(Topic ID: 239117)

Is JJP really done with Pirates?


By Rockytop

62 days ago



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  • Latest reply 37 days ago by rs812
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There are 146 posts in this topic. You are on page 1 of 3.
#1 62 days ago

I've been a little out of loop lately and not on Pinside much.

Is JJP really don't making Pirates, or are they just taking a break to make WOZ again? If they are done, what reasons did they give?

I've owned WOZ in the past and currently have Dialed In and JJPPOTC and I think Pirates is definitely the best game they've made.

#2 62 days ago

They have license for three years. Their distributors are saying that what they have is all that's left. They are giving the vibe that this is it.

IMO.....they will make many more of this title....many more

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#3 62 days ago

Probably trying to give impression of false rarity

#4 62 days ago
Quoted from Rockytop:

I've been a little out of loop lately and jotnon Pinside much.
Is JJP really don't making Pirates, or are they just taking a break to make WOZ again? If they are done, what reasons did they give?
I've owned WOZ in the past and currently have Dialed In and JJPPOTC and I think Pirates is definitely the best game they've made.

from what it looks like they are making room on the line to run more WOZ and then their upcoming machines Wonka/Toy Story/GNR.

i think Pirates just had too many issues and was a tech support nightmare so they are cutting their losses and moving on (which may be the smartest business move they have made). although i wouldn't rule out a 'black pearl' edition or something in a year or two.

#5 62 days ago

Sure sounds like it. Here's what was said at TPF.

Jack said JJP ordered X amount of parts for X amount of games and that Pirates is currently done / sold out. He didn't say that Pirates will never be made again but also didn't say "yes it will be" or something along those lines. There was no comment of "if there's more demand we will make more". Jack also mentioned that JJP needs to make room for future games.

If Pirates ever does come back I would expect some new "limited" edition but with a $11,500+ price tag a year or two from now like YBR.

Here's also what PinballStar, one of the largest JJP distributors, said in one of their latest emails. "Sold out for good".

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#6 62 days ago

Thanks for the info. I believe they'll do future runs for sure...unless they have decided it's a support issue or something along those lines. Based on their track record of continuously making games from their catalogue, I expect future runs of Pirates.

Maybe I'm just fortunate, but I haven't had any real issues with my game...a few switches here and there, but that happens with most all games.

#7 62 days ago

Anyone have a guess as to how many they have produced so far?

#8 62 days ago

if they made 46 different versions of woz, you can bet they won't let a 3 yr license ($disney$) go to waste!

#9 62 days ago
Quoted from ccbiggsoo7:

if they made 46 different versions of woz, you can bet they won't let a 3 yr license ($disney$) go to waste!

Game was announced 10/17, when does the clock start? When acquired or when on sale to public? seems like a good chunk of the 3 years may be up.

#10 62 days ago
Quoted from Rockytop:

Anyone have a guess as to how many they have produced so far?

~1000 or so

#11 62 days ago
Quoted from Rockytop:

Thanks for the info. I believe they'll do future runs for sure...unless they have decided it's a support issue or something along those lines. Based on their track record of continuously making games from their catalogue, I expect future runs of Pirates.
Maybe I'm just fortunate, but I haven't had any real issues with my game...a few switches here and there, but that happens with most all games.

The rumor is razor thin margins on the game. Why would they keep making if this is true?

#12 62 days ago
Quoted from Rockytop:

Maybe I'm just fortunate, but I haven't had any real issues with my game...a few switches here and there, but that happens with most all games.

consider yourself lucky - you are EXTREMELY fortunate.

go read the Pirates owners thread. inexcusable issues with many games that should have never made it past QA.

#13 62 days ago

One of the distributors at tpf told me he has sold more pirates than any other jjp game. He said it is verry popular.

#14 62 days ago
Quoted from bankmansam:

One of the distributors at tpf told me he has sold more pirates than any other jjp game. He said it is verry popular.

Popular doesn’t translate to hitting target profits unfortunately.

#15 62 days ago
Quoted from bankmansam:

One of the distributors at tpf told me he has sold more pirates than any other jjp game. He said it is verry popular.

does he do tech support for machines he sells?

if so, i'm guessing its 'popularity' has been a double edged sword.

#16 62 days ago
Quoted from anathematize:

from what it looks like they are making room on the line to run more WOZ and then their upcoming machines Wonka/Toy Story/GNR.
i think Pirates just had too many issues and was a tech support nightmare so they are cutting their losses and moving on (which may be the smartest business move they have made). although i wouldn't rule out a 'black pearl' edition or something in a year or two.

Most if not all these issues are QC related, if they do not find better line workers the same QC problems will continue.

Eric's mechanical design is wonderfully made, but assembled, dialed in and checked poorly on the floor.

