James Bond 007 (60th LE)
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My challenge....convinced the 60th will be badass and looks anazing from what we've seen.
I do really like the LE however, and just looks like it will be a fun game.
Not going to own 2 Bond pins...really struggling here ( 1st world problem) 
Quoted from Tyler_Durden:Revised, I do feel like covering every inch of a machine in a collage of photos is overkill and just not good design.
[quoted image]
Good grief...I want that one!! Nice approach...
Quoted from CrazyLevi:You guys only want this because you can’t have it.
In pinball - and so many other things in life - fantasy is always more attractive than reality.
Truth, lol...
Quoted from yancy:You don't have to wonder. George Gomez: "One of the things is it does have a display, it's got the small display from the home editions and that display is actually flat on the playfield or facing the player on the playfield."
Anxious to see how it's mounted and used...no clue on the "home edition" size (never seen one...will search)....
(wait!!..looks small on speaker panel, but a great fit on the playfield....suddenly excited again...)
Quoted from iceman44:I think it’s gonna be like Alien Mark. And somebody posted a top down picture in a thread. Might have gotten removed?
Never saw that pic....hope you're right Doug....major enhancement if so.....shit, had talked myself out of this one.....
Quoted from iceman44:Unless, this turns into a ground breaking best pinball machine ever made.
Doubtful this will be the case, lol. Hoping you're right about the $15k and distro's wanting to move them w reasonable mark. Mildly interested vs. LE. More curious than anything. Will need to be fun to play and bring some sort of innovation to "justify" (non-pinball term, lol) me dropping much more than 17, maybe 18k on one......
I do like that it's not a re-skin. Maybe some magic in there somewhere.....
Quoted from iceman44:I’m hoping they aren’t just relying on the pf screen for the video assets. Surely not right?
Good grief, I hope not...huge waste if so...
Given the speaker panel display is the reel, definitely an opportunity for them to leverage the PF screen for gameplay info.
We see this thing next Tuesday? Ive forgotten...
This version will either be a "hard no" or " must have" based on reveal....no gray area for me here, as I think the LE looks great
Quoted from PinKopf:I'm holding out hope that maybe since its built with all off-the-shelf pinball mechs maybe they can target more of a current premium machine level price point, but I'm not holding my breath. We'll see - 500 definitely won't be enough and msrp will irrelevant at that point anyway I guess.
Dont see that happening at all....when it's shown as a mystery at the end of the models to the right of the LE.....this could be stupidly high priced.
Whole reveal was underwhelming to me for such a big theme...idk...just a game I guess
Quoted from PinMonk:Supposedly will be shown at the 60th event in London next week. I'm not sure which one (there are several, including the auction that already happened), but the next one starts Sept 30th.
Wait...like tomorrow? Be nice if they would just go ahead and launch instead of dragging it out ( makes too much sense I guess)...
Quoted from underlord:At least there’s no letter-writing begging for one.
That was a joke big time!!! I remember getting yelled at during the tour for reaching over the velvet ropes just to touch the damn thing, lol....wanted to check the powder out..never wrote a letter, but was offered one at the show...
Ended up w an LE and a pic w Adam that he signed w game in the back....that part was cool...
Quoted from PinMonk:There's a 3-day thing with creator panels and visual effects info that starts tomorrow and runs through the 2nd, then there's a concert later next week. It's all part of the 60th anniversary. I'm not sure WHICH event left is the one that will have the Bond 60th, though.
Ahhh....thx...this whole " reveal" thing is confusing..
Quoted from iceman44:The Distros are in charge of pricing here. Price fixing and collusion
Just the way we like it Doug, !! 
Quoted from sanctumwear:George Gomez:
His game spans the 25 films and his game is very
different. I think it's limited to 500 units and it's a single-level playfield, like old school. It's got reels in the back box. Yes, you heard me right, it's got reels in the back box. Programmed by Mark Penacho who goes back to the Williams Electronics days.
It's not what I did with Beatles where I took Seawitch and updated it and cleaned up the shots and all that stuff. It's not like that it's a from-scratch Keith Elwin single-level playfield that is built around all standard pinball things.
It's got the small display from the home editions and that display is actually flat on the playfield facing the player on the playfield. There are no ramps it's just all shots, but man, has he done a job with the shots!
You're talking about a guy that spent so many years having to play that old-school stuff in the tournaments so he understands the kinetics of those games really well and so he said, "Yes, I'd love to do it."
They did some fun stuff-- so imagine that the score reels are situated where you would expect, where the LCD sits in the backbox and on either side of the speakers. In that panel, with the reel mech, there's a bunch of old school ghosted images for game over and all that stuff, they’re all back there.
We'd love to see how we do with it, right? Every once in a while, the beauty of where we are business-wise is that we can try strange stuff. We're not hand to mouth like our beginnings and so we can try different things.
This also, by the way, the two distinct game thing also lends itself to we're going to do some interesting Insider Connected stuff where progress or things you do in one cornerstone open things up in Keith’s game and things you do in Keith's game open stuff up in my game. Even though they're going to be hard to find because when you're talking about 500 games for his game, they're going to be hard to find, they're going to be in somebody's house but it's okay. We thought it would be fun. Certainly, for the people that own his game, they'll have access to some of mine. If somebody buys both that'd be amazing but I don't know if that's an expectation. I don't know if that's my expectation.
The art on his game is all 25 films are represented with their film posters on the sides of the game, on the playfield every actor that's played Bond, Connery, Pierce Brosnan, George Lazenby, of course, Daniel Craig, Roger Moore, they’re all represented on the playfield. Then there's elements-- he's got villains from each of the Bonds and he's got game features from each of the Bonds. His gadgets and his weapons and stuff work differently than mine but he's basically picked a representative device from each.
Thank you for reposting this ( just saw it)!
Now...to just put it out of my head until whenever they decide to reveal, price it.... 
Quoted from PinMonk:My only worry is Gomez/Stern telling them to make it simple code like early Solid State machines. The sale BS we were told about how Munsters sucked and was a code wasteland because Dwight was told to make a simple game. Complete waste of a license. So THAT is a danger, but if that didn't happene, I think Elwin/Naegele will do a great job as they have proven they are consistently capable of doing.
Munsters actually ended up being a fun game ....play it quite often...
My biggest concern ....$$$/ fun ratio. Guess Supreme owners didnt care paying $50k (?) for a reskinned SM vault, but I like to play my games.
Idk, but have a bad feeling this one is going to have a stupid sticker price on it...
Quoted from iceman44:They are already skating on thin ice and they better F ing bring it.
Shit is hitting the fan worldwide.
Better not turn into some half ass effort
When you start charging where they are at? Then you better crush it
+1000 Doug....
Quoted from LTG:Thank you.
I hope it's great and everybody that wants one can get one.
LTG : )
I too hope you get one! Cant think of a better person than you to own/ provide valuable help and feedback.
Ready to see this thing!!
Quoted from blowback1976:Supreme and Heavy Metal would like a word.
Neither applicable.....60th will tie (somehow) into the cornestone release. Alot more on the line to make this thing badass, given it was announced (just not shown) at release. The bar will be high to command any type of insane price....
Supreme contracted, very niche, stand alone
Heavy Metal....well, just Heavy Metal
Have to believe they will show/price this thing before/ close to the Premium stream.
Cant decide which one I want until I see both ( LE and 60th), however, 100% Im not buying 2 Bond pins...surely Im not alone in this ( maybe they dont care, idk..)
So, education on "single level" please.....still could include, great shot geometry, pops, drop and traditional targets, spinners, magnet, subways (?).
Stern certain waffles on pre-production #'s (50-80 I think for BMSLE, 500-600 for Munsters LE, etc.), however, once they run, they've never changed # of that version, correct? They've never Vaulted an LE. Granted they could make different LE models, but believe this is true.
As stated prior, I genuinely liked the Franchi BM66LE over the SLE...think they only made around 200 of them, so all the stars lined up for me.
The current/ future state of fiscal matters is absolutely real (for everyone), and think it's going to impact decisions regarding luxury purchases, period (regardless if its a Pro, LE or whatever).Things going sideways in an aggresive way....
I own an EHOH 40, love the freakin thing, no "sparklegate" and highly doubt it will ever be a 15k game...if it is, I'll live with it (and don't care, as I play ALL my games). Zero regrets.
This Bond 60 definitely intrigues me, but more in a " is it a beautiful, bad ass player" kind of way. $5k on a toy I hate, is far worse than $20k on a game I love..(just me).
Think the 500 will blow through pretty quick, but agree they will be sitting in distro warehouses for potential lower pricing down the road.....
How low, how much, how good? Who the hell knows......show me the damn thing. Can tack on a trip to Expo if it's there, but they just aren't giving it up w this one....whatever...just pinball....
Quoted from iceman44:At $18k yes. That’s fantasy Tiger. I’ve been told Distros are trying to get $25k out of the box.
$18k a whole lot different
Heard the same....no telling yet, I suppose...
Quoted from iceman44:Well Mark, you me and others I know aren’t dropping $25k on a 500 single level pin regardless of who designed it.
Not gonna speak for you but that is a hard NO.
I already have a game if I want it in the $17-$18k range
Ditto, and correct Doug...( just dont know if I even want it yet)
Quoted from TigerLaw:Yes, I agree with you. They will sell about 100 quickly at $25,000 and then maybe another 100 in 30 days. There is going to be a lot in inventory left after the hype and FOMO period at $25,000.
I also agree with you that the economy will drag down Stern’s 1,000 machine runs on some LEs on any game that is not an A list license. I had told my distro six months ago I wanted a Venom LE. Now, after the price raise and an almost certain run of 1,000 of the LE for Venom, I’m thinking premium (or possibly even a pro) and I’ll add the upgraded speakers, lollipop rails, and Voodoo glass myself. My “collector” money went into my BBB a few months ago…keep the collector money in truly collectible games.
[quoted image]
Sweet BBB!!
Quoted from iceman44:A truly “collectible” pin that I like to play, like an AC/DC BIB, I’m looking for one
Have tried unsuccessfully about 4 times on one of those....tough pin to get....still
Quoted from mstang01:Yeah, I’m a bit worried about that myself. I think letting the distributors set prices risks pissing off their best customers if they overreach initially. Hopefully the prices that are being rumored are trial ballon’s to gauge what their customers will tolerate and the actual price (whatever that is) is something that will be able to hold its value without causing hard feeling and buyers remorse.
Have zero concerns my Distro will be fair w me....I'm much more concerned about the game itself....how am I supposed to make a decision without even seeing the thing?
Don't care about the "500"...they'll make the run and that will be that. If it's 500 stinkers, then it might as well be 50. If it's 500 "gotta have" then doubt anyone is going to take a bath.
I WANT to like this game, and validate (w my wallet only) what I'll pay for it. But tying it into the cornerstone release, then just darkness is freakin' weird...
So just went to Stern's game page for Bond...noticed the 60th shadow pic has been changed to scrolling arrows w nothing in the middle...gotta believe they're going to show this thing soon ( ok, I'm reaching...whatever... 
)
Quoted from JohnTTwo:My dealer was shocked when I turned down my 2 LE’s
I would go 17 on the special edition but not a penny more.
I also agree with you the market is topping out. Glad to see Zillas going for 17+
And what did your Dealer say to the $17k offer? Curious, as my call will be coming soon ( which one do I want)....
Trying to figure out how the " Zilla at 17+" factors in (?)...do you think the title is that good to avoid going down...would think that game will face the same downturn as the rest (?)
Quoted from Sako-TRG:“There are things we need, and there are things we want. But there’s also a whole lot in between. Sometimes we fool ourselves into thinking that something we only want is something we need.
Sometimes to alleviate the guilt of making a purchase (especially a large one), we feel the need to justify it. But if you have to explain something, it usually means that it can’t stand on its own as being the right thing to do.”
Yep....Ive never needed to " validate " or " justify" a single pin purchase. Suspect Ive paid more, sometimes less than others here for the identical pin.
