate communication. It doesn’t have to occur on Pinside. Crickets aren’t acceptable, given how far behind schedule you are.

Pull it together. Let us know what is going on. Showing me how you make one small part for the playfield isn’t going to cut it at this point. COVID isn’t a viable excuse for lack of an update. Email us. Do something.

I am not the only one who is feeling neglected.

#1769 45 days ago

Patience is mother of all virtues, it is just pinball.

#1770 45 days ago
Quoted from etien:

Patience is mother of all virtues, it is just pinball.

You will need plenty of patience in 2022. Chances are you’ve got a pinball machine on order and it could be with any manufacturer. Vote in this topic https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/you-want-it-when-with-poll

It is bad enough when you are promised delivery in six to nine months but when those dates start getting scratched because of parts shortages and pushed out another six months or so, it is maddening. That is really the story of Stern right now. But the delays at Haggis are also frustrating. There are some basic questions we don’t know the answers. Is there a final production ready model? Do they have all the parts needed to build games? What are the remaining problems? What is the status of manufacturing? When will Fathom production start?

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#1771 45 days ago

Yes I know, a close relative is a Maersk executive ( world biggest shipowner, 20% of the world supertankers ) and the current mess is just unbelievable. This is why I am not blaming an Australian pinball startup firm for something even the biggest car/phone/computer manufacturers cannot manage at the moment.

#1772 44 days ago
Quoted from etien:

Yes I know, a close relative is a Maersk executive ( world biggest shipowner, 20% of the world supertankers ) and the current mess is just unbelievable. This is why I am not blaming an Australian pinball startup firm for something even the biggest car/phone/computer manufacturers cannot manage at the moment.

The last time questions and frustrations like these kicked up on Pinside, Haggis responded by posting more progress pics on the socials, mainly for Celts.
I think all we really have seen for Fathom is a beautiful cabinet and a rollover switch. I’m not sure if the one used for Mermaid edition promotions was a Haggis build or a modified original. My guess is the latter.
I think these guys are just in their bubble trying to get everything sorted out.
I put down a $4k deposit through GAP but most people probably paid a much smaller deposit ($1k thereabouts) to Haggis directly.
Personally I don’t expect to see this game until mid next year at earliest given what we’ve seen of it so far.
Everybody will be able to tell when production is getting close when they announce the next game and start taking deposits on that one.
That’s my feeling.

#1773 44 days ago
Quoted from etien:

Yes I know, a close relative is a Maersk executive ( world biggest shipowner, 20% of the world supertankers ) and the current mess is just unbelievable. This is why I am not blaming an Australian pinball startup firm for something even the biggest car/phone/computer manufacturers cannot manage at the moment.

Well Haggis’ lack of communication leaves us all to wildly speculate. The supertankers excuse does not apply to Haggis, that I know of. If Haggis were sourcing parts out of country, these items would be air freighted, not shipped. If Haggis is making their own parts, then the materials and supplies needed would be in country and considered local. That material is chiefly trucked or trained and once again is not directly impacted by cargo shipping. There are legitimate parts shortages at play and extra effort is required to manage the logistics.

As to why we aren’t seeing more parts and supplies, my guess is because they haven’t been ordered. The reason for not making parts nor starting production is probably lack of money. They are working off a shoestring budget where most collected funds have been spent. No suppliers will extend a new company credit. So unless something else happens to improve their fortune, there will be no Fathom games built.

When Haggis made a push to collect Fathom downpayments. We expected that money would go towards buying parts and getting ready to build Fathoms. Instead and seemingly out of left field, Haggis starts building and delivering Celts. That’s right, you read it correctly. Fathom money was collected and Celts are suddenly being produced. So no money to buy parts for Fathom imo. So how will Haggis get their parts and supplies? Raising additional money by gofundme will eventually provide the requisite capital. Once that is received, I'll bet we start seeing Fathoms in production. And the collary to that proof is that until you see them get more funding you won’t have your Fathom’s Revisited.

