Some good points there Iceman. I notice prices are still rather higher for new titles but there's some more "deals" here and there. I've seen lightly used HUO Avengers Premiums sell in the $7500 range whereas 6 months ago those seemed to be $8k. Not a huge drop but something. The crazy Stern LE prices are definitely down a bit but still way up compared to the past 2 years.

Older titles, most of the pre LCD era games, is where I'm seeing the biggest drop and "deals". I think the LCD era games are becoming more and more appealing to buyers then they already are which may be causing some to offload their older games.

Personally, and I know some people will disagree with this, I'm buying a fully loaded virtual pinball machine for my next game (already ordered). There's a ton of EM's, Bally Williams era games, and original virtual pins I want to play. The technology is pretty damn good today compared to years past. I'm sure it will be worth half of what I paid 5 years from now but oh well, as others have said none of this stuff is an investment and I can't take it with me to the grave anyway lol.

I know lol. Nothing will ever beat real pinball machines but some of these loaded vpins are pretty impressive. I would love to own 100+ pins but I'll never have the room or pinball funds for them. There's also a lot of titles I once owned that I would like to play again as a vpin.

Except TMNT is fun, desirable, and is one of Stern's more loaded games.

Good points, agree. The technology for Vpin's has really come a long way. My plan is to stick with real games from the LCD era (and Ghostbusters as it's my favorite movie of all time) and then use the virtual pinball machine for everything else. I have no plans to ever buy another pre LCD era game once the virtual pin arrives.

$2k for a fairly used Twister that they will then try and sell for $4k. Also...it's a Twister lol.

Seller got ripped off bad, really bad.

Yeah, VR pinball is fun. I really tried giving VR pinball a proper shot, even built a Pinsim cabinet for immersion. For me a loaded and full size virtual pin blows away a VR pinball setup. The immersion with a Quest 2 + the Pinsim was great but at the same time it was missing so much IMO. First off the display quality for pinball isn't that great, insert text has a slight blur to it unless looking very close and the overall clarity isn't close to a 4K 120hz monitor. The field of view is also rather low which results in a small sweet spot. The lack of the weight of a full size cabinet was also very noticeable, plus a dedicated cabinet has the space and distancing for a proper SSF + DOF setup along with a shaker motor + gear motor.

The biggest bummer for me with VR pinball is wearing a VR headset. With real pinball you use your own eyes, you can grab a beer, glance at the sports game on your TV, etc. With VR pinball that's all gone, as is any social aspect which is a huge part of real pinball. VR still seems like a theme park ride in a sense it's something just want to do for a few minutes. While the display of a full size vpin is still just a screen it offers more immersion IMO as there's no headset required, nothing is more immersive then the real world. A full size cabinet with SSF, DOF, a shaker motor, gear motor, and the right PC + display provides one hell of an experience. It also costs a hell of a lot more compared to a VR pinball setup which is something to consider. I would like to give VR pinball another try with a loaded full size cabinet as you said.

I'm buying a full size dedicated Vpin for the reasons I stated in the comments above. VR pinball just isn't for me and still seems inferior even with the best headsets compared to the full size dedicated vpins. Setting up base stations for sensors (as with the Valve Index), dealing with VR controllers, cables, and ultimately wearing the VR headset itself all still has that carnival ride vibe, something that's fun for just a few minutes.

IMO there is zero social interaction with VR pinball, no one wants to watch a screen with some ones head moving all over the place and then share a sweaty headset between balls lol. I'll happily pay $4k more for what I believe is the better experience. There's a reason you rarely, if ever, see Xtreme Gaming Cabinets advertising their VR Pinsim on YouTube, all coverage is for the full size dedicated cabinets. I reached out to them regarding their Pinsim and full size cabinets, Pinsim has a 1 month wait whereas the full size cabinets are 6+ months.

