(Topic ID: 83465)

Is Metallica a top 10 pinball

By Mato

10 years ago


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  • 444 posts
  • 151 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 9 years ago by Aurich
  • Topic is favorited by 3 Pinsiders

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“Is Metallica a top 10 pinball”

  • Yes 233 votes
    50%
  • No 178 votes
    38%
  • Needs more 53 votes
    11%

(464 votes)

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There are 444 posts in this topic. You are on page 6 of 9.
#251 9 years ago

I actually like tournament play, the "stress" is fun. I'm just not good enough to be serious. Put me in a room with 20 people and I can probably finish in the top 10, but I won't come close to first place. I'll still participate though, why not. But I'm just not going to enjoy "hit this shot over and over because it's the only way to score big" play.

I'm also not a fan of "I set my home games at 8° and take out the outlane posts because that's tournament style". Hey, your games, do whatever, mine are set at the designer's pitch with the stock post position and I play them to have fun, not punish myself.

#252 9 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

Well, that was a "casual" tournament at a friend's house....but actually I found it pretty stressful - I play better and have more fun when there are no stakes.

Who doesn't?

Really it's all a matter of your state of mind. Believe me, I understand exactly what you are saying as I played in a league for awhile too. The best part, by far, was hanging out with other pinheads. But when you have a shitty night in terms of scores, it really is a downer. Nothing fun about that. But when you do well and you have people cheering you on...that's what I'd call fun.

It can be an emotional roller coaster for sure.

#253 9 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

Tournament players take things VERY seriously. There's stress. There's anger. It's heavy stuff. I understand it, it's a competition...but the mindset of these players is VASTLY different for a lot of us who play "for fun".

That ridiculous. I think you're confusing nervousness and occasional frustration with stress and anger.

Quoted from Rarehero:

Tournament players are convinced their approach to a game is everyone's approach....they'll unequivocally say "this game sucks because you can just hit this ramp over and over forever" as though that truly is the ONLY function of that game - not realizing that outside a tournament, no one would play the game that way - and the game's modes, story progression, lights, sounds and even just the feeling of shots are what make games fun for most people.

The vast majority of games have multiple viable strategies. I enjoy learning new strategies and sharing what I've learned. Very few games only have one strategy. Bad example.

Quoted from Rarehero:

I met Josh Sharpe for the first time at the Hollywood Park Show/Tournament - I think this was the first super hardcore tournament I'd ever witnessed and the first time I played games that were set up so brutally.

Super hard core? There were 19 players total. Mostly local guys. One of the most laid back tournaments I've ever played in. Playing Varkon and Joust outdoors amongst palm trees is not hard core.

http://www.ifpapinball.com/view_tournament.php?t=147&e=1&d=2008-09-12#results

According to the IFPA site, that's the only tournament you've ever competed in (6 years ago). Where are you seeing all this stress and anger?

Quoted from Rarehero:

Well, that was a "casual" tournament at a friend's house....but actually I found it pretty stressful play better and have more fun when there are no stakes. When people are watching I flub and feel bad about it.

That's noob nervousness. Perfectly normal. As you compete in more tournaments, that goes away.

Quoted from Rarehero:

People keep telling me I should play in tournaments....but I don't want pinball to ever be not fun.

If you're playing strictly for fun, then cover up the displays on your games for a few months and tell us how fun they are like that. We all compete to some degree. It is a game. The casual divisions of tourneys like CAX and the NW tourney are blowing up. More and more folks are learning how much fun the competitive side of pinball is, which is reflected in the skyrocketing number of players being added to the rankings each month. No one is forcing you to compete, but you are missing out on all the fun. d:^)

#254 9 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

I met Josh Sharpe for the first time at the Hollywood Park Show/Tournament - I think this was the first super hardcore tournament I'd ever witnessed and the first time I played games that were set up so brutally. I asked Josh, "do you play pinball for fun anymore?" He bluntly answered "No" lol ....it's all about the strategy of finding the game's points exploits.

Let me clarify that most of my favorite games are those where the 'for fun' strategy and 'for tournament' strategy are the same strategy. It doesn't always have to be one way or the other.