#1774 44 days ago
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:

Well Haggis’ lack of communication leaves us all to wildly speculate. The supertankers excuse does not apply to Haggis, that I know of. If Haggis were sourcing parts out of country, these items would be air freighted, not shipped. If Haggis is making their own parts, then the materials and supplies needed would be in country and considered local. That material is chiefly trucked or trained and once again is not directly impacted by cargo shipping. There are legitimate parts shortages at play and extra effort is required to manage the logistics.
As to why we aren’t seeing more parts and supplies, my guess is because they haven’t been ordered. The reason for not making parts nor starting production is probably lack of money. They are working off a shoestring budget where most collected funds have been spent. No suppliers will extend a new company credit. So unless something else happens to improve their fortune, there will be no Fathom games built.
When Haggis made a push to collect Fathom downpayments. We expected that money would go towards buying parts and getting ready to build Fathoms. Instead and seemingly out of left field, Haggis starts building and delivering Celts. That’s right, you read it correctly. Fathom money was collected and Celts are suddenly being produced. So no money to buy parts for Fathom imo. So how will Haggis get their parts and supplies? Raising additional money by gofundme will eventually provide the requisite capital. Once that is received, I'll bet we start seeing Fathoms in production. And the collary to that proof is that until you see them get more funding you won’t have your Fathom’s Revisited.

I mean without seeing their books everything is just speculative. There’s no way they could’ve foresaw all these logistical problems when they originally crunched the numbers and took (relatively small) deposits on Fathoms. They have shown that they know how to make a high quality machine by all accounts and that keeps me hopeful.

#1775 44 days ago

Do I believe that Haggis will develop/produce/deliver Fathom? Likely. Will anyone see one in their home in 2022? No f'ing way.
Wasn't it mentioned somewhere on PinSide to never ever, not EVER pre-pay for a pin? Yea, I thought so.....

#1776 44 days ago
Quoted from CubeSnake:

Do I believe that Haggis will develop/produce/deliver Fathom? Likely. Will anyone see one in their home in 2022? No f'ing way.
Wasn't it mentioned somewhere on PinSide to never ever, not EVER pre-pay for a pin? Yea, I thought so.....

No one pre-paid for a Fathom, we just made small deposits.

I think we’ll see Fathoms in 2022. Honestly, that was when I expected to see them from the start - I knew June was too aggressive.

#1777 44 days ago

I think it was ok to continue to run Celts, & delay Fathom builds until the new year. Covid has slowed down most business around the world. The extra time gives them enough room to hopefully have all parts on hand for the run. If they came out with more pictures of parts on hand, & better updates things would be better!

#1778 44 days ago

You people. I've had a deposit in on Fathom Mermaid since the announcement. After playing a Celts a month ago i paid in full for one of those too. It will be ready at the end of this month/start of next month.

I would not have sent more money if i hadn't known for a certainty they built a great product and they will ship as soon as they are built

You'd never say something like this to their face.

FuckingInternetExpertsPunkin

#1779 44 days ago
Quoted from greatwichjohn:

I think it was ok to continue to run Celts, & delay Fathom builds until the new year. Covid has slowed down most business around the world. The extra time gives them enough room to hopefully have all parts on hand for the run. If they came out with more pictures of parts on hand, & better updates things would be better!

No Haggis shouldn’t have collected downpayments under the premise that games were going to be built immediately. Since the money was collected, all parts should have been ordered immediately. It’s fine to delay production for whatever reason but don’t stop procurement. Dumb. Dumb. Dumb. Do we see pics of hundreds of thousands of parts? As I’ve stated I believe the fathom money was sucked out of the account so fast that when it was time to push the order button for parts, there was insufficient funds. This is totally my theory, based on gut feel. But let’s get real aren’t I just saying what many of you battle-hardened Pinsiders are beginning to suspect? Something doesn’t feel right. Hmmmm

#1780 44 days ago

Man, a lot of negativity around here all of the sudden. I'm still feeling excited and optimistic. Since Celts games are actually going out the door, that's a good sign.

If nothing at all was happening, then things would be different. But games are being produced, so that's good.

I would love an updated timeline though. For planning purposes, if for no other reason. When Fathom was announced, I had a rough idea of a build date, based on the info that Haggis provided. That date has since past, of course. So it would be nice to get an updated timeline for production.

#1781 43 days ago

I wouldn't think it'd be too difficult for Haggis to post a brief update, small as it may be, say once a week. Otherwise, people on here will do what they do best.

#1782 43 days ago
Quoted from CubeSnake:

I wouldn't think it'd be too difficult for Haggis to post a brief update, small as it may be, say once a week. Otherwise, people on here will do what they do best.

That’s a great image of Nixon with the bodies stacked. Used to be my avatar on the socials way back when. Cuban propaganda posters are incredible.