Been enjoying the games for quite some time as what it is....a hobby....nothing more, nothing less.
Quoted from JohnTTwo:He hasn’t called me back on it yet, still miffed I balked at Bond LE’s
Thanks for the response...suspect he'll sell all the LE'S regardless, and these 60's are going somewhere.
I dont buy games to flip, nor buy every new release ( not even close). Bond is a great theme for me and the LE looks fun. Have 1 of those locked at a fair price. Will wait to see if the 60 changes my mind or not...kinda that simple for me.
( I never post what my actual price is out of respect for the Distro )
Quoted from underlord:My opinion is FOMO is on the passionate driven hobbyists that want a beloved title to accentuate their home. Play with family and friends and have that ‘stop and look’ every time they’re in the room. I do it with my collection and my car.
Stern is obligated to provide a value drive within us to buy. Like most other luxury hobbies greed and laziness on both parties drives prices too high and value is lost.
Pinside is a great place for like minded folks to vent, rant, flex, share, etc. I felt obligated to share in this thread and regret nothing.
Huge ditto...
People bitch on here for all kinds of stupid stuff...
Complaining on how Stern is handling ( or not) this release is certainly a viable topic.
( I lose zero sleep regarding hobby activities...lots more important stuff out there)
Quoted from Grantman:Why take attention away from the cornerstone game? I think there's a good chance we don't see the 60th anniversary game for another month.
Probably right....given the time frame for shipping ( thought December), seems odd they would wait a whole lot longer though...
Quoted from eyeamred2u:It appears to be oddjobs hat on the playfield and it will have an elliptical effect I bet, kind of a throwing motion I bet when activated. The playfield has a weird pattern under or near oddjobs placement. Maybe I am wrong here. Just taking a shot at it.
Trying to figure out where the PF screen is...know it was stated to be in there, and given the size should show somewhere.....
Quoted from TreyBo69:I'd guess emededed in the center of the playfield. It's not a big screen. Apron wouldn't be a bad spot either (instead of the standard rule card), but I think they said it was in the playfield
I'm also assuming it'll be in The Beatles cabinet. It could be in the Whoa Nellie et al cabinet, but I doubt there is enough vertical clearance for toys like Oddjob's hat.
My guess as well, but it's the same size as main screen on home editions, correct (?) ...definitely too big for the apron if so...
Quoted from iceman44:Hoping it's not too tiny? Alien size you think Mark?
Believe so Doug.....tried to pull dimensions off the Home Version screen, and definitely around Alien PF size. Too big for an Apron. This could be a literal game-changer....having key info on the playfield where our eyes are......massive, massive plus if so!!!
Quoted from romulusx:Your just being funny right?
Doubtful....appears he's quoting himself...unfortunate to call a hobbiest a " moron" ..but hey, its Pinside....
Quoted from mstang01:I think he’s paraphrase quoting common pinside statements.
Agreed (of course).....I suppose doing so could also classify someone as a moron.
Maybe we just focus on the game hype....spare stating the obvious... judgemental crap about the people buying any of these games just gets old...
Quoted from iceman44:They aren’t getting $25k
They should get what they can get at the outset
I did hear from a very reputable inside distro source that this wasn't put out as a " cash grab for distro's" like EHOH40th ( which I have and love btw).
Think Distros need to make $$$ ( as we all do relating to work), but hoping and believing ( for now) it wont be a $25k game......
Time to release the damn thing already.....
Quoted from iceman44:Amen brother Mark.
I also love Elvira!
I have a Plan A in place. Just waiting for the drop. [quoted image]
Great minds Doug...( better than my grammar in that post, lol)
Even if the game plays great, will be a hard sell over $20k imho. ALOT of $$$ in current times. We all want to see/ play it (I know I do), which means you or your Pinbud will have to pony up. Discussion will get real when they finally decide to release .......
Suppose Stern gets props for messing with us in a new way.....
Quoted from Bud:There are people in this topic that said we weren’t in a recession not to long ago and were adamant about it but have changed their tune now.
Won't derail, but the term "recession" will have a new meaning by the time this path is felt on the scale of it's intent. Only getting started......
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:This pin is similar to when Stern built Supreme. That game had an inferior layout, rules and overall experience. Rumor was Stern built and sold them for $15k. Market prices climbed to over $50k the first week before settling between $25k-$30k today. Your can buy one today for yourself. Or buy 4 Stern pro’s. Would anyone prefer buying Bond60 over collecting GZ, JP2, DP and EHOH?
So what would be a reasonable price? I feel $10k would be more than enough $$$ for Stern. As a potential consumer, I wouldn’t feel like a total dumbass telling others I bought one.
Not in line w your analogy, however, price will play a huge part (as stated numerous times). Anticipating a legit, players, boutique w this one.....the longer they wait to release, the worse it becomes (just my take)
Quoted from cait001:In regards to money:
Anyone who is considering 5 figures on an awesome new toy is probably fairly insulated from any recession.
True to a degree, however feeling the effect is non discriminatory.....things are just being to be felt...just move the decimal as to individual impact.
The game will have to be great and unique ( sort of a given to a degree) and not prohibitive in price.
Just because someone " can" doesnt mean they "will"....I play and enjoy all my games, so hoping for something genuinely special....we shall see...
Quoted from Oneangrymo:Well I sold my Tron LE , so I have "partial" funds for it
You did what!!! 
Oh well, legit Alien lives in your world, lol...
On to this Bond toy!!!! ( which is 100% going to be higher in $$$ than the LE, question is by how much)
Quoted from iceman44:They need somebody to flip it to though.
Flippers will get caught will get caught with their pants down grabbing their ankles if they think they can work this one
Most appealing part of this entire thing.....
Quoted from Aurich:I would appreciate it if anyone who wants to claim that Andrew Heighway was a licensing genius could please check that I'm not drinking something before they say it.
[quoted image]
Lol...agreed...ironic PB gets the pass ( " oh we weren't part of any of it"). Now Queen...another HW license....and Im sure another fine job of it...
Old, (very) painful wounds......I digress...
Anxious to see this 60th Bond. Bump for a reveal this week ( why not)?
Quoted from mstang01:Could be with so much blowback on regular bond reveal being too far ahead of production they are holding on to this one until they are closer (might have worked better without the 007.com picture and then the announcement without doing a release).
Possibly...they released BM66SLE without it even being able to flip ( seriously).......just dont see the harm in putting it out, letting us argue over it ( lol), then ship when they ship.
Suspense kind of fun, kind of an annoying....in truth, only a game end of the day ....
Quoted from TreyBo69:They’re not building them till December, so maybe? Get people at maximum hype and deliver it before they can think too hard about it.
Just a bizarre year for Stern from an outside perspective.
Originally supposed to deliver in December, correct?
Small batch of Op Pros, then LEs shipping November (?).....think schedule, along w lauch kinda wacked w this one.....
Well they've obviously built something....1k posts later, still not exactly sure what or how much, lol
A sheepish bump for.......next Tuesday... 
Comparing parts prices is amusing ( and sort of futile to represent worth).....the most special end products Ive ever seen are ALWAYS more valuable than the sum of the parts...
So much more to it.......
Guess the banter is good, given no reveal yet...
Made it to another bourbon Friday....thankfully...
Quoted from iceman44:We have been punked. There really isn’t an Elwin Bond game!
Definitely don't get it Doug. Can't imagine the hype is increased by putting it out there and going dark this long (mines not anyway)....Pinball I guess
Will still give my "reveal Tuesday" bump.....surely I'll be right some month.....
Quoted from TreyBo69:Eh, it only took him like twenty minutes to design the game with standard off the shelf parts (or at least that’s the way some think about stuff like this)
Lol...too true!!..
Another wasted Tuesday bump on my part...
Swear I dont know wtf is going on....has Stern ever announced vaporware like this before?
Quoted from gonzo73:another day you don't have to pay 20 something K ,for a game that only costs Stern 4 or 5 K in Bom.
"most ignorant phrase read on Pinside today"
Quoted from Thunderbird:Well, you’re certainly right, there is a great deal more involved than the BOM. Plus pinball is very hard, unlike many other industries, there is so much involved to get right or like you say, many would be willing to take the plunge.
Lots of tough industries out there...BOM can be such a small ingredient in the final tag. An OR suite " entry level" admission can vary in price by 6 figures, depending on who's holding the " scalpel" and what they're doing. IT appliance can be 5 figures, w BOM under 5k....
Just no logic to "there's 2k worth of parts in a Pin, it should only be $3.5k"...
Ok....a next Tuesday bump in advance....
Quoted from beltking:No leaked images yet? Pics are done. I guess no hackers in pinball. Gotta be on a computer somewhere.
It will show on reveal this Tuesday.. 
Quoted from PismoArcade:Any truth to the rumor that Stern is requiring full payment from distros prior to the reveal?
No. My Distro will call me when it drops, give me a price, and I buy it or not after it reveals. Wire funds...done.
Done w my Tuesday bumps however....."next week" has turned into a month....whole reveal/ launch has been f'd up imho (which means nothing and ok w that)....
Quoted from iceman44:Like the Tuesday bumps Mark!
Thinking they want to get the LEs on the line in early December before they show it.
When was the EHOH 40th? Delivered in Dec last yr or Jan?
Think this release is an extra “bonus” for the Distros like EHOH 40th.
In other words, tap the big $$$ guys
Ok Doug (I am persistent if anything, lol). Will stay the course.... Bumping 12/6!!!!!!!
Yea...think I got my EHOH40 before Christmas last year....
Quoted from iceman44:Is this really the “hype thread”. If it is there is none left.
Call me a cynic, but I believe Stern is making sure the Distros are collecting the LE $$ first. To do that they have to start shipping those games
And they probably are in a pickle trying to figure out what to price it at.
Agreed....the " pre hype" speculation/ interest was real ( semi leaked photo, shadowed image,etc.)....with every passing day it's diminishing for me personally. Bond or not....would believe very few will buy an LE and an SLE. This thing needs to get released, people make up their minds, and move on.
Bumping for 12/6 reveal again.....keeping it near the top of my favorites as the thread is pretty much dead......I will persist...
Quoted from Grantman:Gomez: Mid-December reveal.
Is this what he said? I don't keep up with many podcasts, streams, etc.
Great news if so......a couple weeks.....
Quoted from PinMonk:He said "very soon...you'll see it Mid-December." Gomez said it would also be "expensive" (If GOMEZ is calling it expensive, forget the fantasies of $15-20k. This is easily in the $20k-$35k range).
Here's the clip with saying it Mid Dec reveal and some other stuff about the 60th:
Thanks for the clip....yep, this one is definitely going to sting hard price wise based on a few of his comments.
" what the market will bear" is going to be interesting...
Quoted from mstang01:Anything here is just talk, it gives us something to do while we wait. The only realities will come initially when it goes on sale (and it hits or misses) and then a few years from now when we see how the game is regarded and valued.
Yep....just not encouraged that the LE is already $14k, and Gomez states " this game will be expensive". Imho, $14k is already expensive, so good grief.
Got a good feeling the 60 is going to be a great game and alot of fun. Bad feeling is they'll have a $25k tag on it.
Can I buy one? Yep. Will I ? Not at $25k.
Will Stern care? Doubtful....
Thankfully, alot of this speculation will end quickly once we actually get to see the damn thing. I know many (newer) Pinsiders that have thrown stupid money at building a lineup in the past year....so the $100k comment is not really out of line. Then there are many that don't even post here with mad $$$ .......
If the game is great and sustainable in a lineup (which only time will tell) then they will be sought after. Think initial FOMO just isn't going to be there for this one as it's just going to be pricey.....could be wrong.
Have no problem sharing my decision here, but truly worthless as everyone has different criteria. When spending my money on a toy, I don't really need or care about others opinions. Would believe most think this way.........
Quoted from pinballaddicted:I think there are plenty of people that can pay 20K for a pin. I think the real question here is if they want to or not.
This....
A great game is a great game. We just don't know ( and won't for awhile) if this is one of them.