Many games fall into this category where the natural progression of the game and higher point areas available are well within reach on a 3-ball game with no extras and harder-than factory physical settings.

Games like Jackbot where Casino Run and Mega Visor are definitely within striking distance and combine the most fun elements of the game, with the highest tournament scoring elements of the game.

IMO any game where the best players in the world can't reach the wizard mode ever in a tournament falls under the 'game is too hard' category. That leads players to abandoning bigger/higher scoring un-reachable goals that the game has to offer and pushes players into choose a different strategy to earn their points for competition.

#255 9 years ago
Quoted from phishrace:

If you're playing strictly for fun, then cover up the displays on your games for a few months and tell us how fun they are like that.

I would and then let you know if I could just cover the scores...but the animations are part of the fun too!

#256 9 years ago

If I had a dollar for every time someone banged the glass at Pinburgh this year, I'd be a rich man.

#257 9 years ago
Quoted from tb0ne:

If I had a dollar for every time someone banged the glass at Pinburgh this year, I'd be a rich man.

Working security at the PAPA facility is one of the easiest jobs in security. They mostly eat a lot of snacks, near as I can tell. I can't ever recall hearing of someone being asked to leave (thrown out) of the PAPA facility. You?

Whoever was throwing out the stink bombs at Pinburgh this year probably should've been tossed though. Not a competitive issue, obviously.

#258 9 years ago
Quoted from phishrace:

Working security at the PAPA facility is one of the easiest jobs in security. They mostly eat a lot of snacks, near as I can tell. I can't ever recall hearing of someone being asked to leave (thrown out) of the PAPA facility. You?
Whoever was throwing out the stink bombs at Pinburgh this year probably should've been tossed though. Not a competitive issue, obviously.

I just can't imagine walking into someone's house and slamming my fist into their glass out of frustration. If you're getting that frustrated, you may be taking pinball too seriously in my opinion. I don't think I've ever seen any of the top players do something like that.

Anyhow, this thread has moved off topic.

#259 9 years ago

I just played today and got 77 million on one ball and got to some level I've not seen before.

I think you need an engineering degree just to understand the new code or maybe I'm just dumb!

#260 9 years ago
Quoted from Rarehero:

Tournament players take things VERY seriously. There's stress. There's anger. It's heavy stuff. I understand it, it's a competition...but the mindset of these players is VASTLY different for a lot of us who play "for fun". It's interesting when the opinions of "fun" players and "tournament" players collide. Tournament players are convinced their approach to a game is everyone's approach....they'll unequivocally say "this game sucks because you can just hit this ramp over and over forever" as though that truly is the ONLY function of that game - not realizing that outside a tournament, no one would play the game that way - and the game's modes, story progression, lights, sounds and even just the feeling of shots are what make games fun for most people.
I met Josh Sharpe for the first time at the Hollywood Park Show/Tournament - I think this was the first super hardcore tournament I'd ever witnessed and the first time I played games that were set up so brutally. I asked Josh, "do you play pinball for fun anymore?" He bluntly answered "No" lol ....it's all about the strategy of finding the game's points exploits.
People keep telling me I should play in tournaments....but I don't want pinball to ever be not fun. I see that stress & anger ...I don't want to emotionally go there when enjoying my nerdy hobby. Also - logically - there are people who've been playing in Tournaments for 20 years....I will never win, so - why get crushed like that? Things are good in Funtown!

Well said! This is exactly why I always turn down my buddies who love going to league when the ask me to come play. I play for fun, and usually have the strategy that if I'm on a table long enough the points will take care of them self. That's not to say I don't like playing games with/against buddies, but that's vasltly different from league.

Quoted from Pimp77:

Yep. People bag on JM because of the spinner exploit and that is what the tourney or points players go for. I play for fun, meaning I go for power down and playing through the game. Tourney players just bash the MM castle all day too...playing for fun means going for all the other stuff. I don't care about score when I play a game. I just want to see cool shit and have fun.