#17 62 days ago
Quoted from DerGoetz:

Most if not all these issues are QC related, if they do not find better line workers the same QC problems will continue.
Eric's mechanical design is wonderfully made, but assembled, dialed in and checked poorly on the floor.

i agree. but its still likely a tech support nightmare for them (and their distributors) regardless of where or why the issues occurred.

the end user doesn't care that Eric's mechanical design is wonderfully made when his/her $9,000 toy isn't working.

11
#18 62 days ago
Quoted from bankmansam:

One of the distributors at tpf told me he has sold more pirates than any other jjp game. He said it is verry popular.

I love many of the top distributors, but i often take what they say with a grain of salt.
Its there job to sell games and talk them up.

#19 62 days ago

I would like to believe this game will be made again, but I personally am not going to chance it. So I bought a NIB LE from Joe and will be putting my standard on location in the near future for the public to enjoy. I agree with others that this is probably the best JJP as of yet. After the Alien and TBL debacles its a real shame that this game also is becoming rare.

#20 62 days ago
Quoted from WolfManCat:

and will be putting my standard on location in the near future for the public to enjoy.

kudos to you. i'd love to see one of those 'on location progress' type threads for somebody who is operating a Pirates on location.

16
#21 62 days ago

JJPOTC is not the QC nightmare that some make it out to be. Other than adjusting a couple of switches and coil strengths, all I've done to mine is add amazing mods. No calls to JJP support needed for me and lots of others. The pirates club thread is full of trouble shooting just like all club threads. Lots of new pinball owners coming to Pinside for first time and learning a lot of basics like flipper adjustments, switch adjustments, etc. If future titles sell well, I would not expect to see another Pirates run. But don't really care. Can't understand why folks get pissed at JJP running more games. If they sell (like WOZ), then why not re-run them? No different than Stern doing Vaults.

#22 62 days ago

A few months ago I couldn't get this game to save my life and now it's going out of production? I don't buy it. Going in the "Disney Vault" maybe. See ya real soon.

#23 62 days ago

False demand. Kinda like how coach/mk will have only a few people in the store yet close doors and make others line up outside.

If enough pre orders in future zero chance jjp turns away buyers, they barely afloat as is.

#24 62 days ago
Quoted from Saveleaningtower:

Probably trying to give impression of false rarity

I agree. JJP has pushed the LE envelope beyond its meaning, this would claw back some much needed price increase justification. Not for me, as 12 grand for a pin is waaay past common sense.

#25 62 days ago

Mentioned something similar in another thread. JJP may not be able to survive on ultra high pins alone and games like POTC and WOZ may simply be too expensive for them to build. Look at Ruby Red WOZ, gone. That game was $9500 and now there's an $11,500 WOZ with a key mechanical feature removed and no mirrored backglass. Why not offer a Ruby Red still? They may not be able to, not at $9500. Will the Ruby Red WOZ ever come back? Jack didn't say yes, just like Pirates he said never say never but I seriously doubt it after YBR was revealed.

Pirates production may be ending for good as the game is to expensive to build and JJP wants to shift their direction as a pinball company. They are limiting their customer base by only offering games in the $9k+ range. All new future games starting with Willy Wonka may be scaled back in terms of features (same code commitment though, HQ animations, etc) to compete with Stern, American Pinball, CGC, and Spooky Pinball. I wouldn't be surprised if we see a $7k Willy Wonka as that would sell like hot cakes for JJP. JJP could still offer an $8k, $9k, or even $10k version of their games but the price for the "lower" model needs to be cheaper for them to grow their market share.

#26 62 days ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:

Mentioned something similar in another thread. JJP may not be able to survive on ultra high pins alone and they simply may be too expensive for them to build. Look at Ruby Red WOZ, gone. That game was $9500 and now there's an $11,500 WOZ with a key mechanical feature removed and no mirrored backglass. Will the Ruby Red WOZ ever come back? Jack didn't say yes, just like Pirates he said never say never but I seriously doubt it after YBR was revealed.
Pirates production may be ending for good as the game is to expensive to build and JJP wants to shift their direction as a pinball company. They are limiting their customer base by only offering games in the $9k+ range. All new future games starting with Willy Wonka may be scaled back in terms of features (same code commitment though, HQ animations, etc) to compete with Stern. I wouldn't be surprised if we see a $7k Willy Wonka as that would sell like hot cakes for JJP. JJP could still offer an $8k, $9k, or even $10k version of the game but the price for the "lower" model needs to be cheaper.

Much like a Lemming, Stern has just followed JJP with these silly price upscales. But unlike JJP, Stern is still cost cutting, which long term, will be unattainable. Natural market adjustments for both are needed. If I’m not buying, they aren’t selling to me. I’m not alone...