These will sell of course...fact. For how much....NIB, then "HUO" ( about 3 times) remains to be seen.....all based on statement above.
The world will keep spinning regardless....just a toy....time for Bourbon.....
Quoted from iceman44:Life is too short. Bourbon and beer over pins. We have plenty of them
Here you go Doug....Bourbon over Pins..
( makes playing and buying much more enjoyable imho)
20221202_214603 (resized).jpgQuoted from CrazyLevi:Yeah, unity and being willing to sacrifice one’s own wants and needs for the greater good of the whole is an absolute hallmark of the pinball community.
I feel your campaign will meet with great success!
One of your best comments in memory...lmfao!!!
Think I'll just decide if its worth whatever after I see the damn thing....pretty sure no one is buying one for me....
Quoted from Ghiandalf:December 13 presentation
Fits w my weekly Tuesday bumps I guess...
Quoted from Aurich:Words of wisdom.
Thinking the exact same thing....correct words Doug...
Was actually playing my WCS94 tonight, loving every minute of it....
Hype and excitement for a theme like this is fun, have the opportunity and means to buy this game...but could walk away w zero regrets ( done w other titles some covet)
Scooby does sound fun, btw.....
Quoted from pinballaddicted:Start coil counting when the games come out!
Always one of my favorites...
Quoted from TreyBo69:After that, let's argue about how Stern should show gameplay at the reveal of this Bond. Then begrudgingly agree Stern doesn't have to because the people who buy this sort of game don't give a fuck
Then after we all see the playfield, we can circle back to the eternal debate about how expensive the unobtanium plastic for ramps costs Stern.
Tip of the iceberg, Pinbud....
Quoted from Grantman:FWIW, Kaneda posted 12/15 (Thursday) reveal for Bond 60th.
Appreciated, but his news means nothing to me...even a broken clock is right twice a day....a next week reveal fits Gomez's latest statements.
I'll still bump Tuesday ( pure guess), but just as happy to see anyday in upcoming week...PLEASE!!
Quoted from demandecan55:It seems like there will be no MSRP from rumors on the Bond SLE, which means pricing will be more chaotic and confusing than the Gomez LE. This after a chaotic and confusing unveiling in September.
I just want Stern to respect the customer. I don't want to haggle with distros to save a few bucks. I just read in another thread (maybe the next Stern) about haggling distros to exclude tax all together. I don't think the people who have 20k+ to spend on a single machine (or anyone) should have to play games to get a better price. Just tell me the price and let me decide either way. Stern has been great the last few years, it only takes one bad incident to change peoples minds these days. And a bad image doesn't have to come from Stern. It can come from a dealer that cancels your order because someone just offered 2k more than you did when you made your deposit. My distro won't do that, for sure, but others might and it makes Stern look bad. The smaller distros are wild, and they don't follow the rules. What happens when a distro collapses and can't refund deposits because the IRS caught them not paying taxes like that other thread I mentioned? This place will be mocking distros advertising 30k SLE spots in a few weeks. It will be chaos. Again, my point is Stern should look into being more strict with these rules, not more loose. That is how you lose trust. I still love Stern, but I am wary about the future here if distro pricing happens...
Is all this stuff true?
How did someone " buy" an SLE ( and how much $$$)
LE was $12k, now $14k ?
Distros w dramatic price differences?
Very, very bad showing if so.....I know pinball in general has had a " questional" past for all sorts of reasons.....but Stern? Present day? NOT A FAN
Quoted from CrazyLevi:Why do you want their respect? Get a dog.
Stern’s job is to produce and sell you pinball machines.
Everybody in pinball takes this shit way too personally. They aren’t your friends they are just selling you shit you want.
Not interested in friendship at all....standard business practice and consistent pricing policies should be a given, however.
I buy very expensive shit all year from reputable manufacturers and their distributors.
Saying Pinball gets a pass and I call bullshit...
Quoted from frunch:Why should it, though? They're a business and they're free to operate in any way they please as long as they aren't breaking the law. We may not like the decisions they make, but they are *their* decisions to make and the only agency we have is to support them (or not!) with our money.
Is their business model such that you gain "respect" the more games you buy? If so, where are those goalposts? 5 games/year? 10? 100? Is it possible you aren't buying enough to earn their respect?
If you don't like the way they operate, you're free to take your $ elsewhere. Frankly, I *wish* people would stop complaining about all this bs and actually put their money where their mouth is. The only way their lousy business practices will be remedied is to stop funding them. There are plenty of other pinball machines out there.What are you going to do though? Not buy their games? If so, I commend you for having standards and sticking to 'em.
Correct on all counts.....dont have to like it, just deal with it if I want the toy or not... no way does it make it right...just voicing my opinion on this mess
Just spoke w my distro ( who I trust and have been dealing with for well over a decade):
LE's start shipping next week, SLE " supposed" to be revealed on the 15th....only rumor hes heard on price is $25k.
Very, very limited audience, allocation on these...
Figured I'd share, and truthfully dont know if I take 1, both, or none at this point....is what it is..
Quoted from iceman44:No reveal? LEs haven’t sold through. $13k too high.
Now they wait until Jan at CES hoping this is a post Xmas buy.
Inflation up. Markets down. Recession coming.
ZERO chance they sell 500 Elwin Bond pins at $25k
ZERO
You can get a full featured Bond LE for 1/2 price. Which is over priced too
Pretty much ZERO interest for me in either anymore........will play what I have (spent last night on AIQLE....whew!!), have a ScoobyCE coming at some point.....enough "new shiney" fix for me now...
Quoted from kklank:hearsay.......rumors........bullshit.
Agreed....
Gonna have to be one hell of a game to interest me at this point....
Quoted from JohnTTwo:He’s only getting one but wants to appear like there is going to be a bidding war
Insanity...
Quoted from Jaytech10:Ok. I don't know what banks are hooked up with these cc. I had a tough time raising the limit on mine to purchase TS4
Alot of banks issue credit cards w crazy limits on them. Not the concern here.....
Quoted from pinballaddicted:Because people spend lots of money around Christmas time.. if Stern release this week and we have been drinking bourbon.. instant buy.. Early next year, more than likely pass.
Like your logic....guessing reveal this Tuesday ( surprise)
Quoted from pinballaddicted:Ha ha. I am not so sure but I certainly hope you are right. We have some nice bourbon!
[quoted image]
This one is " next up".....gonna break the seal this Friday regardless, lol....
Here's to ( hopefully) complaining about price and other stuff this week!!!...
20221218_222712 (resized).jpgUnlikely any logic can ever be applied to this one, pricewise.
Personally, kinda sucks they couldn't at least reveal the thing before years end given it was " announced" 3 months ago....realistically, doubtful they could care less....just a game.
Quoted from iceman44:I really believe the Bond LEs haven’t sold through as well and they are giving Distros time to lock down that money, getting them delivered, and then the “switchers” don’t have a choice.
My Bond LE arrives tomorrow. My friend received his last weekend. Big potential, barren code, ala BM66
Distro not making me choose until the 60th is revealed....Im in no hurry ( also a clue that the LE's are certainly not all sold out in owners hands yet)
Quoted from cooked71:lol. Lets face it - all pinball parts are cheap. But as they say, a pinball machine is worth more than the sum of its parts.
Yep
Quoted from iceman44:Gomez said the 60th was gonna be revealed “very soon” after the LE reveal. Then he said “maybe the next week” after the stream they did.
So who knows? Gomez doesn’t even know! Ha
I think they do know Doug....just stalling for whatever reason....doesn't stop the bourbon from flowing on Friday...their cadence isnt going to alter mine...
Quoted from guitarded:Is the machine still a thing?
Less by the day PinBud....Happy Holidays!!
Quoted from Grantman:Hey, something concrete in that press release:
"Exclusive for attendees and press of CES Unveiled (January 3rd at the Mandalay Bay) and ShowStoppers @ CES (January 5th at the Bellagio), Stern Pinball will be officially unveiling the highly collectible James Bond 007 60th Anniversary Limited Edition pinball machine. Limited to 500 machines globally, this rare machine celebrates the entire franchise of the iconic, genre-defining James Bond films."
" Game On" or not I suppose, lol....this kind of release= machine is going to be expensive as hell imho....hoping Im wrong
Quoted from TreyBo69:Hey my stab in the dark was right!
Congrats!! My consistent Tuesday bumps would have been right.....eventually, lol..
Quoted from TreyBo69:I know distributors are already telling people they don't know the cost but to expect EHOH40th like pricing. So probably 20-25k.
Thats my guess ...it's $25k if its a dime
Quoted from iceman44:I'd say #1 gotta see it first would make sense for most people.
#2 Pricing i think will matter to most, not some.
Once the FOMO buyers get taken off the top? Who knows.
I'm excited for it because it's James Bond. Not at any price
Ditto Doug
Kind of set "not to exceed" price in my head......seeing the reveal will go a long way as to whether I actually bite and take 1 or not....
Quoted from iceman44:Should be interesting Mark!
It's "limited to only 500 worldwide", like every other LE that came before it, at 1/3 of the cost maybe?
Lining it up for the celebration brother. [quoted image]
I'll take the middle one!!!
Quoted from mrclean:Hmmm... This is looking more accurate.... only now its 9-12 days away CES / show reveal.... Also I was told and I'm quoting a very major STERN distributor they were told and this is a huge spread 30k-40k is what they are expecting the SLE 60th 007 to be priced at.
Whoa!!!!
Quoted from yancy:I set the line at 3.5 new threads started about this game and/or its price during CES week. Over or under? Place your bets!
Over.....so many things to argue about.......
Quoted from yancy:I set the line at 3.5 new threads started about this game and/or its price during CES week. Over or under? Place your bets!
I want to start now ( not price).....
Do the games ship first quarter, yes or no....
Quoted from JohnTTwo:I’m relatively new to pinside. How does one quantify whos a high end collector?
How many high end collectors would you guess there are?
Thanks
The ones I know rarely, if ever, post here....
Quoted from GoldenBeard:If I still drank I’d get that base. I think I have 3 tops now
Took me awhile, but finally got all the letters from bottles I consumed. Generally only touch the stuff on Friday evenings anymore.....next week could be an exception if I decide to do something stupid...
( could start as early as Tuesday, lol)..
Quoted from iceman44:Ha! What the heck is that Mark.
Keep your wits about you brother but it will be hard to avoid the Bond FOMO.
Man I love this theme!
Party begins early on Tuesday.
Someone gave it to me several years back....before and after shots, lol
20221228_204008 (resized).jpg20221228_204055 (resized).jpgQuoted from Roostking:Does this come with different " toppers" that you collect with the bottles?
Yea...different " grades" of the stuff, and each cork has a letter at the back of the horse....
Luck of the draw on which one is on the bottle
20221228_210417 (resized).jpgQuoted from Kkoss24:Sweet Mama that’s some presentation there
Developed a taste for it, lol.... 
Quoted from chuckwurt:Different tops on blantons gold, which is only available outside the US.
Yep....hooked on the Single Barrel Red now...aged an additional 4 years in Japan...only available abroad...
( no harm w slight Bourbon thread derail, lol)
20221228_213623 (resized).jpg20221228_213709 (resized).jpgQuoted from chuckwurt:Blanton’s is the shit. I liked it better when nobody cared about it though. Haha.
Agreed...we can thank John Wick for that!!
Quoted from chuckwurt:Seriously? Haha. I don’t know the movies well. That’s funny.
Yea....doubt he caused it singlehanded, lol, but in every damn movie (was indulging long before I saw the 1st one).....
Quoted from GoldenBeard:John Wick Pinball…..
LE has Blantons corks and movie bullets hahaha
Instant buy, lol!!
Quoted from Budman:Just received an email from my distributor. Announcement/ more info next Tuesday the 3rd. Pricing expected to be similar to Elvira 40 th anniversary edition.
Seems to be common logic, however all speculation ( still). The only definite is it IS going to be pricey...