Agreed! I had JM for a good while and put up some decent scores and never exploited the spinner. I remember one game getting to power down mode twice in the same game!

#261 9 years ago
Quoted from vtec16:

Well said! This is exactly why I always turn down my buddies who love going to league when the ask me to come play. I play for fun, and usually have the strategy that if I'm on a table long enough the points will take care of them self. That's not to say I don't like playing games with/against buddies, but that's vasltly different from league.

Give league a try. I'm not sure which part of NorCal you're in, but the SFPD meets are some of the most casual pinball playing I've ever seen, and most leagues are pretty chill. Folks that are new are often given help on games or with the league rules, and you get to meet a bunch of pinball folks on a regular basis.

#262 9 years ago

I own an LE and have been enjoying the heck out of it since the new code dropped, but it doesn't crack my personal top ten. It would probably be like top 25 if I made that big a list.

#263 9 years ago
Quoted from jalpert:

Or the snake shot that doesn't seem to stick more than 1/2 the time. This game needed some serious hardware polish before it was finalized, and you can't really fix this stuff.

That must be a premium thing.. my snake eats it all the time.

Ahem.

Also, the post in the lane is adjustable. If you really don't like it then turn it off, or hold down the left flipper on skill shot, or shoot combos. For me, since I like the operation of it, I left it on, but I DID have to adjust it on my pro after bringing it home from TPF. The thing was sitting way too high by default and when it was not activated, a nub actually sat above the playfield. Adjusted the set screw and magically the ball doesn't hang there, doesn't dribble back down the left side much, if at all, either. I'm guessing the thing being in correct position is deadening the hit a lot more. I dunno about the bounceback from the plunger to the right lane, but not sure why anyone would skillshot the post other than ignorance of the super skill shot anyways.

Anyways... 3 pros in my area, 2 on location, 0 snake issues. There was a premium on location and I don't remember any snake issues with it...was before code updates though. Hammer seemed to work great as well. = \

#264 9 years ago
Quoted from yancy:

I own an LE and have been enjoying the heck out of it since the new code dropped, but it doesn't crack my personal top ten. It would probably be like top 25 if I made that big a list.

What's in your top 10 then?

#265 9 years ago
Quoted from Mato:

What's in your top 10 then?

Those were my thoughts.

#267 9 years ago
Quoted from pinballcorpse:

Thanks for the clarification.
As I said, you obviously have skills-you could not stumble into 800 mil. But claiming 100mil every game was an attention getter.
Look forward to your statistics.
As a pinball and math lover, this part of the thread piqued my curiosity and raises an interesting hypothetical question to those with access to Metallica:
What would be the highest repetitive level score, say playing 10 straight games, someone would be willing to claim playing Metallica? I would assume the number is pretty low, maybe not even 20 MIL.
Assuming it is 20 MIL, to validate the claim, a player must make a minimum of 20 MIL ten times in a row. Not an average score of 20 MIL over ten games, but a minimum score of 20 MIL ten times in a row. The first game out of 10 that is not 20 MIL would nullify the claim regardless of how high any other scores are.
If people wanted to run a trial test, then play 10 games of Metallica. Whatever their lowest score was in 10 games, that would be an indicator of what they could claim they could do any time they stepped up to the game. Use that as your indicator and play another 10 games and see if it was accurate. If desired, you can say the low game was a fluke, and pick a higher number for your claim and try to back it up by proving it to yourself with another 10 game run.
Be interesting if people try this at home, with no restarts, do overs, coin door ball saver cheats, etc. It is something different to do.

