(Topic ID: 239117)

Is JJP really done with Pirates?


By Rockytop

1 year ago



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  • 248 posts
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  • Latest reply 75 days ago by Tkaye
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There are 248 posts in this topic. You are on page 5 of 5.
#201 3 months ago
Quoted from delt31:

I do agree that Jack will build this game if he can (regardless of if it was a pain or not). The cost will def be 11.5 or higher and likely year(s) out but Jack will build it again IF the license doesn't cause a conflict (IMO).

I gotta think the 11.5 WoZ's did just...okay.

For a POTC to sell at 11.5, it would have to be somewhat unique like the CE, not features removed.

I say this all the time.... People clamoring on Pinside for this game is entirely different than people buying....this game.

I wonder how many 10K in full down payments would be made, if JJP made an open call to fans.

#202 3 months ago

If JJP was to eliminate "one" feature from POTC - like they did the Monkey with WOZYBR - which would it be?
Remember.... I said "if". Hard to see any feature being removed really. They are all pertinent to the game play.

#203 3 months ago
Quoted from MurphyPeoples:

If JJP was to eliminate "one" feature from POTC - like they did the Monkey with WOZYBR - which would it be?
Remember.... I said "if". Hard to see any feature being removed really. They are all pertinent to the game play.

I'd say the closing treasure chest or 2 of the 3 spinning disks. Oh wait...

#204 3 months ago
Quoted from kermit24:

I'd say the closing treasure chest or 2 of the 3 spinning disks. Oh wait...

Ancient history but still a little funny

#205 3 months ago
Quoted from romulusx:

Ancient history but still a little funny

Seriously though, if YBR Woz is showing anything it’s that removing stuff AND charging more is insane. So I hope they keep the game the same. But I doubt it will get remade. A few folks will pony up $11K+ for POTC but not enough to justify a new run. I’d think they would need 1K orders for that.

#206 3 months ago

$11K at 1,000 = $11,000,000.00!

#207 3 months ago
Quoted from captjoeb:

$11K at 1,000 = $11,000,000.00!

They don’t make anywhere near 11k per game

#208 3 months ago

Here is my take... I think Jack wants them to make more Pirates. I think others at JJP do not want to do more Pirates. The parts are a serious issue with this game.

But here is my opinion... only do Collector Editions make 100 of them and charge $13,500.00.

They will sell out in the same week they announce it.

#209 3 months ago

Seems like JJP’s investors finally want some real returns and are making financially driven decisions like compromising customer service, cutting the BOM, and consolidating facilities. Hard to see how committing precious production assets & resources to a machine that was not a success is a compelling business strategy. Even if there are hundreds of potential sales of a high $ POTC version, the returns would be small compared to 1000’s of sales of a franchise title like Toy Story. The profit margin on a high $ POTC would still probably only equal a Willy Wonka Standard or LE. Who really knows, but games shipping back from AU and EU due to lack of demand was surprising. Maybe it would be the right decision (lesser of 2 evils) if one of their new games is a weak seller and they need to leverage open capacity.

#210 3 months ago
Quoted from kermit24:

Seriously though, if YBR Woz is showing anything it’s that removing stuff AND charging more is insane. So I hope they keep the game the same. But I doubt it will get remade. A few folks will pony up $11K+ for POTC but not enough to justify a new run. I’d think they would need 1K orders for that.

They could sell it for $9500 and make good margins I have no doubt. I believe the playfield issues are resolved so the profit on the new games will be even better as they won’t have to send everyone a new playfield for free.

#211 3 months ago

Pirates is done. Time for JJP to make more profit on slightly less loaded and complex games.

#212 3 months ago
Quoted from drfrightner:

Here is my take... I think Jack wants them to make more Pirates. I think others at JJP do not want to do more Pirates. The parts are a serious issue with this game.
But here is my opinion... only do Collector Editions make 100 of them and charge $13,500.00.
They will sell out in the same week they announce it.

Yeah That plan would go over well for JJP! lol They made the Collectors Edition game 1-200. Yes they have done limitless LE games but those were not sold as volume specific. Add to that the Ce custom crap cost them way more then a simple 1k bump. If and I am highly doubtful they ever would they could do another 11.5 run of LE's and even loose the troublesome spinner. 2k over previous would make sense and having an Over stock of inventory on the more common LE would be more sensible.

