I think LOTR is fun, but even with my lack of playing skills, games last too long.

Metallica is far and away the Best Stern, and best pin overall, for me. I am really looking forward to the day when I see a pin that I like more than Metallica. That will be a very fun pin.

i really don't think so. it did not last long for me. i know people love it. path of dead is horrible in my opinion. call outs get annoying - did i mention path of dead
but in the end, play what you like and keep what you like. with the exception of some very rare games, you can always get back something you miss

here are my top 5 modern sterns

1 tron le
2 walking dead premium le
3 acdc premium or le
4 GotG premium or le
5 Iron Maiden pro for now

I just think these newer sterns are so much more immersive and they are only getting better. kinda hard to describe but they have the one more game element where tspp, lotr, spiderman, ... just don't. maybe they feel old now like an EM does.

It's because the owner and the techs who work on the Silverball machines believe Stern machines are unreliable and the cost of replacement parts is excessive.

They still have a few Stern machines such as TSPP, Elvis and Sopranos.

LOTR is a great game but it never really clicked with me. Same with TSPP. I can easily think of ten Sterns I'd rather have.

SW
Metallica
ACDC
WPT
IMVE
GOTG
BM66
ST
IMDN
GB

I didn't realize that they no longer had those machines. They must have gotten rid of them in the last year or so because I played all of them there.

I have an office right on Cookman Ave. and used to go there quite a bit after having some pizza and a few drinks at Porta.

My opinion; yes, it’s in a small group that could be be considered the best Stern Pin.
Thus far there is nothing I have played from Stern that I would put above it.

But how you like (or don’t like) the theme and the play of each specific machine makes a difference.
Mine may be an exception as it is super fast and challenging, it has a new playfield with an extra clearcoat and strong flippers. Play is very fast with speeds on some shots that at times can rival JM and TOM. Many games are short, with an occasional long game. I could see it being a drag at times if it played slower and every game took a long time.

no

STLE and AC/DC are tied for number 1 in my opinion, but I guess I prefer Steve’s layouts. Nothing wrong with LOTR, but it’s a bit of a grind to play.

Yeah, I feel the same way. I find Stern games the most fun to play. In a way, I am glad my collection is small, because I can go to a bar and play some pinball, have a good time, and not have to worry about the cabinet splitting, or other shitty quality issues. I think WOZ is a masterpiece, especially for when it came out, but I almost have no idea what i'm doing most of the time. I'm excited to see more games from different manufactures. It's in the best interest of pinball for their to be a lot of competition.

That being said. I love LOTR and wish I owned one. I tend to think there is no "best" of anything. People like different things. I can't see why AFM is so popular. Just not my thing, but it's a lot of other peoples.

I've seen statements like this before, and I always find them to be a bit confusing. The wizard mode is simply a goal to shoot for, and even when you reach it, the game doesn't "end" per se.

LOTR doesn't click with me either. It just looks cheap to me on the surface and difficult to understand how to play. I tried getting into it and learning rules but just get bored. Not a fan of the whole medieval fantasy thing so maybe that's a big part of it. TSPP has more interest for me with fun theme, multiple flippers, mini playfield that actually does something, and just lots of features. Still not my favorite Stern, though. I would have to say that goes to MET. Artwork and theme not exactly my favorite style but they work great for a pinball theme. Band members do callouts and animations are top notch. Rules are very balanced with easy to understand basics for beginners and depth for advanced players. It's not hard to get to a CUI mode and feel like you accomplished something. Gameplay is fast and challenging without being too brutal like other Stern games (looking at you GB and TWD). Stern has been making these for what - 5 years now? No telling how many they sold but has to be the top seller or 2nd. That says something right there.

If you're a Tolkien fan and a fan of the movies then yes. The theme integration is insane, every mode and multiball, call outs, etc. puts you right back into the movies.

If you're not a fan of the theme you probably don't feel its #1.

The Silverball Museum in Del Ray has a few Stern games.

I think their focus is on classics, which is great. It's not like it's too hard to find Stern games to play. Not so much a Drop a Card, Strange World, or TKO.

That's one I don't usually hear regarding LOTR. I'm curious what exactly gives you that impression and what other Stern games you're comparing it to (that doesn't look cheap)?

Personally I'd rather a MET over LOTR right now, which is funny because when I first started out LOTR was my grail pin.

Mostly the photoshop grainy artwork and the "path of adventure" feature. Balls just rolls down and falls off in different places. Things just look thrown together. In general, I find most Stern pins a bit cheep looking. I started out as a B/W snob but once I started to play Stern games I found most of them to be pretty fun. Basically learned not to judge a book by it's cover when it comes to pins. Latest example of that is SW. Really not impressed with the look of it at launch but once I started to play it I loved it. Super fun game.

Owned the L.E and sold it after 2 months. It's definitely a good game but lengthy game times do ruin it for me. The overall art package looks nice but it suffers from Sterns Photoshop era issues compared to the current games. I think Met and TWD are easily better and maybe some other Sterns top it as well.