So you and most on here are 100% correct. I have played multiple games and can't break 50,000,000 on 4 consecutive games it seems. For excuses, my graveyard targets are now only dropping 1 out of every 4 hits or so. I have really bashed them with my strategy so they are an issue now. Just smashing sparky is much more consistent and you can still get some graveyard hits for CIU while the ball saver is on. On 10 games scores as low as only a few million... Most around $20M or $50M. If I was in a tourney it would be stupid to try my strategy. But if I am trying to get all CIUs and make it through the game my strategy is still the best. I will try to fix my graveyard targets and keep experimenting. If they dropped everything my method might still hold water

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#268 9 years ago

I should mention as well that I am not a big fan of playing 4 player games myself at once. I just can't seem to take it serious enough when one of the scores gets behind

-2
#269 9 years ago
Quoted from tb0ne:

I just can't imagine walking into someone's house and slamming my fist into their glass out of frustration. If you're getting that frustrated, you may be taking pinball too seriously in my opinion. I don't think I've ever seen any of the top players do something like that.

seriously? they're only machines...they can take cab slaps and glass bangs imo

#270 9 years ago
Quoted from Mato:

What's in your top 10 then?

I dunno, I'm not much for lists. Whichever ten I pick today might change tomorrow. But I doubt Metallica would ever be up there. Still, calling it top 25 out of hundreds of titles is pretty high praise.

#271 9 years ago
Quoted from ifpapinball:

Games like Jackbot where Casino Run and Mega Visor are definitely within striking distance and combine the most fun elements of the game, with the highest tournament scoring elements of the game.

Casino Run...sure... Mega Visor? I dunno... MV is pretty bloody hard to get IMO. I guess it depends on how brutal your eye kickouts are and if you have the center post or not? Mine kick nearly STDM almost every time...it's VERY hard to get control of the balls and pick off shots on mine, and I've got Superbands on it. I've only ever gotten to mega visor once, but generally I'm more focused on Casino Run than MV, so that probably plays a part too. My outlanes are all the way open, and game is jacked up nearly all the way, slings and pops are super touchy as well... lots of fun!

#272 9 years ago
Quoted from Frax:

Casino Run...sure... Mega Visor? I dunno... MV is pretty bloody hard to get IMO. I guess it depends on how brutal your eye kickouts are and if you have the center post or not? Mine kick nearly STDM almost every time...it's VERY hard to get control of the balls and pick off shots on mine, and I've got Superbands on it. I've only ever gotten to mega visor once, but generally I'm more focused on Casino Run than MV, so that probably plays a part too. My outlanes are all the way open, and game is jacked up nearly all the way, slings and pops are super touchy as well... lots of fun!

The point I was mainly trying to make was regarding the strategy of stepping up to Jackbot and knowing that through the natural course of playing multiball (which is a major part of the game), that Mega Visor is 'in play'.

http://papa.org/2012/07/02/northwest-pinball-championships-final-game-2-jackbot/
Start watching at 18:10 and see Daniele reach MV in just under 5 minutes of play. Do the stars have to align to get there, sure, but it's very attainable for the upper echelon of players.

#273 9 years ago
Quoted from Ballsofsteel:

seriously? they're only machines...they can take cab slaps and glass bangs imo

Walk into my house and slap my glass or abuse what I own, I'll escort you out. Have some composure..

#274 9 years ago

Metallica has moved up another spot to 17..........its moving up where it belongs, 7 to go and a top 10 spot will be well rewarded for an awesome game and just think band mode to come.

#275 9 years ago
Quoted from ifpapinball:

but it's very attainable for the upper echelon of players.

Would like to see one of them on my game, just for laughs. Maybe I could learn a few things, because it's not attainable at ALL for me, and it's not like I'm some kind of slouch. I gotta figure out how to adjust the kickouts so they don't go STDM so much I guess.

1 month later
#276 9 years ago
Quoted from Roostking:

Walk into my house and slap my glass or abuse what I own, I'll escort you out. Have some composure..

nothing new, been thrown out of a bar before (literally) for slapping the cab of a COTBL

#277 9 years ago

A cab and glass are two different things my friend.

#278 9 years ago

This was a fun read. LOL Go Aurich! I totally understood what you meant. Aurich's point was that to attempt to prove MET isn't a Top 10 game because here's what the PAPA players are doing "Start Sparky...rinse repeat" is a weak attempt to make a terrible point.