#213 3 months ago

Thing is...there are several LE’s for sale right now that aren’t moving, and aren’t terribly overpriced either. Really not sure the market conditions are right for a POTC run right now.

And I say this with sadness because I think this game’s run was absolutely too short.

#214 3 months ago
Quoted from zaphX:

Thing is...there are several LE’s for sale right now that aren’t moving, and aren’t terribly overpriced either. Really not sure the market conditions are right for a POTC run right now.
And I say this with sadness because I think this game’s run was absolutely too short.

Looks like the one HUO LE moved within an hour for 10500 though.

#215 3 months ago
Quoted from wesman:

Looks like the one HUO LE moved within an hour for 10500 though.

No, he apologized to the forum as he typed the price incorrectly. He did not sell.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/apologies-1

#216 3 months ago
Quoted from Yelobird:

No, he apologized to the forum as he typed the price incorrectly. He did not sell.
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/apologies-1

Wow! Thanks for posting that. I saw the ad go dead before I left work, and noticed it was just archived.

Definitely makes sense. Thanks for the clarification!

-1
#217 89 days ago
Quoted from wesman:

Wow! Thanks for posting that. I saw the ad go dead before I left work, and noticed it was just archived.
Definitely makes sense. Thanks for the clarification!

Yeah expect a repost at $14k or $14.5k

#218 89 days ago

I would buy a NIB RRWOZ so yep JJP has lots of options for the main and secondary lines.

-8
#219 88 days ago

POTC a good game is way overpriced and the reason foreign operations could not sell them and sent them back. Don’t think if pricing was actually Jack’s decision they’d be priced so high. Guessing it is the investors saying we want a big return from all the losses to date. Isn’t that why they ran YBR at $11.5k to bring in much needed revenue?

If POTC could be run at a more reasonable price, they’d sell fairly well I’d guess. It’s better to make less per machine and keep the factory rolling, than make a high margin on just a few and keep stalling the assembly line and only making one game every 2 years or so.

#220 88 days ago
Quoted from jimwe5t:

POTC a good game is way overpriced and the reason foreign operations could not sell them and sent them back. Don’t think if pricing was actually Jack’s decision they’d be priced so high. Guessing it is the investors saying we want a big return from all the losses to date. Isn’t that why they ran YBR at $11.5k to bring in much needed revenue?
If POTC could be run at a more reasonable price, they’d sell fairly well I’d guess. It’s better to make less per machine and keep the factory rolling, than make a high margin on just a few and keep stalling the assembly line and only making one game every 2 years or so.

Good grief. Do you see what Stern is charging for $9k lately? Theres no way in hell Pirates could be run cheaper. That game is loaded more then 99% of pins out there. Seriously theres twice as much stuff in Pirates LE then say Stranger Things LE.

The JJP bashing from the usual suspects has gotten old these past few weeks.

#221 88 days ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

Good grief. Do you see what Stern is charging for $9k lately? Theres no way in hell Pirates could be run cheaper. That game is loaded more then 99% of pins out there. Seriously theres twice as much stuff in Pirates LE then say Stranger Things LE.
The JJP bashing from the usual suspects has gotten old these past few weeks.

I just got an Elvira LE, which is probably the most mech-heavy game I've seen from Stern in quite a while. It even has subways! It has a moving staircase ramp, mechanical trunk ("chest"), a moving, opening/closing bash toy, and a whole bunch of diverters. Huge improvement IMO from Stern in the "what you get in the box" department. That game runs about the same as the Pirates LE did, and it's not even remotely close to the BOM as POTC.

#222 88 days ago
Quoted from Rdoyle1978:

I just got an Elvira LE, which is probably the most mech-heavy game I've seen from Stern in quite a while. It even has subways! It has a moving staircase ramp, mechanical trunk ("chest"), a moving, opening/closing bash toy, and a whole bunch of diverters. Huge improvement IMO from Stern in the "what you get in the box" department. That game runs about the same as the Pirates LE did, and it's not even remotely close to the BOM as POTC.

Congrats on the new pin! I really liked playing an Elvira Premium on location and can see picking one up. I wish all Sterns were treated the same in regards to number of mechanical features and 3D molds.

