(Topic ID: 322628)

James Bond 60th Anniversary Edition $LE (Super Limited Elwin) Hype Thread

By TreyBo69

1 year ago


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“Is $19,999 a lot of money for a pinball machine?”

  • Yes 207 votes
    41%
  • Indeed 17 votes
    3%
  • Affirmative 20 votes
    4%
  • True 10 votes
    2%
  • Absolutely 56 votes
    11%
  • Indubitably 97 votes
    19%
  • Most assuredly 39 votes
    8%
  • Undoubtedly 62 votes
    12%

(508 votes)

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#196 1 year ago
Quoted from frolic:

This hobby continues to surprise me.
Stern seems to be in a "no lose" situation with this. Those 500 will sell, or they won't. But they won't know if it was possible unless they try. And if it doesn't, they've got plenty on the line.

I suspect 500 will sell pretty quick.

#199 1 year ago
Quoted from John_I:

For sure. This is as much of a reward for the dealers as anything. Normally they are strongly encouraged to stick to MSRP even on LEs. On this game the dealers are only given a minimum price they can charge. There is no MSRP and the sky is the limit depending on what people will pay. This gives the dealers a chance to rake in on some FOMO instead of the flippers. Stern makes their buck on the volume sales of the cornerstone pro/pre/LE sales. They will surely make money on the 60th too, but with only 500 made you factor in the development costs are higher per machine and the extra cost of the license. The lack of premiums (Elvira) or golds (Beatles) means these 500 will be it so the value should hold pretty firm (unless the Goldfinger LE is based on the classic playfield version!!).

IP costs will be dispersed along the four pins being made and a single level game will be faster & cheaper to develop compared to a game with ramps and subways.

Complexity of new mechs is an unknown factor in cost of course.

#201 1 year ago
Quoted from TreyBo69:

I can hold out hope that they like the design enough to retheme it to some other games like Whoa Nellie and the Spider-Man Home variants
Course it may be hard depending on just how integrated this game is with the theme... quick what's another property Odd Job's hat would work in? Charlie Chaplin? Clockwork Orange?

Doesn't have to be a hat, could be a jeep in jurassic park.

#215 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

People keep saying "they are only making 500 I'll never even be able to play this Elwin classic!"
I'm just pointing out that's bullshit. As someone else pointed out, there are under 200 BBBs on the planet and we've all played it.
I'm not able to buy one? Who gives a shit. I'll sleep like a baby at night without owning the mega-rare pins.

There are a few hundred titles I have never played and it won't budge the needle a jot if I never play 007 SLE.

There will be dozens I do play and enjoy myself.

#321 1 year ago
Quoted from sunnRAT:

The hobby caters to anyone who can afford it, not just super rich CEOs. No one is forcing you to pay for what they're offering.
And yes, there are plenty of other options other than NIB pins, at many different prices. Not sure why folks fail to see that.
I could care less about Toy Story. Not owning or playing that game has no effect on how I enjoy the hobby. But if were talking TS4 prices, I'd rather have a few classic Ballys or Sys 11 and probably have cash left over.
No NIB. No problem. Plenty of fun in this hobby and no one needs to be a super rich CEO to have it.

The pinball market caters to a number of different buyer price points, no different than a number of other goods consumers purchase.

#323 1 year ago
Quoted from sunnRAT:

And that's what keeps things interesting, atleast for some of us. Nice haul btw.

1) The more expensive pins tend to subsidize the less fancy ones, again true for a number of markets.

2) Early adopters of expensive tech drive down the prices till it reaches an affordable level for the masses. Think how expensive large panel TV's were 20 or 30 years ago. Now those same panels "the rich" paid good coin for are virtually worthless and just about anyone can get a large panel TV for chump change.

Frankly if someone wants to pay for exclusiveness which includes toppers, powdercoat and numbered plaques that doesn't change my enjoyment of pinball one iota and they can have at it. Some people choose to drive beaters, others pavement princess SUVs that never see a drop of rain or snow.

An ass for every seat as we say in the auto trade.

Thanks for the nod on the lot pickup, my prior best was 6 pins at a go and I doubt I'll top 12 anytime soon if ever.

#336 1 year ago
Quoted from kklank:

Last thing, the notion that “rich people” will just plunk down say…25k because they can is silly.

