(Topic ID: 237468)

Is there any downside to playfield protectors?

By beefzap

5 years ago


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  • 404 posts
  • 122 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 60 days ago by Aniraf
  • Topic is favorited by 23 Pinsiders

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    Topic poll

    “Is there any downside to playfield protectors?”

    • No Downside, a good investment 93 votes
      42%
    • No way, not needed to protect damage and might affect play 93 votes
      42%
    • No Opinion 33 votes
      15%

    (219 votes)

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    #99 5 years ago

    I’ve installed 4 of them. My review is generally positive, but you need to know the following:
    -Wax it! It is unnoticeable with a few coats of way.
    - long install. You end up taking a lot of stuff off, you may want to allocate a lot of time to focus.
    - be prepared to shave it down. 2 of mine did not fit right out of the box.

    #110 5 years ago
    Quoted from Deez:

    Did you read the thread? People are saying the games play like shit. Lol.

    I think his point is that they are sayin it, not experiencing it. I tend to agree with @gatecrasher…after you wax it, you wouldn’t know there was a difference. Before wax, I find they are slightly slower and thus noticeable. I like to play my machines and don’t care as much about the protection aspect, I just find it causes old surfaces to play in uniform ways. I did install one on my #tna recently because I lucked out with some play field issues…game still plays perfectly with no noticeable difference.

    #140 5 years ago

    There has to be an experiment we could run to prove/disprove all of this talk about the game playing differently. I feel like I have seen the same ball physics on the waxed protector as I have seen on a waxed clear coat pf. I have never seen the “slide” that people are talking about. I don’t know how that would be possible as the PET G should always have a rougher surface than automotive clear coat.

    Furthermore, people rave about the “hardtop” restorations…how is this different? They use the same exact product base correct?

    #154 5 years ago

    I bought a PinBot which had full mylar…I took that off and replaced it with the protector. The game play is significantly more fun to me. I feel like the ball moves perfectly and the pf looks 500x better than that cloudy mylar.

    From what I know, that mylar is factory. So, I love this concept of people saying the playfield protector is something inferior to a factory experience when in reality there are plenty of factory play fields covered in clear coat or mylar.

    Until someone can prove to me that to coefficient of friction is significant less than a clear coated playfield, I am not going to believe these things impact the game in a negative way.

    #158 5 years ago
    Quoted from whthrs166:

    Most of the time factory Mylar is removed because it is trashed, coming off, yellowed, blistered, ugly, ect... not for game play. I have removed lots of Mylar for these reasons. I have also installed Mylar to protect an entire Play Field and the game played the same.

    Does mylar play better than the plastic protector? Not trying to be a troll, genuinely curious.

    1 week later
    #176 5 years ago
    Quoted from Gatecrasher:

    None of my protectors seem to move. At least not that I can notice.
    Another thing to realize is that Mylar is Dupont's trade name for biaxially-oriented PET sheet. Mylar is PET sheet that has been physically oriented (stretched) in two directions.
    PETG is also a member of the Polyethylene Terephthalate family of plastic resins but contains an additive which makes it a copolymer.
    The physical properties are similar in some areas and differ in others.
    So basically if you hate the PETG playfield protectors you automatically hate Mylar too along with automotive clear coating since all alter gameplay.

    Science +1. Now we just need a way to compare play on a new machine with and without the protector.

    1 month later
    #186 4 years ago

    I think Durzel has a fair assessment. I personally like them and do not notice the play being slower. I put one on a total nuclear annihilation just to experiment with the speed and I would say there is no way to tell once it was waxed.

    #210 4 years ago
    Quoted from Nepi23:

    Anybody with a solution on how to get rid of Newton rings when installing the PF protector? I have a protector on my DI installed at factory without any Newton Rings -phenomenon and then there are two pins where I've myself installed the PF protectors and there is the Newton Ring -phenomenon very visible. I had cleaned both PF:s before with naphta, if I recall correctly.

    I would like to see a solution for this as well. Something must be sticking, but I cannot figure out what.

    1 week later
    #249 4 years ago

    The conversation about the “wet spots” or newton rings has me really interested in a solution. protectors is there anything we can do to solve that? The concept of dusting the underside seems logical, but I wouldn’t want to put some kind of powder all over my machine.

    #252 4 years ago

    Interesting. My Cirqus Voltaire doesn’t show them, but my Total Nuclear almost looks like I put water on the playfield.

