“We get it” posts have no effect on me.

Sorry dude.

Now, let us explore the topic of dimpling...we can’t afford to let that get lost in this rolling grievance thread.

My take: I don’t like it!

Even better. Where do I sign?

The comparison to you and Sterns complete inability to understand feedback is good comedy. Birds of a feather and all that.

We get it dude. You all hate stern!

We get its are a two-Way street.

What you don’t seem to get is how awful most of the “feedback” here is. If stern “understood” all of the useless feedback it gets here, they’d be out of business in a week.

We get it. You all want stern bankrupt. We get it!!!

Ah the good old fall back of false equivalence and ranting hyperbole. Throw in some random "air quotes" and you are checking all the boxes of being in an indefensible position.

We get it. You are an expert.

Like when you told us stern hiring more software people wouldn’t help them get more code done. And then they hired more code people and more code got done.

We get it!!

What’s the point of this thread again? I don’t get it.

Ah if only you could understand the difference to trying to discuss a path to success and improvement and wishing failure. Please I would love to hear your expertise when it comes to software engineering. You can keep yelling that I am an expert like its in some way an insult or negative.

P.S. It has to be a couple years since you failed to comprehend that point and your still rolling it out like it makes you look smart, take a little feedback and at least try some new materiel that is less self deprecating.

I’m not sure what a rolling List of off-repeated stern grievances has to do with whether or not stern is blacklisting people. Seems like whenever stern is brought up, the “path” leads to the same tired nonsense.

I don’t get it. You guys never get tired of repeating these grievance lists?

The fact that you guys only have ONE worn out playbook - regardless of what’s being discussed - is what invites mockery.

Do you get it?

The purpose is to discuss Stern and how they deal with leaks.

I'll admit, I shouldn't have gone off the Stranger Things UV kit tangent in that one post. But you've gone off on way more tangents and have dismissed a ton of interesting conversation. All to put in your two cents that you don't like the conversation or find it interesting, but can't be bothered to write anything meaningful to that extent...yet you still have the addiction to chime in regardless.

Yes, I have an addiction to responding to posts on a message board, where the point is to read and respond to other messages.

I think I get it now.

Man that Star Wars topper. What a ripoff, am I right?

More of a poorly managed product that failed to maximize sales by being released well after the initial Star Wars purchasing frenzy. One that everyone knew about and joked about because it had leaked years before release.

Look at that, I made my "Stern grievance" germane to the topic of leaks.

Those few business decisions span years. You do you, but for me, I can't partake in spending my money with a company that I know full and well keeps giving us less while taking more. There has to be a limit, and I found mine. Will I play them at other people's homes or locations once I get back to "America" instead of this wasteland I'm currently in.....? Absolutely. But Stern ain't getting my money.

So, what you're saying is your next game you are purchasing is Scared Stiff ; )?

Yes, I absolutely do plan to come to Pincinnati. Not getting deployed this time ; ). We'll just have to see what COVID brings in terms of travel for active duty members.

Until this community stops blindly throwing money at Stern, nothing is going to change. Actually, I take that back - things will change but not for the better.

You ever thought you'd see "prop rods" for working on your game? (yes yes, the sliding rails returned, and you get to pay even more $$ for them now...nice pyrrhic victory there)

Ever thought you'd watch that artwork slip, chip, and slide around your brand new $6000+ game?

Ever thought you'd be conditioned to accept that seeing the wood lines through the artwork to be normal?

Insert ghosting is "par for the course" and even put in the manuals to make you believe that's normal?

Hey, what did Stern actually do to fix their PF artwork chipping pooling problem? Did they ever really and actually TELL you? Nah. They kept producing and this community kept buying.

Hey, I'm not telling anyone you can't spend your money. Burn it in front of a camera for all I care, but don't put up a bitch-fit against them if you're writing checks every time a new game comes out and expect anything to change for your benefit. Nothing will change until the money spigot gets turned off from the community, and that is just not going to happen.

No arguments here , Larry. I am spot on with you, and I always appreciated how you walked a new player through the rules on some of these games. You were like our local Bowen Kehrins in terms of gameplay and knowing what to do. I definitely felt less intimidated trying to digest pinball rules that rivaled the thickness of King's IT novel.

In the end, I have drawn my line in the sand (note, I said sand meaning I am willing to change my mind) as to what my limits are. I refuse to support Stern until some things change.

In a way, I'm honestly grateful so many people buy NIB. More classic B/W games for me and others that enjoy that era of pinball!

Good discussions here. I enjoyed this, and it actually stayed respectful and coherent. Maybe there is hope!

Sounds like a real genius.

They aren't doing it "blindly" and I think for the most part things have gotten better. I'm a big fan of DP, JP2, Maiden, BKSOR, TMNT is looking great. If an individual can't tolerate the short comings then time to move on I guess, I mean if I was fed up with Stern I wouldn't buy it anymore and I certainly would blame others for continuing to purchases pins. No one can say there are blind or unaware of the issues at this point, they don't care and are having fun.

Couldn't you just buy HUO Sterns and avoid giving Stern money that way? Plus, if you wait a year or so you'd know how the code was going to settle out and be able to spot any issues with the playfield clear on the game you were purchasing.

Nothing wrong with not caring and nothing wrong with caring. The only issue is people bitching at the opposite club. I think everyone wants Stern to succeed.

Stern does care, because all that has been mostly fixed. I've not heard a peep about insert ghosting in a long time. No pooling and chipping on our JP and haven't seen many reports of it on games shipped this year. The clearcoat is slightly more matte, perhaps that is a reflection of changed process that fixed the pooling issue. The service rails came back (I bet because the service department got tired of people tearing up underplayfield components).