#1783 43 days ago

CELTS just won best Modern Pinball in Pincinatti , congrats and well done.
I speak, text with Damian pretty much weekly and have no reservations about Fathom being built.
Yes the time frame they intended has blown out, but considering the other issues in the world right now, well you know.
In the overall scope of things, Fathom date is low on mine and others priority.
Does Haggis post on Pinside? i don't know, but if I was building I wouldn't post as i would spend more times appeasing questions and putting out spot fires instead of the task at hand.
I recently cancelled my FxxxBOOK and that was pretty good for answers. Has anyone tried this.
I refuse to ask Damo when the Fathoms will be ready as I personally am not pushing, I do know for a fact that quite a few components and cabinets have been built ready to go.
I hope this gives some comfort to those who want to know.
I will mention that the natives are getting restless again and see if he can respond.

Have an AWESOME day, gonna go and smash some clans!

#1784 43 days ago

I agree with all that mate. It'll be ready when it's ready, and i expect that will be fairly soon in the new year. In the meantime i'll play my Celts as soon as it get's here.

Not like we are waiting on a Big Lebowski for 6 or 8 years.

#1785 43 days ago
Quoted from punkin:

I agree with all that mate. It'll be ready when it's ready, and i expect that will be fairly soon in the new year. In the meantime i'll play my Celts as soon as it get's here.
Not like we are waiting on a Big Lebowski for 6 or 8 years.

or Thunderturds that took literally 5 years, 4 months, 3 weeks, 2 days and 1 hour plus I think roughly a few more weeks.

Jokes aside Damian and crew are not like Deeproot, Heighway etc they are sharing the journey, building games & parts, and delivering machines - yes not Fathoms but shouldn't be long

#1786 43 days ago

It’s not hard. Just tell us what is going on. Not too much to ask, really. Some might call it common courtesy.

#1787 43 days ago
Quoted from bane:

It’s not hard. Just tell us what is going on. Not too much to ask, really. Some might call it common courtesy.

Reckon their last post covered it all as to what is going on? Seriously look outside your window and you will notice things have changed, and not for the better.And for those that are wanting can have deposits refunded or do what seems to be the go around Pinside is to buy and pitch a higher price NIB, etc.What happened to the genuine players I wonder sometimes??????????????????????????????????????

#1788 43 days ago
Quoted from Micky:

An update for you guys that aren't on Facebook.
[quoted image][quoted image]

This update? It was 53 days ago.

Any reason Haggis can’t send us an email explaining what is going on? Stop with the COVID excuses. We deserve to know. We are funding the company.

I was very enthusiastic about the Fathom remake. Now, less so.

If anyone want to buy my preorder spot, I am willing to listen. This whole thing is staring to remind me of Heighway Pinball. Celts = Full Throttle?

#1789 43 days ago

First world problems

#1790 43 days ago

I see Kaneda's posted a bit of a wind up about Fathom production on his FB. Easy to play armchair critic from other side of the planet lol.

12
#1791 43 days ago
Quoted from bane:

This update? It was 53 days ago.
Any reason Haggis can’t send us an email explaining what is going on? Stop with the COVID excuses. We deserve to know. We are funding the company.
I was very enthusiastic about the Fathom remake. Now, less so.
If anyone want to buy my preorder spot, I am willing to listen. This whole thing is staring to remind me of Heighway Pinball. Celts = Full Throttle?

Honestly if you want to sell your spot then do it and move on. The negativity that is now being shown by a few loud members, is tiresome. I know quite a few people have been burned on preorders in the past, and I am one of them, but I remain optimistic about what is going on at Haggis. I spoke to Damian earlier today and an update will be posted in the next week or so.

#1792 43 days ago
Quoted from Our_Man_in_Oz:

I see Kaneda's posted a bit of a wind up about Fathom production on his FB. Easy to play armchair critic from other side of the planet lol.

Kaneda will always kaneed. (edited)

#1793 43 days ago

With all due respect..you have understated your amount of speculation and i suspect there's more holes in your speculation theories than what the Titanic succumbed too. Gofundme????? what rabbit hole did you pull that from??

#1794 43 days ago
Quoted from bane:

We are funding the company

What complete Bollox!! Do you really believe that your pre-order deposit helped pay for the setup of all the machinery etc that has been highlighted in quite a few of Damian's vids?? MOST of which was accumulated before Fathom was even announced??
Lets stop the crazy speculation and achieve a sensible level of good old fashioned bloody common sense

#1795 43 days ago
Quoted from bane:

This update? It was 53 days ago.
Any reason Haggis can’t send us an email explaining what is going on? Stop with the COVID excuses. We deserve to know. We are funding the company.
I was very enthusiastic about the Fathom remake. Now, less so.
If anyone want to buy my preorder spot, I am willing to listen. This whole thing is staring to remind me of Heighway Pinball. Celts = Full Throttle?