Tournament players do not play for fun during tournaments, only points, and as Keefer pointed out, you're trying to make the safest shots in order to outscore the other 3 players. That's just a horrific litmus test for a machine's Fun Factor. So please, much like the guys who call MM a 'castle fest' after watching it in PAPA TV, never again use tournament players' strategies as an example of a game being more/less fun. It's completely irrelevant. Timing out modes, slow and sterile ball manipulation over and over again, pounding one particular shot only, etc. That's supposed to make a case for whether or not a machine is fun? C'mon... Good for you Aurich! Poor choice of words in your rebuttal, because of course all the PAPA players thoroughly know the ruleset and can probably remember how they'd play back when they used to have fun, but good for you standing up to the Gang Mentality!

MET is a special pinball machine. The flow of the layout, the varied scoring tiers and strategies, the new depth of the ruleset, the incredible lighting effects, the sounds, etc. The furious way in which made shots can flow during a great multiball stack into pure pinball euphoria is simply special, only something I've found on a handful of other machines. I have a varied collection and have almost exclusively chosen to play MET in 2014. It's actually surprising how addicting it is.

A sidenote. Does anyone else use the "Pool" callout during multiball (not just MET, but any multiball)? LOL Well MET is one of the best for it. We use it to call a pool-shot so the other players know you're purposefully cue-balling one ball into a shot using another. And MET is one of the best for this. I cue shots into Snake all the time, but of course it's just luck unless you call it! And if you call it, and it doesn't go then you look like a Dork. So there's the risk/reward. You feel like Bruce Elwin Ali Norris when you make a couple of called cue-shots in a row, though! For me, when I'm hitting it that smooth and precise on the fly (I'm not much of a ball-cradler during multis, normally) I feel like Kvothe lowering himself into the Heart of Stone (for the Kingkiller Chronicle fans out there). Zen.

Top 10 lists and rating systems get very political, of course, so who cares. I just know for the past few months since the update, MET has not only been the most machine played at my place, it's been damn near the only.

#280 9 years ago

Most definitely a top 10! Probably a top 5...(the only reason it may not make that echelon is that not everyone is a fan of Metallica's music).
I own ACDC Prem, LOTR both ranked high according to Pinside. Honestly, METLE is so much more of a rush to play. I don't even turn on most of my machines anymore! I always seem to come back to Metallica!

#281 9 years ago

Yup. Total agreement with these last few posts. What I love about the game is this:
Fantastic flow with lots of shots available. You can play it your way. Want to go for multiball? Go for it. Hit Sparky, the inline drop targets, coffin, or the snake. Want to try to get to Seek and Destroy? Light all those inserts without draining or you have to start over.
Crank it up? So much fun, AND 4 different modes, providing a very different experience each time you get there.
Often I find myself ignoring everything else and just trying to combo ramps.
In my opinion, a couple good ramp combos are as satisfying as the STLE warp ramp, only a little easier.

I wouldn't go so far as to say "I hate Metallica", but I only knew 2-3 on the songs when I bought it, thinking I would replace the music. After playing it (and playing it, and playing it...) over the last week+, I know more of the music, and there are only four songs approx that I won't select at the start. It's growing on me for sure.

#282 9 years ago

METALLICA pinball is easily the greatest pin ever !

Thank you so much JB and LS for this insane game ,
you guys are awesome

around 1 month of solid play after code update (well 2-3 games per day )
I am totally addicted ,
my SM , WH20 and HS2 lay totally neglected

METLE keeps me coming back for more
the depth, the modes, the entire game is just kick ass !

METLE is # 1

#283 9 years ago
Quoted from mechslave:

Good for you Aurich! Poor choice of words in your rebuttal, because of course all the PAPA players thoroughly know the ruleset and can probably remember how they'd play back when they used to have fun, but good for you standing up to the Gang Mentality!

lol, I dunno about the "Gang Mentality", you understood the spirit of my point, but I freely admit I got in over my head talking about the tournament stuff. It's a different way to play, and I can respect that. I should have been more careful about how I phrased things, I was only trying to say "hey, there's a lot more to this game than spamming one shot" if you're trying to have fun and explore all there is to offer with scoring. If someone like Keefer wants to correct me about tournament play who the hell am I to object? I've never played in anything outside of little local tournaments with peers.

