(Topic ID: 138322)

JARED. Please pass this to Mr. Stern please.


By kklank

4 years ago



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  • Latest reply 4 years ago by Whysnow
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There are 141 posts in this topic. You are on page 2 of 3.
#51 4 years ago

So I don't have a dog in this fight (never seen the show GOT and don't have interest in the game) but I can speak from experience with regards to the art and licensing.
I work in the creative department for an apparel brand that does TONs of licensing with all the biggies and we need to get everything approved by the license holder. We were just working on some new Star Wars The Force Awakens stuff and all of it was shot down by Lucas even though we used the approved artwork they sent us. The problem was we took minor creative liberties with it to better suit our product needs. To them it was just enough to reject and send us back to the drawing board - and force us to create something twice as fast with less creative expression.

I guarantee this happened to Stern while working on GOT.
I don't blame them at all for the artwork situation.

#52 4 years ago
Quoted from Trekkie1978:

I'll just have to tape a poster to the LE back glass on mine.

LFP_Participation.jpg

you realize how many baby boomers are leaving the workforce due to retirement? A college degree is also a requirement these days so young people are waiting longer to enter the workforce. The participation rate is not a good indicator of unemployment. While the economy isn't perfect by any means, it's still WAY better than it was 5 years ago.

#53 4 years ago
Quoted from thearcadegeek:

you realize how many baby boomers are leaving the workforce due to retirement? A college degree is also a requirement these days so young people are waiting longer to enter the workforce. The participation rate is not a good indicator of unemployment. While the economy isn't perfect by any means, it's still WAY better than it was 5 years ago.

100% spot on.

#54 4 years ago
Quoted from Ranhorton:

So I don't have a dog in this fight (never seen the show GOT and don't have interest in the game) but I can speak from experience with regards to the art and licensing.
I work in the creative department for an apparel brand that does TONs of licensing with all the biggies and we need to get everything approved by the license holder. We were just working on some new Star Wars The Force Awakens stuff and all of it was shot down by Lucas even though we used the approved artwork they sent us. The problem was we took minor creative liberties with it to better suit our product needs. To them it was just enough to reject and send us back to the drawing board - and force us to create something twice as fast with less creative expression.
I guarantee this happened to Stern while working on GOT.
I don't blame them at all for the artwork situation.

anyone who said, ''yep this is perfect, go ahead'' needs to be fired, especially the PF.

#55 4 years ago

I can only think that this is all part of the plan. Stern will sell out the LEs on theme alone. Pro is chopped back to try and trun those buyers into prem buyers.

Prem art is 'delayed' and will be much improved (also prems wont ship till late Nov so plenty of time to fix).

Net results they are hoping for is more prem orders and a step towards full elimination of the Pro model.

#56 4 years ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

I can only think that this is all part of the plan. Stern will sell out the LEs on theme alone. Pro is chopped back to try and trun those buyers into prem buyers.
Prem art is 'delayed' and will be much improved (also prems wont ship till late Nov so plenty of time to fix).
Net results they are hoping for is more prem orders and a step towards full elimination of the Pro model.

I agree. Think of the margins on LEs and Premiums vs the Pro. Does anyone really think it costs $1600 more to produce a Premium vs a Pro? They sell Pros because they have to - for now.

#57 4 years ago
Quoted from kklank:

... if this was the TV show Mash, it would be like putting the Chaplin, and Corporal Klinger on the back glass. Where's Hawkeye, Radar, and Hot Lips Houlihan?
If this was the TV show Cheers, it would be like putting woody harrelson and Frazier Krane's wife on the front of the backglass. Where's Norm and Sammy?
If this was the TV show, All in the Family it would be like putting Sally Struthers and Meathead on the backglass. Where's Edith the dingbat and Archie?

I agree, but good lord can't we get any examples from even the last 20 years?