#223 88 days ago
Quoted from Rdoyle1978:

I just got an Elvira LE, which is probably the most mech-heavy game I've seen from Stern in quite a while. It even has subways! It has a moving staircase ramp, mechanical trunk ("chest"), a moving, opening/closing bash toy, and a whole bunch of diverters. Huge improvement IMO from Stern in the "what you get in the box" department. That game runs about the same as the Pirates LE did, and it's not even remotely close to the BOM as POTC.

plus Elvira HOH is nothing but a mech nightmare.

#224 88 days ago
Quoted from Whysnow:

plus Elvira HOH is nothing but a mech nightmare.

Luckily, I’ve not experienced this at all. Maybe it’s not suited for location play (it’s a “Studio” title after all). I was REALLY disappointed with the build quality of the last few games - Iron Maiden was hard to let go since it’s such a fantastic game but it just felt “cheap” to me, and the crappy audio quality (not the music) was driving me crazy.

Anyway, this is a big step in the right direction. We’ll see how the playfield holds up, but overall the game is really fun, and Lyman’s theme integration is on the same level as Hobbit. It is that good.

#225 88 days ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

Congrats on the new pin! I really liked playing an Elvira Premium on location and can see picking one up. I wish all Sterns were treated the same in regards to number of mechanical features and 3D molds.

Totally! The playfield looks great, which - while I’d love to be a purist in terms of the gameplay and innovative rules - let’s face it, the game has to look good too. At least in my house

#226 88 days ago
Quoted from Rdoyle1978:

Totally! The playfield looks great, which - while I’d love to be a purist in terms of the gameplay and innovative rules - let’s face it, the game has to look good too. At least in my house

That's great to hear. I'm a big fan of Hobbit as well and its ruleset. You mentioned some similarities with EOH ruletset and Hobbits. Does EOH have a deep progressive based ruleset with a lot of individual modes and some wizard modes?

Thanks!

#227 88 days ago
Quoted from jimwe5t:

POTC a good game is way overpriced and the reason foreign operations could not sell them and sent them back.

I'm gonna go ahead and disagree with you there.

-8
#228 88 days ago
Quoted from delt31:

Yeah expect a repost at $14k or $14.5k

Pirate owners need to chill with the price pumping and the guarantees that these will never be re-run. Shit is getting old.

#229 88 days ago
Quoted from pinlink:

Pirate owners need to chill with the price pumping and the guarantees that these will never be re-run. Shit is getting old.

That price is not my opinion. It's from the owner themselves - he PM'd me directly. I would have bought two pirates at 10.5!

#230 88 days ago
Quoted from pinlink:

Pirate owners need to chill with the price pumping and the guarantees that these will never be re-run. Shit is getting old.

No price pumping, it’s just selling at a higher price. One of the few pins like this right now. I had to go up to get a CE and was still thousands less than others domestically. I know of a huo CE that sold at $18.5k recently, a recent NIB at $20.5k, and so forth. It’s just simple supply and demand economics.

#231 88 days ago
Quoted from pinlink:

Pirate owners need to chill with the price pumping and the guarantees that these will never be re-run. Shit is getting old.

whose price pumping?...the market dictates value....the reality is POTC is probably the best game to hit the market in a long time. Unfortunately JJP ran into problems and decided not to make the game anymore.....its supply and demand economics...I think its a long shot that JJP makes the game again (I wish they did). If they don't who knows what that game might be worth in 10 years

#232 88 days ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

That's great to hear. I'm a big fan of Hobbit as well and its ruleset. You mentioned some similarities with EOH ruletset and Hobbits. Does EOH have a deep progressive based ruleset with a lot of individual modes and some wizard modes?
Thanks!

I wouldn’t say the rule set is similar - what I meant was that the total integration of the theme is on the same level. So TH feels like you’re on a long journey filled with all these awesome battles and dramatic moments, but you’re still able to choose which modes to start and how you progress.

In EHOH, there are fewer modes thus far, but the integration is REALLY well done. I grew up watching Movie Macabre, and the new scenes they shot really call back to that old show. They look better but they feel like they would fit right in. There are a ton of different things that can happen at once - start a mode, a progressive multiball starts, then all these additional modes can start; lock a ball in the trunk and you have to gather items to progress through the house.