Not buying the " distro pad" that seemed common logic w EV40 though.....think its just going to be an expensive game......we shall finally know this Tuesday
Quoted from PanzerFreak:Just to add something to the cost conversation. Does anyone else find it a bit ironic that Kaneda is telling people not to spend $2,000 on toppers and to wait to buy pretty much every pinball machine when he's spending $500+ on Gucci shirts that likely cost $4 to make? lol
If the "shirt" fits, lol....taking fiscal ( or any) advice from that source is....well......
Quoted from Aurich:Don't you think it's weird that he threw you under the bus after taking your money and you're thinking about what kind of shirts he wears?
Cleanse your mind, stop worrying about what people who don't mean anything to your life do and say. You'll be happier.
Its worse than weird.....truth Pinbud...
Quoted from pinballaddicted:The more I think about this game the less I want it. We are drinking Wild Turkey today so that may change as the afternoon goes on!
Expensive game.. makes me think of Supreme..
I have to wait until tomorrow evening to indulge, but agree completely w your take...
Quoted from DBLM:Come on, Ice. I would have thought you drank real bourbon and not the gimmick stuff. You need me to send you a care package of Old Carter? Maybe some of this hotness?[quoted image]
A nice pour.....
" gimmick" is sacrilege, however.....love the stuff..
Had a nice ounce of Pappy 23 couple weeks ago
Thread finally getting substance before the damn game drops...
Quoted from chuckwurt:Blantons straight from the barrel is 133 proof and it’s perfection.
Truth...
Quoted from DBLM:Have never been a fan of either of the Buffalo Trace mashbills. Too floral for my pallet. Regular Blantons at 90 proof is too thin for me. It does have the greatest bottle and gimmick with the tops ever though. Blanton’s Gold had more firepower for sure but the mouthfeel and finish did nothing for me. Different strokes for different folks.
As for Pappy, I actually prefer the 15 to the 23. I think it hits a better balance of flavor. I got a Lot B this year as part of my allocation and government it away to a friend. If you are looking for a god high end wheater, try this. Super thick and unique. It has some heat and spice to it, what you do not expect in a wheater. Pricey, but I really like it. [quoted image]
Ahh...solid bourbon talk in a speculation thread....love it!! ( the bourbon thread was good for a long time until it got polluted).
It is personal choice for sure.....I actually prefer the Blantons Red (single barrel) to the gold, and don't drink the regular anymore. Not a snob about it, but that gives me enough horsepower, and opens perfectly for me...not floral, just more robust and smooth. Gets the job done consistently....
Agree on the Pappys...have a friend abroad, and when I was there recently he had a bottle of 23 so took a pour. Could never bring myself to getting on the allocation train...four figure bourbon just can't click in my head (think I only pay $250.00 for the Red)
Had Willett several times and really like it...even enjoy MVR on occasion.
Blanton red is just my go to, and fits the bill consistently...always enjoy trying others (sometimes with very good results)....
I'll pm you for a deeper chat, and never a bad thread if bourbon is involved imho..... Hope for this Pin!!!! Bond time!!!!
Quoted from iceman44:I'm more of a lightweight beer drinker and occasional tequila. I'm afraid to get started on the good bourbon!
One thing i can say for Stern and the Bond 60th release, whether it's good, bad or indifferent, as long as we are praising and/or complaining, that's a GOOD thing for them.
They better start worrying when nobody cares enough to even bitch about pricing or whatever else.
If they don't have all the Bond assets incorporated into the PF screen somehow then that will suck. If i can't see Jaws pop up there then wtf, it's a total waste!!!
I've got you covered on the bourbon Doug...
The pf screen content really has me curious....sizing seems perfect...too big for an apron, yet perfect for in-playfield use....always looking down when playing anyway.....incredibly valuable asset for me if deployed properly....
Quoted from NeilMcRae:So I'm hearing a lot of contradiction on this title.
First - price is unset dealers are setting it. Then Stern are setting it, latest I heard is that like Batman SLE all sales are going to be managed directly through Stern?!
I'm sure there must be a good reason but it seems like this is harder than it should be.
Suspect there is a method to their madness Pinbud...hell if I can figure it out....an official bourbon Friday for me so wont be trying, lol
What the hell is a $1k transfer fee? I call some weird Distro bs.
Huge note....Not all Distros operate the same
Quoted from ryank11379:Just out of curiosity, who feels comfortable at $25k for this game currently?
Comfortable guess the price is landing in that range
Not comfortable at all that I'll be buying one
Quoted from iceman44:In other words you have to see it first ? Wtf!
Then you have to drop down the $5k instantly. Or not
At least we are having some pin release fun!
True....and all based on the belief you can actually get one...
( believing 250 available on each side of the pond is going to leave some out....but at the projected price, who knows)
Quoted from iceman44:Are there enough people in the world, 500, that would pay that for a stripped down single level, scoring reels, mini pf screen game no matter who designs it?
You have to think the THEME alone gets it done. And it’s not working on the LE.
Is the 60th somehow going to blow out the LE 2x? Not a chance. That’s why they waited so long to collect all the LE $$$ before releasing this game at $25k
Don’t forget, Gomez already said he wants to do a Goldfinger LE version.
That’s why Distros like the email that was sent are already pumping this “non refundable” gig hard. This particular distro is way overstating his “demand”. I’m on it and have zero interest of buying there.
I believe this will end up settling way below $20k. 500 way to many. Distros make $$$ to buying at $15k, same as Elvira. Just wont get the eye gouger
Never in history. That many at that price.
Agreed Doug,
Theme isn't going to be enough for me, and probably alot of PinHeads to bite hard on this....the Supreme analogy is the only thing that makes sense (being shown at CES, so who knows) to move the #'s w a stupid price tag.
Thankfully (hopefully), the dust settles next week....my FOMO died awhile back on this one, so I'll sleep well either way.....
Quoted from iceman44:There is no pinball Da Vinci. Or 500 Mona Lisa paintings
Stern and the Distros will make plenty of $$
If you haven’t learned yet then this will be the lesson learned.
Neither are our friends. Some try and stoke the FOMO train and lock people in like the email that was sent out by “that guy”
That is why “that guy” who got me once ain’t getting it again.
That guy is asking for deposits NOW
Who the F**k is "that guy" trying to pull this?....I'd never spend a dime there...... (didn't get an e-mail as I obviously am not on that list)
Quoted from iceman44:[quoted image]
Wow....unbelievably disappointing...... (makes me sad actually)
The bourbon derail always helps, lol.....
Biggest difference here is a sizeable , non refundable deposit on a game that we truly haven’t seen or know exactly what it costs, except that it is very, very expensive.
Complete speculation on both fronts, so the boundaries are just being pushed a bit far with an ask like that.
I too, appreciate Stern selling direct ( speculation?) to help steady the " padding".
This is just a very different approach to a game launch ( that Ive seen anyway)....
Hope its a hell of a game...then I might buy one...
Am still celebrating New Years eve however...hope everyone is being safe...
Quoted from demandecan55:Yeah other distros do this too for LE's lately. Maybe not all, but the ones I talked to. Maybe some big shots have different rules, but for an up and coming collector like myself; This has been the rules when I called everywhere for other releases in the past. Hence my confusion on the problem. I don't mean to offend... it's just like that for my friends and I who collect. It's why you see so many people selling their spots. They bought them upfront.
You cant offend me w Pinball so no worries ( though some legit d-bags out there). Fortunately, I spend my own $$$ for toys on my terms.
Glad you're getting into the hobby...very addictive but getting more expensive all the time.
Generally, you don't have to be a " big shot" but rather one of consistent business practice to get the games you want.
People sell spots all the time...used to be mostly flippers and those who fell for FOMO, then facing reality they cant afford every new game.
This stuff will thin the flippers, benefiting the hobby and all who are in it....just my 2 cents...
( if new hobbiests can drop $25k on a game blindly, more power to them I suppose...)
Quoted from pinballaddicted:Elvira is a great game... this what makes the collectible versions worth more money..
Bingo....timing was good ( or bad) on the 40th...depends how you look at it. Love mine and play it consistently GREAT GAME
Quoted from cooked71:Hard to find a connection between his Elvira 40th and Bond Sle.
At this point, the only speculated comparison is the price tag....
Suspect that will change in upcoming weeks, and ultimately the long haul...
Quoted from PinMonk:But yeah, genius-level coder with a deep understanding of accessibility and layered difficulty that made his games approachable for novices and a challenge for players. RIP.
Wander around my gameroom sometimes..... truly blown away with how many awesome , timeless games he's done. He was a one of a kind...
Well.....T-minus 48 hours I suppose. Happy New Year everyone. This one is certainly going to start off with a bang......
Quoted from demandecan55:After some thought I have decided I am going to get a Bond 60th. I am excited for tomorrow
Here is my reasoning:
1) We didn't get any good pin releases last year (2022), and the heavily rumored pins this year don't excite me. JJP's stuff seems lame, and a music pin and Venom (which could be cool) from Stern don't force my wallet to budge much. Spooky has gone downhill with their stuff. CGC is amazing, but they make games at a snails pace. So using that logic I believe this has a chance to be the best game of 2022 and 2023 combined. I am not saying it will be, but it just has greater odds due to less releases, lame titles, and some flops so far.
2) This next reason is kinda lame, but I think Stern will use this release as a barometer for their busines model. Can a limited machine at a super high cost work if there are no Premiums or other similar machines like it? Well, if they want it to work this 60th better be amazing to build FOMO for the next release. If this machine flops so does this business model as nobody here will forget about it. I am banking on Stern putting out a super product to incentivize future greed and limited runs.
3) Elwin + All Bonds in one game. I love the Bond franchise and it's music. So personally I am invested which matters a lot!
4) I can see people wanting all of Elwins games some day. If he continues to push out amazing pins that drive sales and innovation he will expanding Pinball for years. Collectors will want all of his gems, and that could possibly keep the price tag high.
5) I made the decision and I don't regret it immediately. No remorse like I have had in the past on other titles. I feel good about it. I have been looking for a single level game for a while and kept floundering on which one to get. Now that problem is solved. I might have to cut back spending in other places to get it, but that's fine. I will live with the bad art, and enjoy it for what it is.
Hope it works out for you. Just can't commit to something I haven't seen and don't know what it costs.....sort of basic criteria for me. Still in the " maybe" camp.......
In.... thru my Distro. Will catch up on bitching posts tonight.....game looks pretty cool and different from what Im playing now.
Excited to see how the content shakes out on the screen...
Carry on....
Just getting out of the hospital (work) from a nice 11 hours ..........
Funny the consensus narrative could have been posted well before launch ( although we are more in the nitpicky phase)
All these games are too damn expensive
All these games seem to stabilze at some sort of price well within what it was bought for....YEARS down the line...most for more
Even the few exceptions rarely sell for half what it was bought for, unless the game itself is shitty....
Many people buy these things to simply enjoy them.....the more I look at it, the more I like it ( and the pf screen doesn't even have game info displayed yet). Looks like a great shooter, and even the entire package is pretty cool....love the proprietary mirrored backglass, topper, armor and yes, even the "art".
Just my opinion, my $$$, so yes...I'm excited to play/ own this game...... 1 upvote...minority posting here ( I'm probably in the 1%, lol)
Quoted from Cobray:People made smart decisions in their life (obviously) so they could make stupid ones like paying $20,000 plus tax and shipping ($22K?) for this absurd offering.
"Some" people didn't pay $22k for this game, and everyone makes smart and stupid decisions in all areas of life.....
I'm no Stern defender......always enjoy when the posts start to attack the people buying the games for whatever reason. Happens every freakin release....
Think I'll let this thread run awhile, as I won't have anything of substance to add.......long day....
Quoted from skink91:This is truly the most shit hype thread ever.
Literally nobody in here is talking about aspects of the layout, despite bitching for months about no details, etc. and now we have photos of everything and a short video… but instead just a bunch of haters complaining about a game they wouldn’t have been interested in to start with.
Hype threads are guaranteed to be quite toxic...ALWAYS ARE..go look at old WOZ, BM66, etc....this is not a Diamond Lady, its an Elwin Bond ffs. Let the rage flow. Owners thread will have the info you'll appreciate.