#58 4 years ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

I can only think that this is all part of the plan. Stern will sell out the LEs on theme alone. Pro is chopped back to try and trun those buyers into prem buyers.
Prem art is 'delayed' and will be much improved (also prems wont ship till late Nov so plenty of time to fix).
Net results they are hoping for is more prem orders and a step towards full elimination of the Pro model.

You think they will sell all 700 LEs? I'm not so sure. I was on the pre-order list...and declined once I saw the art. I'm pretty sure I'm not in the minority.

Maybe they'll be able to unload them all on the distributors. Eventually there will be alternate art so maybe they will all sell - but I'm guessing it takes 2 years.

It also depends on how it plays, how complete the code is and if it contains audio clips from the show too...

#59 4 years ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

I can only think that this is all part of the plan. Stern will sell out the LEs on theme alone. Pro is chopped back to try and trun those buyers into prem buyers.....

it's exactly it. a lot of peoples went with the pro in the last few games.

by removing everything from the pro (worst we've seen yet) they are forcing collectors to go with the premium at a higher price.
they keep saying the operators/ arcades are the main customers. i think the future of pinball are the collectors.

#60 4 years ago
Quoted from thearcadegeek:

The economy is thriving and unemployment is low.

Hahaha....

Good one...

#61 4 years ago
Quoted from Damonator:

You think they will sell all 700 LEs? I'm not so sure. I was on the pre-order list...and declined once I saw the art. I'm pretty sure I'm not in the minority.
Maybe they'll be able to unload them all on the distributors. Eventually there will be alternate art so maybe they will all sell - but I'm guessing it takes 2 years.
It also depends on how it plays, how complete the code is and if it contains audio clips from the show too...

I believe Distributors are required to buy a certain # of LE's.

#62 4 years ago

Oh remember test locations for thins like this. Not anymore. Sadly the playfields are all done and sitting in racks already. No going back now.

#63 4 years ago
Quoted from Damonator:

You think they will sell all 700 LEs?

to distributors, yes

they have to take the good with the bad

#64 4 years ago
Quoted from Purpledrilmonkey:

I agree, but good lord can't we get any examples from even the last 20 years?

Big Bang Theory

Backglass would include

Bernadette, Stuart and Janine Davis (woman who works in HR at Cal Tech)

image.jpg

#65 4 years ago

Gameplay Idea: Video Mode where the queen is walking nude through the city and each ramp shot hits her with another tomato/cabbage/poop and there would be a callout "Shame!" DING! OMG that would sell the pin for sure.

#66 4 years ago
Quoted from Ranhorton:

So I don't have a dog in this fight (never seen the show GOT and don't have interest in the game) but I can speak from experience with regards to the art and licensing.
I work in the creative department for an apparel brand that does TONs of licensing with all the biggies and we need to get everything approved by the license holder. We were just working on some new Star Wars The Force Awakens stuff and all of it was shot down by Lucas even though we used the approved artwork they sent us. The problem was we took minor creative liberties with it to better suit our product needs. To them it was just enough to reject and send us back to the drawing board - and force us to create something twice as fast with less creative expression.
I guarantee this happened to Stern while working on GOT.
I don't blame them at all for the artwork situation.

I do blame both Stern and HBO for the artwork situation. I would think HBO would want it to be thematically correct to the GOT universe. They spend a lot of money to make the show look like Game of Thrones, so why wouldn't they want any licensee to have the same look and feel as the show? I'm not discounting the game yet (I haven't played it), but the art is garbage.

#67 4 years ago
Quoted from thearcadegeek:

you realize how many baby boomers are leaving the workforce due to retirement? A college degree is also a requirement these days so young people are waiting longer to enter the workforce. The participation rate is not a good indicator of unemployment. While the economy isn't perfect by any means, it's still WAY better than it was 5 years ago.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/jul/7/unemployment-rate-drop-obscures-troubling-decline-/?page=all

"From 1995 to 2013, the number of Americans ages 15 to 24 participating in the labor force fell by more than 11 percentage points, according to research from Ritholtz Wealth Management. Labor force participation among those 25 to 54 years old also has fallen, though to a much lesser degree.