A number of Diamond Beatles pins sold for 25k at release.

So there is people who have disposable income where 25k is a not an major hardship to ownership.

I would not mind a Pro myself but so far have managed to avoid buying a NIB pin.

#385 1 year ago
Quoted from nicoy3k:

It’s not a linear thing, billionaires would not be ok paying $1000 for a roll of toilet paper.
Stern is f ucking their existing customers and the pinball community with there outrageous prices. It’s a short term money grab at the expense of pinball. There are ways to maximize revenue and grow a business that don’t involve alienating the people that support your industry.
At these prices the community will slowly die, and the rich collectors will move on to another hobby when they realize no one cares about their 15k stern LE turd anymore

They have a pin for all price points.

Stern will be just fine.

#408 1 year ago
Quoted from iceman44:

I don’t know anybody saying that for $25k and Elwin “I want it now”.
Maybe some flipper pumpers?
No way 500 sell for that despite what some might try and FOMO BS pump this
It sounds great, but can’t imagine a $25k single level game without an LCD screen in the back box I don’t care who designs it

All 500 will be gone in hours if not minutes.

#412 1 year ago
Quoted from iceman44:

If it's for $25k then I'll pick one up for $17,500 30 days later.
Not this time. Unless it's in the $18k range, then they go fast depending on what is actually in there.
FOMO pumping.

With only 500 available even with the steep price they will go fast.

#416 1 year ago
Quoted from iceman44:

What is the "steep price"? They said the same thing about Beatles and Elvira 40th.
"Only 500" is a LOT of pins after selling 1,000 LE's.
What price?

The SLE is a totally different pin than the LE.

They will be gone quick, just like the LE.

#422 1 year ago
Quoted from iceman44:

It's a single level game, like Beatles. They won't be gone quick at any price.
The LE is $13k

Give a time frame.

People were all shrieking it was a money grab and the LE was literally gone in seconds.

500 SLE wont take long to vanish either.

#438 1 year ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Go ahead and get you one for $25k then

I have no interest in ordering one, the product isn't for me.

I simply note past sales numbers, time and pricing.

Stern certainly thinks 500 will sell and Gary Stern strikes me as a guy who takes few risks in the this area.

#505 1 year ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

Why do people think that ramps are like 90% of the BOM? Haha

Without getting too off track and setting aside labor what would be the largest expense? Cabinet has to be the largest, have you seen the cost of quality wood?

#509 1 year ago
Quoted from TreyBo69:

In the past, I've heard a fully assembled cabinet and associated parts was around $1,000. That was a few years ago before wood became stupid expensive...
There are a ton of common parts all games use too. They all have at least two playfield node boards (the home game variants only have one), ball trough, dual plunger, two flippers, and two slings. That's a few hundred bucks right there.

Node board cost is far less than what we pay.

Wood though, can't dodge that one.

#530 1 year ago
Quoted from Sako-TRG:

They make pin cabs from grade 1 walnut?

Looks better than the junk being sold at average big box store.

1 week later
#647 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Yeah the idea that your average moneyed bond super fan has ever heard of terms like “street level” or is concerned that an AIQ pro is in fact a “better deal” is pretty ridiculous. They’ll just buy it.

Most people are unaware pinball machines have rules.

#648 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Just face it folks: Gary stern will be bathing in cash in a gilded solid gold pool for the rest of his days.

Correction sir!

If the pool is solid gold there is no need to gild it as that is the process of adding gold leaf to a non-gold object.

#650 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Good catch.
Let’s go with diamond encrusted bathtub with gilded fixtures!

Emeralds have a little more contrast with some platinum fixtures.

#652 1 year ago
Quoted from beelzeboob:

Chlorine has a corrosive effect on gold. So in a few months, Gary's tub is really gonna look like crap.

Which is why he uses the finest water drawn from artesian wells.

#654 1 year ago
Quoted from pch3727:

Also I don't thing bond super fans who aren't pinball fans are gonna even know this thing exists.

Bond marketing might reach further than you think.

#741 1 year ago
Quoted from JohnTTwo:

By the way loved the code name for Bond “Jaws” LMAO +1 on that one stern!!

