(Topic ID: 245012)

Is the new BLACK KNIGHT TOY LAME? POLL


By guymontag451

7 months ago



Topic Stats

  • 376 posts
  • 107 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 6 months ago by Tranquilize
  • Topic is favorited by 2 Pinsiders

You

Topic poll

“Is the new BLACK KNIGHT TOY LAME? POLL”

  • Black Knight toy is awesome 407 votes
    66%
  • Black Knight toy is lame 208 votes
    34%

(615 votes)

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#84 7 months ago

Damn ! Such vitriol for this new pin. For a minute, I thought is was over on The Munsters page; t looks like there is a lot of copy and paste going on. The only thing that is different is the names of the pinsiders with axes to grind.

#110 7 months ago

Jeez, between this thread, a similar bash thread on Munsters, and another one on Ghostbusters, you all have a trifecta going on. I'm willing to bet Stern sees this stuff and thinks it is a wolf you all are crying about. Stern is probably thinking, "Here we go---again."

#124 7 months ago
Quoted from Extraballz:

Now that you point it out the Knights torso doesn’t do much for me.......

You know, on a video game you could have the knight doing double-back flips and top off the back flips with a couple of forward summersaults. On a real play field, where the laws of physics still apply and the physical parts can cost a lot to build and can result in more parts to break after some hours are put on the pin, I think Stern did a pretty good job with the knight. He looks boss.

#133 7 months ago
Quoted from vicjw66:

You don't think Stern has the capacity to figure out how to make it work? Shut off power to the mace while the other solenoid or servo is working? Would the Knight moving his head side to side interfere with the flail? With that kind of thinking, it's a wonder that you would want any type of feature in a pinball machine of any complexity at all. And that's o.k. What you need is video pinball my friend.

Oh, I'm sure Stern could make it work. But at what cost? You have already added a switch to shut off power to the mace/flail, a servo has been added, or a solenoid has been added. Perhaps both. This will require extra wiring and extra work on the assembly line. It will probably turn into a warranty headache because people will be bitching about "my knight is broken. The head won't move".

The part that adds to game play is the flail; That part works. It adds to the game. How is a knight moving his head side-to-side going to add to game play. A knight like you are wanting is just expensive eye candy.

#137 7 months ago
Quoted from vicjw66:

I think the head moving adds to the experience.

How? I'm curious. How can something that just moves around, beyond the silver ball add to the experience ?

Quoted from vicjw66:

The solenoid to shake him and with the removal of his standup target thus making him a true bash toy would add immensely to the gameplay.

This one I do not get at all. You either hit the toy or you hit a stand up target in front of the toy. Hitting either one will bring action. What difference does it make?

Quoted from vicjw66:

Honestly, the flail doesn't really add a whole lot in practice. I would have scrapped it in its current form.

The flail is the only moving part and you are going to scrap it ?

Quoted from vicjw66:

I would have used a solenoid to operate a mace instead.

Quoted from vicjw66:

And I think the extra cost would have been worth it.

Are you a design engineer? How much would the extra cost amount to? Do you have any numbers? Or are we talking pin in the sky?

#149 7 months ago
Quoted from Vino:

I appreciate the BK toy along with feather.
Carry on.
[quoted image]

I know what the problem with the knight is. Instead is that lame stand up target in front of the knight, Stern should have outfitted the knight with a codpiece.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Codpiece

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#202 7 months ago

I like the toy. Someday, maybe I will find a one of these to play in the wild. But I thought the play field looked familiar.

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1 week later
#254 7 months ago

Stern's cost cutting on the production line:

Some of you are going to call it cheap. For the ramps, I see innovation. There would have been in times past where the two stainless steel ramps would have been welded together.

To weld the 3 pieces that make up the ramps would have required a jig to have been built. Someone would have had to load the parts in the jig and lay down the weld beads. The welded unit would need to be checked for warping---after it cooled down.

Instead of welding the ramps, Stern is using a "twisted tab" method of assembly. I do not know what the industry calls this but it looks like twisted tabs so that's what I call it.

Three ramp pieces are cut and profiled on whatever machine Stern decided to use. Two pieces will need to be roll formed. After that, an assembly worked can---more or less---slap the three pieces together and twist the tabs and the ramp is ready to install.

I would assume there was a substantial cost savings by replacing the welding with the tabs.

No muss. No fuss. I like it.

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#257 7 months ago
Quoted from snaroff:

Wonder if anyone is doing R&D on non-wood PF's. I realize it's sacrilege, however it would be cool to have lighter, more resilient PF's. The wood being used for PF's isn't what it use to be.

I wonser this a lot. A couple of times I have brought up a product called Richlite. It is solid as a rock. Can be sawed, drilled, machined, glued, and painted on. It is an epoxy impregnated paper pressed at high pressure.

I used to work with the stuff when I was making form dies in the aircraft industry. It is fantastic to work with.

It is being used on guitar fretboards. I think it would be worthy of research for the top layer of a pin play field.

https://richlite.com/

#262 7 months ago
Quoted from snaroff:

Looks amazing! Definitely worthy of research...looks lighter and stronger than wood!
Wouldn't be surprised if there would be no need for a "clear coat".

It is not lighter than wood. Where wood has a cellular structure (depending on the wood: think oak compared to balsa wood) the Richlite is highly compressed and very dense. Where some woods can be laminated for spring action, such as a compound bow, I don't think Richlite can take spring like stresses. But I really do not know. What I can reasonably consider is that weight considerations would only allow for the top ply of a play wood play field to be Richlite. A 1/2 " thick piece of Richlite the same size as a play field would be more comfortable for two people move than just one person.

But since it is a dense material, I think it would make a great surface for a rolling ball.

And there is always the possibility that Stern has already looked into it and saw things that made it not a good candidate for a play field.

#264 7 months ago
Quoted from vicjw66:

Yeah, like cost. It is pretty obvious that the bean counters have complete authority at Stern.

Stern does have a partner. You could say they are bean counters. Now, it makes sense that Stern is acting a little bit like Apple Computer.

https://sternpinball.com/about/

"In the fall of 2009, Stern Pinball partnered with an affiliate of Hagerty Peterson & Co., LLC (‘HP”), a private equity investment firm, to help the company weather the Great Recession and prepare for its next phase of growth. A team led by Dave Peterson, Managing Director of HP, helped the company strengthen its operations and financial condition, expand its product offering and enter new markets."

#325 7 months ago
Quoted from GaryMartin:

and a target to whack the bad guy in the nuts.

Some whine that it is a stand up target in front of the Knight instead of something that is intregal to the unit; All the while, not considering that a separate SU target will be much easier to service some time in the future.

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