Anytime we've had an issue with "something that shouldn't be" Stern has taken care of us. Warped LE playfield? Replaced with a new wired playfield. ACDC with dished window got replaced with NOS blank. Failed DMD with rework showing on the board got replaced no questions asked months after it crapped out. I read horror stories here but have not had similar experiences. Maybe because I measure and document the issues and approach Stern with courtesy and professionalism I get better results? Or maybe because the issues we raise affect gameplay and are not just cosmetic? Either way I'm happy with them. I just want to see more reasonable prices on replacement boards, especially since they're difficult to service.

Looks good on paper, but then the person you are buying the game from just turns around and buys another NIB game.

I tell you, it's a vicious circle that just has to stop!

Aha, so what's called for is a total boycott then, do no business and provide no funds to anyone that's bought a NIB Stern in the past three years!

He would die for them.

Just wonder when was the last time he gave a dime to them.

Are you suggesting that Levi's secretly in on the great Stern boycott?!?

Not really because they make games that he picks up much cheaper when they are a few years old. Then the cycle continues.

I believe his motto must be somewhere along the lines of "let the NIB buyer take the risk and the hit".

How else are we supposed to get them to stop producing the cheapest (by far) commercially available full-featured pinball machines with the most popular themes, 5-7 times a year, for all of us to enjoy?

Someone has to flip the script here! BOYCOTT!

Hope I don't end up on the black list.

We are just in the hate, cancel and tear it down culture right now

Meanwhile Stern just keeps making great games and selling the shit out of em Levi

I know.

AND IT MAKES ME SO GODDAMMM MAD!!

Why can't they be like the other 20 pinball companies and release 1 game every 1.5 years collectively?!

I hope this was intentional because it was killer funny.

CrazyLevi has been relatively quiet in this thread until one “we get it” comment and years of treatment is ruined. His psychologist is going to be pissed.

On the plus side, we know another trigger.

Now Stern sends you a used playfield for a unpopulated replacement. Go to the playfield issues thread.

This is an insult to that owner. Damn, just when I thought they were improving.

I think he’s blacklisting Stern.

I didnt go through every page, but I wonder how many times the word "Stern" is printed in this thread? Think about it.

It's a topic about Stern.... What's to think about?

Blacklists and infringement orders are like shaking a hornet's nest. Sure, you piss a lot of them off, but you also generate a lot of buzz.

And there might be a few stings with some inflammation, soreness and general discomfort!

It wasn't used, it just had stuff removed from it. There isn't anything wrong with the replacement playfield he received, it looks as good as any other pro playfield.

Y'all see Spookys post on FB?
Even their legal videos are getting flagged

Are you sure? I could have sworn I seen where screws were screwed in popping out of the top of the playfield.

When they partially populate a playfield, put screws in too far, bulge the top sheet, strip it down, throw it in the reject pile, and then recycle it and send to a customer that already has a bad playfield. That is the standard for new and as good as any playfield in a pro machine.

They probably could have gotten away with that playfield in a pro machine and maybe the person would not have noticed. To send it out as a replacement?! I thought it was just a mistake, maybe someone grabbed it out of the wrong pile. Then they told the guy it wasn't and that it was good enough, then it was just them blatantly not giving a fuck.

Oh really? If there was nothing wrong with it then why did they start to put it together and then decide not to? Seems like an awful lot of work to me for no reason?

No, pinside people saw tiny (and I mean tiny) bumps in the wood and assumed it was caused by screws. The playfield looks pretty much the same as any other new pro playfield.

Stern can get parts on and off a playfield much faster than the average person at home. Maybe they realized they needed a playfield for that guy after all of the current stock were already on the line? So they tell the dude running the line to go grab one and strip it for shipment. New owner is presumably gonna fill those holes with screws, so why not?

Lol

Just like to say, that these suggestions of Stern not releasing information, photos etc. to the sales network before the public - forget it. It will hurt sales, if the people further down the chain cannot answer to any questions from potential buyers on their first phonecall or email enqury. Just bad practise, that may upset business partners too.

I don't think Stern mind too much that information is getting relayed on. It is the bad publicity that goes with it. It is because the leaks are not stunning, full resolution and complete presentation that reveals the product in the best possible way. It is a hazy copy. Without supplementary information or gameplay videos. And then the natures law (for any company), that the new game will be bad mouthed into oblivion by the hordes of opinionaders.

The key to a successful launch of a new pingame is that the time from reveal to games being shipped is a short as possible. It has to come out there, being played and enjoyed. That is what mediates the cold tempered expectations.

Are pro playfields inferior to PreLE? Didn’t see that on the feature matrix.

Exactly. They’re all the same. Unless there is a different version. (ie the Munsters lower playfield)

rd

Remember when this thread was about how Cary Hardy threw a tantrum about things he made up in his head and then once his paranoia subsided he admitted it wasn’t real and asked for the thread to end but then all his fan boys pivoted to bitching about stern for three more pages. Pinside sure is cool.

Remember those splitting Aerosmith cabinets?

WHY DO YOU HATE US STERN?!?!

Asking for a friend: is there a merit badge for contributing to Stern Rolling Grievance greatest hits threads?

All of the Maiden pro playfields I've seen were less saturated in color than prem/LE. Not sure if intentional or not. On paper the quality should be the same, but I think Stern is more proactive at culling premium/LE playfields with minor imperfections. I look at those tiny bumps highlighted on that JP Pro playfield and wonder, are y'all forgetting the bad old days of mis-registered LOTR playfields with random color emphasis?

I’ve closely inspected a STH pro playfield against my LE and the pro the clear was noticeably thinner and could feel the inserts. LE?. Like glass. Couldn’t feel inserts.

Intentional? No idea. Just my experience.

You mastered the art of selective reading.