At the same time, more older Americans are staying on the job as they near retirement, though that hasn’t been enough to make up for the number of younger men and women fleeing the workforce."

If these younger people were entering the work force, think about how many more buyers of pinball machines there could be. Would make for a more robust used and new market.

#68 4 years ago
Quoted from cosmokramer:

Hahaha....
Good one...

Directed at both:

What is your "acceptable range" for
"unemployment" and the "economy"? There is no one individual statistic to accurately access the state of either of these. News and politics would obviously have you believe otherwise.

17
#69 4 years ago
Quoted from Ranhorton:

So I don't have a dog in this fight (never seen the show GOT and don't have interest in the game) but I can speak from experience with regards to the art and licensing.
I work in the creative department for an apparel brand that does TONs of licensing with all the biggies and we need to get everything approved by the license holder. We were just working on some new Star Wars The Force Awakens stuff and all of it was shot down by Lucas even though we used the approved artwork they sent us. The problem was we took minor creative liberties with it to better suit our product needs. To them it was just enough to reject and send us back to the drawing board - and force us to create something twice as fast with less creative expression.
I guarantee this happened to Stern while working on GOT.
I don't blame them at all for the artwork situation.

while i'm sure license holders are responsible for a lot of dumb requirements and revisions, NOBODY on HBO's side was begging Stern to use more 1990s photoshop filters. the huge outline with the bevel/emboss is the biggest embarrassment - it makes the house shields look like they've got rubber padding on them. then there is the 0-distance dropshadows everywhere, and bad-looking outer glows. none of that can be blamed on the license holder.

got-th-compare.jpg

there is a serious lack of digital graphic design expertise at work in one of these playfields ...

#70 4 years ago
Quoted from pezpunk:

there is a serious lack of graphic design expertise at work in one of these playfields ...

Keeping in mind the one on the right has been changed multiple times due to complaints and is a year late

#71 4 years ago
Quoted from Purpledrilmonkey:

Keeping in mind the one on the right has been changed ~3+ times due to complaints and is a year late

absolutely. revision should be a part of any functioning development process, although ideally it should take place before it hits the public's eyes, of course. Unfortunately, unlike JJP, Stern is probably not in a position to change playfield art at this stage.

but that's all beside the point. the point is it looks bad. (especially in comparison to their most obvious direct competitor)

#72 4 years ago

Did not read through this thread yet, but the art is done. Playfields, decals and back glasses are already made.

#73 4 years ago

#wheresthethrone

no throne on the pro model anywhere in a game of THRONES

11
#74 4 years ago

Sadly, although Jared is probably reading all of this feedback, he's not going to pass anything on to Gary. When they announced that they were going to "ship overseas orders around September 15, and the North American orders will ship about a month after that to coincide with those first machines' arrival in Europe"--the truth of the matter is that ship has all but sailed.

It's too late to go back to the drawing board if they hope to maintain those ship dates. One could make the argument "Well, JJP did that, they took the feedback from the community, why can't Stern?" The truth is, you can't have your cake and eat it too. Going back to the drawing board takes time, which will result in delays, and buyers will be unhappy with that aspect of their purchase instead.

Fans of the series have been chomping at the bitt for a Game of Thrones themed pinball to be produced for years. Despite a two year development window, it looks quite frankly--rushed as hell. It's disjointed, sloppy, and it honestly doesn't even look like Greg Freres bothered to watch the show before slapping together that generic artwork package.

I'm not going to insinuate that JJP has served their customers any better given all of their delays--but take a minute and just look at the level of detail on the finished product: http://www.pinballnews.com/games/hobbit/45a.jpg

There are so many subtle intricacies that genuinely captures that the spirit of that universe. None of that detail exists within the Game of Thrones playfield artwork, and there is nothing that even makes you think that this game is actually Game of Thrones unless you recognize the house names. Take those off of the playfield and read the description of gameplay again: "Play as a Knight representing one of the seven houses. Battle the other houses to rule the throne." It looks and sounds like a generic medieval game that got some branding slapped on to it at the last minute.