It's a nice bit of misdirection and I still chuckle when I see folks thinking Stern is going to release an actual Jaws movie pin.

BTTF is the code name for Rush (for the time machine in the center of the playfield)

11
#749 1 year ago

I have never seen people so wound up over a pin when no official pictures have been released nor any official pricing.

It's just crazy to me.

2 weeks later
#904 1 year ago
Quoted from jeffspinballpalace:

Stern is on a power trip.

Paging CrazyLevi!

Stern is doing no such thing.

1) Stern sees pins trading hands for mad amounts of money and rightly so they would like some of that bonanza.

2) Limited edition pins less units are sold which does not defray costs well due to the small number being made.

3) If they are using assets and music from 25 different Bond movies licensing alone will be through the roof per unit.

#932 1 year ago
Quoted from TreyBo69:

A single level has no ramps (or very minor ones like Seawitch). That's almost all pinball pre early 80s. They can be pretty loaded with shots and mechs (like an Eight Ball Deluxe). A street level was a Gottlieb style of game that made single level games for super cheap in the early 90s.
Single level = no ramps
Street level = single level with low BOM

Seawitch has zero ramps.

#936 1 year ago
Quoted from Tuna_Delight:

I guess you can shoot it (sort of), but I wouldn't consider that a ramp at all.

Exactly, is this configuration it's just a one way gate.

#939 1 year ago
Quoted from TreyBo69:

It may function as a one way gate, but it's a small ramp. Fireball's skillshot ramp is another weird gray zone of "it's a ramp, but not the kind you typically think of"

A good observation but not a ramp either as it is a raised/warped portion of the playfield.

If you could take the "ramp" away would it change the destination of the ball? In both cases the answer is no. On Beatles the ball would still launch and on Fireball the ball would still enter the playfield. You would lose the skill shot on fireball but the ball isn't be transported to another location on the playfield like a typical ramp.

It is an interesting question to consider as you have ramps to nowhere like Space Shuttle for example. At least on Space Shuttle the ramp to nowhere is raised so the ball can pass under it (shooter lane)

#943 1 year ago
Quoted from TreyBo69:

I guess defining a "ramp" to mean that it has to ramp up to at least one ball height elevation change is a good starting spot.

Agreed.

Quoted from TreyBo69:

As an aside, mentioning flattening Fireball made me think of flattening Flash Gordon. I don't think it does anything that really requires it to be split level.

Balls pickup some speed coming down the ramps though, I can attest as an FG owner!

I'm considering ordering a Bond Pro for no other reason than people bitching about node boards, dildos and bad artwork.

It would amuse me greatly.

#947 1 year ago
Quoted from TreyBo69:

I was tempted in a pro till the local spot said they're getting one. Also this is the 60th Hype Thread!

Ah, thanks! I lost track.

I am very curious what the layout will be.

#948 1 year ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

How? The ball would hit a wall and stop.

If the ramp is gone its just an opening into the loop with no gate, assuming the same setup as Seawitch

#950 1 year ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

I see. I was speaking about Beatles. The ramp is needed because there is a ball guide below it like TNA.

And if you took it out it would not impact where the ball went. The wall is there because the ramp gate is there, remove both.

It's a just a clever one way gate, you could do the same thing with a wire gate but might get some off ball dynamics on a loop shot when it crashed into the gate. Seawitch has some odd dynamics with the spring gate which I find endearing.

#956 1 year ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

That one way to say it for sure. The Beatles way is much much better. It actually allows the player to loop the shot. Seawitch it is borderline impossible to do that. Hell even hitting it once is basically impossible.

I have done it both directions back to back, want to see the video?

Not impossible but suitably difficult.

#957 1 year ago
Quoted from chuckwurt:

Yes. Things change when you remove both.

One requires the other, they don't exist in a vacuum.

#1004 1 year ago
Quoted from PinMonk:

45 second clips of audio. Stills when archival video is available. Pro-level BOM. It should cost less.

Everyone is ignoring the cost of Beatles licensing.

A friend of mine is in the car business selling parts for Chrysler products, the licensing fees and requirements are utterly insane. It's one reason when you go to the toy store you see lots of GM and Ford products on the shelf and much less Chrysler.