#27 62 days ago
Quoted from anathematize:

consider yourself lucky - you are EXTREMELY fortunate.
go read the Pirates owners thread. inexcusable issues with many games that should have never made it past QA.

I disagree. I've had pretty much no issues with mine either. People who's games work fine don't come to the forums every day to post about how their game worked fine again today.

#28 62 days ago
Quoted from f3honda4me:

I disagree. I've had pretty much no issues with mine either. People who's games work fine don't come to the forums every day to post about how their game worked fine again today.

I know, right? I’m always calling back customers after an extensive repair job for feedback. Always makes things look horrible until the truth comes out.

#29 62 days ago

It definitely looks like production is ending. Will JJP build more? Maybe? That’s why I went ahead and ordered an LE.

#30 62 days ago

Jack's exact words about JJP POTC are:

"We ordered parts for X amount of games, and we can only build as many games as we have parts for.... and we are out of parts.... We don't have any plan to build the game again right now. That doesn't mean we won't build the game again in the future, we have the license for a few more years... It's not because the game isn't a great game, it's just that we want to go build another game and another game and another game.... We don't have anything in stock. I got in trouble with some of my distributors who got mad at me because they thought we would have more games... but distributors sold out of their games and we don't have any more. I'm happy the demand is there but I'm not happy that everyone who wanted a game didn't get one."

-2
#31 62 days ago
Quoted from f3honda4me:

Jack's exact words about JJP POTC are:
"We ordered parts for X amount of games, and we can only build as many games as we have parts for.... and we are out of parts.... We don't have any plan to build the game again right now. That doesn't mean we won't build the game again in the future, we have the license for a few more years... It's not because the game isn't a great game, it's just that we want to go build another game and another game and another game.... We don't have anything in stock. I got in trouble with some of my distributors who got mad at me because they thought we would have more games... but distributors sold out of their games and we don't have any more. I'm happy the demand is there but I'm not happy that everyone who wanted a game didn't get one."

So basically they are delays from vendors but they've decided to frame it in a way that drives up demand. I'm sure they've already ordered more parts for additional runs.

#32 62 days ago

Based on the past, it might just be a way for JJP to stop the $9500 production, then after a discrete halt in production start making them again slightly differently for $1500 more. Either way I'd say if you want the price it's at now, buy it now.

#33 62 days ago
Quoted from seenev:

So basically they are delays from vendors but they've decided to frame it in a way that drives up demand. I'm sure they've already ordered more parts for additional runs.

That’s not what he said at all. He said there are currently no plans to make more. So no, this is not some vendor parts delay and some lame attempt to drive up demand.

#34 62 days ago

Buddy picked up ce. One thing of note, other than messing with the chest so that it released the ball properly, was that the solder joints on the upper playfield coils ..... no wonder they broke off. When one of those wires pops off ...do yourself a favor and resolder them all cause they all need it. Would really suck if we were unable to fix it ourselves so i can understand why folks would be upset.

Other wise... im very jelly. Its an amazing game and i wish i had the cash.

#35 62 days ago

After playing at tpf, decided I wanted an le. Should be getting it this week.

#36 62 days ago
Quoted from f3honda4me:

I disagree. I've had pretty much no issues with mine either. People who's games work fine don't come to the forums every day to post about how their game worked fine again today.

It’s also worth pointing out that JJP made noticeable improvements to the line based on issues found in the field. More people are getting games great OOTB now and that’s a good thing.

#37 62 days ago

Mine played great out of the box. It's a phenomenal game.

#38 62 days ago

We waited about 14 months to get our game - ordered November 30, 2017 and received beginning of February, 2019. Ours is a Standard Edition which is likely the reason for at least some of that delay.

We were disappointed about the three disks being eliminated but we decided to hold fast with our order.

We're glad we did! It's been here almost 2 months and has, by far, been the highest earning machine we've had. It earns about 2/3 more than the next highest game (The Hobbit, which was our highest earning machine for 1 1/2 years). Too early to tell if it has staying power.

There have been minor issues - a couple of opto casings came apart - one under the chest comes apart frequently and requires me to take the chest off to access it. I have replacements from my distributor so no problem there. Just this week the action button broke, I was able to hold it together with a C-clip, again I have a replacement from my distributor so no complaints. The deflector over the Tortuga scoop came loose, and the ship wasn't connected to the motor when we first got it. That's basically it, it's been quite reliable especially since it gets played all the time.

I don't know if this will be it for production or not. I suspect they will make more in time, judging from their past history it seems likely this is not 'it'. It's just speculation at this point. If you have the means and have found someone who is selling, there's probably no sense in waiting. It's a great game.

Kevin

#39 62 days ago
Quoted from zaphX:

It’s also worth pointing out that JJP made noticeable improvements to the line based on issues found in the field. More people are getting games great OOTB now and that’s a good thing.