#284 9 years ago

Lyman is still working on it !

-5
#285 9 years ago

Top 10 all time? Nah. I reserve those designations for watershed type games like High Speed, black knight, taf, fireball, Space Shuttle....

#286 9 years ago

I was at the pinball hall of fame in Vegas not long ago and it gave me a chance to play the classics. Theater of Magic was a standout amongst all and of course Mm was a blast, Monster Bash etc. And of course I don't have these in my house, but I would not trade 2 of those games for my METLE. This game has me addicted!!

#287 9 years ago
Quoted from Roostking:

I was at the pinball hall of fame in Vegas not long ago and it game me a chance to play the classics. Theater of Magic was a standout amongst all and of course Mm was a blast, Monster Bash etc. And of course I don't have these in my house, but I would not trade 2 of those games for my METLE. This game has me addicted!!

+1

Quoted from davewtf:

Top 10 all time? Nah. I reserve those designations for watershed type games like High Speed, black knight, taf, fireball, Space Shuttle....

Your so far away in time,your slowing the group down

Every one has different opinion and that's fine but dawm i love the new Stern's they are making !

#288 9 years ago

Imo, this is the greatest, flow, adrenaline rush, lighting, music, rules, artwork, everything about tallica, well, it just plain ROOOOOLZ MAN! !! If you're not liking it, theres seriously something wrong. It kicks the butt off everything, wow, I play like 15 games a day mimimum, (im a decent player) and this game has the capacity to kick my ass and make me want more, more, more. Ive tried getting into my others, iron man, tspp, wpt but they just dont do it for me anymore, ive hardly touched them since.ive gotten my le, (I havr tried) 1-2 games later, its back to tallica, it will nevaaaaa leave, it's just soooooooo damn good. And theres more.to come, luv u jb an lyman.

#289 9 years ago

Aren't we all glad we kept ours while others sold before the "big" update Metallica is my house is #1

#290 9 years ago

With the new code and premium version top 10, if they improve the code I think even the top 5

#291 9 years ago
Quoted from Aurich:

If someone like Keefer wants to correct me about tournament play who the hell am I to object? I've never played in anything outside of little local tournaments with peers.

Haha, well I think he was actually helping to make your point in a roundabout way. Keefer's one of the better and more consistent PAPA players...I've played against him in Pinburgh, and even luckily beat him on a couple games. The best of the best can not only understand what makes a game fun, but can turn that part of their brain completely off when in competition and isolate safe points and measure their flips carefully. I'm not in any way that seasoned of a player.

Tournament play is *almost* about NOT having fun, for me. What I mean is that I have to catch myself in tournaments, when I start a multiball or something, I'm like "Yeeeeaaahhhh!" inside and get all excited, start trying to knock shots around on the fly and have fun....and then I go..."No!! I'm in a tourney, what am I doing???" and I'll try and stay under control and walk in the hallways instead of running, but that's not my game...so I end up playing tight, etc.

To truly understand the fun factor of MET, I think you have to let go of any sort of methodical tournament play mindset, and just open the game up organically with natural flowing fun shots. You'll find yourself putting qualifying elements together and be surprised not only at how insane your score is (Fade to Black jackpot anyone?!!) but how entrancing and immersive the game can be.

#292 9 years ago
Quoted from mechslave:

To truly understand the fun factor of MET, I think you have to let go of any sort of methodical tournament play mindset, and just open the game up organically with natural flowing fun shots. You'll find yourself putting qualifying elements together and be surprised not only at how insane your score is (Fade to Black jackpot anyone?!!) but how entrancing and immersive the game can be.

It's an awesome mix of just flailing at the ball, and experiencing the amazing flow the layout offers, but also knowing when to slow things down and plan your shots.
That's what I find so cool about this game.

#293 9 years ago

Top 5 for me

#294 9 years ago

If some people don't like the 'big' hammer, you would think there might be a market for a mod to put a smaller one on the playfield so it isn't so obtrusive?

And as much as I might think the pro is ok, I really do want the better lightshow with the premium. I'm trying to locate a premium right now.