As far as moving around goes with VR pinball that seems cool but I don't even move around much with my real pins, except for when a ball is stuck and I'm trying to find it. Below is White Water running on a 49" 4K monitor, there's not much 2D about it, still 3D but just lacking being able to look under objects which I'm not sure how many people even do with real pinball.

aa7a95e8b89d1550eb3b7b615350227b48633f9c (1) (resized).jpg

I'm not looking around or standing to the sides while playing, never do while playing my real pins unless a ball is stuck. It sounds cool to lean over and look down the shooter lane but who does that with real pinball? lol. Also...VR is still fake as well, and much easier to tell it's fake when having to wear a headset. I'll take the slightly flat look, that still very much has a 3D effect, over wearing a headset with a small sweet spot, a FOV that isn't anywhere close to the actual eye, and having to look at fuzzy insert textures (happens when you look at insert text on a screen that is 1/2" away from your eyes). Not wearing a headset at all is far closer to the real world then having to wear one. People don't wear a headset while playing real pins...

If full 3D was that critical and popular we would all own 3D TV's, there would be a ton of 3D content, and we would be wearing 3D glasses with our friends and family to watch shows and sports. No one does that though as for a lot of people having to wear glasses, let alone a headset that completely blocks off the outside world, is a turn off, it doesn't work well for social situations, and it's not as immersive as the real world.

Not sure why we are bashing both of these back and forth, both are cool but real pinball is still better Also not sure why you keep saying the prebuilt full size cabinets are a rip off. Some are but there are some models that have a lot going into them not just in terms of hardware but also software. I priced out building my own with a replica quality cabinet, high end PC parts, DOF + SSF, shaker, etc. Price? Around $6k - $7k and that doesn't include configuring any of the tables or the 50+ hours it would take me just to build it. I'll happily spend $2k - $3k more for something that works out of the box with 1,000+ tables installed, I don't have the patience or the time to build and configure my own. The people that make their own are very talented, wish I could pull something like that off.

Here's a screenshot from YouTube of a new Iron Maiden vpin being worked on by VPin Workshop. Flat? No...looks damn good (thought it was the real pin at first) and has a 3D affect as with all of the best virtual tables.

Screenshot 2022-06-02 072333 (resized).jpg

LOL. I really hope that is a joke, the sandwich part had be cracking up (with 3 deli meats!).

What economic recession? The DOW is still well over 30,000, unemployment is under 4%, nearly 400,000 jobs were added in May alone, etc. There's been a slight downturn but nothing like a full blown recession or what we saw in 2008. There are no reports as of yet of mass layoffs occurring in multiple industries. Ford just announced yesterday that it's adding 6,000 jobs in 3 states. Hell even high gas prices are not deterring many buyers from buying huge SUV's and trucks due to low inventory. If a NIB Godzilla Premium sold 2 months ago for $12k it's selling this month at $11k, still well over MSRP.

Here come the insults, not cool. You don’t understand. I’ve been building my own PC’s for 20 years. There’s much more to a virtual pin build then the PC piece. The build I priced out was going to cost me $6k - $7k, I’m perfectly fine paying another 2k - $3k to have a professionally built vpin that works out of the box.

Also I don’t understand where your 2D comments are coming from as there’s nothing 2D about standard virtual pinball. All of the tables have 3D graphics, same thing applies to video games with 3D graphics. Just because people play PS5 games on a TV that doesn’t make them 2D…

At the same time Ford is hiring 6,000 workers. Tesla for years has been the only big EV car company in town but that has now all changed with companies like Ford, and GM heavily entering the EV space. It’s possible Tesla is currently staffed to support current sales numbers but those will be negatively impacted with Ford and GM entering the EV space.

Seems like they may not be trimming at all now. Just a bunch of speculation which isn't worthwhile to follow.

https://fortune.com/2022/06/05/elon-musk-says-teslas-total-headcount-will-rise-despite-cuts-to-salaried-staff/

$4.30 a gallon? Sadly that's now on the cheaper side, over $5 here in metro Detroit.

Sale pending too. Good deal here for an Indiana Jones, only $28k...just in case anyone missed out on the nearly $18k Munsters LE.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/for-sale-indiana-jones-the-pinball-adventure-146

Insanity ending? No, it's just getting started. I could see $15k maybe for a HEP TZ but one with a claim of being HUO and no pictures...yeah.
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/for-sale-twilight-zone-236