The licensing fees are horrible and Chrysler does nothing in return for the scalping.

And mind you this is for nothing more than using the words "SRT" "Mopar" "Super Bee" or "Hemi" they want upwards of 50%

1 week later
#1095 1 year ago
Quoted from iloveplywood:

I agree though that they can price things however they want. I just get a little tired of the "saved the hobby," stuff. I really doubt they stayed in business for the hobby's sake, but maybe I'm wrong.

Gary Stern was doing what Gary Stern knows how to do, make games. And clearly there is still a pinball market because other people keep trying to break into it with varying degrees of success. So.. yes I find the "saved pinball" to be over the top myself.

Stern is good at what he does and may he continue to do so for many years.

#1144 1 year ago
Quoted from mnpinball:

What's funny is a few years ago Gary Stern at a pinball seminar made a bold statement about their company not taking pre-order money to facilitate sales and calling out bashing other companies doing it............ Oh how the times have changed.

Stern isn't taking money, distributors are correct?

1 week later
#1208 1 year ago
Quoted from flynnibus:

I know people local that went from zero games...to 8 plus games within a year. It's not uncommon to see people doing 3-4 games a year and know a smaller percentage with that kind of money into the collection within 2-3 years. It's not the majority, but it's not out of the question either.
I mean.. I roll up to buy two games for 15k and someone has 300k in toy sports cars in the driveway... They have disposable income to throw around.

25k is pocket change for some folks, they question is how many wish to buy a limited Bond pinball machine.

#1242 1 year ago
Quoted from Lethal_Inc:

What a joke. Stern blew this title and I could give a shit less about what this game looks like. It’s gonna be way overpriced and not for me.

No official pics or prices.

As always, wait.

12
#1292 1 year ago
Quoted from iceman44:

This game is dead as a doornail right now.
Scooby has scooped up the hype and excitement.

Different market segments, won't change Bond 60th sales one iota.

#1296 1 year ago
Quoted from iceman44:

It’s still pinball $$$
I agree though, won’t affect sales much, lost one guy in LittleCammi here.
IF $25k initially sales will end up just like BEATLES tiered model. Not good.

I'll be amused if priced at 20k or less.

People just have to wait. Making spending choices based on rumors & speculation is not a winning plan.

#1298 1 year ago
Quoted from iceman44:

Why amused if less than $20k?

Because people throwing around numbers like $25k it's gospel.

Until Stern actually states what it is actually going to be, just speculation.

People are actually getting in a huff about it which to me is just crazy.

#1301 1 year ago
Quoted from PinStalker:

Com'on Stern, go OVER THE TOP and put it at 30K!!!!
If you're going to flip the bird, do it with two hands!! Make it count!!

60 years? 60k

#1340 1 year ago
Quoted from frunch:

Frankly, I *wish* people would stop complaining about all this bs and actually put their money where their mouth is.

I'd be impressed if they refrained from bitchin till Stern actually announced the pricing.

#1343 1 year ago
Quoted from luvthatapex2:

If its like Beatles diamond release, Stern wont release a price. It will be up to the distributor to set the pricing.

Of which nothing has been set since the pin has not been released.

I keep popping in when I see a spot of activity hoping its new pictures and its all the same.

Someone poke me with a stick when something actually happens.

3 weeks later
#2081 1 year ago
Quoted from Yoko2una:

I feel like a lot of pins have had something similar, esp those Gottliebs where half the PF is close shots to allow a separate PF area behind it (Rock, Spring Break, Gold Wings...etc.), but now that shot is just in a corner. Nothing really crazy or new. It's 3/4 of a circle.

Gold Wings did it twice.

#2127 1 year ago

My money is that Stern will sell every single one at $20k

Just like DE Back to the Future, "Bond superfans" will vacuum them up.

#2638 1 year ago

Doesn't matter what the layout was going to be, everyone would complain due to price.

#2739 1 year ago
Quoted from NeilMcRae:

No matter what the machine was you mean !

Nope, the layout. The art you are stuck with what the license approves. Stern isn't going to waste valuable time arguing about it. Personally I think a black cab with some white pinstripes and "BOND 60th" on the side would have been fine.

Pinball has been around a long time, how many combos are there on a 2 x 4 sheet of plywood?