    #257 4 years ago
    Quoted from TwoHeartedMale:

    if i do PF touch ups by hand with acrylic paint, will it be ok to put a PF protector down? i'm worried that the protector will move around and grind down the touch up paint.

    I can’t say for certain, but I would say there is a very low probability of it scratching at the paint. I would say you have a better chance of the PET-G having a chemistry issue with the acrylic. Even that seems unlikely.

    1 month later
    #283 4 years ago

    I noticed that they put some instructions on their site. The “wet spots” they say can be addressed by blowing compressed air under the protector.

    https://www.playfield-protectors.com/about/Docs

    I haven’t tried this or their suggested wax. That wax is not recommended by forum posts because of “solvents” but I am no chemist, just relaying what I’ve read.

    2 months later
    #289 4 years ago
    Quoted from durgee7:

    My playfield protector had a good run before collecting bits of white crap. I bet it happens each time I lift up the playfield for maintenance. There must be some flaking paint underneath some of the plastics. I hope the mylar keeps the paint protected from all that debris. I'm a little dissapointed but this should be expected.[quoted image]

    If you have an air compressor, blow it under the protector. You can get 90% of that stuff out to one side then wipe it up. Don’t use canned air. The angle will cause freezing liquid to spray all over the play field.

    #293 4 years ago
    Quoted from Nepi23:

    Hopefully I may hijack this topic for a small question. I am using playfield protectors myself and I like them very much. The new thinner material that is used apparently is the culprit for the newton rings phenomenon, but I can live with it, even though I am not fond of it at all.
    Here's my question: I have the following three games - is it worth to install a PF protector on them in your opinion?
    (Looking for answers from people that use the PF-protectors)
    GB Premium - has ca. 1000 games on it and has dimpling already
    MMR - has ca. 400 games on it and some dimpling (not so much as on GB)
    CC - is a restored one and has a very nice clearcoated playfield. There is a minimum of dipling, which is hardly noticeable.

    I’ve installed them over play fields with dimples…I don’t think the dimples should impact your decision. It is a personal preference. I equate it to putting a glass shield on top of your cell phone screen. Personally, I enjoy having the protection.

    I also enjoy installing them because it gives me a reason to deep clean machines which have a lot of play.

    #299 4 years ago
    Quoted from C_Presley:

    The protectors themselves from overseas are cut perfectly, spots where I was nervous about the edges lining up always came out perfect.

    I haven’t had the same luck. On at least half of the games I have installed them on, I was forced to make cuts in order to get a fit where the protector would lay flat. It hasn’t stopped me from using them, but it should be know.

    1 week later
    #311 4 years ago
    Quoted from C_Presley:

    Are you buying the ones from Germany? So far on Jurassic park, guardians and dredd it’s been fantastic for me. For example I was worried how it would line up with the hole where the trex eats the ball and it lined up perfectly. Sucks you guys are having issues though. I rotate my games from home use to my route so they get lots of plays. I most likely won’t route a game again without one, at least the games I plan on keeping forever.

    Yeah, I buy them from playfield-protectors.com. Most of the time they are pretty good, but I've had a few situations where they need adjustments. I've shaved off parts on Pinbot, Oktoberfest, Black Knight Sword of Rage (LE), and Twilight Zone. The most major of the adjustments came in the form of Black Knight SOR's flail ramp. I found that with the fully waxed plastic on there, that shot became very difficult. I ended up just cutting it off, and it played perfectly again.

    #312 4 years ago
    Quoted from hocuslocus:

    It's actually really easy, took me like 5 minutes on a game I had.
    I don't know about slower, usually after an first wax (after 50-100 plays) it plays a little to wild. It's harder to do drop/live catches on, but I like the challenge so I'm fine with it. Before the wax and intial break-in period it doesn't play that well. Did before and after video of the last game I did. That was the main thing I observed along with the ball having a bit more spin. Almost the same thing as if a regular playfield was super waxed.

    I've had the same exact experience. People tell me how the protectors cause too much spin, or slow the game down. After they are waxed and worked in, I can't see any difference other than my playfield stays wear free. It is interesting to hear you say that about drop/live catches. I'm going to have to test that and see if I notice it as well.

    3 weeks later
    #315 4 years ago
    Quoted from chad:

    When installing the playfield protector , are the pop skirts the same size as the holes in the protector?