Be happy for your purchase w your $$$. Looks like a great game....Im excited, cant wait to play it and after being on the fence, happy w what I saw ( finally).
Until someone buys a game for me, could really give a shit about the negativity....
Another reveal day on PinSide...thats all...
Quoted from demandecan55:I want there to be clips, but listen to this bit from Keith:
“ The ball times are short, whereas in modern games, they're telling the story, there’s all kinds of clips. Sometimes, the games can take a while. There's a lot to be said about the older games, and sometimes you just want to play a 10-minute game of pinball”
I interpret that as a fast, smooth shooting, bastard of a game w video assets added when it makes sense. Pretty confident they'll find a cool way to implement them...
Another reason for the pf screen...may not be alot of time for looking up...the whole package is just very intriguing to me...
Agree w the pinblades...this one screams for black mirror....
Quoted from flynnibus:I can’t understand why they would emphasize the bracket around the playfield monitor like that… instead of covering it with some sort of integrated art.
Agreed....
I'm just ready for the game and the owners thread......shit is just getting stupid in here, even for a "speculation" thread.
All the bitching isn't going to make it $7500.00. Even then people would bitch.
All the bitching isn't going to make it a hologram. Even then people would bitch.
It's released......take it or leave it...I waited, saw, then took 1.....why would anyone care except me.....move the f*k along...
(I'm sooo heartbroken by the wise people...NOT)...
Quoted from ASAC_Schrader:I can’t wait to rip those spinners! Game is gonna be a flow monster
"Good intentions post"....hang on to it for the owner's thread (soon)....nothing saving this one....
Quoted from cooked71:I'm honestly jealous you guys have justified buying this. It would be awesome having this in your collection. As long as you're happy with it, who cares
Kind and accurate assessment Pinbud.
Wouldnt be jealous however...I've " justified" far more questionable choices in my life, lol...
Quoted from docquest:My Batman66 LE topper was in the box and shrink wrapped on top of the boxed game.
Speaking of topper, George thought that the 60th topper was also going to be sold as an acessory for his Bond games.
But in the 60th trailer it says "exclusive topper" so maybe there will be a different topper for the GG Bond games?
I've wondered about that Doc...I think it says " the official 007 topper" ( or something like that) but doesnt say " exclusive to the 60th"....think it looks great regardless. I'd hope for this amount of $$$ it would only be available for the 60th....but then again, Elvira 40th didn't even come with one, lol..
Quoted from Dan1733:Can’t wait to see topper exclusive to 60th, so that the toppers get flipped for 5k.
If they are exclusive to the 60th....highly doubtful they will get flipped...BM66LE and SLE were pretty solid benchmarks there....
Will a knockoff be made? I'd definitely think so...
Quoted from demandecan55:Pretty sure I thought Gomez said his 007 game would have the same topper. Like... 83% sure
Love the "83%", lol
I played pinball and enjoyed it ( possibly) better when I had to scrounge quarters. ZERO chance I had funds to buy one, regardless of whatever they sold for back then...
Not grrr......reality. Some of these posts are absolutely laughable.
The world in general is an angrier place now, so it does make sense however.....
Just getting to read some of these pages....
Think " echo chamber" is my favorite ( maybe because Im an AV guy).
Funny thing...echoes are like microphones.. dont know good sound from bad sound....reinforce or repeat input indiscriminately.
The relentless " echo" in here is negativity ( price, design...just about everything actually)..
Guess its fun to amplify and perpetuate....gives me a headache....
A quiet place is in order until I get to play this badass game...( not an echo, just a first order reflection)...might engage more tomorrow evening, as bourbon night will be upon us....
Actually listened to the insider podcast a bit deeper just now.....think there is going to be a lot more than meets the original take here. Yes I'm getting one, but if I don't like it I'll just sell it. All the effort ( and talk) about the 4 optical spinners, integrated with a very modern, but retro look score reel, "unseen" gadgets, etc. just sounds incredibly fun and different than what I've been playing...idk. More under the hood than what is percieved ( from a fun and challenging perspective) imho....
They actually said the game has been targeted to be on the line in December, so maybe a Jan. Feb. timeline is somewhat realistic.
I'm barely an average player, so " billions and billions" of points never really excites me ( because I rarely see them, lol). Just get the feeling this is going to be a damn fun game....all I really ask of a toy. Bitched to see it....now bring it!!!
Sorry to interrupt whatever the current hate theme was trending currently....
Quoted from iceman44:And GWJ. It’s been a journey.
I was in on Alien, not Predator but tried to help him. Like Jpop, I never learn
It all ends well Aurich. Can’t be happier with Alien.
Thankful to just be part of it all.
Can’t we all just get along?
Been in far more toxic threads than this ( getting a bit out of hand though...suspect the new anger threads come out when the games actually land...yin/yang crap then...vitrol gets potent...thread ejects, locks, etc.)
Think the WOZECLE was absolutely a brutal thread several years ago......that and Alien were excruciating at times (parking lot drivebys, legit pitchforks, blatent threats ( as Aurich stated)......
This will die, and mostly vanish when the next game is out......
Sort of just noise to me, and only blocked 1 former Pinsider in my 10+ years (who eventually got permabanned and became a podcaster I hear ).
Don't have to like every game (or everyone) on here....I sure don't. But there are legit legends still hanging around (hell, LTG wants one of these) and I've got some great Pinbuds and games as a result of being here.....(shit 2 nice posts in a row...apologies)
Quoted from Mr68:I was thinking they would have been better used as a topper. You'd need to hit certain shots to line up 0-0-7 and then you'd get a 7 ball multiball or something.
They talked about that (not the topper part) in the Insider stream.
Quoted from iceman44:No doubt Mark. Where it all began for me.
WOZ and Jack. An LCD screen with video. Thought that was very cool. $6,500 was crazy back then
Here we are today. Pin life goes on
Big time Doug...ditto for me. My very first NIB (had other games but decided to take the plunge). Game barely played, and shit blew up all over the place...still have it and plays perfectly now after thousands of games.
Pin life does go on Pinbud!!!
Quoted from Mr68:[quoted image]
I had to pay, lol..pretty sad I suppose when you think about it.....
Quoted from Roostking:Owners can certainly just not visit the bond SLE cesspool
Deal?
True, but the noise actually doesn't bother me ( much)....besides, we're both Halloween owners and have enjoyed some of your posts....maybe not in here, but everyone has a voice in a public forum...even owners in a toxic speculation thread...
Maybe I'll get pissed instead of just avoiding the vitrol " concensus "..... tomorrow, lol.....deal?
Quoted from 27dnast:I played the 60th Bond Edition today at CES... fun game. Ball flow is great. Topper with lighting is slick. I particularly liked the ball flow through the upper left corner. Definitely felt Elwin-ish with how the ball can come down the left side and hook back out to the flipper.
These are going to be well loved in people's collections.
[quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image][quoted image]
Thank you for posting! Definitely sounds like ( and appears to be) a great game....getting sxcited..
Quoted from Zablon:But did you buy one? No one is debating if it is fun or not.
I think quite a few posts are debating it actually. My belief is it's driven by the tag " it would play ok at $5400.00" or crap like that...
Quoted from Zablon:Alien doesn't cost 20k and has a lot more value to it. The history is not even part of the equation for most that aren't aware of it, or even those who are.
PB Alien probably 1/2 the price of Bond 60 ( roughly).....twice the fun? We will see...retains value like the 60? We will see....( apples and oranges).
OG Alien story ( and game itself) are irrelevant here, and not worth the bandwidth.
Quoted from kermit24:Would any of the Bond 60th buyers be upset if this layout was re-used in another game? Part of the appeal for me (if I were buying) would be to have a unique Elwin layout you can't get anywhere else.
There has been talk that this could be used for other games, like the private label games.
Doubtful it would happen ( as referenced in last interview), but personally I could care less.
This is a very unique, almost one off for Stern....their words....very doubtful a path that will be pursued further....I caught alot listening to that stream carefully last night...
Quoted from MapleSyrup:If I don’t want an Alien, it has ZERO value to me.
What is “Value”?! Is it Cost Divided by Desire? Cost divided by Fun? Cost divided by Resale price X .5 of Fun??!
I buy games to Play them. Games that I want have a high value to me. Games that I don’t want have no value to me. I would never buy a game I didn’t want because it represented somebody else’s idea of a “Better Value”.
Many of my favourite games were made from ‘78-‘84. I’ve bought some of them for $600, and I’ve paid closer to $10K for some of them.
This game looks like the perfect marriage of my favourite things about pinball. Spinners, in-line drops. Difficult shooter with simple rules. Designed by the GOAT.
Price is stupid… every price for every luxury item is stupid. I’m looking forward to playing this one.
Let's not start bringing logic into this thread, lol
"value", "perceived value", and "worth" for luxury items are all subjective, based on what an individual is willing to pay for it, period.
Bourbon Night!!!
Quoted from iceman44:Billy out
Maple in
Bond girls.
Come on in Doug...the waters fine, and the game wreaks of pure pinball badass.
Quoted from CoinGuyNinja:This just gets better and better with bond60. LOL[quoted image]
This makes the SLE cheaper as it comes with the topper, correct?
Quoted from Zablon:Oh come now. EVERYONE bases what they buy on price. Just because I don't want one at 20k doesn't mean I wouldn't want one at 8k. Percieved value only skews so far. Even if this had been Alien at 20k I wouldn't have bought it. I think from what we've seen is that for the majority of the pinside members, 10-13k is about the limit. There's a minority willing to go above that and only under certain conditions.
Nope....EVERYONE buys things based on what they are willing , or capable of paying for it.
A choice can then be made....
I'll never defend this price ( way too high) or any other game for that matter....
Never defend the game itself...is what it is..will succeed or fail all on its own.
And definitely not defending or justifying what I choose to spend $$$ on...no need
Opinions are great...everybody has them...fun to read except when the main narrative has been repeated a thousand times....
Judging others for theirs? Well, not in my wheelhouse....
Ok...thinking we're in " spinnergate" currently...trying to catch up..
Quoted from Zablon:I think we're saying the same thing, just in a different way.
Very well could be, lol....Im just ready to play it!!
Think watching the reels keeping up w the spinners is going to be badass....they spent WAY too much time talking about those aspects to not be something unique..
Quoted from Jaytech10:I got to play this machine today for some time. Then I had to help pack up to get shipped back to stern. It shoots well and has a lot more going on than what I expected.
Yes!!!! Great to hear...
Quoted from pinballaddicted:Serious pinball decisions being made this arvo!
[quoted image]
Yes!! on my second pour and feeling fine for a Friday (brutal week). Decision is if you can find one and afford one, get it ( strictly my opinion, so means zero to those laying out the $$$). Very excited to shoot this!!!
Quoted from pinballaddicted:Question... is Bond60th sold out in USA?
Not aware of any left in the network I deal with (don't know everyone, obviously)....$17,400.00 is not a real Distro price...hope you find one!!
Quoted from pinballaddicted:We are good thanks! As soon as we have secured our spot I will post!
Bourbon is flowing now!
Excellent!!! as it should be....
Quoted from RGR:Was this much hate given to Supreme when it came out? (I Actually dont know)... What was the price of that game, how many units again? I am sure that was a far worse game than this.
As a side note, not sure if it was mentioned before but the reverse figure 8 shot imo does lock the ball given the angle of the left metal rail.
No....barely a topic...reskinned Spidey vault....can't remember how many made, but sold for stupid $$$ (3x this I recall, maybe still do) and gone instantly. No one here cared (including me). Definitely a niche market game that catered to the brand, not pinball at all...
Quoted from Vino:It’s was a nice mix of funny and hate.
From IPDB:
[quoted image]
Was it that cheap? Recall insane #'s tossed around....remember an auction for one around $37k, then remember some stuff as high as $60k
Quoted from flynnibus:700+ posts here…
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/stern-x-supreme-new-machine
And the usual downstream price threads… like this
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/the-40k-supreme
The difference is almost no one on pinside supports the kind of hype brand limd supreme so there really was far less angst as nearly everyone here thought the whole idea was dumb. Plus the game was a simple rehash so no pinball to debate either.