With a single plain to work with there is only so much you can do, It's all be done before to some degree. The game has some fun looking shots and like the watch guy states, the Bond collectors will snatch every one of them up.

I'm really not sure what everyone is excised about. It's not a game being marketed to me any more than "Supreme" was and there are plenty of other pins out there.

#2776 1 year ago
Quoted from Mr68:

It's amazing what they can do with only 4 chime bars in the bottom of the cabinet.

What makes you think there are chimes?

It is advertised that it has a premium sound system and the sound effects change with the era being played, I'll assume any chimes are sound samples.

#2885 1 year ago
Quoted from Pinball-Wiz:

I am a pinball enthusiast with a pinball collection, what excludes me from the target customer base exactly?

Your elitist attitude is comical.

Pot meet kettle.

Seriously, Stern decides to roll out a limited model for the well heeled fan and you all lose your mind.

I'm a Chrysler fan and I'm not the least bit upset they sell $100k+ SUV's to the same crowd.

#2887 1 year ago
Quoted from Pinball-Wiz:

LMAO. I'm losing my mind? I'm just talking about a pin release in a thread, buddy.. Get over it, it's called the internet!

You should go back and re-read you posting.

#2908 1 year ago
Quoted from MonsieurCS:

I don't buy this cargument because it's a bit of the antithesis of what pinball is about - a game, mostly meant to be enjoyed together.

You mean like single player pinball games?

Carry on gents, I'm out.

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-2
#2924 1 year ago
Quoted from BasementFacts:

What gets me is how bad it looks and lack of features for the price.

Doesn't matter, look at a Supreme.

The value is subjective.

153d9ee7257e47de18c6b997cef0a9491b7d5a56 (resized).png153d9ee7257e47de18c6b997cef0a9491b7d5a56 (resized).png
#4762 1 year ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

Wow, from the Scooby thread.
[quoted image]
[quoted image]

Talk about throwing gasoline on a fire.

That word does not mean what you think it means.

I was actually toying with the idea of picking one up, with this statement from Stern they consider you stupid. I'm not inclined to give money to someone whom thinks I'm stupid.

Exclusive means exactly that, exclusive. Singular.

#4833 1 year ago
Quoted from Mr68:

But no one has played this game and yet already people are fantasizing it to be the greatest single level machine ever.

1) There are several videos of this game being played so this is in error.

2) Whom stated "it was the best?" that will be subjective at best.

3) 500 is "limited" not necessarily rare. It depends on what your personal view of rarity it. They made 20,000 Addams Family pins so in comparison it is rare if you want to play the "rarity game." The made 10,000 Supersonics, so again 500 Bond SLE will be rare in comparison.

#4835 1 year ago
Quoted from CaptainNeo:

I think what has people most upset, is that it's so obvious that stern is Price gouging.

Stern is free to ask what they want for a product, just as I'm free to say NOPE.

Any issue I have with Stern at the moment is they claim "X" is EXCLUSIVE to product "Y" and after they fact offer "X" to everyone. This reduces the value of an exclusive product you are offering at the premium price.

Part of the value in the premium product is the exclusivity, which has now been reduced somewhat.

#4836 1 year ago
Quoted from Mr68:

Your points 1 and 2 conflict with one another.
I'm happy for those that can determine by a brief 30 second video what makes a great game.

1) "But no one has played this game" FALSE.

2) Someone stating IT IS THE BEST is subjective which any rational person should be able to grasp. No different than cars, Pokeman or current wife model. It's subjective and anyone making the claim is engaging in hyperbole.

#4840 1 year ago
Quoted from Beechwood:

To be fair, I doubt anyone considered that topper to add any more than $1K to the price, exclusive or not. I could be wrong.

Not the point, was advertised as being exclusive.

Now it's not. If I dropped $20,000 on a pin and was told "XYZ" was exclusive and after the fact it was not I'd be bent.

Stuff like the shooter rod is silly but with what toppers are selling for these days, value to you may vary.

Personally I think the topper can be duplicated fairly easily so something of a money grab in itself compared to the BKSOR topper. A lighted sign box with RGB controlled rope lights, big whoop.

#4858 1 year ago
Quoted from Beechwood:

Edit: Bring back the physical knocker. Just add it to the BOM!