    The protector holes are slightly smaller, but you can push the protector over them. The only thing you need to remove on pops are the caps.

    #320 4 years ago
    Quoted from Nepi23:

    Hi! Do you wax the playfield protectors also, or just clean them? Thanks!

    I wax them the same way I would a playfield. It makes them really slick.

    2 months later
    #322 4 years ago
    Quoted from ibuypinballs:

    I took a Captain Fantastic in on trade that was restored with a playfield protector on it. Looked great and the game played very well. Sold the machine the following week to someone who purchased it for their 1st machine. After three week one of the pop bumpers locked on and fried the pop coil. He changed the coil and it happen again. Being he is 200 miles away I tried to guide him thru checking the pop switch and the relay for that pop bumper. He was intimidated with trying so I had someone do a service call. Turns out the plastic playfield protector somehow caught the pop skirt in the down position causing the pop to stay locked on. I never installed one so I not sure why it happened. Other wise I like the look of it and the machine played very well.

    I have had this happen on my Firepower. I was lucky because I was running one of those fuse boards that protects the coils and boards, but it still blew the fuses.

    I was able to stop this by taking some fine grit sand paper and rubbing it on the edge of the pop bumper skirt. I can’t tell why it only happens on my Firepower and not any single other game I’ve put the protector on.

    Also, for further context, that Firepower has brand new pop bumpers and skirts. All I could figure is that the angle, and the “roughness” of the two plastics can catch randomly.

    You can also trim the protector with a sharp hobby knife. It might be worth shaving a tiny bit on the protector you are talking about. I would have to see it, but in general I modify them to fit.

    Hope that helps.

    1 week later
    #327 4 years ago
    Quoted from hassanchop:

    Always hated these protectors. Gameplay becomes slower and the ball makes some weird trajectories some times.

    I’ve now filmed both a natural playfield and the protector in slow mother…I believe this is completely untrue and the result of a “placebo effect”. People tell me this stuff all of the time and I really cannot reproduce anything that doesn’t happen on a clear coated playfield. The only difference I can see is that the protector never wears down, whereas the clear coat does. After 10k plays, the “bite” is different on the clear than the protector because of all of the dimples.

    #331 4 years ago
    Quoted from hassanchop:

    I believe that if you say so when it comes to the speed of the ball.
    But with the pf protector, the ball sometimes makes an effect that never happens on a clear coat pf: It makes some harsh slowdowns on some moves. For example, the ball comes at high speed and out of nowhere it slows down way faster than it should to the point that almost stops.
    I have never seen this effect on a non protector pf and see it many times on the T2 I play.
    But if overall the ball has the same speed as you say, then this tiny "incident" is irrelevant in my opinion, which makes the pf a great buy. Any way we can see those videos?
    I would love to change my mind about this. All the spanish machines made in the 90s had some kind of pf protector on top, and all of them have a perfect pf today lol

    I’m not sure I have them anymore. Maybe I can make some new ones. I haven’t done a perfect scientific experiment, so I am certain there are holes in my assessment.

    I was simply trying to counter the “these are bad” arguments because some people simply refuse to accept new things.

    #333 4 years ago
    Quoted from hassanchop:

    Don't need to make new videos. You word is enough for me.
    You did changed my mind so I will be looking at these in a totally different way. For example, I always ran away from machines for sale that had the protector . From now on I won't

    Wow! I wish I made money from this company! Lol. I think the product has room to be improved, but it is certainly nice for those of us who are routing high end pins.

    I have tried to be really objective on my assessment of them. At first I felt it was different so I took one off after a week. Then I started to notice the same things I saw as “different”. I started doing some slow motion iPhone videos to make sure I wasn’t crazy. I ended up looking at the data and gaining a different opinion.

    2 years later
    #380 1 year ago

    In my opinion there is not enough noticeable difference between a freshly waxed playfield and a protector to justify the guaranteed wear on the playfield. That said, I agree that the protector can be a bit ugly and I am confident in the stern playfield’s ability to withstand normal play.

    1 year later
    #404 60 days ago
    Quoted from Kaijumke:

    Use a “micro” dusting of talcum or other type of powder on the underside before you install. It should be so little powder that your naked eye can visibly see the powder. This will remove the static cling as well s the rings.

    This isn’t a bad idea. I’ve never tried it, but the concept seams sound. I wonder if the powder could scratch the clear?

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