Certainly was a active topic…
Ahh....guess I just didn't care enough to pay attention....(700 posts in main Supreme thread, with around 4k in speculation here sort of sums it up)
Quoted from ASAC_Schrader:I’m starting to regret my decision to create a pinside account, this place is toxic. Can’t say anything positive or be excited about a game without getting a slew of down votes and belittled to death. You people are a strange bunch.
Can only offer that any public forum has this type of dynamic to it. Doesn't make it right, but is what it is.
Generally ignore the up/downvote stuff (hell, you downvoted me when I simply stated I didn't think the topper was going to be exclusive, lol).
Hype threads are always somewhat toxic, filled with those that bash the game and the people that committed to it at some point....all sorts of reasons...some have merit, most are repetitive rubbish.
Don't ever come into a hype thread expecting to get huge props for buying the game....outcome will be much different than possibly anticipated ( as you are seeing). That's owner thread stuff.
Minor suggestion, then on to more exciting things in my day (rearranging my sock drawer or something) - "you people" is definitely a combative phrase to address everyone here...might use a little discretion with that one if you can't handle the rebuttals.....
Onward Bond!!!!
Quoted from JSC:Intentional or not, they advertised it in 2 places as exclusive and it’s a material part of the product. If someone wants out they need to let them cancel.
I always interpreted "Commemorating this exclusive pinball machine, the James Bond 007 60th Anniversary Limited Edition includes the official James Bond 007 pinball topper" (from website) as "included and official", but never "exclusive"....though it should have one (Stern being sneaky). Backglass and armor are definitely exclusive, so you won't see those on the site....just my take on it.....
Quoted from Zablon:I've never sold a game since the first one I bought 30 years ago. Is that better?
And you only have 10 in 30 years!?! The shame, the shame.....
Quoted from Zablon:Control man...control
Not a term associated with the hobby......can't compute, lol.....
Quoted from JSC:I love Stern, own 5 machines with another on order. That doesn’t mean I cannot be honest about a mistake they made. They materially misrepresented a topper that is a significant part of the collectibility of a collectible item priced extremely high because of its scarcity. I don’t see how you can interpret the images from the flyer and video any other way. It is what it is, but I think they need to honor any cancellation requests that come as a result.
[quoted image][quoted image]
Have to agree with you as it was a very sneaky (kind) play on words on Stern's part. Kinda sniffed that one out early ( they never said " exclusive SLE Topper"...was hoping I was wrong....sadly appears not......
Quoted from CrazyLevi:No, because nobody takes a $50 burger personally. They just don’t order it and move in with their life.
Pinball super fans, however, are insane, and view pinball companies as their family members, or worse, as their friends, and view prices or games they don’t like as a personal betrayal.
It’s only getting weirder as time goes on.
Nope.......foodies ( I'm not one) pay absolute stupid, insane, astronomically high prices for specialty dining " created" by " renowned food artisans, then crucified, shut down, etc. In the aftermath.
Ive witnessed some of it ( " you're paying $ 1200.00 to eat where/ what?!).
Last I checked....zero resale on food Ive eaten...
No video/ audio assets? Wtf does it say that? So they put a premium sound system in to play nothing? I call serious bullshit speculation there...think this game will have audio references/ track snipets out the ass.
Screen in the PF...a GOOD thing...who knows what retro stuff they put in along with all sorts of direction that I can actually see, since Im staring at the damn playfield.
Time to ramp this shit down....seriously...same thing being said hundreds of times...
We should be past this phase...next official shitstorm should start after the games get in peoples hands, correct?
This is not just Stern...they just happen to be the largest, most legit players currently
( apologies Levi....condensing some responses in one post)
Quoted from Aurich:Pull up your favorite podcast app, I use Apple's, and search for "Keith Elwin". You'll find 8-10 interviews easy, and he's a great listen. Very chill, smart guy, and happy to give insights into his design process. You'll probably walk away with a greater appreciation for what he does.
There are a few weirdos in this thread who are hating on spinners of all things, but aside from them and the "hurr hurr it's a home level game because it doesn't have ramps" crowd I don't think anyone is really taking issue with what Elwin did.
This..
Quoted from kklank:Funny. Respectfully, This thread has had the exact opposite effect on me.
What really created traction for me was listening to the Stern Insider podcast interview of Elwin and Panacho.
This combination of experience and skill has possibly created a brilliant gem. It’s worth listening to imo.
Multiple multiballs and 2 “wizard modes” really intrigued me and from their discussion it seems more than likely a one off.
Also it’s worth watching an Elwin interview on YouTube 8 years ago where Keith has become the #1 world ranked player,
Interesting to hear his influences and how,IMO, he he got to where he is now and is in his prime. Seems like a really down to earth person that has a true passion for the hobby.
Price is wrong.
Artworkmeh.
But I’m big fan of both modern and old Ballys.
Just an opinion though.
Bingo
Quoted from phoenixpin:I would like to formally applaud the negativity of this thread. When the game came out I was on the fence but did consider buying it at 20k, in part due to FOMO. I’m not a ‘flipper’ but I like to buy games, have fun for 1-2 years, and sell them. I don’t mind losing $1-2k when I do even. The tsunami of negativity helped convince me I would lose much more than that if I were to sell the game in the future. You negative bastards saved me thousands of dollars. Time for me to donate to pinside.
If you let hype thread negativity keep you from buying games, you may never buy another....saving yourself tens of thousands of dollars ...... this game is not an insta-flip ....
Quoted from Roostking:Have you looked into that, you might be surprised!!!
Hope you're very, very wrong about that, lol...
Quoted from Roostking:Also, which of these pins look higher end if they sat side by side. [quoted image][quoted image]
In truth, the LE just looks like a typical LE......Premium w additional bling for thousands more...
Dig the retro vibe, modern approach they are doing w the 60th. I like it alot better as it has nothing in common w the other three models...taking a different road.
Idk....I like it, Im getting one, and probably getting redundant in my speak too.
Will slow down until I get the game in hand....
Quoted from metallik:Service menu. Hard to navigate settings using 4 score reels.
THAT is an amazing point and true, lol ( wasn't even thinking about it)
Will certainly be counting on more of course, but not really looking for huge video clips on this one ( I already have games which do very well in that department).
Quoted from cooked71:To be fair, the Stern settings menu is only marginally more advanced.
Too funny ( but true)
Quoted from chuckwurt:Every single super LE is the same. Everyone complains about what it isn’t. This has always been the case. Every hype thread devolves into a troll war.
Yepper....sort of the standard I suppose...
Seems some newer posters just cant seem to get out of their own way in this one ....possibly just perception on my part...
Guess we knew it would be a hellish week...." the thrill is gone" in this thread for sure...
Quoted from chuckwurt:Yeah. I wish they shipped games faster so owners threads could start, and actual interesting conversations about the game could continue faster.
Exactly....think this one is going to be an interesting dive...anxious to get started!!
Quoted from Beechwood:It would be playing VHS porn on the tiny playfield LCD. Not a bad idea considering the retro theme.
You might be on to something there... 
Quoted from thekaiser82:Last little bit of Old Forester Birthday Bourbon. This thread is more fun with bourbon.
[quoted image]
Finally...a voice of reason...think I'll join on straight pour...the tie that binds sanity in here!!
Quoted from pinballaddicted:Most excellent pinball buying decisions coming up!
Think I'm " decisioned" out, lol...now onto solving world problems, lol...
Quoted from thekaiser82:I was picking up dinner for the family and they had a bottle of this years birthday bourbon. So I had some while I waited. Need to figure out what’s next here at home.
" whats next" usually = " what do I have" at some point, lol....enjoy your Saturday evening!!
Quoted from thekaiser82:This is what’s next along with some pinball. Enjoy your evening as well. Mine will be full of whiskey and pinball.
[quoted image]
Great pic...enjoy!!
Quoted from Amused_to_Death:But, if its main purpose is to be a service menu, it sure as hell doesn’t need to be an ugly framed display smack dab in the middle of the playfield. Put a smaller sized display in a corner on the apron or hide the display inside of the back box or elsewhere in the cabinet.
I don’t get the mechanical score reels. If they were ever going to make sense, they needed to be implemented like they were with Whoa Nellie, in a custom old-style cabinet, and with a game based on the early Sean Connery films, not sloppily shoved into a modern day LCD cabinet that features the latest Daniel Craig films.
Artistically, The Beatles is a far better game. Franchi’s art is gorgeous. The LCD animations are beautifully done and scream retro. I’ve never once looked at The Beatles and thought it was lacking because it didn’t have mechanical score reels.
I’ve been on the list for a Bond SLE for years. Bond is a dream theme for me. Price isn’t a concern. Sadly, though, this game ended up being a hard pass for me.
We were kidding about the " primary purpose" part, and didn't believe a Bond SLE was anywhere near offical just a year ago, muchless " years".
Anyway, w respect, most of the bases have been covered here...exponentially in some cases, w the obligatory " hobby going to shit" posts.
This game is not a reskin, not a cornerstone, not anything Ive seen or played prior....a mix of retro and current technologies w an iconic theme and hefty tag.
Grateful I saw enough to be excited and have enough hard earned $$$ to give it a go. Guess we ( or at least I) will see.....enjoy your Saturdays and play the pins!!
Quoted from Daditude:Enjoying the posts and a bit of bourbon and cognac. Come at me.
[quoted image][quoted image]
Both? Nice! I dont think Ive got enough in me, ....
Um......you think golf is really a sport (?)
Quoted from Beechwood:Yes, yes it is a sport. Right behind it is pinball.
Ok...back in for a few..." hell no its not", and " the membership fees are destroying this hobby for all of us" ( confession...Im not a golfer obviously)
Quoted from Daditude:I'm a bigger drinker than most on here realize (sorry, I'm Irish).
I enjoy golf, but my real passion to play is disc golf. All the enjoyment and sport of golf with a fraction of the cost and wait times.
I will throw out an open invitation: if there are any pinsiders who disc golf ...feel free to message me to get together and play if you are ever in the Dallas-Fort worth area.
Wait...disc golf? Ive done that and actually enjoyed it....( and I'm more bark than bite w the bourbon...12 hour days gives me a nice Friday and / or Saturday pour)
Quoted from Daditude:Oddly enough, I don't drink when I play. I am a pretty serious player.
My handicap (lack of handicap) puts me in the semi-pro/pro range.
But is it a sport? Definitely ranks above golf at least...rather rub crushed glass in my eyes than watch that stuff on the tube....
Quoted from Zablon:I'm back. While you suckers were arguing and drinking your bourbon, I was getting laid. *internet flex*
We were talking golf, not arguing...( congrats however, lol...time well spent)
Quoted from Guinnesstime:With inflation, that’s a solid 2 hours.
Pricing the normal hobbiest right out of the market.... 
Quoted from 27dnast:Should have posted this here and not the other bond thread….
Topper Video!
Very, very nice!!! Backglass looks freakin great...whole game actually
Quoted from underlord:Hefty tag. Give it a go. Hard earned money. Stern needs you to work harder. What’re you doing wasting time. WORK! WORK! WORK! CONSUME!
[quoted image]
I’m only teasing. I’d play this but damned if I’ll ever get past the simple design and fucking PRICE. I’ve got other hobbies to enjoy. Fast cars and boat modeling. Both 1/2 this pinsane money now..
Lol....all good Pinbud...think the sauce might have been kicking in, so a little corny w that part....
The end should have said " my money, I like it, so Im buying the damn toy.. "..
Definitely hate the $$$ and silence ( no real gameplay vids yet)....but actually think it's going to be a fun pin....
Pricing across the board is just getting stupid...
I WILL WORK HARDER!!! ( not today though, lol)
Quoted from snaroff:The decision to bring back scoring reels and put an LCD on the PF with large text images that tells you what to shoot make no sense. By comparison, JJP's Dialed In Phone LCD looks brilliant.