Rob

#295 9 years ago

It's definitely a top 20 game but I've got to move that left lane down. Biggest left lane drain game of any I have owned.

#296 9 years ago

Mine may be a pro....but i love it. Definitely one of the best pins ive ever owned....and ive owned plenty over the years, see my past game collection on pinside...and that aint but 1/3rd of it. The honeymoon is over, it is still a winner!

#297 9 years ago
Quoted from eggbert52:

It's definitely a top 20 game but I've got to move that left lane down. Biggest left lane drain game of any I have owned.

The left drain is killer.

#298 9 years ago
Quoted from eggbert52:

It's definitely a top 20 game but I've got to move that left lane down. Biggest left lane drain game of any I have owned.

Shadow outlanes can be pretty brutal too. When I owned mine, I lowered the posts all the way otherwise it was a super outlane drain monster...

Rob

#299 9 years ago

My mate come around yesterday and its the 1st he played my mople, let me tell you he said it was the best pin he had ever played. I had to question him cause he is a huge Tron pinball fan and yep he admitted that mople kicked its butt all over the park.

-3
#300 9 years ago

In a word: no.

In more words: The game is still just not that exciting. The Crank It Up modes are great but the Fuel shot is too awkward to maintain a lengthy doubler like you can with the bell in ACDC. The layout is awkward as hell and magic Sparky drains get old real fast. If you ever have to shoot one shot 10+ times in a row in a game in order to score well, it's not a "top 10" game. There's no doubt that the game is far far better with the new code, but it just doesn't provide the interesting strategic decisions or exciting gameplay necessary for a game to be top 10 in my book. The whole way that qualifying the Crank It Up modes works currently is bizarre and frankly counter intuitive too. Maybe I just need a few pointers from KME in order to enjoy the game, but as is it just leaves me feeling kinda unhappy and bored while I'm playing. There are some signs of greatness in there (the multiple Super Skill Shots with different rewards, Crank It Up modes, pick target add-a-ball/playfield multipliers, etc) but it's far from top 10 status right now. Lyman has made some of the greatest code in the history of pinball, though, so I'm sure it will be great when he is truly done with it.

Just in case anyone is curious about what *is* a good game by my criteria, here's some of my favorites:
Jackbot, AFM, TSPP, Congo, ACDC, Frontier, Flash Gordon, Twilight Zone, etc...

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From: $ 30.00
Lighting - Interactive
Pinball Z
Interactive
From: $ 5.00
Cabinet - Other
Pin Monk
Other
$ 29.95
Cabinet - Decals
Pinball Pimp
Decals
$ 26.50
$ 4.95
Lighting - Led
Mitchell Lighting
Led
$ 15.00
Playfield - Protection
SilverBall Designs
Protection
From: $ 30.00
Cabinet - Toppers
+CY Universal
Toppers
$ 24.95
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
ULEKstore
Toys/Add-ons
$ 24.95
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
ULEKstore
Toys/Add-ons
$ 76.00
Lighting - Backbox
Arcade Upkeep
Backbox
From: $ 1.49
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
Daddio's 3D Printed Mods
Toys/Add-ons
11,000 (OBO)
Machine - For Sale
Middletown, DE
$ 129.95
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
Hookedonpinball.com
Toys/Add-ons
$ 15.00
Cabinet - Other
Rocket City Pinball
Other
$ 54.99
Cabinet - Shooter Rods
Lighted Pinball Mods
Shooter rods
$ 199.00
Cabinet - Decals
Pinball Shark
Decals
From: $ 6.00
$ 19.95
Playfield - Protection
SilverBall Designs
Protection
From: $ 129.95
Lighting - Interactive
Hookedonpinball.com
Interactive
$ 69.99
Playfield - Toys/Add-ons
Lighted Pinball Mods
Toys/Add-ons
7,000 (OBO)
Machine - For Sale
Elgin, OK
$ 54.99
Cabinet - Shooter Rods
Lighted Pinball Mods
Shooter rods
7,750 (Firm)
Machine - For Sale
St. Louis, MO
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