The actual modes are well thought out too - for example in Night of the Living Dead, the first shot is “get to the house!” And then you knock off zombies with each subsequent shot.

The modes don’t give you the same shots each time either; sometimes you are presented with 2 or 3 options, hit those, and different shots appear. It’s really clear what to hit and when.

There are TONS of callbacks to the other 2 Elvira games as well, so that’s pretty cool to see. And in the last update the House itself started to get more interactive

#233 88 days ago
Quoted from Rdoyle1978:

I wouldn’t say the rule set is similar - what I meant was that the total integration of the theme is on the same level. So TH feels like you’re on a long journey filled with all these awesome battles and dramatic moments, but you’re still able to choose which modes to start and how you progress.
In EHOH, there are fewer modes thus far, but the integration is REALLY well done. I grew up watching Movie Macabre, and the new scenes they shot really call back to that old show. They look better but they feel like they would fit right in. There are a ton of different things that can happen at once - start a mode, a progressive multiball starts, then all these additional modes can start; lock a ball in the trunk and you have to gather items to progress through the house.
The actual modes are well thought out too - for example in Night of the Living Dead, the first shot is “get to the house!” And then you knock off zombies with each subsequent shot.
The modes don’t give you the same shots each time either; sometimes you are presented with 2 or 3 options, hit those, and different shots appear. It’s really clear what to hit and when.
There are TONS of callbacks to the other 2 Elvira games as well, so that’s pretty cool to see. And in the last update the House itself started to get more interactive

That's awesome! Thanks for the details about the modes. The code sounds very well done.

#234 88 days ago
Quoted from Rdoyle1978:

I wouldn’t say the rule set is similar - what I meant was that the total integration of the theme is on the same level. So TH feels like you’re on a long journey filled with all these awesome battles and dramatic moments, but you’re still able to choose which modes to start and how you progress.
In EHOH, there are fewer modes thus far, but the integration is REALLY well done. I grew up watching Movie Macabre, and the new scenes they shot really call back to that old show. They look better but they feel like they would fit right in. There are a ton of different things that can happen at once - start a mode, a progressive multiball starts, then all these additional modes can start; lock a ball in the trunk and you have to gather items to progress through the house.
The actual modes are well thought out too - for example in Night of the Living Dead, the first shot is “get to the house!” And then you knock off zombies with each subsequent shot.
The modes don’t give you the same shots each time either; sometimes you are presented with 2 or 3 options, hit those, and different shots appear. It’s really clear what to hit and when.
There are TONS of callbacks to the other 2 Elvira games as well, so that’s pretty cool to see. And in the last update the House itself started to get more interactive

That game is sounding better and better all the time!

Side note, did you preorder the Al Adamson box set out in April?

#235 88 days ago
Quoted from wesman:

That game is sounding better and better all the time!
Side note, did you preorder the Al Adamson box set out in April?

I STILL can’t believe no one has made a movie about his story. Crazy, every second of it! And the movies are just the beginning!

#236 88 days ago
Quoted from jimwe5t:

POTC a good game is way overpriced and the reason foreign operations could not sell them and sent them back. .

Here we go again with this clown... WHY ARE YOU HERE??? ALL you do is shit on JJP...

Jeff

#237 88 days ago
Quoted from Rdoyle1978:

I STILL can’t believe no one has made a movie about his story. Crazy, every second of it! And the movies are just the beginning!

Well, this kinda does... Came out last year. I know a little about his death, going to watch this blind when I get...

https://filmthreat.com/reviews/blood-flesh-the-reel-life-ghastly-death-of-al-adamson/

....this in very soon!!!

https://severin-films.com/shop/bundle-of-ghastly-horror/

I'm a little more familiar with Bob Crane's death, from docs and of course "Auto Focus"...!

(Sorry to derail!)

#238 88 days ago
Quoted from jeffro01:

Here we go again with this clown... WHY ARE YOU HERE??? ALL you do is shit on JJP...
Jeff

I may incorrect here but I don't think the guy even owns any pins? Unless he just doesn't list them on pinside, which is okay. But, for someone constantly bashing JJP where is he getting his insight from? Also, his 6 ratings are all 5.25- MM, Attack, Twilight Zone, Addams Family, etc. So every game is a 5.25? Not trying to troll anyone just questioning the validity of claims.