I was really looking forward to this title. I saved up, and stopped myself from buying other pins because I really thought that after two years this one would be worth the wait.

18
#75 4 years ago

They can't change the playfield art now, the current art took literally 10s of minutes.

17
#76 4 years ago

If the people that work for me don't feel like they can walk in and tell me, as their boss, that I'm out in left field on something or that I'm out of my F ing mind on an issue, then I don't want them around.

Too many "yes men" leads to bad outcomes. Take a look around you, it's everywhere on the news and workplaces.

I'm wrong a lot, and I've got good people around me to let me know.

#77 4 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

I'm wrong a lot

Isn't that the truth!!!

Sorry brother... couldn't resist!

Quoted from iceman44:

I've got good people around me to let me know

Agree 100% with this... all successful leaders surround themselves with good people.

#78 4 years ago
Quoted from Ranhorton:

I don't blame them at all for the artwork situation.

So you say they shouldn't have waited and tried to fix this mess? They are the masters of their domain....they could have pushed the launch by a month and tried to fix this cluster f*ck.

Now look at this poll... 1.87265917603% of people will take a pro...
Screen Shot 2015-09-09 at 12.39.40 PM.png

#79 4 years ago

"It's only pinball"

#80 4 years ago
Quoted from flashinstinct:

So you say they shouldn't have waited and tried to fix this mess? They are the masters of their domain....they could have pushed the launch by a month and tried to fix this cluster f*ck.
Now look at this poll... 1.87265917603% of people will take a pro...
Screen Shot 2015-09-09 at 12.39.40 PM.png

That's only because the economy is turrible obviously.

#81 4 years ago

It is like doing a ST;TNG machine and use a spaceship on the playfield that was only in one episode, rather than the iconic borg cube

#82 4 years ago
Quoted from pezpunk:

while i'm sure license holders are responsible for a lot of dumb requirements and revisions, NOBODY on HBO's side was begging Stern to use more 1990s photoshop filters. the huge outline with the bevel/emboss is the biggest embarrassment - it makes the house shields look like they've got rubber padding on them. then there is the 0-distance dropshadows everywhere, and bad-looking outer glows. none of that can be blamed on the license holder.
got-th-compare.jpg
there is a serious lack of digital graphic design expertise at work in one of these playfields ...

Apologies. I should have been more clear. There is no excuse for poor graphic design execution in this day and age.
But I understand if sterns hand were tied with regards to what characters and scenery they were allowed to use in their design.

#83 4 years ago
Quoted from beatmaster:

i like your effort but do you think $tern really care?

He'll care if we speak with our wallets! 2 Heighway pins on the way. I would have loved to have purchased GOT! The funds were setting & waiting for it, instead it looks like TH is the better choice, or a MM. There is no way I'm spending that kind of $ on a pin that looks this amateur! No way MR. Stern! The artwork on this pin is laughable! I can't imagine how it made it through the approval process. I'm not an artist, but if that was put on my desk for approval, someone would have gotten the "WTF is this" talk!

#84 4 years ago
Quoted from InfiniteLives:

#wheresthethrone
no throne on the pro model anywhere in a game of THRONES

The Pro version is "Game, No Thrones"

#85 4 years ago

In Steve Ritchie I trust.

#86 4 years ago
Quoted from snyper2099:

Remember that giant AMC logo on TWD? You think Stern actually wanted that ugly thing on the game?

Probably more like they don't care.

Conversation probably went like this.

AMC: Put our logo all over the game.
Stern Pinball: Sure. Whatever. As long as we have the license for The Walking Dead.