Oddly, we are 180d out on this point....Dialed in Phone LCD is horrid to me (yes, played it quite a bit...hard "no" for me at any price).
Neither of us are "right or wrong"....just what we are willing to spend our $$$ on for our toys (that perceived value thing again)...
Choice is a good thing.....
Quoted from snaroff:I think you'd have to admit that if you were forced to have a 6-12 pin lineup, Bond 60th might not make the cut!
No idea yet, lol....
( haven't played it yet...hoping it's a keeper..who knows?)
Quoted from Zablon:I guess kind of related since it keeps coming up. Oh nooooss..
Morgan Stanley: Prices for Rolex, Patek Philippe and Audemars Piguet watches will keep plunging due to a flood of supply
https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/morgan-stanley-prices-rolex-patek-140000256.html
They forgot pinball.
The reality there ( watches) is it's still speculative...the " production increase" is slow, and secondary market still insane....not to mention the new models are exponentially more expensive than prior.
Are we still talking about this ( not referencing you in particular).?
Not a home Pin ( alot more going on), not inexpensive as tied in unique way to expensive license, not for everyone, and will be a non issue soon as they are pretty much gone already...
Guess it feels good to bitch; idk. The game is going to be badass in its own way..... everyone is not:
- Entitled to owning one just because they like pinball
- Will appreciate or care to see why its expensive and different
Good grief ....how many more pages?
Quoted from skink91:LOL. Not gonna lie, I do enjoy arguing about stuff in general - but when you discuss things in a public forum, and people are making generalizations about one side or another and their motivations, IQs, income/class levels, upvoting/downvoting, etc. etc. and you know the statements are a direct result of things said as an organic aggregate of all the various posts… we all get invested in the discussion if for no reason other than the time we spend in here involved in it.
I will attempt to try and better(?) understand when it is acceptable for me to believe a comment is being directed at me or the idea that I agree with or something(?)… and when I am personalizing(?) vs stating an opinion but just know that this is rather confusing to keep straight as you see it… so I will more likely than not fail at this endeavour.
When it gets incredibly personal or stupid( generaizations berating buyers or blatent attacks designed for just a reaction) is when I cant help myself....mostly on games Im interested in....
I do try to maintain civility, when some truly dont deserve it...
Just not needed, and doesnt change anything...
In every speculation thread sadly, and suspect the owners thread will be started by a Mod for this one ( like WOZ) to keep it on the tracks....
Quoted from Mr68:Well, I tried to turn this into a boating thread.
BTW. I forgot to classify the Bond Premium buyers. Here they are running a load of coke.[quoted image]
I do like the boat....WAY overpriced, too limited, and looks just like a dingy to me....
( made an attempt to derail w golf and bourbon...not much traction)
Quoted from TreyBo69:If we're going to talk about expensive ugly boats, let's bring it back to Bond movies[quoted image]
Yes, yes....boat derail please!!!
Talk about way overpriced, cash dump, zero ROI!!!
Im painfully in the market for one now...( by default of property location)
Quoted from iceman44:Agree with all of the above Kim except for I wouldn’t call the Pro buyers winners either price wise.
In the FUTURE, not for those living in the past, the Goose is cooked.
1,000 LEs is NOT “limited”. Try that $13k on Venom or most other titles. Nope
500 is NOT some kind of “rare” number worldwide as Stern promotes it.
Same goes for the overpriced Premiums.
Inserts anything JJP here as well. Their new pricing model has already failed. And it’s NOT just TS4
Of course they will always sell some pins of any theme regardless of price. But the pool of those buyers is decreasing.
That’s the FUTURE. Some here can dismiss the pissed off feelings of past buyers, I wouldn’t if I were JJP and Stern.
Then again, sometimes lessons have to be learned the hard way
I’m still going to enjoy the overpriced pins I might buy, but those FUTURE buys are gonna fewer and far between.
Agreed Doug...
Was certain I'd broke the chain when I bought Halloween INSTEAD of Godzilla ( love both by the way)...rather than buying them both...my way of backing off...
Really had zero intent to buy Bond60, but swear there is something about it that really appeals to me...
My " futures" are going to be very thin, as it's getting harder and harder to look away from the insanity, price wise.
Quoted from TreyBo69:Two best days of boat ownership: the day you buy one, and the day you sell it
Completely agree!!! No middle ground at all....just $$$ and pain/ liability...
Quoted from Bublehead:Pinball Machine = Boat minus water.
Both are a hole in which to throw money, one just happens to be in the water.
Admirable comparison, but have lost major $$$ and untold grief on the seas...boats are pure, stupid $$$ ...$20k doesn't touch anything, and worth pennies on the dollar in a matter of years ( after they self destruct)...
Quoted from snaroff:Seems like the consensus is this release isn't for a majority of pinsiders (who tend to be players, collectors, hobbyists...ya know, passionate pinball folk). It's for trophy collectors that tend to have more money than genuine love for the hobby (yes, I realize not EVERYONE fits into that box MK6PIN. The game Stern directed at "us" was the Gomez edition with video assets and the standard Pro/Premium/LE lineup. When I think of it this way, it makes a lot of sense...just like I don't pay attention to Stern's "home pins"...not a product I cared about. In fact, the only reason I've care about this release is Keith was leading it. If it was being led by Koris Borloff, I wouldn't have given it so much attention (https://www.thisweekinpinball.com/spooky-announces-halloween-pinball-deep-dive-in-depth-overview-of-the-machine-features-rules-and-more/).
Good thing you put the disclaimer in, lol...
Back to the boats!!!
Quoted from glasairpilot:BOATT = Break out another Ten Thousand
Fixed that for you....
And that's that...truth
Newsflash....
Game wont need saving.....and thats not just my take... 
( might be one of the only ones still engaged to a degree here though)
Carry on....
Quoted from ZNET:Kim knew what you meant to convey by the metaphor. But, the literal reading is far more entertaining.
Lol...yes
Quoted from Zablon:yeah, it should be pretty quiet in there with the 3 or 4 people that will be in there! <mic drop>
I kid of course, pretty sure there's lurkers out there who haven't strapped up their boots and posted in here.
Lol, even simple math would provide otherwise....even though there will be a whopping 250 units in the US, doubt many will engage. I'm hoping so, as really want to deep dive what I believe to be lurking in this one, beyond being a stupid expensive, great shooter......
Sort of don't mind these threads until they get too personal....even then..."stay the course" ( I've had lots of practice)...
Quoted from Gribbs:…not true. A game in my collection might not get play for a while, but then it will come ‘back in rotation’. Do they ALL get played ALL the time? …of course not. However, I am about to hit TSPP and AC/DC Luci after not playing them for a few years. If I had let them go, I could not continue to enjoy my favorite games. I know everyone doesn’t have that desire or luxury (I have had to let some go that I would have preferred keeping), but I just offer this as one collector/player’s perspective.
Thats how I roll....almost feels " new" when you haven't played it in awhile...
Quoted from Gribbs:The ones I KNOW I love can sit for a while, but when I go back and play one game I tell myself: “THAT is why I love that game!”
Played my WCS and Spidey this past weekend...forgot how fun they really were!!!
Quoted from Rarehero:Send Spidey back to me so you have room for this…thing.
Shall never Greg!! Spidey still kicks ass..
( learning to love dotsxl too!!)
Quoted from Aurich:It's pretty much peak Pinside to quote the Tilt forum wiki to crap on a game, and not look at the posts under it, where Keith posted the basic ruleset days ago.
Anyways, for those who are curious, here it is straight from the game designer. I don't really blame him for not wanting to post it here tbh.
KEITH ELWIN:
I didn’t do the rules for this game but they are pretty good. I’ll copy Mark’s rule doc here. It’s a little out of date but fills in more info
A, B, and C A, B, and C targets increase bonus multiplier.
Top Lanes Completing 007 Lanes lights pop bumpers for additional score, and awards what is indicated on back panel.
Collect Bonds Completing various items (B-O-N-D targets, Villain mode) will light Collect Bond on left scoop.
Collecting all 6 Bonds will start Bond Multiball.
Bond Multiball During Bond Multiball, Pops, Loops, Drop Targets and the Oddjob Disc all advance the movie meter to award the next Bond movie
in sequence.
Bonus Bonus is collected at the end of each ball. Various targets and awards will increase bonus.
Bonus can also be collected via ball entering shooter when lit. Hitting second inline drop target, or completing top lanes two times
will light bonus collect on shooter lane.
Outlanes Awarding third gadget award will light alternating outlanes for underwater escape ball save.
Return Lanes Hitting first inline drop target will light alternating return lane for bonus advance.
Return lanes will light corresponding spinners and/or Oddjob disc for extra points.
Captive Ball Hitting captive ball will award corresponding lit value; add 2 bonus, extra ball, and jackpot.
Combos DR. NO Combo - top center loop, top center loop.
ON HER MAJESTY’S SECRET SERVICE Combo - top left loop, top center loop.
MOONRAKER Combo - top center loop, top left loop.
THE LIVING DAYLIGHTS Combo - top left loop, top left loop.
GOLDENEYE Combo - top center loop, inline drop target.
SKYFALL Combo - top left loop, inline drop target.
NO TIME TO DIE Combo - top center loop, captive ball.
A VIEW TO A KILL Combo - top left loop, captive ball.
B-O-N-D targets Lights Oddjob disc to award playfield gadget lights. Awarding fourth gadget (X-Ray Glasses) start Gadget Multiball.
Lights left scoop for Collect Bond.
M-I-6 targets Lights Oddjob hat to select Villain mode (when unlit). Starts corresponding Villain Mode (when lit).
When completed successively during Villain mode, will add time to the timer, and double Villain Mode scoring.
Inline targets First inline target lights return lanes for bonus increment. Second inline target lights collect bonus on shooter lane.
Third inline target will allow access to right scoop for Mission Multiball. Hitting right scoop when lit will start Mission Multiball.
Gadgets Completing B-O-N-D targets will light the Oddjob disc to advance the gadget meter to award one of 4 gadget lights. Gadget awards are:
Jetpack - Hold Bonus.
Spy Camera - Button on lockdown bar lights to open right scoop for lock.
Gondola - Light outlane for Under Water Escape ball save.
X-Ray Glasses - Start Gadget Multiball
Gadget Multiball During Gadget Multiball, the Oddjob disc will advance the gadget meter to award one of 60 movie gadgets. Gadgets earned are remembered
between games if playing using a Stern Insider Connected account.
Mission Multiball Locking a ball inthe right scoop will start Mission Multiball. This multipart mode has several steps that must be completed to award jackpot.
Phase 1 - two ball multiball - Locking one ball in either the right or left scoop will start a timer to lock the second ball. Locking both balls
will start Phase 2.
Phase 2 - three ball multiball - Locking one ball will light timer on captive ball for jackpot. Locking two balls will light timer on captive ball for double jackpot.
Phase 3 - After scoring jackpot, M target will light on a timer for super jackpot.
If multiball ends during phase 1, the right scoop will light on a timer to restart Mission Multiball.
Pop Bumpers Score 1 point, or 10 points when flashing. Top lane completion will make one of the pop bumpers flash. Second top lane completion will make both pop bumpers flash.
Extra points awarded for every 25 pop bumper hits.
Villain Modes One of 6 timed modes
Jaws (Super Spinners) - Hit spinners to complete mode.
Zorin (Super Pops) - Hit pop bumpers to complete mode.
Oddjob (Super Disc) - Hit Oddjob disc to complete mode.
Trevelyan (Super Loops) - Shoot top left and top center loops to complete mode.
Blofeld (Super Drops) - Hit B-O-N-D and M-I-6 drop targets to complete mode.
Flashing drop target will raise previously hit targets.
LeChiffre (Super Shots) - Shoot lit shots to complete mode.
In all Villain modes, Completing M-I-6 targets will extend the timer. Second completion will double mode scoring.
Completing all 6 Villain modes will light left scoop for Villain Multiball.