#239 88 days ago
Quoted from wesman:

Well, this kinda does... Came out last year. I know a little about his death, going to watch this blind when I get...
https://filmthreat.com/reviews/blood-flesh-the-reel-life-ghastly-death-of-al-adamson/
....this in very soon!!!
https://severin-films.com/shop/bundle-of-ghastly-horror/
I'm a little more familiar with Bob Crane's death, from docs and of course "Auto Focus"...!
(Sorry to derail!)

Awesome! I am going To check that out.

.. back to POTC code

#240 88 days ago

I would buy one if they made more.

Personally, I don’t see why they would not re-examine the idea of making more so they could recoup their costs and potentially make more in profits. Unless licensing is an issue of course.

If I was a betting man, then yes, they will at a minimum have another run of them.

#241 87 days ago
Quoted from LukyDuck:

I would buy one if they made more.
Personally, I don’t see why they would not re-examine the idea of making more so they could recoup their costs and potentially make more in profits. Unless licensing is an issue of course.
If I was a betting man, then yes, they will at a minimum have another run of them.

I don't think JJP ever makes it again. They are now focused on games with a greater profit margin that also offers a more affordable model for home and operators (the SE model starting with Wonka). It's time for JJP to start getting two games out a year.

#242 87 days ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

I don't think JJP ever makes it again. They are now focused on games with a greater profit margin that also offers a more affordable model for home and operators (the SE model starting with Wonka). It's time for JJP to start getting two games out a year.

Agreed. JJP doesn't become more profitable and sustainable by re-running a complex game that takes a longer to assemble at lower volumes than a new release. Wonka is a fun game, but showed the direction they are going. It will be interesting to see if Guns & Roses can get to a $7500 price point for a standard game with the mech heavy approach Eric has taken in the past. Elwin is proving that a great layout can go a long ways without relying on a lot of expensive mechs.

#243 87 days ago
Quoted from kermit24:

Agreed. JJP doesn't become more profitable and sustainable by re-running a complex game that takes a longer to assemble at lower volumes than a new release.

I thought for SURE you were being sarcastic and were winking at us about WOZ; One of the most complex games of all time that they keep re re re running.

#244 87 days ago
Quoted from jorant:

I thought for SURE you were being sarcastic and were winking at us about WOZ; One of the most complex games of all time that they keep re re re running.

WOZ is a unicorn though - the main reason they are still in business

#245 87 days ago
Quoted from jorant:

I thought for SURE you were being sarcastic and were winking at us about WOZ; One of the most complex games of all time that they keep re re re running.

But they raised the price to $11.5k, removed one of the more expensive mechs, and then apparently sold very few of them. And seemed like a response to the delay in Wonka production vs. good business strategy.

#246 87 days ago

JJP has made some fun games and will continue to do so! I don't think they will revisit POTC not only for cost effectiveness and the license will be expiring. But also to move on and get more Wonka's out there. Wonka is gonna sell as fast as chocolate bars with golden tickets.
I do agree that JJP will start pushing for a two pin a year eventually, especially with the move and putting everything under one roof. It will afford them that option. Jack has a great line up when it comes to design, concept, toy makers, layout team. And anyone else I forgot!!
IMO POTC is a grail pin for JJP, yes it is a theme based game, but it has so much to offer!
And maybe I will get a game of GNR in come Chi Expo

#247 87 days ago
Quoted from luckymoey:

But they raised the price to $11.5k, removed one of the more expensive mechs, and then apparently sold very few of them. And seemed like a response to the delay in Wonka production vs. good business strategy.

They took the mech out and put it back in, I thought? Never the less, they do do this. Raise the price on pirates. If I got a promise the playfield issues were fixed, I'd buy one at 11.5 new.

1 week later
#248 75 days ago

I'm really hoping all the chatter fires up another run of these. I'd love to grab an LE even if they jump to $10k or $10.5 I'm sure they'll have no issue selling another 200 easily.
Look at the resale and everyone on Pinside raving it may be the best game ever! How can retailers not ask for more from JJP?

Seems like there's a bunch for resale now from $11,500 - $12,500...Guys hoping to cash with a new code update before another run is announced maybe?

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