How hard would it be to just have a sound file that sounds like an old school "knock"?

The current "blast of static" Stern uses sounds like ass and makes me cringe when it goes off, even with the sound volume reduced.

#4859 1 year ago
Quoted from TreyBo69:

I don't think people should hold their breath on a retheme for this.
People wanted one for the Beatles and it never happened either.

Has not happened... yet.

Stern has proven "exclusive" does not mean what you plainly think it means.

1 week later
#5399 1 year ago
Quoted from Rizmo:

I dont believe this game was made for pinball people. It was made for the super James Bond fan for when they flex to all their friends. Look at when Omega or Aston Martin release a 007 edition. They put a crazy price tag on the item. Its not for their regular buyers but the super fans.

Several people including myself have pointed this out but the whole thread can be summed up in one sentence.

What about me.

#5495 1 year ago
Quoted from Haymaker:

wtf is Kelly's Heroes lol?
Is it like Hogan's Heros? I barely even know what that is either.

Too obscure, neither would sell though Hogans Hero's has a rich field of stuff to work with.

Just trap door mechs alone could fill the playfield.

4iShA-1503512174-347-quiz_question_image_-hogans_trap_door (resized).png4iShA-1503512174-347-quiz_question_image_-hogans_trap_door (resized).png
#5528 1 year ago
Quoted from Ollulanus:

Fair enough. Lemme clarify - my own opinion is it looks like a cheap piece of tacky crap.

Agreed, that being said someone predicted it would look like the casino slots and they were right.

That is what the license holder wanted and thats what they got.

I would have much preferred it looked like the Queen cabinet, perhaps the only thing so far the the PB got right.

A simple "Bond" with a man in a suit outline.

Make it simple, make it elegant.

179ea4789a2e9094e022fec1f7f2ea9762afc1b3 (resized).jpg179ea4789a2e9094e022fec1f7f2ea9762afc1b3 (resized).jpgbond (resized).jpegbond (resized).jpegbond2 (resized).pngbond2 (resized).png
#5629 1 year ago
Quoted from Roostking:

Definitely in the "jealous I cant afford one camp". Im not purchasing, but I aint jealous either.

Yup, were not the target buyer.

#5645 1 year ago
Quoted from mstang01:

I think the 500 only become “suckers” if they reuse it…

I hope whomever is running Stern at the moment realizes this would fall under "phenomenally bad idea" category. If you are going to stroke people for $20,000 and call it exclusive it has to remain exclusive.

Otherwise that well will be dry for future endeavors.

Personally the layout does nothing for me for one reason; That stupid hat in the middle of the playfield. If I wanted a game with something that useless I would have never sold my Triple Action. The fact it's lurking in front of a set of drops... eh, interesting design choice.

I'll give it a try if I run across one in the field but put it under "items on a pinball game I'm not inclined to own" which includes spinning posts in the way of important things, gobble holes and Gottlieb variable targets. At least the Avengers IQ it's less obnoxious and on the Prem turns into a cool ball lock.

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#5647 1 year ago
Quoted from skink91:

This is the most confusing choice for me as well… though I am hoping the way I imagine it may interfere with gameplay will be different than how it first appears.

I can see it being a better choice if it was off to one side a bit and further back but in the center of the playfield?

#5805 1 year ago

Damn, 65 posts since I last visited! I thought for sure gameplay video dropped.

Nope.

Carry on.

2 weeks later
#6366 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

Come on dude this is absolutely hideous.
Gottlieb 1980 bond looks at this and shakes its head.
And that game is ugly

License holder approved it and no doubt demanded certain things.

Horse has been beat to dust at this point.

#6370 1 year ago
Quoted from CrazyLevi:

That’s all well and good but what’s slam tilt’s excuse?

I try and be charitable and not post my thoughts on the subject.

#6389 1 year ago
Quoted from ZNET:

Anyone know the over-under odds on the anniversary edition's power cord configuration? ;>

This would be period correct for 60's Bond.

cord (resized).jpegcord (resized).jpeg
#6610 1 year ago
Quoted from frankmac:

This release is not marketed for everyone.

Which people continually fail to grasp any more than The Supreme pin.

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Hey modders!
Your shop name here

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