Villain Multiball Extra points are awarded for lit spinners. Completing shots on all 4 spinners will restart the spinner sequence.
007 (Wizard) Mode Playing Bond Multiball, Gadget Multiball, and Villain Multiball on a single game will light the left scoop for 007 Mode.
This multipart mode has several steps that must be completed.
Phase 1 - Increase 007 Mode value - While this timer is running, all scoring shots increment the bomb defuse value. Ball save is locked on during this phase,
and any ball drained are replaced with new ones.
Phase 2 - Inline drop targets must be hit while the timer is running. Hitting the right scoop before the timer expires defuses the bomb and starts 007 Multiball.
Phase 3 - During 007 Multiball, all shots award extra points.
Yep, game is shallow and gonna suck for sure...
Quoted from TreyBo69:Are you really even playing pinball if you’re not also watching chopped up moments from some of the Bond movies you like?
Lol...
Suspect I'll be playing this one....alot...
Quoted from Aussiepinwiz:If some distributors are sending back to Stern some of their initial allocation, what is the general consensus:
a) Stern won't produce all 500 units
or
b) 500 units will be produced and all will eventually sell to other distributors?
- Call bs on " sending back their allotments " . If so, a well heeled distro would take them. There ARE distros that dont have a game to sell currently.
- Making 500, not 501 or 499...
- Not hyping anything and dont really care...just my opinion on the question
Back at central division this AM working.....seeing the trend (correction - spiral) here, I will guess another thread will need to be started to discuss things like any streams, info as it gets shown, etc. prior to the owners club with any type of sustained positive light.
No one was forced to buy...company didn't go bankrupt and steal anyone's $$$. certain all deposits would definitely be refundable.. (on and on)..but shitstream seems to be absolutely relentless. The game is too expensive....we get it....once and for all.
Not whining, simply observing...contemplating how to learn/ convey/ share positive aspects of this unique game. I'll attempt to spin a thread up tonight (if one doesn't already exist) to try to discuss other things, pre-owners club (example = Aurich's rules post w zero traction, shot layouts w minimal, etc.). Granted we haven't SEEN anything, just no reason it can't be discussed in speculative fashion.
Childish, when 75% (minimum) in here were never going to buy the game regardless (f**king fact) but speak "gospel"....ahh...Pinside....
Quoted from Zablon:I wouldn't call any of this entitlement. Clearly there are a few here that just don't get it.
And clearly MANY that won't let it go......
Quoted from Zablon:What I would say is at this time there are way more negatives to talk about on this game than positives. Even the video above shows this pretty clearly. Seems to me everyone is free to talk about what they find is positive, and there has been but there's just a lack of those things.
Let's talk about the spinners.
With respect....this is a majority viewpoint, somewhat mob driven consensus, easily ( and justifyably to a major degree) driven by price.
There are positives about the GAME itself that can have subjective, speculative discussion (hype/ speculation thread, remember)....just will never get traction in here when washed away by the fact the most who want the game aren't going to chime in. Smart people (wiser than me, obviously).
Supposed to be a pinball community.....hell, I could count a dozen or more games I'd never own, and just jump on the destruction trail. Choose to refrain, as zero to be accomplished, simply move to something else of interest to me.
Even a Pinsider or 2 that I rarely see eye to eye with admitted "the game looked the best out of the 4 offerings", throwing in a few positives, before stating the obvious price rub.
FFS - this isn't beyond even a dead horse .gif.......my pre-11am meeting soapbox.
Quoted from Beechwood:They refrained from showing any real gameplay in that video. Why?
Maybe an official stream coming w Elwin playing? IDK. It's not like at this price point and oddity of the approach, they needed hype. Geesh.....
So NOT seeing something makes it shit? Nope....price, price, price, or 3/4 of this thread wouldn't have materialized, and the context much different.
Quoted from Beechwood:I in no way think it is shit or insinuating as much. I am seriously curious why they went out of their way to hide gameplay. If it's good, they should at least show a little something. I for one can's wait to see a stream with gameplay. No matter what I think of the price, I am definitely interested to see it in action!
Not directed at you, more the narrative of the thread in general. I do want to see gameplay (by someone who plays much better than myself). "The King" himself admitted he doubted he'd ever roll this game....both exciting and terrifying at the same time.
Just not certain it's a priority, given the reasons stated above (price, and approach). Doesn't make it right, but is what it is.
I'd show you my gameplay at somepoint....guessing the shortest vid of all time based on Elwin's comments....
Quoted from Roostking:Why are they suckers? I would guess many of the people buying this pin are probably pretty good with $$$ and wieghed the plus and minus. I dont understand the need to KEEP calling buyers names or inferring they are stupid making this purchase. I think, way over priced, who doesnt, but the rules do look really cool and if I had the extra funds, id be a sucker too.
Remember $20,000 is a decent amount to me, to others, they lose x2 that in a day in the market, and they still can afford to be suckers.
Thank you....
Quoted from Zablon:Biggest question is now, are all Elwin games going to be 20k from now on? That seems to be the only thing people are judging this on.
Doubtful, but every single game is getting stupidly priced....
Quoted from Aurich:I’ve been as critical as anyone I think, without name calling buyers. But it’s clear people just want to be mad, and not talk pinball.
I can think the game is overpriced and not the most compelling package while also being very curious about how it shoots and plays.
We can do both.
Exactly......
Quoted from yancy:Why can't you just talk about it here? What makes you think a new thread with less traffic will spur more discussion? Resist forum clutter!
Agreed, and there has been info of substance in here regarding speculation....guess I opened the thread to about 40 posts or so, just regurgitating the same noise....caused me to pause and contemplate a bit.
Probably more legit " speak" in the most recent pages...
AND...approx. 155 posts since we thought civility was reached approx. 6 hours earlier........
Seem to have gained a consistent downvoter ( regardless of what I'm posting).......
All signs the thread is doing fine.
Trying to care (as I am the sensitive type)...not gonna happen.
Quoted from JohnTTwo:How often does the pinside mob mis the mark?
I got pinsided out of getting this game and am leaning towards getting one again thinking maybe this could be a awesome game in my line up.
If you let Pinsiders decide what game to buy....then it's sadly you that have missed the mark.
Enjoy and be happy w your purchase, or don't do it....your decision alone, as it's your $$$.
Quoted from Crumbalimb:This is interesting, MGM wanted to do this.
"Desiring a higher-priced 007 machine for the collector’s market, MGM commissioned Stern to release a game commemorating the franchise’s 60th anniversary featuring elements from every released movie in the series so far"
Keith Elwin game, and 1/2 the games overseas. If stern doesn't make a Goldfinger edition or reuse the playfield for another game, this game is going to be 30k a few years from now.
Won't speculate $$$ on anything pinball, but was fully aware of the reasoning...
Quoted from doublestack:I thought this was known to anyone following this. Gomez said it on one of the many podcasts he was on recently. Licenser wanted this and it was part of the package to get bond.
Too busy going ballistic over the price to remember I guess.
Quoted from cooked71:I doubt it's commission like Supreme The Pabst Can Crusher or Heavy Metal . Weren't those effectively produced and "owned" by the license holder (ie pabst supreme etc)? No brainer for Stern to run those since there was no downside/risk. The rumour is that this was a model insisted on by Bond as part of the full license package. Still Stern's game though.
Agreed...and this is no reskin or minor theme...
Just not worth the bandwidth for discussion in this thread anymore....this game will stand ( or fail) on its own...
Quoted from Beechwood:I guess we need to know who updated this information in the Tilt forums. That is the only place I see this information.
[quoted image]
This was in an Insider Podcast very, very early on...
Quoted from Zablon:and lord knows things said on podcasts before the product is made are always true and correct and should be considered scripture.
(and as if everyone watches all of those)
What I do know is...4 spinners. 4 of them.
1....2....3....4. In. No. Va. Shun.
I will run up to Tilt if they get one and give it a few rolls. If it's not all stop and go, I will probably love it.
You're definitely worked up on this and can't really figure out why. Statements presented to validate what has been posted, yet constant deflection....
Just a game, and you've seem reasonably balanced in the past. Im only offering to further reinforce what has been stated on the positive side of things.Been out there awhile...
I was NOT going to buy this game!! From what I have seen ( more importantly heard) there was no way I could pass. This game, for me, will be a keeper...period. Too much going on to not be.
Can respect those that dont feel the same for whatever reason. Beyond stupid expensive, I cant validate a pass.
Really stirring people for sure....feel good with your decision...just not going to change mine...
Quoted from ptrav1:I can make predictions too. They'll sell all 500 and in one year people will wish they could get one for 20k.
Agree with this...but if I like the game, Im not selling anyway.
If I don't like it, then I'll just sell. To Dougs point, I dont buy any game w intent on making $$$ after ( if) I sell. Losing some money on it wouldn't bother me ( will never be $12k....f*king stupid, attention getting comment).
Oddly haven't lost $$$ on a single game Ive ever sold though......guess Bond60 is just THAT bad..lmfao...
Quoted from iceman44:My prediction is still the same for 2023.
The current pricing structure isn’t sustainable for the pinball masses.
Stern won’t see 1,000 LEs at $13k UNLESS people are just resigned to losing $$$ on the secondary market.
If that is a main concern for folks then you shouldn’t buy the pinball machine, any of them.
The days of buying, playing and flipping for more $$$ are over.
I would be ok with paying $18k for a BondSLE, playing it for however long to enjoy it and then IF it’s $12k next year or 2 years from now, that’s ok with me, the relative “value” is worth it to me.
Same thing with a BondLE at $14,500 shipped and taxes.
IF I ever sold for whatever price lower I’ve already gotten my FUN value out of it.
I get why most people don’t feel that way which is why the Stern and JJP Gooses are somewhat cooked OR they simply have to adjust in the future.
That’s what make pinball FUN, we get to “collect” and play what we like.
And it’s not just something that sits on a shelf to look at like my vintage graded basketball cards (worth more than my pins today)
Agreed and well put.
Quoted from SLRage:I gotta say I respect your attitude toward all this drama. You seem like a stand-up guy.
Appreciate the kind words....Im oddly immune to most of the drama....kind of like babies screaming on an airplane ( I fly alot for work)...they always do it.....every flight....just naturally tune it out and do my work just fine....
Pinball is my hobby...my escape from the madness...no crybaby is ever going to affect my buying decisions or enjoyment of the game, lol.
There are good people in here that contribute to the hobby and enjoyable to chat with in the PM's...
Then there are the others...
( standing now, but yes, bourbon Friday)
Too stoked for this game!!
Quoted from underlord:I’m gonna say this. If you play it and decide it’s awesome I’ll call this SLE version a win. For you.
More than fair, lol..
Quoted from snaroff:Wow - that's pretty remarkable! I've been in this hobby pretty deep for 20 years and have had a great run. I've made more money than I've lost and consider myself fortunate. Nevertheless, I've lost $$ on the following 6 games in 20 years (which is roughly 10% of the games I've purchased):
HEP AFM (-3k), Aerosmith (-$600), Munsters (-$400), SWLE (-$250), UMCE (-$1,250), IM (-$800)
From my perspective, it's inevitable that as prices go wild there will be much more opportunity to lose money. Who cares? Nice cars depreciate like crazy yet I still enjoy them. I also like investing...not all investments work out It's unfortunate that so many folks are fixated on "never losing money"...
Probably because I still have most of the one's I purchased, lol........
Quoted from ASAC_Schrader:Jus got word my Bond 60th ships out next week!
Congrats!! Hoping I get a call this week....
Quoted from pinmister:I have not made any calls about this game, but I am curious about the chatter. What are distros saying about this game? Sold out-available-how much? Seems like crickets with the details
Are distros going to hold these like the Beatles? Inquiring minds want to know
Think Id just call around tomorrow for a straight, real answer( kind of). The three (3) distros I buy from had sold their allotment to end users.
I also know of one distro that has a Godzilla LE, but not letting it go....to say these games are readily available in quantity or completely sold out is highly, highly doubtful...Pinside talk....
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