I have a November build. So a pretty early on machine.

#40 62 days ago

LE prices, and pin prices generally, are way too high at JJP and Stern currently. I'm out. I've been having a tremendous time buying other stuff with the money that would have gone on NIB pins One of the wackier purchases was for a kinetic sand table from Sisyphus Industries. Truly awesome. I also bought a 2nd hand Rolls-Royce for weekend fun.

When JJP and Stern bother to price sensibly with better QC and value for money, I'll bother to buy their product again. We're consumers, not cash cows. I love pinball, but am not a sucker.

#41 62 days ago
Quoted from PanzerFreak:Mentioned something They are limiting their customer base by only offering games in the $9k+ range. All new future games starting with Willy Wonka may be scaled back in terms of features (same code commitment though, HQ animations, etc) to compete with Stern, American Pinball, CGC, and Spooky Pinball. I wouldn't be surprised if we see a $7k Willy Wonka as that would sell like hot cakes for JJP. JJP could still offer an $8k, $9k, or even $10k version of their games but the price for the "lower" model needs to be cheaper for them to grow their market share.

Does anybody believe Wonka will have a 7k model? I don’t think that’s a reality. Expect a packed game, great code, and high prices. Jack has said he expects to sell 2,000 + units ... we shall see.

#42 62 days ago
Quoted from Greenandwhite:

Does anybody believe Wonka will have a 7k model? I don’t think that’s a reality. Expect a packed game, great code, and high prices. Jack has said he expects to sell 2,000 + units ... we shall see.

I think any game going forward from JJP is going to be $9k for the lowest version, at minimum. JJP just keeps raising prices.

#43 62 days ago
Quoted from f3honda4me:

I think any game going forward from JJP is going to be $9k for the lowest version, at minimum. JJP just keeps raising prices.

Looks like POTC will be my last NIB JJP then. These prices are nuts lol.

#44 62 days ago
Quoted from Psw757:

The rumor is razor thin margins on the game. Why would they keep making if this is true?

This seems logical to me...cuz if distributors are mad because the demand is there why wouldn’t you make more to fill demand. It makes me wonder if that Disc mechanism was scrapped more so because of cost then reliability.

#45 62 days ago
Quoted from f3honda4me:

I think any game going forward from JJP is going to be $9k for the lowest version, at minimum. JJP just keeps raising prices.

This is a damn shame but it really looks like it’s going that way. Sell 2k games at $9k or 1k games at $10k?

Quoted from PanzerFreak:

Looks like POTC will be my last NIB JJP then. These prices are nuts lol.

You, me, and almost everyone I know lol

#46 62 days ago
Quoted from Pinballlew:

This seems logical to me...cuz if distributors are mad because the demand is there why wouldn’t you make more to fill demand. It makes me wonder if that Disc mechanism was scrapped more so because of cost then reliability.

We will never know

1 week later
12
#47 50 days ago

For me, here’s how excellent and perfectly designed this game is. I heard about the scarcity and bought an SE as that was all I could find. Never had a chance to play it and had never seen one in person. I thought, what the hell, you only live once. SE was delivered Tuesday.

I am completely blown away by this game. The layout, rules, and shots are light years beyond anything I have ever played. I had some out of the box assembly issues, but they were fixable. This is the only widebody I have played that doesn’t feel floaty. The toys are beyond belief! Both in number, complexity, and uniqueness.

My boss (wife) who is not really into pinball, but tolerates my sickness , can’t quit playing it. I kid you not, this game is utter design perfection. The lack of movie assets is no issue whatsoever. In fact, what i once viewed as a weakness, i now view as a strength. This game stands on its own!

Long story short, I knew that i had to have a CE. I had been told that they were sold out and unobtanium, along with the LE’s. I found a distro this morning that just picked one up at the factory and had it in stock. Bought it! This game is a definite keeper! I have never purchased two of the same pin, let alone in the same week, and probably never will again.

That’s how good this game is for me. Its a shame they are going to quit making them.

#48 50 days ago

I agree 100%. The game got off to a slow start (which I attribute to very few machines on location for people to try.)

Everyone I introduce to this game wants one. It is truly a shame to limit such an excellent design.

#49 50 days ago
Quoted from rs812:

For me, here’s how excellent and perfectly designed this game is. I heard about the scarcity and bought an SE as that was all I could find. Never had a chance to play it and had never seen one in person. I thought, what the hell, you only live once. SE was delivered Tuesday.

LOL, you must really love the game!

I have an SE and am extremely happy with it. Enjoy

#50 50 days ago

More than once I’ve considered upgrading my LE to a CE. Now I think my window has probably passed which is for the best given the other exciting new pins coming out. I did invest in a set of Radcals for it, as the Radcals are the CE’s most striking feature IMO. I’ll post pics when I do the install.

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