#87 4 years ago
Quoted from Zampinator:

He'll care if we speak with our wallets! 2 Heighway pins on the way. I would have loved to have purchased GOT! The funds were setting & waiting for it, instead it looks like TH is the better choice, or a MM. There is no way I'm spending that kind of $ on a pin that looks this amateur! No way MR. Stern! The artwork on this pin is laughable! I can't imagine how it made it through the approval process. I'm not an artist, but if that was put on my desk for approval, someone would have gotten the "WTF is this" talk!

^^ This! ^^

People need to stop pre-ordering sight unseen and unplayed.

#88 4 years ago
Quoted from pezpunk:

while i'm sure license holders are responsible for a lot of dumb requirements and revisions, NOBODY on HBO's side was begging Stern to use more 1990s photoshop filters. the huge outline with the bevel/emboss is the biggest embarrassment - it makes the house shields look like they've got rubber padding on them. then there is the 0-distance dropshadows everywhere, and bad-looking outer glows. none of that can be blamed on the license holder.
got-th-compare.jpg
there is a serious lack of digital graphic design expertise at work in one of these playfields ...

This says it all. No matter what people think about JJ and their timelines; at least their playfield's don't like some sort of clip art bull shit.

#89 4 years ago
Quoted from iceman44:

If the people that work for me don't feel like they can walk in and tell me, as their boss, that I'm out in left field on something or that I'm out of my F ing mind on an issue, then I don't want them around.
Too many "yes men" leads to bad outcomes. Take a look around you, it's everywhere on the news and workplaces.
I'm wrong a lot, and I've got good people around me to let me know.

Amen Ice!
I run my business the same way! I'm not perfect, I'll make mistakes, but I'll do it with good intentions. If you have a problem, or a better way to do it, by all means lets talk about it. Lets be efficient, safe, & profitable! The more $ my I make, the more $ my employees make, we're in this together.

#90 4 years ago

The day they stop making pros is the day I stop buying anything NIB from Stern.

#91 4 years ago
Quoted from grifter:

(Who is Jared? Hope he's not that Subway bloke.)

Jared is definitely not the Subway bloke. Different people and different states. I hope that crap dies.

Jared is a great person and does social media marketing for Stern. I believe he is their director of that.

LTG : )

#92 4 years ago

The LE is centered around the Daenerys story line, which both Missandei and Drogo are key, along with Jorah and Daario on the backbox. Pinball enthusiasts arguing over GoT is like Three Stooges fans arguing over Downton Abbey...lol

#93 4 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

Jared is definitely not the Subway bloke. Different people and different states. I hope that crap dies.
Jared is a great person and does social media marketing for Stern. I believe he is their director of that.
LTG : )

Who's Lloyd?

download.jpeg

13
#94 4 years ago

I'm the bad influence your mother wouldn't let you play with.

LTG : )

419963.jpg

#95 4 years ago
Quoted from dsuperbee:

The worst gum ever was/is Fruit Stripe. Remember that stuff? It tasted awesome for 3 seconds, then lost all flavor.

But where else is an eight year old boy gonna get zebra tatts?

#96 4 years ago

Curious as to why they havent assembled a machine and posted real photos before announcing the game.

#97 4 years ago

Jared should give Gary a footlong and call it a day.

#98 4 years ago
Quoted from LTG:

I'm the bad influence your mother wouldn't let you play with.

Reminds me of a song from Blue öyster Cult "I am the one you warned me of"

#99 4 years ago
Quoted from PopBumperPete:

It is like doing a ST;TNG machine and use a spaceship on the playfield that was only in one episode, rather than the iconic borg cube

It was a two-part episode, the Borg ship was in the season finale of season 6 and also in 7x01. Still trying to figure out who Admiral Na-chay-ev is though.

#100 4 years ago
Quoted from pezpunk:

there is a serious lack of digital graphic design expertise at work in one of these playfields ...

You can say that again. It looks like the UI for Hearthstone. All that bubbly outline crap. Yuck. Doesn't matter cause i'm not a potential customer, the price point of any new pin is just too much for me. I got 5 kids!

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