I'll have to give you that. The photoshop art was pretty much the Stern standard up until Met.

LOTR is the nicest stern game with the cointaker LEDs package,a LED package was put together for LOTR and man you talk about beautiful colors and well thought out.a true beauty indeed

Same here. The long ball times do have an impact on how often I would fire up the game. I started asking myself if I really wanted to dedicate the amount of time that a good game of LotR might take, so I found myself not playing as often. For several months the one thing that kept me playing was the thought of finally getting to Valinor, but once I did that, the motivation to play was reduced quite a bit.

That said, I will always consider LOTR one of the best pins out there overall. There are very few pins that have better theme integration than LOTR, and personally I think the theme is superb. The ruleset is one of the best, and it helps significantly with that theme integration. Also, this was a time when Stern could actually use call outs from the actual movie. And man, this pin probably has some of the best call outs on any Stern pin ever, including the custom voice work that was done. The center ring magnet is a great toy and it is used well.

Destroying the Ring *never* gets old, and that is one thing that also would motivate me to keep playing despite the long ball times. I've owned LOTR 3 times (including an LE) so the pin obviously appeals to me.

Batman66 can’t hold LOTR’s jock. LOTR has WAY better toys and layout and despite all the TV show clips and callouts, LOTR has better theme integration and immersion. AND call outs!

And while Lyman is certainly putting a lot into BM66, those rules can’t touch LOTR’s. It’s Keefer’s masterpiece.

And unless the people complaining about long ball times are getting to TABA regularly, finishing MBs and receiving gifts from the elves....play better! The game rewards good play. If you’re just playing grab ass all day then by all means, sell the game.

I should have mentioned TABA in my post. Such a great (mini wizard?) mode. The music for that mode is so distinct from the rest in the game, there is just no mistaking the fact that you are in TABA.

yes it really is and one of a kind gem,i do hear it a lot from previous owners that they wished they still had their LOTR not because its going up in value its the gameplay they miss

The callouts are some of the best! Suuuper jackpot whaahaha!! Plus on the rare occasion that you take down the Balrog. You shall not pass!!

yes it really gets your blood pumping

I own many great Stern pins and incuding LotR which has among the best rules and features and theme.

Stern's best? IMHO Yes.

The 2 flippers give it simplicity.
The rules give it complexity.
The Ring and Balrog give it "a toy to bash."
The call-outs give it instruction.
The music & sound give it drama.
The artwork gives it attraction.
The depth gives it a challenge.
The theme gives it familiarity.
The reliability gives it longevity.
The animations give it extra "coolness."

LOTR is one of those rare combinations. It truly is.

Tron is my favorite game of all time.
LOTR I’ve owned, and currently own and it’s definitely in my top ten games of all time. When I come back to it after not playing it for a long time, I’m reminded how epic it truly is. It’s lightning in a Gomez bottle. The shot layouts, code, sounds and callouts, all tops.

With that said the game is maddening too. I’ve yet to reach Valinor, but have had the ball in the ring with Valinor waiting on the other side, even hit the ball...but it didn’t free from the magnets grip.
Someday.

YouTotallyDoSimplyWalkIntoMordor (resized).png

My one that got away story:

I didn't know the exact requirements to qualify Valinor. I thought I had to complete TABA, turns out you only have to start it.

In that game, I had everything else completed and was in DTR. It was a long game and the flippers were struggling. I got six or so shots at the ring but none of them had enough juice. I hadn't completed TABA so I thought I still had a long way to go to restart it. So I basically gave up shooting the ring. Bricked a ramp shot. Game over.

Shortly after I actually read the rules and realized just how close I was.
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/how-is-valinor-started#post-284574

I find the hardest thing to do is, start fellowship again. It’s a lot of ring shots to qualify it again, so even if you beat that multi ball, you’re going to (almost definitely) need to start it again manually.
(It’s basically spotted at game start, just hit each shot)
I’m still not exactly sure what even qualifies a ring flashing for each character on fellowship

I played LOTR for the first time at Pinfest last year. It was a stunning example of the game. I loved it and it would at the top of my list of Stern games to own IMO. Maybe one day.

Just curious why you like Metallica over Iron Maiden as deciding between the two

The main thing I like about Stern as I believe they create great flow in games compared to other company’s still trying to find or create in games. LOTR, SM, Star Trek, Metallica, Star Wars, Maiden seem to all have it. Maybe others I am missing but just off top of my head.

Well said. It is subjective. I happen to really love LOTR, and I'd say it is their best game (I'm on my second copy). But I don't turn to it all the time, because it is a longer playing game. Plus I have to be in the mood for it. I remember when I got my first one, I'd play obsessively. Over and over trying to get farther. Each game, I'd have a strategy. Sometimes I'd play to complete multiballs. Others, it was just destroy the ring this time. And still other times it would be TABA, or finishing modes. LOTR has so much going for it. But sometimes you just want the brutality of Iron Man... at which point I play Iron Man.