The optimism makes me shake my head, it ignores the reality of life (and history) vs. what we want which isn't always the same. As someone who builds pins from scratch I want Haggis to succeed for no other reason than the trickle down of parts which might become available.

Exchange the word "pinball" for "car" or "dresser" or "widget" and would you be happy with a manufacturer taking deposits for "x" item and then turning around selling "y" item? Money is fungible, just because it is collected for "x" doesn't always mean it will stay earmarked for "x"

It's a bad look on it's face, shouting at people for pointing this out doesn't change the reality of the situation.

I wish Haggis all the best; I have long thought the market for remakes in various forms was under-served. Older pin buyers tend to have more discretionary income to spend and like "toys from youth" in my opinion. Look how much restored pins sell for on the more desirable classic titles.

Throw in some bells and whistles, alternate code, better sound and it should be a license to print money.

P.S. As someone that is in charge of ordering products at work, supply chain disruptions are a real issue. Every week I have to scramble to obtain what is needed to keep our medical facility operating going so far to order product from Amazon! because my first, second and third tier suppliers were either out or on intergalactic backorder. Things have gotten so dire, our facility is being shopped on the market because the long term prognosis for operations in the hostile state of Connecticut is very dim.

I maybe retiring from the industry in next few months due to this.

#1796 43 days ago

Damien stated somewhere early on that all deposit money for Fathom went into a trust account so if that’s the case it hasn’t been used to fund factory setup.

But in a situation where deposits are non refundable I’m not sure why you would bother locking those funds away - it’s not like they need to be accessible for refund calls.

#1797 42 days ago

I just got my celts. Damian was going to ship for free with my fathom when I ordered but I opted to get it via air freight rather than wait. My order number was 351 which is significantly different from my machine number 32/200 highlands edition. Hopefully we all get our fathoms. Not sure how many celts have been made. The game is fun and like an old em with modern tech. The technology with the lcd in the Playfield, built in pinstadium type lcds and hybrid acrylic Playfield are cool. As far as trusts and Australian bailout money that’s all speculation unless haggis is publicly open about their business . If I lose my deposit caveat emptor.

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#1798 42 days ago
Quoted from Rjbdmdmd:

I just got my celts. Damian was going to ship for free with my fathom when I ordered but I opted to get it via air freight rather than wait. My order number was 351 which is significantly different from my machine number 32/200 highlands edition. Hopefully we all get our fathoms. Not sure how many celts have been made. The game is fun and like an old em with modern tech. The technology with the lcd in the Playfield, built in pinstadium type lcds and hybrid acrylic Playfield are cool. As far as trusts and Australian bailout money that’s all speculation unless haggis is publicly open about their business . If I lose my deposit caveat emptor.
[quoted image]

So as the numbers are posting does this mean they have another 170 Celts to build and ship prior to Fathom? When was Celts announced again?

-1
#1799 42 days ago
Quoted from Yelobird:

So as the numbers are posting does this mean they have another 170 Celts to build and ship prior to Fathom? When was Celts announced again?

My machine is a highland version and I opted against the name in the game so I could resell if desired. I can only speculate on numbers of regular vs highland editions produced thus far.

The machines is very nice and they have amazing attention to detail on the build. Tons of beautiful small features. I had to reposition the shooter rod. Otherwise it’s been great out of the crate.

Hopefully the hybrid Playfield will be live up to the advertising. Stern and JJP certainly haven’t. I used your iron technique (yelobird) and stacked washers on gnr which is now doing well. My Star Wars LE looks more dimpled than the moon after 1000 plays. I can’t comment on AP or spooky Playfields.

#1800 42 days ago
Quoted from Rjbdmdmd:

My machine is a highland version and I opted against the name in the game so I could resell if desired. I can only speculate on numbers of regular vs highland editions produced thus far.
The machines is very nice and they have amazing attention to detail on the build. Tons of beautiful small features. I had to reposition the shooter rod. Otherwise it’s been great out of the crate.
Hopefully the hybrid Playfield will be live up to the advertising. Stern and JJP certainly haven’t. I used your iron technique (yelobird) and stacked washers on gnr which is now doing well. My Star Wars LE looks more dimpled than the moon after 1000 plays. I can’t comment on AP or spooky Playfields.

Congrats on the repair! And thanks for the reply. There game does look good no question just curious as recently game #30 posted, then #31, so I am assuming they are going in order which would mean 170 plus more games to reach Fathom time.

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