In LOTR, it is just the integration of the theme, and some of the best rules ever written in a pinball machine. Does that make it the best? I think so, but we all need to decide that for ourselves.

I truly wish people would stop with all the superlatives.

"Truly" and "greatest" don't work together. Subjective opinion and truth are mutually exclusive.

And, a game that requires a commitment of at least a half hour to press Start? Then everything doesn't fall together, again, as usual, are you ready to try again and fall short again? Some "greatest!"

I’m actually gonna say yes. Even tho I got tired of it after a couple years, LOTR really does tick all the boxes. It’s fun but deep, looks good, has great call outs and music and other than playing a little long and maybe flipper fade doesn’t seem to have any real issues.

I’d say Metallica, AC/DC, Spider-Man and TRON have very serious claims to the title of Greatest Stern too tho.

For me, it isn't. Id sell it before my Met Premium, GB Premium or Spiderman. It is a great game though.

Nope .... not for me owned three, two HUO and one new in box. Id rather shoot myself than hear " path of the dead " in my home again.

You meant it as emphasis. I get it. But "greatest" is already emphatic, so it didn't need further qualification.

Unnecessary adverbs are just bad writing, as any writer will tell you.

I truly hope you have a very very super duper day.

LOTR was the best modern pin to be release UP TO THAT POINT IN TIME. However, it plays very long, has a couple of poorly designed mechs, and is far from the best Stern has to offer any longer.

Has it been "passed up" because Stern hired better designers and up'd their game? At this point, probably so.

If you put TWD or MET next to LOTR, LOTR looks and feels dated by the standards set by the pinball industry in general along with those that play pinball.

LOTR set the standard for a while. That torch has been passed along. It's a fantastic design in many ways but designs and fun factors move along with the times and that helps to keep games fresh and timeless. I can name a lot more games since LOTR that do not measure up to it but a few that were released after LOTR are certainly better games and have higher replay value.

MET will play very very long. I've gotten to End of the Line, and it took forever (200 plus hits to the captive ball alone) Either game can be flipped for fun, or, take the journey down the rabbit hole. MET is regarded as a great pin, but as ''dated'' as LOTR may feel, I think LOTR is a better overall game.

You may be overlooking quite a bit. Any member here could start listing massive improvements in lighting and software design that Stern has made standard since LOTR (cabinet construction and clear coat/insert issue jokes aside). The stuff just didn't exist and is missing from games released before the pro/prem/LE game models.

This is just like comparing pinball games from 1980 or 1992 with games from 2018. There really is no fair comparison. Times change and stuff gets better integrated man.

"Better" for you? Ok, I agree with that. Better for the masses... I don't know about that one. I don't think a LOTR would appeal to nearly as many patrons in a barcade as Star Trek, Star Wars, Kiss, or Iron Maiden. BEFORE OR AFTER they are forced to play LOTR. You could put LOTR on free play in all it's incandescent GI glory and those other 4 Sterns next to it and they would still kill on location.

Putting that scenario together makes no more sense than comparing pins from 2003/04 with games from 2016/17/18, stating one is better than the other. Better in which ways... design, earnings, sales, replay value, secondary market sales, audit/ops management, collectability, ect.

Answer this question for me. In your opinion, when LOTR was released, what pin did it surpass as the best up to THAT point in pinball history?

Half of this argument isn't entirely fair, as MET is still a newish pin, certainly fresher on the scene, while LOTR has been played and pumped more times than a prostitute in the red light district. One obviously has more of a desire to be played more by the masses, it's newer, and they're what, 11 years apart?

As for surpassing, I would say it surpassed all of them at that point. Pinball went the way of the dinosaurs, and out popped this creation. Think of what came right before this from Stern, what was it, Monopoly?
I don't know, you could argue that some WPC pins are ''better'' pins, that's all subjective to personal taste. As far as it not living up to it's earning potential, MET will get there someday, give it another decade. Maybe people won't want to pump quarters in it anymore, maybe they will but it doesn't mean it wasn't one of the top games.
LOTR is 15 years old, and I've nearly owned them all and played the snot out of each release. In my opinion, it IS one of the top ten games ever made. Metallica is not to me. Might be in my top 15-20 though.

The reason TSPP is better than LOTR, is you don't have to play for an eternity to reach the point where it is a new challenge for long term owners.

Just start and finish the modes without timing out or draining. If you can do it you are rewarded with super jackpot value shots to blow up your score. Ther more you complete, the better the value. It's an attainable challenge from the first plunge. Throw in double scoring the shots and it adds even more short term challenge. It ain't about completing the multiballs like LOTR.

The beauty is you don't have to "earn the opportunity" for something cool to occur by playing for 30+ minutes. (But if that's what you like. TSPP beats LOTR in the depth dept too.)